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Happy 25th 7800 - Sales Figures Attached...


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#1 Curt Vendel OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 5:33 PM

To begin the celebration of the Atari 7800's 25th birthday/anniversay, I am attaching the original internal Atari Sales reports from 1986-1990 on the Atari 7800... I know everyone has always wondered how well it sold, here is the info.


Attached File  7800_sales.zip   34.83KB   895 downloads

Curt

#2 ApolloBoy OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 5:42 PM

So there were 151,183 sold in total, right? Sounds real small compared to the NES or SMS.

#3 DracIsBack OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 5:48 PM

To begin the celebration of the Atari 7800's 25th birthday/anniversay, I am attaching the original internal Atari Sales reports from 1986-1990 on the Atari 7800... I know everyone has always wondered how well it sold, here is the info.


What format is this in?

#4 GroovyBee OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 5:49 PM

To me, the most interesting part to see are the company names listed in the loan units. Some good software houses in there that did nothing for the machine :(.

#5 GroovyBee OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 5:50 PM

What format is this in?

Text-file-o-vision!

#6 Impaler_26 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 5:51 PM

Thanks for sharing!

#7 Mitch OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 6:10 PM

So there were 151,183 sold in total, right? Sounds real small compared to the NES or SMS.


Uh no, where did you get that number from?
There was 286,417 from 1986 alone.

And thanks to Curt for the infos. :thumbsup:

Mitch

#8 Ransom OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 6:46 PM

Thank you for posting that, Curt! It's nifty to see this stuff.

#9 Allan OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 7:00 PM

To me, the most interesting part to see are the company names listed in the loan units. Some good software houses in there that did nothing for the machine :(.



Like these?

L001038 - IBID INC. 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001042 - BOB VIERA 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001045 - COMPUTER MANIA 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001047 - DAVID PAYNE 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001048 - LAWRENCE HALL OF SCIENCE 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001050 - ANDROMEDA SOFTWARE 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001051 - SORJANA PUBLICATIONS 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001052 - ULTIMATE SUPPORT SYSTEMS 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001056 - COMPUTER CURRICULUM CORP 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001058 - COMPUTER CURRICULUM CORP 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001059 - COMPUTER CURRICULUM CORP 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001060 - IMA 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001061 - COMPUTER & SOFTWARE NEWS 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001062 - AKRON BEACON JOURNAL 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001063 - COMPUTER CURRICULM 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001064 - M.I.S. WEEK 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001065 - DESKTOP PUBLISHING JOURNA 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001066 - MILATARI 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001067 - SOFTGOLD GMBH 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001068 - U.S. VIDEO GAME TEAM 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001075 - WOLFRAM RESEARCH 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001079 - BORLAND INTERNATIONAL 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001083 - DAVE SMALL & ASSOCIATES 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001088 - GRIFFITH OBSERVATORY 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001096 - PRODIGY SERVICES 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001109 - KENNETH HILL 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001111 - VIDEO CONNECTIONS 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001113 - N VIEW CORP. 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001115 - ELECTRONIC GAME PLAYER 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001121 - EXIDY, INC 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001123 - AMIDEI & CO. 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001128 - DRAUDT & ASSOCIATES 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001131 - MILWAUKEE JOURNAL 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001132 - LIZ METZGER 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001159 - D.M. PRODUCTS 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001168 - JOE COPSON 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001172 - MEDIA WEST 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001184 - U.S. GOLD 0 $.00 0 $.00
L001196 - I.T.D.C. 0 $.00 0 $.00

Interesting. I see Joe Copson of 5200 Star Raiders and Elevator Action fame was possible working on a 7800 game in 1987. Cool.

Maybe somebody could find some prototypes by using this list.

Allan

#10 Allan OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 7:07 PM

There is an Atari Chicago in there. Anybody know anything about this?

Allan

#11 GroovyBee OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 7:07 PM

Maybe somebody could find some prototypes by using this list.

:cool: It might jog a few memories.

#12 8th lutz OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 7:20 PM

To me, the most interesting part to see are the company names listed in the loan units. Some good software houses in there that did nothing for the machine :(.






L001131 - MILWAUKEE JOURNAL 0 $.00 0 $.00


The Milwaukee Journal is not a software house to my knowledge. Here is the proof: http://en.wikipedia....ournal_Sentinel . You will see a Milwaukee Journal Section on the wikipedia page.

The Milwaukee Journal was an afternoon newspaper in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. That is the Newspaper I read when I was a kid back in the 1980's through 1995.

The Milwaukee Journal is known as the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel after the Milwaukee Journal was consolidated with the Milwaukee Sentinel in Spring of 1995. I was a teen when the two papers were consolidated.

