RetroN 77

[doctorclu]

If I fix it i think it won't be long until it happens again. Are there any Atari cartridge passthroughs?

 

What come to mind was the multi-bank selector that they came out with toward the beginning of the Atari VCS run, the one where you could plug up like 10 games and select with a switch which game you wanted. Forgot what that was called.

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Game brain...

 

 

What come to mind was the multi-bank selector that they came out with toward the beginning of the Atari VCS run, the one where you could plug up like 10 games and select with a switch which game you wanted. Forgot what that was called.

 

Game Brain...

[+GoldLeader]

This is exactly what I expect from Hyperkin products. Out of the box and into the trash in just a few short weeks.

 

I've never had this problem with any of their stuff! Of course everybody's experience is different...

[Coolcrab]

Hyperkin seems to still be advertising this thing at cons. So I think that a new batch is comming.

[MMarcoux66]

Hyperkin seems to still be advertising this thing at cons. So I think that a new batch is comming.

 

Yes, it was also in Frys ad today with $10 off. They seem to be out there.

[Coolcrab]

SO maybe they will also update the software?

[zyzzle]

My understanding is that the RetroN 77 is really just a very streamlined Linux box. Why then is it so hard to update to Stella 5 and the fabled SDL2? Is more than just a simple recompilation / software tweaking required? Anyone very familiar with Linux should be able to get Stella 5 on there? I'm not a hater or perfectionist, but I'm very, very disappointed in this company releasing a product that is using a 6-year old, obsolete version of Stella, when it is PERFECTLY capable of running the latest versions of the emulaor. Others have commented that the CPU is powerful enough, etc. I don't think any hardware would even need to be modified on the board to make it run the latest Stella, but correct me if i'm wrong.

 

I have not bought one for the above reasons, and am certain it was RUSHED to market, in a far too premature state, the this absolutely cripples the product. The company must be made aware that sales have been lost because of their rush. 60-70% compatibility just dosen't cut it.

[+remowilliams]

The company must be made aware that sales have been lost because of their rush. 60-70% compatibility just dosen't cut it.

 

Where is that number coming from?

[Andromeda Stardust]

My understanding is that the RetroN 77 is really just a very streamlined Linux box. Why then is it so hard to update to Stella 5 and the fabled SDL2? Is more than just a simple recompilation / software tweaking required? Anyone very familiar with Linux should be able to get Stella 5 on there? I'm not a hater or perfectionist, but I'm very, very disappointed in this company releasing a product that is using a 6-year old, obsolete version of Stella, when it is PERFECTLY capable of running the latest versions of the emulaor. Others have commented that the CPU is powerful enough, etc. I don't think any hardware would even need to be modified on the board to make it run the latest Stella, but correct me if i'm wrong.

 

I have not bought one for the above reasons, and am certain it was RUSHED to market, in a far too premature state, the this absolutely cripples the product. The company must be made aware that sales have been lost because of their rush. 60-70% compatibility just dosen't cut it.

Something, something, something, have to add a bunch of useless libraries, something something something, recompile a bunch of crap, something, something, something, write a few hardware drivers, something, something, something, to get hardware acceleration, sdl2, and henceforth Stella 5 to work.

 

FYI, I got a Retrofreak and a Retron77, and possibly some other junk I'd like to get rid of. I'm done with the whole emulation dumper crap. I'll be posting a marketplace thread later this week...

[Andromeda Stardust]

Well, at least it exists and mostly works at this point. I can give them credit for that. On the other hand, there is that other Atari based project that needs a taco post from me....

Thank you for reminding me. You will appreciate this one...

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/266480-new-atari-console-that-ataribox/?p=4099652

[zyzzle]

 

Where is that number coming from?

From this very forum, earlier in this thread and the posts that stephena has made in the review thread of the RetroN 77. Again, please correct me if my info is wrong or there is now a higher compatibility level.

