pixelperfect Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 (edited) That sounds epic cowdog! This battery solution combined with the new Mcwill screens and SD card makes the ultimate retro 16-bit portable. I'm dying to do some development for it now, just need to get development environment setup and a flash cart. Edited August 16, 2016 by pixelperfect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 17, 2016 Author Share Posted August 17, 2016 Waaaaahahaha, love the Level 42 reference there Cowdog !!! Well I totally have tot thank you for pointing me to the LTC2950 and Powerboost1000C.....wouldn't have be able to follow this path without those suggestions. Yes it would be very cool to have an (almost )'plug and play solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pixelperfect Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 Got my Lynx Model 2 in the mail today, and the McWill screen ordered. Also got my dev environment setup so fun times are coming. Still trying to find a flash cart though. I signed up for the SainT pre-order but looks like that might be a while.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdog360 Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 I was talking with another person last night, and it may be possible to use the original CD4069 and power buttons to act as an enable trigger for the powerboost. The CD4009 will work with as low as 3V input, so if you have it tied directly into the battery at 3.7V, that should work. The big issue would be seperating out the power rails, since it is a shared one right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 18, 2016 Author Share Posted August 18, 2016 Quick note: McWill's LCD has arrived, is installed and seems to allow at least _some_ overclocking.... I am having some issues with jumping colors when running at my current top speed (22Mhz) BUT.........I have a feeling that the jittery old Pot I've installed for now is might also be the cause of this....gotta find me another pot to hook up.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdog360 Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 Actually, it's more likely to the way that McWill implemented the screen buffering on the new screen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 18, 2016 Author Share Posted August 18, 2016 Yeah could be, what happens is that the colours seem to invert. Sometimes just on some lines sometimes the entire sceen. I'll see if I can make a video.... However...overclocking up to 20mHz seems to be no problem and I guess that is enough for most games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdog360 Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 So here's some more ideas for the lithium ion conversion. I'm going to try this on my Lynx II: Basically, the CD4069 inverter can run down to 3V, and its what acts as both the power on circuit and the oscillator for the built in switching DC supply. If you look at all the Red X's, I'm going to chop out all of the DC switching section since we don't need it anymore. Where D11 is, I'll drop in VBAT from the Powerboost 1000c which should allow the 4069 to operate like it used to. Then, take pin 11 off the 4069 and run it into the enable on the powerboost. Then, the 5V output of the powerboost would just be placed across where C41 was. This should work, retain all the original button and shutdown functions from the CPU. I'll try and let you know! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pixelperfect Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 I wish I understood all that, but it sounds awesome. Any idea how long of battery life this would give? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdog360 Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 This is pretty typical of engineers/technical guys dealing with the end user of a product. It sounds great, but we always miss what's really important Let's say we use a lithium battery that is 3400mah, since that's probably what I'm going to use. In a Lynx I, you can fit more. The Lithium battery will be boosted to the voltage needed to run the Lynx, and the conversion is probably around 90% efficient, so you wind up with about 3000mah roughly of usable power. A McWill modded Lynx with new screen probably draws 300-400ma, so a decent guess would be 8-10 hours. And you could recharge it in about 3 hours. So in short, probably 8-10 hours depending on what size battery you pick. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pixelperfect Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 Man that sounds perfect, just long enough for a longass plane ride, and for day to day use might only need a couple charges a week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 19, 2016 Author Share Posted August 19, 2016 Don't set your hopes too high, I measured about 700mA with McWill's screen. OK this was including my Visaton speaker and it was running at 22Mhz, but even so, 300-400 is not going to happen with McWill's LCD. But who cares.....it looks BRILLIANT Look what I found in the mail today......free sAmple LTC2950's ! Not bad considering they cost about 4-5 euro a piece..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 19, 2016 Author Share Posted August 19, 2016 Don't set your hopes too high, I measured about 700mA with McWill's screen. OK this was including my Visaton speaker and it was running at 22Mhz, but even so, 300-400 is not going to happen with McWill's LCD. But who cares.....it looks BRILLIANT Look what I found in the mail today......free sAmple LTC2950's ! Not bad considering they cost about 4-5 euro a piece..