I am guessing Atari had plans of putting Atari 7800 games or system ads in the Milwaukee Journal during that time frame.

Edited by 8th lutz, Sun May 24, 2009 7:26 PM.


#13 GroovyBee OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 7:25 PM

The Milwaukee Journal is not a software house to my knowledge.

I never said it was. For some reason what tickled me most was seeing Borland International in there.

#14 8th lutz OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 7:29 PM

The Milwaukee Journal is not a software house to my knowledge.

I never said it was. For some reason what tickled me most was seeing Borland International in there.

Allen listed it with software houses. I even seen another newspaper in his list.

#15 Allan OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 7:32 PM

The Milwaukee Journal is not a software house to my knowledge.

I never said it was. For some reason what tickled me most was seeing Borland International in there.

Allen listed it with software houses. I even seen another newspaper in his list.

Actually the list was loaned 7800s. That could be for reviews or other things as well as development.

Allan

#16 DracIsBack OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 7:42 PM

I am guessing Atari had plans of putting Atari 7800 games or system ads in the Milwaukee Journal during that time frame.


Probably a review copy.When companies have limited marketing dollars, they often put more emphasis into securing reviews.


Thanks for the tip on the text file. i changed extensions and it worked. Interestingly though, the grand totals for 1987 and 1988 (presumably the best sales years of the system) show up as ***** for me.

I see:
1986: 286,417 units in US (less 742 RMA)
1987: Don't see total units (less 13831 RMA)
1988: Don't see total units in US (less 38817 RMA)
1989: 655,353 units in the US (less 50932 RMA)
1990: 93,443 units in the US (less 46861 RMA)

Based upon the units I do see, it looks like the 7800 moved 948,793 units in the US in 1986+1989+1990. Looking at the revenue numbers below for 1986 and 1987), it seems reasonable to assume that the number I heard of the 7800 selling 2 million units in the US (according to ACE magazine) seems reasonable.

Total revenues for consoles in US (not counting games, accessories, revenue in countries other than the US) looks like as follows:

Net Revenue
$4,673,186.06 (1986)
$32,487,598.65 (1987)
$37,917,287.05 (1988)
$12,326,431.77 (1989)
$290,911.78 (1990)
$87,695,415.31 (Total 1986-1990)

Edited by DracIsBack, Sun May 24, 2009 8:07 PM.


#17 8th lutz OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 7:44 PM

The Milwaukee Journal is not a software house to my knowledge.

I never said it was. For some reason what tickled me most was seeing Borland International in there.

Allen listed it with software houses. I even seen another newspaper in his list.

Actually the list was loaned 7800s. That could be for reviews or other things as well as development.

Allan


Come to think of it, I recalled the Milwaukee Journal having a small section in their newspaper for reviewing video games back in the late 1980's though the 16 bit era if I remembered right.

#18 GroovyBee OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 7:47 PM

Probably a review copy.When companies have limited marketing dollars, they often put more emphasis into securing reviews.

Yep! Makes sense. Why take out a large advert in a paper, when you can say more in a review and they send the unit back when they've finished with it. However, that does assume that the product will get a good review in the first place.

#19 Mitch OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 9:20 PM

Interestingly though, the grand totals for 1987 and 1988 (presumably the best sales years of the system) show up as ***** for me.

I see:
1986: 286,417 units in US (less 742 RMA)
1987: Don't see total units (less 13831 RMA)
1988: Don't see total units in US (less 38817 RMA)
1989: 655,353 units in the US (less 50932 RMA)
1990: 93,443 units in the US (less 46861 RMA)


I was a glutton for punishment and added up the totals for 87 and 88.
Here are my numbers:

1986 286,417
1987 1,313,561
1988 1,423,977
1989 655,353
1990 93,443

Total 3,772,751

I think those negative numbers listed are already accounted for and don't affect the sale units.

Obviously these numbers don't count the 84 test market sales and anything sold in 91 and after but those probably weren't real high numbers. I wonder how many were sold outside the US.

Mitch

#20 DracIsBack OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 9:25 PM

I think those negative numbers listed are already accounted for and don't affect the sale units.


It will vary from retailer to retailer. Same may review inventory every quarter and make returns. Others may review annually and make returns. Others may be really disorganized and return years later.

I'm working on a spreadsheet now that calculates a bunch of data points together out of these.

Obviously these numbers don't count the 84 test market sales and anything sold in 91 and after but those probably weren't real high numbers.



More thank likely what's in 1991 and (beyond) is RMA and/or clearance. Does this sheet capture mail-order direct from Atari sales too?