[+remowilliams]

From this very forum, earlier in this thread and the posts that stephena has made in the review thread of the RetroN 77. Again, please correct me if my info is wrong or there is now a higher compatibility level.

 

I'm not seeing stephena saying that in a quick search, though if you can post a link that's fine. I have seen other people throwing similar numbers out there repeatedly with absolutely no grounding.

 

In terms of 'classic' carts (what Hyperkin is saying the RetroN 77 is meant for, for better or worse) it's much higher.

[Keatah]

Something, something, something, have to add a bunch of useless libraries, something something something, recompile a bunch of crap, something, something, something, write a few hardware drivers, something, something, something, to get hardware acceleration, sdl2, and henceforth Stella 5 to work. YUP!

 

Indeed. Recompile this, add this library, modify that part of SDL2.. Whatever.. Despite my love for technical-layman-conceptual understandings and explanations, it all sounds like excuse after excuse. Ohh I don't doubt that it's an involved process, and that real work needs to be done, it should have been done from the get go.

 

If it's one thing that'll kill the product, it's the old version. This is the year 2018, a year in which we have highly polished emulators available. Stella is approaching version 6. No reason not to use it.

[Keatah]

FYI, I got a Retrofreak and a Retron77, and possibly some other junk I'd like to get rid of. I'm done with the whole emulation dumper crap. I'll be posting a marketplace thread later this week...

 

Ohh I agree..

 

 

 

 

 

I once saw a stretch Corvette. I once saw a Corvette with 4 wheels in the front, and 2 in the back. I once saw a Corvette converted into a trike. All interesting and creative experiments when taken separately separately, but this mixing and matching results in low-performance freak machines. About the only thing they do good is turn heads in bewilderment.

 

Here with the Retron77 we have a low-cost Linux single-board computer, some dated emulator, and a partially complete cartridge dumper and ID'er.

 

Low-cost Linux computers/boards are fine for experimenting/educating and doing many kinds of tasks.

 

Dated emulators, while not cool today, were cool back in the day when they were released. They were pushing the boundaries and being refined on what seemed like a steady schedule - that was cool in its own right.

 

Cartridge dumpers or ROM readers are important. And they did (and do) their job extremely well. Seems like all carts for all systems were run through one of these at one point in time.

 

3 great ingredients on their own, used for their designed purposes, are cool things. Can't argue with that. But when mixed, it's like making chocolate-infused salmon with mayonnaise topping. Awesome ingredients in their own element, terrible when combined. That's what this emulation dumper crap is. Nothing fits together in an appealing manner. It's worse than those freak Corvettes. Worse than an unbalanced, bottlenecked, hot'n'heavy PC.

 

We can say we like it, to justify our interest, to justify a purchase, to want to have something to look forward to, to have a real console replacement. But it isn't working out so great. Is it? You simply can't mix awesomes to get more awesomes without thinking.

 

---

 

So.. The best ways to play the classic games remain:

 

1- A properly designed and tested FPGA replacement console that plays all cartridges.

2- Original hardware that's cleaned up, capped, and adjusted. With clean working controllers. Video-modded if needed.

3- A properly set-up dedicated Software Emulation rig that's using the latest software and isn't trying to be something it is not.

 

 

 

 

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

I once saw a stretch Corvette. I once saw a Corvette with 4 wheels in the front, and 2 in the back. I once saw a Corvette converted into a trike. All interesting and creative experiments when taken separately separately, but this mixing and matching results in low-performance freak machines. About the only thing they do good is turn heads in bewilderment.

I kinda like those trike rat-rods with the Volkswagon beetle backends and chopper front wheels. All the horsepower of the original VW engine is intact so you still get good throttle in those things. I would be weary that the front fork suspension could fully support all that weight of of back half of a Volkswagon though.

 

If the front fork breaks, it will not end well for the rider.