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 19, 2016 Author Share Posted August 19, 2016 (edited) So here's some more ideas for the lithium ion conversion. I'm going to try this on my Lynx II: Basically, the CD4069 inverter can run down to 3V, and its what acts as both the power on circuit and the oscillator for the built in switching DC supply. If you look at all the Red X's, I'm going to chop out all of the DC switching section since we don't need it anymore. Where D11 is, I'll drop in VBAT from the Powerboost 1000c which should allow the 4069 to operate like it used to. Then, take pin 11 off the 4069 and run it into the enable on the powerboost. Then, the 5V output of the powerboost would just be placed across where C41 was. This should work, retain all the original button and shutdown functions from the CPU. I'll try and let you know! Looking sweet......but the way it's drawn now you have a direct connection between the battery plus and the Powerboost 5V output,don't think that will be healthy....you need to break the line somewhere.... You did break the negative rail by removing L15 and Q12. This might break the ground line to McWill's LCD if you installed it according to the instructions. But I guess you'll figure out where to get +5V and GND from I didn't realize the 4069 was part of the oscillation circuit.....do you understand how that works ? Edited August 19, 2016 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdog360 Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 Yeah I realized that right after I posted it. I'm trying to find a good spot on the board to break the traces to seperate the 5V and battery rails. So far, not finding anything obvious. The schematic and board layout are very different. Regarding the 4069, actually @Mojado did an excellent job talking about how the power supply circuitry works here: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/236279-what-are-the-5v-regulator-mod/page-2 Go to post 37. Lots of info and pictures. But basically, half of the 4069 is used to latch the On/Off button state. The other half if used as a square wave osciallator to run the switching power supply. Pretty slick design really. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdog360 Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 I actually need to solve several problems for the lithium circuit: 1. How to seperate out the 3.7V battery rail and 5V boosted output rail if I want to use the 4069 instead of a button controller IC. 2. How to keep the original lynx power jack, but deal with the issue of someone plugging in a real 9V adapter. Since the powerboost and most boost controllers can't take more than 6 volts in. 3. Make it pretty easy to do rather than tons of hacking to the board. #1 is the one I'm working on at the moment. #2 seems like what you might actually have to do is put another 5V buck converter in front of the powerboost. I really want to use the stock jack so we can use the Lynx adapter, or a 5V adapter, but don't have the mod the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 19, 2016 Author Share Posted August 19, 2016 Don't really understand why you want to stick to the Atari adapter. It puts dangerous voltages in th Lynx, which is one of the things you prevent with using a Lipo battery. There are so many adapters of lousy quality with connectors that fit in the Lynxes power jack....a lot of them pump out way more volts then specified....and lots of them have terrible AC ripple...... Also, today people have loads of USB chargers and cables....and those USB chargers are generally of higher quality and have straight 5V outputs....why not just use a (micro) USB connector even if you don't want to use the Powerboost 1000C. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 19, 2016 Author Share Posted August 19, 2016 (edited) Separating the rails is a PITA. The schematics can draw some easy lines, but in reality you have no idea how the paths are layed out on the PCB. That's one of the reasons why I decided to rip out each and every part (well almost). You could consider lifting up the + and GND connections of U6...... Edited August 19, 2016 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pixelperfect Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 Would Lightning connectors be an option? I'm sure everyone has 10 of those lying around, and I wouldn't need to bring an extra cable for traveling 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 19, 2016 Author Share Posted August 19, 2016 (edited) I seriously considered that too, have everything Apple here. However, the Powerboost 1000C already comes with a micro-USB connector installed and the documentation indicates it needs a 2A power supply with really thick wires. The iPad charger can do 2A but the wires are very thin....and it would mean doing another mod to the Powerboost for me. Adafruit suggests this power supply: https://www.adafruit.com/product/1995 Since I'm in Europe I won't be getting that one because I don't want to use an extra part to adapt it for here, plus Adafruit's shipping costs to Europe are horrendous.... However, I incidentally found a local store which is an official reseller of Adafruit stuff (where I will be going tomorrow to get the parts) and I'll be getting this supply from them: https://www.kiwi-electronics.nl/MicroUSB-Travel-Power-Adapter-5V-2A-10-Watt?search=Adapter%20micro%20usb Yeah it's on the expensive side, but I want good quality and i dont want to take a risk with this. Edited August 19, 2016 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 19, 2016 Author Share Posted August 19, 2016 (edited) By the way Cowdog, there I doubt the original Lynx AC adapter is going to provide the required 2A for the Powerboost 1000C ! Yes it's 1A at 9V but.....if you add another buck converter this means more loss.... I bet the original Lynx adapter is a conventional,design..... Edited August 19, 2016 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 19, 2016 Author Share Posted August 19, 2016 (edited) Did anyone notice the town where Linear Technologies is located in the US (See the envelope) ......... sounds familiar ? Must mention that for now I have reconnected the original crystal. I had desoldered the 50k pot of the brightness to see how it would work with the variable frequency board but that actually worked a lot worse than the 20K pot I had in there earlier. Got a bit tired of the whole thing....I might end up putting a second crystal inside at 20Mhz, I think McWill's LCD will work with that. I'll need a way to figure out how to switch between both frequencies without the Lynx crashing though. I remember my old set-up often did (I guess because of switch bounce).I'll need to be able to switch between 16Mhz and 20Mhz to keep using the SD-card.....