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Beyond Castlevania...


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#51 KevinMos3 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Dec 19, 2009 6:57 AM

The smoothest jumping I've seen yet on the 2600 was the Mega Man demo. I don't know if that's the kind of smooth jump you had in mind though.

#52 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Dec 19, 2009 12:14 PM

The smoothest jumping I've seen yet on the 2600 was the Mega Man demo. I don't know if that's the kind of smooth jump you had in mind though.

I agree. But the only reason I brought it up is cause it seems the default routine in Batari basic seems bare bones. Since megaman was done in batari basic, I wonder how the juming was done and if the routine could be easily lifted for other games

#53 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Dec 20, 2009 2:36 AM

I wanted to give an idea what a dungeon might look like layed out in a playable fasion. I only did 4 screens but this gives an nice lyout and it looks rather good I might say. There are still unused lines that can be another color. I thought about blue for water but wht do all of you think?

zelda2600palette2dungeon.PNG

I added some color and items to make it feel more like a real dungeon. Some blue for water and the vases. and a streak of yellow for fire flicker, chest locks and the edge of the door locks. There is one line in the color matrix that is still unused near the top/middle of the matrix.

zelda2600palette2dungeonitems.PNG

Edited by grafixbmp, Sun Dec 20, 2009 3:25 AM.


#54 KevinMos3 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Dec 20, 2009 5:14 PM

These all look really cool. Do you have any plans to turn it into a game one day?

#55 Mord OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Dec 20, 2009 7:06 PM


The smoothest jumping I've seen yet on the 2600 was the Mega Man demo. I don't know if that's the kind of smooth jump you had in mind though.

I agree. But the only reason I brought it up is cause it seems the default routine in Batari basic seems bare bones. Since megaman was done in batari basic, I wonder how the juming was done and if the routine could be easily lifted for other games


The Megaman demo source code was posted over here a while back, so it should be possible to find out how it's done. :)

#56 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Dec 21, 2009 12:07 AM

These all look really cool. Do you have any plans to turn it into a game one day?

I would love to. And I could more easily do it since I have some help working on the design now thanks to my friend Chris James. Also since it would probably only be possible with Harmony hardware but i'm not totaly sure on that one. For now I only plan to design on this until the first of the year, after which I am delving back into Castlevania. I hope to have atleast the first level of it and then I may just jump full force at zelda after that.

I was toying around with an alternative name like Zuldoo, Zealdo or Zooldo... something like that.

We already have some weapons design only in writing.

Iron Bomerang: You find and old rusted iron bomerang that can daze enemies but you can take it to a blacksmith and have it refined, balanced and sharpened to travel further and cut enemies to inflict damage

Hookswing: Allows one to grab onto spindles suspended in the middle of a room and then while still connected, move tward a conveyor that will push you around the spindle to the next ledge. With this you can tap the button to grab and hold. Tap the button again to retract. You can simply hold the button to extend and retract in one go. If the button is held the original implimentation applies.

More will come but the overall weapon and item collection will be around a dozen or so.

Some things will be a classic must like sword, bombs, bow and arrows... but some new or modified ones, like mentioned above, will also add much to the mix. But nothing too complexed. I mean after all this is the 2600 here and compexity is not one of it's best traits. lol

Edited by grafixbmp, Tue Dec 22, 2009 8:46 AM.


#57 MausGames OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Dec 21, 2009 4:15 AM

I like that your dungeon graphics are so dark and muted, it makes the colors blend well and foreground items stand out.

#58 roland p OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Dec 21, 2009 4:53 AM

I wanted to give an idea what a dungeon might look like layed out in a playable fasion. I only did 4 screens but this gives an nice lyout and it looks rather good I might say. There are still unused lines that can be another color. I thought about blue for water but wht do all of you think?

zelda2600palette2dungeon.PNG

I added some color and items to make it feel more like a real dungeon. Some blue for water and the vases. and a streak of yellow for fire flicker, chest locks and the edge of the door locks. There is one line in the color matrix that is still unused near the top/middle of the matrix.

zelda2600palette2dungeonitems.PNG

What about making the walls a solid color, and use missiles for the diagonals?

