Fine Tooned Engineering

[+kheller2]

Search the old comp.sys.atari.8bit here:

http://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.atari.8bit/topics

[ijor]

No, I don't have any info other than that. Sorry.

 

"Abandonware" is a slippery proposition, at least here in the US. It may be "abandoned" until someone comes back with a lawyer...

 

Yes, I know. Abandonware is not a legal status, of course. But in this particular case it might be valid for practical purposes.

 

I have the feeling that Spartan copyrights were left, as it is used to say, in a total limbo when the company closed down. Technically it is not in the public domain, but there is nobody that can claim copyright, and there is nobody that could send a lawyer.

 

The reason I feel/guess this situation, is because the older CSS Archiver related products don't claim any copyright. When you load Scan-It (Chip emulator for Happy 1050), there is no copyright notice whatsoever. That's quite strange.

 

Edit: It would be interesting if one of those that have contact with Bob could ask him about this. He should know.

Edited April 27, 2007 by ijor

[+Larry]

Search the old comp.sys.atari.8bit here:

http://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.atari.8bit/topics

 

Thanks. I'll take a shot at it with http://groups.google.com/advanced_search?q=&

 

But without some bit of info (author, subject, etc. it looks to be a "needle in a haystack."

 

-Larry

[Goochman]

There was someone on the 8bit mail list (I think Lance of Video 61) who is claiming ownership of SpartaDOS (everything except X maybe) - There was a big fight between him and Steve Carden about copyrights and who owned what, etc..............

 

I didnt keep any of the msgs but someone else might know what Im talking about here.

[Pab]

Hello Pab

 

I used Pab-QWK before most people even know the Internet existed. Nice to see that you are back.

 

Yeah, there are still a few of us around who remember the old days of BBS'ing. I loved the old days of FoReM and AtariLink when every BBS could have a different feel.

 

BTW there are people already working on a new version of SpartaDOS X. Maybe you can join them.

 

Well, for one thing I don't speak Polish, and that seems to be the main language of those developers. Second, this is pretty much a pet project I plan to finally see through to the end.

 

One reason is that while SDX is an excellent option for actual Atari hardware (and was my DOS of choice for years) it's not that convenient for people using emulators. There are SDX .ROMs out there, but if there's a way to "piggy back" them onto another cart's ROM I haven't found it, and if there isn't then I don't see the point. If I want to program in Action!, for example, I don't want to have to reboot with a different cartridge and DOS; I'd rather have it "plugged in" and go right to it.

 

Also, SD5 was going to have a drastically different structure and philosophy from SDX. Mike wanted it built from the ground up but backwards compatible. He saw it as an OS for hard drive and large-capacity floppy systems, taking some inspiration from what MSDOS had become.

 

I remember some of my thoughts and suggestions from our talks. The main features were going to be:

 

(1) More efficient and extensive use of the XE extended memory. A lot of the more complex functions and the command processor itself were going to be loaded into banked RAM and stay resident at all times. Since one of the main uses of Ramdisks for most users was for MEM.SAV type functions, that would be less important if the command processor almost never needed program memory, even for copy and sector copy functions. This would have also allowed us to move away from using OSRAM for anything, providing less conflict with other programs that wanted to use it. Also, nearly every command processor function (even COPY and DIR) could theoretically be executed through an XIO call.

 

(2) What I referred to as "the abstraction layer." Essentially, this would have allowed for a lot more flexible installable file systems, along the lines of what SDX had started with their ATARIDOS.SYS driver, but easier to use and expand. It would have worked essentially the way HATABS did for CIO, assigning a code character to different file systems and using recognition routines to detect a drive's file system whenever a disk was changed. I remember that "5" was going to represent our new expanded file system, "S" Sparta 2.x/3.x/X format, "A" Atari DOS 2.5 and before, "M" MyDOS large disks, "X" for DOS XE, and I half-jokingly included a "3" in the list. Yes, to demonstrate how flexible the abstraction layer was going to be, I wanted to include a driver users could load to read and WRITE to Atari DOS 3 disks. Not too useful, but a great demonstration.