 

[zyzzle]

 

Indeed. Recompile this, add this library, modify that part of SDL2.. Whatever.. Despite my love for technical-layman-conceptual understandings and explanations, it all sounds like excuse after excuse. Ohh I don't doubt that it's an involved process, and that real work needs to be done, it should have been done from the get go.

 

If it's one thing that'll kill the product, it's the old version. This is the year 2018, a year in which we have highly polished emulators available. Stella is approaching version 6. No reason not to use it.

 

So, serious question now - is it therefore likely that the RetroN 77 will languish in mediocracy forever, or is it acually possible someday that some genius Linux God with the knowhow and the desire could in fact bring the system up to date with a Stella 5 / 6 emulation core? Is it physically impossible, or possible with software tweaks alone (which the company should have done, not this community!). But, where there's a will there's a way?

Edited August 28, 2018 by zyzzle

[Keatah]

Of course, Stella 5 should run fine, if someone takes the time to make it happen. Developers even said so. And I would guess 6 also.

[AtariLeaf]

I wonder how many who don't currently have an R77 still want to buy one. Are there still people looking at this thing and its myriad of issues and saying "That's something I really want to own"?

 

Perhaps if they release a version 2 but by the deafening silence, I doubt Hyperkin is interested and who would even trust it if they did?

[MrBeefy]

I wonder how many who don't currently have an R77 still want to buy one. Are there still people looking at this thing and its myriad of issues and saying "That's something I really want to own"?

 

Perhaps if they release a version 2 but by the deafening silence, I doubt Hyperkin is interested and who would even trust it if they did?

I am interested in one. I refuse to buy one in its current state though. I am also waiting to see what the Flashback 9 is like this year. If the cart part was better on the Retron I might care more, but in the end its still just emulation. So of AtGames has a better version of Stella on it I think its a no brainer.

[+Nathan Strum]

I wonder how many who don't currently have an R77 still want to buy one. Are there still people looking at this thing and its myriad of issues and saying "That's something I really want to own"?

 

Perhaps if they release a version 2 but by the deafening silence, I doubt Hyperkin is interested and who would even trust it if they did?

I'd buy one if the current version of Stella ran on it.

 

I'm somewhat optimistic that it will happen, since it doesn't require any actual re-engineering of the hardware. This is a matter of Hyperkin putting the necessary resources into it to update the software. I'd be surprised if they weren't at least looking into it. However, I'm not counting on it either.

[marcallie]

I'm an Atari newbie but here's my thoughts on the Retron77.

 

I had a Flashback 2 for years, and enjoyed it. Picked up a CIB Star Raiders for a buck at a local gaming shop, and it just sat around as decoration in my gameroom. It always sorta bugged me I coudn't play it. I learned about the method for hacking the FB2 to play cartridges, but it was over my head. A friend agreed to try it for me, and so I picked up a half dozen or so games I remembered playing as a kid while he worked on it. My buddy failed to get the mod right, which was disappointing. However, my desire to play these games was now at an all time high. Looking online, the Retron77 seemed like a good deal, so I ordered it.

 

It arrived, and I was giddy to be able to play Phoenix and Cosmic Ark again. But Star Raiders didn't work, at least, the keyboard controller didn't. The paddle in Super Breakout was so jerky I couldn't play it. Even got another set of paddles, and cleaned them. Still unplayable. I went to the internet, found this forum, and applied the community update to my Retron77. Still no Star Raiders or Super Breakout. I was really disappointed.

 

Forum member masschamber was selling a frankenstein half 4 switch half 6 2600 with some common games cheap. I contacted him, and he even threw in some extra clean paddles for me. A few days later I was playing a classic original Atari in my living room, and all the games worked great!

 

I'm torn, really. The Retron77 image is flawless and it looks amazing... for games that work. The vintage system has all the compatibility but doesn't look great on a modern TV. The rocks in Asteroids looked particularly bad, and the spider legs and even the bullets in Centipede were difficult to see. I'll probably keep the Retron77 in the living room, and move the old-school cool 2600 to the gameroom and hook it up to an old CRT I've kept around. Best of both worlds, right?