#59 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Dec 21, 2009 11:09 AM


I wanted to give an idea what a dungeon might look like layed out in a playable fasion. I only did 4 screens but this gives an nice lyout and it looks rather good I might say. There are still unused lines that can be another color. I thought about blue for water but wht do all of you think?

zelda2600palette2dungeon.PNG

I added some color and items to make it feel more like a real dungeon. Some blue for water and the vases. and a streak of yellow for fire flicker, chest locks and the edge of the door locks. There is one line in the color matrix that is still unused near the top/middle of the matrix.

zelda2600palette2dungeonitems.PNG

What about making the walls a solid color, and use missiles for the diagonals?


I'm afraid that if I were to do solid colors especialy for the left and right walls that there would be nothing left for the room's objects to stand apart from the rest. Every room, item, and object would be one color which would get old quick. I personaly would like to use the missles though but that might take away from the action especialy when the asociated player goes by it and the wall corners start changing to rainbow colors plus some rooms might have 6 or more corners with several in a row which makes it more of a hassle to do not to mention the missles will probably need to be used for weapons and enemy fire anyway. And to top everything off, because of the way the PF will be rendered, I don't think I can use the ball without it looking like crap.

#60 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Dec 22, 2009 1:13 AM

I finaly added some major detail to link along with some more to the dungeon. I also added the link to the overworld. Looks nice.

zelda2600e.PNG
zelda2600palette2dungeonitems2.PNG

I think I have the official title and main game theme down, however there will probably be some minnor tweaks and changes as time goes on.

Zuldoo's Myth: Dinky and the Mirrorverse

In the land of Zuldoo, there is a Legend once thought to be myth of an opposite world that exist everywhere and every time you can see your reflection, you are really looking at this other world. One day the Village Eldrer's daughter was recieving gifts for she was soon to be wedd and upon recieving a tall mirror in her private room, she disapeared without trace. A reward for her return was issued but noone knew where to start looking... except you.

You had always believed in the mirrorverse and when you learned of the mirror she had recieved that day, you were sure that was where she went to. Noone else even considered this for it was thought to be nothing but a myth.

The Elder talks with you in secret and reveals that he also thinks she was taken there as well. For the truth of such a place is closely guarded by there family. He says that the only way to get her back is for someone to go there themself but he is to frail to make such a journey. He tells you of a secret passed down through his family of a portal which would take one to the other side called the Trance Mirror. He then gives you the only clue you have to go on... A page of a book from his library depicting an old map which you don't recognize where it is refering to. So you are off and with a blessing from the elder,

"Good luck young lad on your quest."

Edited by grafixbmp, Wed Dec 23, 2009 1:17 AM.


#61 KevinMos3 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 23, 2009 8:34 PM

I really like the look of that character. Very nice. :thumbsup:

#62 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Dec 26, 2009 12:37 AM

Thank you. As you may have noticed I based him off of link's awakening. Most of the game is. I just plan to design on this from time to time. An engine will come much later. For now, I have elaborated on some of the dongeon and overworld test/demo images.

zelda2600world.PNG

zelda2600palette2dungeonitems2.PNG

I would like to see what others cn here come up with as far as another color palette/matrix. It would be possible to use multiple matricies on a single image provided they uae the same BG color unless it is a major transition like the side of a lake filling the whole lower or upper portion of the screen. I am more looking for a town palette/matrix at the moment. I also thought that the dungeon matrix can easily be changed from level to level by changing out the brown to another dark color and the BG color as well.

Edited by grafixbmp, Sat Dec 26, 2009 1:15 AM.


