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Donkey Kong Arcade (ColecoVision)


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#26 Pixelboy OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 7, 2009 11:47 AM

I wonder if those 'new' levels that that guy made for the arcade version could be hacked into this? That is if he gave permission of course.

Tempest

You mean Champ Kong? johnnywc already gave his blessing for Eduardo to integrate the extra Champ levels in Donkey Kong Arcade, and you can even see those levels in the mockups I made a couple of years ago.

However, since then, Eduardo has studied the arcade ROMs of Donkey Kong a lot more, and it may not be as easy as most people think to add those extra levels. I'm sure Eduardo has more to say about that. :)

Or perhaps you're referring to Donkey Kong 2 - Jumpman Returns? That looks cool, but complicated to port to the CV, even with the MegaCart...

#27 Tempest OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 7, 2009 11:48 AM

Or perhaps you're referring to Donkey Kong 2 - Jumpman Returns? That looks cool, but complicated to port to the CV, even with the MegaCart...

Yeah those are the levels I was talking about.

Tempest

#28 Trebor OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 7, 2009 11:54 AM

Oh, you can even get the bezel artwork for it here:

http://mrdo.mameworl...e_otherart.html

Just look under the MisfitMAME Artwork section.

Here's a couple of snapshots of the game (With the bezel cut out):
0001.png 0006.png 0010.png
0018.png 0034.png 0040.png
0045.png 0076.png 0094.png
0105.png 0116.png 0128.png
0149.png

-Trebor

#29 Jess Ragan OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 7, 2009 7:50 PM

I'd just be happy with an accurate conversion of Donkey Kong, without the extra stages from D2K. I remember when the ADAM version of Super Donkey Kong was ported to the ColecoVision. I was so excited to get a copy, but when I actually played it... bleech.

Edited by Jess Ragan, Tue Jul 7, 2009 7:51 PM.


#30 opcode OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 7, 2009 9:56 PM

Last update of the day (and for a while). Stage 3, mostly playable. Missing is the sprite "flicker" routine. I will leave that for last, as I need to know how much free CPU I still have after all the game routines are done.


EDIT: Ok, I just found out that (believe it or not), I still have around 50% free CPU in stage. How do I know that? I change a video attribute as soon as NMI happens and change the attribute back once NMI completes. Instant CPU meter on screen. Anyways, the game is still missing sound and a better sprite driver, but the good news is that the sprite driver should indeed be quite efficient with so much free CPU.

Edited by opcode, Tue Jul 7, 2009 10:12 PM.


#31 Pixelboy OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 4:30 AM

Last update of the day (and for a while). Stage 3, mostly playable. Missing is the sprite "flicker" routine. I will leave that for last, as I need to know how much free CPU I still have after all the game routines are done.

While I was watching that latest video, I kept expecting to see Mario's death animation. I see you got the Pauline item pickup working, although I notice the score never increases at the top of the screen. ;)

EDIT: Ok, I just found out that (believe it or not), I still have around 50% free CPU in stage. How do I know that? I change a video attribute as soon as NMI happens and change the attribute back once NMI completes. Instant CPU meter on screen. Anyways, the game is still missing sound and a better sprite driver, but the good news is that the sprite driver should indeed be quite efficient with so much free CPU.

Best news I've heard all day! :D So do you expect that you will get that same amount of free CPU on all stages? I would expect Stage 1 (the girders stage) to be a bit busier than Stage 3, especially later into the game, when things get more hectic.

#32 Trebor OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 9:02 AM

Hi Opcode,

I'm curious as to how you are selecting the color palette and if there will be an option to pick between palettes.

One palette can represent the colors as seen on the TKG-02 hardware which are the Red Donkey Kong cabinets that are conversions of Radarscope. The other and arguably more common were the colors as seen on the TKG-04 hardware or Blue Donkey Kong cabinets. Depending on who you ask, a person will swear by one palette or the other, of course dependent on which cabinet/hardware they were playing the game on.

I took some screen captures along with the cabinet they represent of both the TKG-02 hardware and TKG-04 hardware to demonstrate the aforementioned. Please note I used the Donkey Kong Japan Set 1 set (dkongjp) in MAME just for the easiness of passing all boards on the first sweep as opposed to the US board progression. Nonetheless, both hardware conversions and cabinets were available in the US, Japan and elsewhere:

DKTKG02_1.PNG DKTKG04_1.PNG
DKTKG02_2.PNG DKTKG04_2.PNG
DKTKG02_3.PNG DKTKG04_3.PNG
DKTKG02_4.PNG DKTKG04_4.PNG
DKTKG02_5.PNG DKTKG04_5.PNG
DKTKG02_6.PNG DKTKG04_6.PNG
DKTKG02_7.PNG DKTKG04_7.PNG
DKTKG02_8.PNG DKTKG04_8.PNG
DKTKG02_9.PNG DKTKG04_9.PNG
DKRED.PNG DKBLUE.PNG

-Trebor

Edited by Trebor, Wed Jul 8, 2009 9:04 AM.


#33 Pixelboy OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 9:28 AM

Hi Opcode,

I'm curious as to how you are selecting the color palette and if there will be an option to pick between palettes.

One palette can represent the colors as seen on the TKG-02 hardware which are the Red Donkey Kong cabinets that are conversions of Radarscope. The other and arguably more common were the colors as seen on the TKG-04 hardware or Blue Donkey Kong cabinets. Depending on who you ask, a person will swear by one palette or the other, of course dependent on which cabinet/hardware they were playing the game on.