(load game at 16Mhz, play at 20Mhz). I played Joust the other day at a slightly higher speed than standard and it INSTANTLY gave me the exact arcade feeling (I have a Joust arcade cab, so I know how it feels ). Alternatively I could figure out two (or three ?) usable speeds and thus the corresponding resistance values and use two or three resistors with those values and use those with the mod board instead of the pot...... I guess I need to do some calculating......it should be possible to find out a fixed resistor + pot value to vary the speed between 16Mhz and 24Mhz. Tomorrow I'll be driving 20 minutes to the store that has the Adafruit stuff on stock. Luckily they have a good supply of Powerboost 1000C's.....Adafruit's website constantly indicates they are out of stock..... Buying these: Powerboost 1000C: https://www.kiwi-electronics.nl/powerboost-1000-charger-rechargeable-5v-lipo-usb-boost-1a 2A 5V micro-USB power supply: https://www.kiwi-electronics.nl/MicroUSB-Travel-Power-Adapter-5V-2A-10-Watt JST connector and wires to hook up the lipo battery: https://www.kiwi-electronics.nl/jst-2-wire-cable 8-SO IC board to mount and connect the LTC2950: https://www.kiwi-electronics.nl/soic-naar-dip-adapter-8-pin Prices are higher than on Adafruit's site but having them in my hands tomorrow and zero shipping costs totally outweigh this. Also, I actually really like this stuff is for sale locally in an actual store. Also nice for service if needed...... Edited August 19, 2016 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 20, 2016 Author Share Posted August 20, 2016 (edited) I've been having a bit of doubt about buying that 2A micro-USB charger. First of all it's pretty expensive (probably because of all the included international adapters, which I don't really need). But also, I've been reading about chargers a bit....here's a very interesting article which shows why (f.i.) Apple chargers are so expensive.... http://www.righto.com/2012/10/a-dozen-usb-chargers-in-lab-apple-is.html If there is one thing I want to be sure of is that the +5V going into the Lynx (or actually the Powerboost 1000C) is going to be of good quality. Also, I have a buch of original iPad chargers here, they can delver 2A and are great quality, why buy another one which I don't know the quality of ? However, I'd need a GOOD USB micro cable with really thick wires but most important: I know Apple uses the data lines to share the current to charge their devices, but I wonder if the charger will deliver 2A when hooked up to a micro-USB cable....anyone know ? I just hooked up the Samsung phone I have from my work (which I don't use) to the iPad charger and I measure only 0,74A but this is probably because the phone's charging circuit probably doesn't allow higher current....at least, that's what I suspect... I think I'll buy the charger at Kiwi on the condition I can return it if I don't like it. Edited August 20, 2016 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andromeda Stardust Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 Just buy a generic 2A 5V power supply and splice on a MicroUSB cable. Some cheap chargers leave the plus and minus data leads disconnected, but it is better to join them together. Buy joining the data plus and data minus wires together in the charge cable, you are telling whatever "smart" device that it's connected to a "dumb" charger, allowing it to pull maximum charge current without fear of tripping the USB protection device. Apple uses some assinine system where the device actually tests the internal resistance between the data leads. Zero Ohms = 500mA, and a resistance of 100 ohm or 200 ohm lets the device charge pulling higher current. But in short, if you're simply fabricating you're own "dumb" charger, simply twist the data leads together, otherwise the smart device will respect the minimum rated 100mA current limit per port when handshake protocol fails. I have also found through experience only PS3 controllers seem to flat out refuse to charge from dumb receptacles. You absolutely must use a PC (powered up; standby charge won't work) or game console to charge PS3 controllers because some assinine Sony policy, and of course they made it such that you can't charge with the PS3 off. :facepalm: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted August 20, 2016 Author Share Posted August 20, 2016 (edited) Good info thanks....well I decided to pick up the adapter as they sold it on the condition I'd do some testing and could return it if I wasn't happy (which already is a basic right here, but doesn't hurt to talk about it). So here's the stuff. I mentioned to the guy that Adafruit was all out of Powerboost 1000C's and he said they basically "cleared out" Adafruit as it was a hot seller....LOL First test is a succes Edited August 20, 2016 by Level42 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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