#63 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Dec 28, 2009 3:49 PM

Just had a crazy idea that would be rather cool for the Harmony. There was once a line of games for Commodore 64 called Forbidden Forest. One of the games was probably the first to do a constant time change as the moon would rise and fall throughout the night as the game progressed and you could also travel into the distance like that of a poor concept of 3D. I think that with the harmony this game might be possible but the only reason why I am even bringing this up is that I think that the color/BW switch could be used to switch from color to 3D! I have only seen 1 or 2 demos that try to do 3D on the 2600 but a full game I haven't. I would like to do a detailed image to atleast test how 3D might look. Granted the only way to get a good image is with the players since they have higher resolution. :ponder:

#64 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Dec 29, 2009 12:33 AM

I did a dungeon entrance in another color set (Main color and BG changed) I like this one a little better.

dungeon entrance.PNG

Added a deep purple and midtone blue/grey for an Ice crystal cavern type level. This level will have cracked floors and Ice bolders that can hinder or block your path.

Ice Crystal caverns zelda 2600.PNG

Edited by grafixbmp, Tue Dec 29, 2009 9:59 AM.


#65 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:44 AM

On to a new diversion of sorts. I may have just stumbled on a new design for an awesome game engine! But first some background.

I still have castlevania close to my heart but the overall design where everything is doable is still hard to sort out. But I haven't given up. I had the thought that if I shoot for a tougher design of a more complexed videogame, then the simper design of castlevania would come easier. May sound crazy and probably is, but I wanted to through it out there anyway.

Designing within the known constraints of the atari 2600, I believe I may have a way to create a game once made by atari for arcade (or published.) and downgraded for other systems.

Engine consist of:
Upto 48 individual enemies that are simi-independent. (Uses only player1)
there can be upto 2 types of enemies per horizontal section.
The PF is scrollable in all directions.
supports atarivox.
PF is rendered in multiple colors but only for each scanline.
MUST be designed specifically for Harmony/Melody cart.

Has potential to support 2 players sans Atarivox.


Does these things to accomplish this:
HEAVY self modifying code.
Framerate is not very high 15 to 20 frames a sec.
a big amount of Extra RAM.

PF color matrix designed originally for zelda.

Specific guidance rules for enemies (some minor constraints.)

Flicker will be a given but will have to be smart to accomplish this feat.

Rouge single blank scanlines across PF (sprite reposition)

The largest portion of the kernel is loaded from the extra RAM.

I am currently working on some mocks that will show off what this could possibly be like. And like most of my designs, this one uses all the ideas I have had and balls them up into this single engine concept.

I even bet many thought this game would never be possible and may still not be, but worth a look anyway. But what is even cooler is the potential this one has for TONS of other similar games. I will be back with some demo mocks.

Edited by grafixbmp, Tue Mar 16, 2010 3:01 AM.


#66 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:13 PM

I will give a big hint. I personally love this sprite sheet. They look so... cute. 8 sprites mirrored.PNG

#67 lapetino OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:22 PM

I will give a big hint. I personally love this sprite sheet. They look so... cute. 8 sprites mirrored.PNG


Is it Gauntlet?! And those sprites are beautiful. :) I was very excited about Castlevania continuing, but am also looking forward to whatever this is. Nice work, grafixbmp!

#68 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Mar 16, 2010 3:11 PM


I will give a big hint. I personally love this sprite sheet. They look so... cute. 8 sprites mirrored.PNG


Is it Gauntlet?! And those sprites are beautiful. :) I was very excited about Castlevania continuing, but am also looking forward to whatever this is. Nice work, grafixbmp!


You get a big piece of candy!

#69 lapetino OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Mar 16, 2010 3:16 PM



I will give a big hint. I personally love this sprite sheet. They look so... cute. 8 sprites mirrored.PNG


Is it Gauntlet?! And those sprites are beautiful. :) I was very excited about Castlevania continuing, but am also looking forward to whatever this is. Nice work, grafixbmp!