 

However, if I had it all to do again... I would definitely get the vintage system first and skip the Retron77 entirely.

[zyzzle]

I'm an Atari newbie but here's my thoughts on the Retron77.

 

I had a Flashback 2 for years, and enjoyed it. Picked up a CIB Star Raiders for a buck at a local gaming shop, and it just sat around as decoration in my gameroom. It always sorta bugged me I coudn't play it. I learned about the method for hacking the FB2 to play cartridges, but it was over my head. A friend agreed to try it for me, and so I picked up a half dozen or so games I remembered playing as a kid while he worked on it. My buddy failed to get the mod right, which was disappointing. However, my desire to play these games was now at an all time high. Looking online, the Retron77 seemed like a good deal, so I ordered it.

 

I'm torn, really. The Retron77 image is flawless and it looks amazing... for games that work. The vintage system has all the compatibility but doesn't look great on a modern TV. The rocks in Asteroids looked particularly bad, and the spider legs and even the bullets in Centipede were difficult to see. I'll probably keep the Retron77 in the living room, and move the old-school cool 2600 to the gameroom and hook it up to an old CRT I've kept around. Best of both worlds, right?

 

However, if I had it all to do again... I would definitely get the vintage system first and skip the Retron77 entirely.

 

 

Well, I was so torn that I finally caved today and bought a RetronN 77 for $40 + tax, which seems a more worthwhile deal than the retail of $70 + tax. I will hold out hope that someday some enlightened and talented fan will open up all that the system is capable of by bringing it up to date with a Stella 5 or 6 and a SD2 recompile. I know the manufacturer won't ever do it, for they're too lazy and there's no money in it for them.

 

The super-crisp HDMI display is the main reason I finally caved. I also own a Flashback 2, and was tired of its blurry composite-only output.

 

May the Atari gods unite and bless us someday with a proper hack that makes the RetronN really shine. Until then, I'll keep mine sealed and hope to someday be able to open up a treasure chest. Well, maybe.

[Keatah]

In the meantime there’s Stella 6 (and betas!) to enjoy on the PC.

[Mr SQL]

Maybe Altirra will add 2600 support, it would be awesome to see true phosphor support instead of a blurry mess and artifact colors in games designed to support them. Even a video mod can remove that capability from classic Atari consoles:

 

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/224723-why-did-the-atari-2600-console-design-change-so-much/page-2

[alex_79]

The super-crisp HDMI display is the main reason I finally caved. I also own a Flashback 2, and was tired of its blurry composite-only output.

I actually can't stand an unfiltered image with perfectly square pixels, it really ruins the 8-bit graphics IMO, especially if displayed on a big 50+ inch TV. Without some smoothing the individual pixels become too evident making the displayed objects less recognizeable, and the whole image look "flat" to me. That's another reason for me to not even consider getting a r77 unless the upcoming Stella 6 is ported to it.

 

Stella has highly configurable crt filters, scanlines and, since version 5, a new phosphor mode that better simulates phosphor persistence of a crt display. Personally, that's the only way I enjoy playing the atari 2600 on a modern TV set. An original console never looks that good on a digital TV, no matter what expensive mod and/or upscaler you get.

 

On a dedicated device like the r77, you have to sacrifice most of the configurability of the PC version of the emulator to keep it easy to use, but a couple of presets with different level of crt emulation in addition to the raw unfiltered image should do the job.

 

Here are some screenshots with example of filtered displays compared to "raw" ones (both taken in Stella 6 beta) to show what I'm talking about. (You can see the phosphor persistence effect in fast moving objects in "Galaxian" and "Super Break Out". It's really a dynamic effect that needs to be seen in action rather than on a screenshot, but it gives an idea). Note that the smoothing doesn't cause any loss in resolution: every single pixel of the Atari display is visible in the filtered images.

Edited August 31, 2018 by alex_79