#21 ApolloBoy OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun May 24, 2009 10:17 PM

So there were 151,183 sold in total, right? Sounds real small compared to the NES or SMS.


Uh no, where did you get that number from?
There was 286,417 from 1986 alone.

And thanks to Curt for the infos. :thumbsup:

Mitch

Oops, I must've been reading it wrong. I'm not really sure how the lists are formatted.

#22 Atarifever OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon May 25, 2009 9:17 AM

Interestingly though, the grand totals for 1987 and 1988 (presumably the best sales years of the system) show up as ***** for me.

I see:
1986: 286,417 units in US (less 742 RMA)
1987: Don't see total units (less 13831 RMA)
1988: Don't see total units in US (less 38817 RMA)
1989: 655,353 units in the US (less 50932 RMA)
1990: 93,443 units in the US (less 46861 RMA)


I was a glutton for punishment and added up the totals for 87 and 88.
Here are my numbers:

1986 286,417
1987 1,313,561
1988 1,423,977
1989 655,353
1990 93,443

Total 3,772,751

I think those negative numbers listed are already accounted for and don't affect the sale units.

Obviously these numbers don't count the 84 test market sales and anything sold in 91 and after but those probably weren't real high numbers. I wonder how many were sold outside the US.

Mitch

So the generally given estimate of 2 million is off by half, and that's only the U.S. data? Even 4 million puts it ahead of the O2, and would have made it a realative success in the previous generation (inty and Coleco only did 6 million or so, didn't they).

So. at that time, Atari had 3-4 million 7800s in homes, a few million Jrs, millions of older 2600s, some XEGSes, and many computers. The 7800 game sales alone brought in almost $90 million (obviously not all profit, but no small part profit either). I think the picture of the company Tramiel actually pulled back from the grave is becoming clearer. I wouldn't have focused too much effort on the 7800 either if a $100 million division can be made from almost nothing.

#23 Curt Vendel OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon May 25, 2009 11:07 AM

I'll post the 2600 figures tomorrow over in the 2600 forum, which is VERY impressive...

The XE figures.... not so great overall... To be honest, looks like the Tramiels shouldn't have had the 2 year hiatus, they had product ready to go, and 5 months to gear up for the holidays, even mildly, they should've keep a better presence in 84-85 while working on the ST's and should immediately considered a stripped down ST as the next game console for a holiday 86 release - it would've been VERY feasible.


Curt

Interestingly though, the grand totals for 1987 and 1988 (presumably the best sales years of the system) show up as ***** for me.

I see:
1986: 286,417 units in US (less 742 RMA)
1987: Don't see total units (less 13831 RMA)
1988: Don't see total units in US (less 38817 RMA)
1989: 655,353 units in the US (less 50932 RMA)
1990: 93,443 units in the US (less 46861 RMA)


I was a glutton for punishment and added up the totals for 87 and 88.
Here are my numbers:

1986 286,417
1987 1,313,561
1988 1,423,977
1989 655,353
1990 93,443

Total 3,772,751

I think those negative numbers listed are already accounted for and don't affect the sale units.

Obviously these numbers don't count the 84 test market sales and anything sold in 91 and after but those probably weren't real high numbers. I wonder how many were sold outside the US.

Mitch

So the generally given estimate of 2 million is off by half, and that's only the U.S. data? Even 4 million puts it ahead of the O2, and would have made it a realative success in the previous generation (inty and Coleco only did 6 million or so, didn't they).

So. at that time, Atari had 3-4 million 7800s in homes, a few million Jrs, millions of older 2600s, some XEGSes, and many computers. The 7800 game sales alone brought in almost $90 million (obviously not all profit, but no small part profit either). I think the picture of the company Tramiel actually pulled back from the grave is becoming clearer. I wouldn't have focused too much effort on the 7800 either if a $100 million division can be made from almost nothing.



#24 DracIsBack OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon May 25, 2009 11:58 AM

I'll post the 2600 figures tomorrow over in the 2600 forum, which is VERY impressive...


At under 50 bucks, with a wide range of games (many quite cheap) and the brand equity of being the last generation's winner, I don't doubt they moved a few.

The XE figures.... not so great overall...


I also believe it here. It wasn't cheap and it was confusing branding. Still, I look forward to seeing. Thanks for sharing all this, Curt.

#25 Retro Rogue OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu May 28, 2009 3:13 PM

The Milwaukee Journal is not a software house to my knowledge.

I never said it was. For some reason what tickled me most was seeing Borland International in there.

Allen listed it with software houses. I even seen another newspaper in his list.

Actually the list was loaned 7800s. That could be for reviews or other things as well as development.

Allan



Yes, there were Atari user groups in the list as well - such as Milatari.




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