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2600 Rom Comparisions and Dumps


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#1251 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jun 7, 2017 2:57 AM

I believe that, in case of Pitfall II, the cause of most of the graphic changes is SECAM compatibility.

Interesting theory. It would explain less color luminosity differences, but not completely wrong PAL colors (e.g. in PAL Pole Position, the curbs are brown ($44). They could easily be red ($64) and still look OK in SECAM).

It would be nice to find some clear evidence or first hand information.

#1252 alex_79 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jun 7, 2017 5:59 AM

Interesting theory. It would explain less color luminosity differences, but not completely wrong PAL colors (e.g. in PAL Pole Position, the curbs are brown ($44). They could easily be red ($64) and still look OK in SECAM).

Yeah, the lousy conversion argument still stands. I think the SECAM compatibility is an additional cause that explains some programming choices in some of the Atari and Activision PAL conversions of the early '80s. Later, the 2600 junior and 7800 were available in France in PAL format (or RGB with PAL palette), and support for SECAM was abandoned.
 

It would be nice to find some clear evidence or first hand information.

I'd like that too.
 



#1253 Tempest ONLINE  

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Posted Wed Jun 7, 2017 7:20 AM

Why is the boulder behind Quick Claw missing?



#1254 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jun 7, 2017 7:30 AM

Must be an initialization error. If you run to the next screen and back, the boulder is there. And even you if hack the game and make Harry start left of Quickclaw, he cannot exit to the left.

Edited by Thomas Jentzsch, Wed Jun 7, 2017 7:33 AM.


#1255 alex_79 OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:27 PM

Activision Bridge PAL:
bridge1.jpeg

bridge2.jpeg

 

Attached File  Bridge_PAL.bin   4KB   22 downloads

 

Bridge_PAL_1.png

 

Only 5 bytes differ from the NTSC "fixed" version.

PAL on the left, NTSC on the right:

01AD 40 23  overscan TIMER
02E5 47 2A  vblank TIMER
0FD8 64 44  diamonds COLOR
0FD9 64 44  hearts COLOR
0FDB B2 92  background COLOR


The pirate PAL rom (208 in 1 cartridge) that was already dumped, has slightly higher timer values (frames are 316 lines) and keeps the color values of the NTSC versions (which by chance look quite right, anyway).

original PAL on the left, pirate PAL on the right:

01AD 40 43
02E5 47 4A
0FD8 64 44
0FD9 64 44
0FDB B2 92


 



#1256 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:59 PM

Many thanks, Alex!

I'm glad the cart worked 100%.

Will add the ROM right away.

8)



#1257 alex_79 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Jul 1, 2017 7:25 AM

Thanks to tdp, the Supercharger PAL bios is now dumped:

http://atariage.com/...t/#entry3796524

:)



#1258 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Jul 2, 2017 11:24 AM

Thanks to tdp, the Supercharger PAL bios is now dumped:

http://atariage.com/...t/#entry3796524

:)

 

Excellent!

I'll add it to the V13 collection.

Thanks!

8)


Edited by Rom Hunter, Sun Jul 2, 2017 11:25 AM.


#1259 Albert OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 11, 2017 3:46 PM

I've updated the first post with Rom's edits.  



#1260 stephena OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 12, 2017 10:43 AM

Stella 5.0 will have the updated v13 info as well.



#1261 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 12, 2017 10:46 AM

Stella 5.0 will have the updated v13 info as well.

Excellent.

 

Thanks, Stephena!

8)



 



#1262 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:16 PM

Finally River Raid Secam has been dumped! I'm also very happy to see a PAL Bridge dumped.

 

I would love to see Pete Rose's Baseball (PAL) get dumped. If I ever get a copy I think I could do it.



#1263 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Aug 10, 2017 3:22 PM

Finally River Raid Secam has been dumped! I'm also very happy to see a PAL Bridge dumped.

 

I would love to see Pete Rose's Baseball (PAL) get dumped. If I ever get a copy I think I could do it.

 

The man is back!

 

Glad to hear from you again, Omega!

 

8)



#1264 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Aug 11, 2017 9:39 AM

I think it's important to dump and confirm Robot Tank (HES) and Pitfall II (HES).

At least with Robot Tank I suspect there is high possibility the rom was converted from FE to F6.

#1265 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:19 AM

I think it's important to dump and confirm Robot Tank (HES) and Pitfall II (HES).

At least with Robot Tank I suspect there is high possibility the rom was converted from FE to F6.