You get a big piece of candy!


Sweet! (Literally.) :)

#70 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:13 AM

Here is the first mock. I hope everyone likes it and thinks this would be fun to play on atari. Hope it is doable.
Let me know what you guy think.

gauntlet 2600 mock1.PNG

Edited by grafixbmp, Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:13 AM.


#71 ZylonBane OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:45 AM

I can already feel the headache from the 15Hz flicker.

#72 MausGames OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 17, 2010 12:00 PM

Gauntlet was a huge flickerfest on the NES and I enjoyed it; I think it's one of the few games I'd like to see ported to the 2600 that I wouldn't mind having a ton of flicker. Great work on the sprites and the playfield.

#73 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 17, 2010 7:07 PM

Really most of the time, flicker wont have to be seen. Even that mock as shown would have no flicker. Only when more than 3 enemies per horizontal row would need flicker and even still, I would only want to have 30 Hz and nothing less. Basically the max you could have is either 6 per row of the same enemy or 3 of one kind and 3 of another per row. But they would alway group themselves in threes.

#74 grafixbmp OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:24 AM

As a side note to this, I will try and explain the dynamics of the movement of all creatures as best I can cause I'm not certain if all scenarios will hold up to the movements I have planed.


If a creature comes from a spawn point then it will travel towards you. That is its main objective. If others are spawned, then they will do the same. If you are above them, they will group into twos as close doubles. If they are the only ones of that particular enemy on that horizontal section for them, they will flicker in order to merge together. If another comes along, it will do the same giving only three at this time. As long as no other type of enemy comes across this area, upto 3 other can join. However, this time the merge will be instant (appear to jump over).

All types (1 2 or 3 copies) can move horizontally just fine. So then if you are to the left or right of them, the sprite image will change accordingly and follow. If there is room for the movement (which may have to be made if it gets priority) they can move diagonally as well.

If another type of enemy has already occupied that horizontal line section when a merge is to happen, it will also be instant. And since they will always point toward you, the animation doesn't have to change for upto all three enemies as triple close. for that type.

As a side note, if the intelligence of the dynamic code allows the possibility of this, then even two to three wide would allow for intermixing of 2 types of enemies.

All of this happens on a per horizontal line basis and in order to reposition properly, at least 4 to 5 scanlines will/need to be between all enemies on the screen.

If by chance flicker happens, then even 2 diffrent types of enemies can only come close to each other as that of multiple copies (8 color clocks)

Some PF items can animate like treasure chest sparkles (sort of lol) and any high level spawn point will degrade as shot. Floor traps and such can animate as well.

I also bet the ball could play some sort of role for flash flicker possibly.

Each enemy or group of enemies will take turns shooting if they do with their respected type of shot.

Since only 2 types of enemies can be on the same line at once, then all rules must keep that possible.

However, quite possibly more than those 2 types could be on screen at once if the smarts are right in the engine.

I really am not sure how to do this game concept, but I can show how it can be done sort of speak.

If the Harmony/Melody cart were targeted for this game. And quite possibly a bankswitch type that could pre-lay out the entire PF section for loading like using self-modifying code to render with in a bank of RAM, the PF can scroll in all directions. A lower frame rate (which is what that game had anyway) can give lots of time to calculate all of this I would bet.

Im not sure how it works cause I haven't looked at the programing necessary to work it, but the Atarivox might give the voice to this game like the original had.

But if 2 player can be done (flicker for player 0 and missle 0), then the atarivox would be mute option for this form of the game.

Anyone care to speculate some? It would help my brain get a wrap around this possible approach with some dialogue. I could use so much input on this thing cause I can see it but can't figure it out. Ya know.

This would be a lot of data to crunch during 3 to 4 frames. could the DPC pull it off?

Edited by grafixbmp, Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:31 AM.


#75 ZylonBane OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:51 AM

Gauntlet was a huge flickerfest on the NES...

Eh?




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