 

(3) Inspired by playing around with a friend's copy of OS/2 2.1, I proposed using "extended attribute" files to add directory data not available in SDX or earlier versions while providing backward compatibility. Things like extended filenames, encryption keys, and such could be assigned to a file under SD5, but still allow the disk to (mostly) be read from earlier versions of SpartaDOS.

 

(4) Oh, since I mentioned it above, file encryption. You'd be able to assign a four character passcode to a file when you created it, and you'd need to include that passcode in the filespec when you accessed it, or it would just return garbage. I think the passcode was going to use the ! character as its signifier, like "D1:ENCRYPTD.SYS!PSWD" but I can't remember. This would have been done through a quick XOR of each character in the file as they were loaded. This was half a pipe dream back then, and would probably have been the first of my new features to be abandoned, but I still suggested it.

 

Obviously, this was only at the discussion point at that time; Mike hadn't assembled a complete "team" for SpartaDOS 5 although he had planned to, and most of this was just two guys sitting on the phone saying "wouldn't it be cool?" about this stuff. No feature set or actual disk structures had been decided upon, and within weeks I lost contact with Mike and FTe started falling off the face of the Earth.

 

Looking back, Mike may have just been blowing smoke and had no real plans for SD5 (especially since he was allegedly including SDX 4 on his MARS 8 boards) but it was nice to dream back then. Now maybe it can actually be brought back to life as PDOS (the Public Domain OS). I'd like to give it a try.

[jaybird3rd]

You may wish to get in touch with Steve Carden. He's been working for years on a new shareware Atari DOS called RealDOS, which addresses some of the problems of SpartaDOS and adds some interesting new features.

[+bf2k+]

One reason is that while SDX is an excellent option for actual Atari hardware (and was my DOS of choice for years) it's not that convenient for people using emulators. There are SDX .ROMs out there, but if there's a way to "piggy back" them onto another cart's ROM I haven't found it, and if there isn't then I don't see the point. If I want to program in Action!, for example, I don't want to have to reboot with a different cartridge and DOS; I'd rather have it "plugged in" and go right to it.

 

Also, SD5 was going to have a drastically different structure and philosophy from SDX. Mike wanted it built from the ground up but backwards compatible. He saw it as an OS for hard drive and large-capacity floppy systems, taking some inspiration from what MSDOS had become.

 

....

 

Sounds like a very interesting project. Good Luck with it :!:

[trub]

Well, for one thing I don't speak Polish, and that seems to be the main language of those developers. Second, this is pretty much a pet project I plan to finally see through to the end.

SDX 4.40 upgrade project page in English: http://trub.atari8.info/index.php3?strona=...upgrade_en.html

SDX 4.40 addenum manual in English: http://trub.atari8.info/sdx_files/4.39/sdx440manual-en.pdf

In case you have any questions regarding the SDX upgrade do not hestitate to email either me or Drac030. You can do this in English

[mutterminder]

I have one of the Sweet 16, 65816 boards in one of my 800XL's. When I originally received this board, the only supporting software that I got with it was MAC/65 modified to support the 65816. I noticed that the Rapidus 8bit Atari Turbo Card has a Sweet 16 mod. Is there any software out now that supports the Sweet 16? What about the Rapidus? I'm wondering if it would be worth while to upgrade one of my Atari's with the Rapidus? I was thinking it would be cool to upgrade a 600XL with the Rapidus and the U1MB.

[mutterminder]

Here is a picture of my 800XL with the FTe Sweet 16 installed. I remember that I also installed S-Video 2.1 in this computer. It has a 256K memory mod as well but I don't remember which version it is. It looks like I also installed BASIC Rev. C in this one too, although I don't remember doing that. Of all the mods, the S-Video 2.1 was the most work, but it wasn't as bad as the hand wired 256K memory mod that I did to another 800XL.

 

[+kheller2]

How did this 65816 deal with HALT? Is there a circuit under the CPU?

[Kyle22]

There is a GAL on the bottom of the board. It is mounted upside-down.