 

Also, Telesys' Coco Nuts (PAL), Stargunner (PAL) and Gameworld's Airlock (PAL) have high priority.

These third party PAL games are still not dumped.

8)



#1266 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:16 PM

Does Turmoil (PAL) really exist?

 

Also is that all of the SECAM carts? Anything else to add to the list?



#1267 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Aug 11, 2017 4:05 PM

Does Turmoil (PAL) really exist?

 

Also is that all of the SECAM carts? Anything else to add to the list?

 

IIRC Marco owns Turmoil (PAL), but I'm not 100% certain about this.
Perhaps it's time to remove this one until proof is shown.

Yes, all SECAM carts are dumped now, except for X-Man:
http://www.atarimani...-man_30521.html

But I doubt it's truly SECAM.

8)


Edited by Rom Hunter, Fri Aug 11, 2017 4:06 PM.


#1268 thegoldenband OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Aug 11, 2017 5:13 PM

I would love to see Pete Rose's Baseball (PAL) get dumped. If I ever get a copy I think I could do it.


I used to have it, but sold it -- alas!

#1269 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Aug 11, 2017 6:04 PM

I used to have it, but sold it -- alas!

That's too bad. It's not too rare of a cart though so someone should have one. I took a look on eBay and I saw PAL Pete Rose Baseball, Robot Tank, Stargunner, Airlock, and Commando Raid all on there. The problem is they are all too expensive for me to justify buying just to dump. I'm hoping some people got some donors with crappy labels that they don't care about, or someone has them and a dumper.

 

Pete Rose would have been dumped by now, but it is problematic with a 7800 dumper. I think I can do it with my Harmony dumper though.



#1270 thegoldenband OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Aug 11, 2017 7:26 PM

I mentioned it (and my SuperVision multicarts, also now sold) a while back, but I'm guessing maybe it wasn't possible to dump it at the time. I hope the Harmony dumper works out when you get a copy! :)



#1271 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:10 PM

I mentioned it (and my SuperVision multicarts, also now sold) a while back, but I'm guessing maybe it wasn't possible to dump it at the time. I hope the Harmony dumper works out when you get a copy! :)

I totally missed that post or it just didn't register with me at the time. At least a few dumps have emerged since I've been away. I thought about taking Birthdaymania off the list, but it sounds like there might be some differences between the released carts and the recovered source. IIRC the color of the screen is at least different.

 

 

Edit: Found some screenshots. The cartrdidge version has different colors for sure.

 

Cartridge:

http://atariage.com/...areLabelID=2805

 

Rom built from source code:

http://atariage.com/...pped/?p=3367880



#1272 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Sep 22, 2017 8:12 PM

Airlock by Gameworld (PAL). I had a very quick look and couldn't determine how much of code has true changes from the NTSC version. That requires disassembly and compare, and I don't have the time right now.

 

Attached File  Airlock (1983) (Gameworld) (133-004) (PAL).zip   2.79KB   20 downloads

 

The graphics are different. That's all I could tell without disassembly. I couldn't get too far into the game as the controls are bad.

 

Of note the Gameworld cart has DA1002, but the NTSC version by Data Age uses DA1004.



#1273 alex_79 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Sep 23, 2017 2:43 AM

Wow, quite a difference!

Player and mines are much nicer in PAL version and they're animated too.

Thanks for the dump!



#1274 thegoldenband OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Sep 23, 2017 9:13 AM

Thanks very much for the Airlock dump! I'm pretty fond of the NTSC version so I just spent an hour playing through the easy and hard modes of the PAL version. The graphical upgrade is nice, but there's an annoying bug on the topmost floor: if you jump on the "wrong" animation frame, your character will always hit his head on the ceiling -- you can only make a successful jump if your legs are bent. I was tearing my hair out trying to figure out why some of my jumps weren't working until I realized that the animation frame was the key variable.

 

I haven't tried it on real hardware (and basically can't since I'm in NTSC land), so it's possible that it's an emulator issue. Otherwise, is there any chance that this was the original code (or plan), and the NTSC release of Airlock is actually a version with the animation frames cut to get around this bug? Probably not, but it does make me curious...



#1275 alex_79 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Sep 23, 2017 1:28 PM

The bug of player hitting the ceiling on the topmost floor is present on real hardware too.

I disabled the timer to quickly test that:

Attached File  Airlock_PAL_no_timer.bin   4KB   5 downloads






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