I'm not really sure where you're coming from with this question, but the ColecoVision only has 16 colors, and they are not editable. So aside from changing the red girders into magenta girders, there's not much that can be done in terms of color adjustments between the TKG-02 and TKG-04 palette on the ColecoVision port.

#34 5-11under OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 9:44 AM

Hi Trebor,

It's a ColecoVision. Besides black, white, grey and see-through, there's only 12 other fixed colours available... unless this game is linked with the planned opgrade module.

Thanks,
5-11under

edit: looks like Pixelboy beat me to it.

Edited by 5-11under, Wed Jul 8, 2009 9:45 AM.


#35 Trebor OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 10:26 AM

...the ColecoVision only has 16 colors, and they are not editable. So aside from changing the red girders into magenta girders, there's not much that can be done in terms of color adjustments between the TKG-02 and TKG-04 palette on the ColecoVision port.


Thanks for the answer, Pixelboy. I do not know the ColecoVision was limited to 16 colors.
I appreciate the response.

-Trebor

#36 retroclouds OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 1:14 PM

Last update of the day (and for a while). Stage 3, mostly playable. Missing is the sprite "flicker" routine. I will leave that for last, as I need to know how much free CPU I still have after all the game routines are done.


EDIT: Ok, I just found out that (believe it or not), I still have around 50% free CPU in stage. How do I know that? I change a video attribute as soon as NMI happens and change the attribute back once NMI completes. Instant CPU meter on screen. Anyways, the game is still missing sound and a better sprite driver, but the good news is that the sprite driver should indeed be quite efficient with so much free CPU.



Hi opcode,

this is very interesting. I understand the part setting an attribute when entering NMI
and setting attribute back once NMI completes. But how do you use this/visualize as CPU meter.

Are you then looking at debugger out/VDP regs? Would you mind sharing some more info
on this (perhaps youtube video of CPU meter in action).

Reason I'm asking is because I'm currently working on a homebrew version of Time Pilot for
the Texas Instruments TI-99/4A () and this
computer has the same VDP as the colecovision.


Thanks
Filip

www.retroclouds.de

#37 opcode OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 1:51 PM

Hi opcode,

this is very interesting. I understand the part setting an attribute when entering NMI
and setting attribute back once NMI completes. But how do you use this/visualize as CPU meter.

Are you then looking at debugger out/VDP regs? Would you mind sharing some more info
on this (perhaps youtube video of CPU meter in action).

Reason I'm asking is because I'm currently working on a homebrew version of Time Pilot for
the Texas Instruments TI-99/4A () and this
computer has the same VDP as the colecovision.


Thanks
Filip

www.retroclouds.de


First of all let me tell you that your Time Pilot is quite impressive. Loved it. Are you using background and sprites for the clouds?
About the CPU meter, that depends on the way your program work. If everything is done inside the NMI or everything done outside the NMI, you can set the background color (register 7) to some bright color in the beggining of your game control loop, then set it back to default color once the block is done. A frame (NTSC/60Hz) has 262 scanlines more less. You just need to check how many scanlines are left in default color. Then divide the number by 262 and voila, you have your free CPU percentage.

#38 opcode OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 2:10 PM

Last update of the day (and for a while). Stage 3, mostly playable. Missing is the sprite "flicker" routine. I will leave that for last, as I need to know how much free CPU I still have after all the game routines are done.

While I was watching that latest video, I kept expecting to see Mario's death animation.


I am a pretty good player, what can I do... :D

I see you got the Pauline item pickup working, although I notice the score never increases at the top of the screen. ;)

I am playing in attract mode, so no score updates...

EDIT: Ok, I just found out that (believe it or not), I still have around 50% free CPU in stage. How do I know that? I change a video attribute as soon as NMI happens and change the attribute back once NMI completes. Instant CPU meter on screen. Anyways, the game is still missing sound and a better sprite driver, but the good news is that the sprite driver should indeed be quite efficient with so much free CPU.

Best news I've heard all day! :D


Really? Best news I heard today is that I will be a proud father of a baby boy (in four months)... :D

So do you expect that you will get that same amount of free CPU on all stages? I would expect Stage 1 (the girders stage) to be a bit busier than Stage 3, especially later into the game, when things get more hectic.


That is correct, stage 1 is the busiest. Stages 2 and 4 are similar to stage 3.
In fact stage 1 is so demanding that I will need to multiplex sprites in order to display all the objects. But that is the beauty of the thing, stage 1 will prove many things about this port... :)

Eduardo

#39 opcode OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 2:34 PM

Finally, to celebrate the day, a new video footage of stage 4 mostly playable. Since the sprite driver isn't complete yet, sprites vanish badly. But you know, in the end I am expecting this game to flick slightly less than Pac-Man Collection did on average, or about the same in the worst case scenario. Most the time (95%+) flickering shouldn’t go worst than 20Hz. 20Hz means Mario with the hammer plus 4 enemies in the same scanline. That hardly happens, even in stage 4. Stage 2 uses 2 sprites per cement pan, but sprites aren’t in the same scanline, so probably stage 4 will be the worst case. But even so the game hardly puts 4 enemies in the same scanline. 20Hz was the worst case in Ms Pac-Man. I would say that most of the time we will have Mario and 1 or 2 enemies in the same scanline, and that is 45Hz~30Hz flickering or better. 30Hz looks like interlaced video, the sprites look kind of translucent, darker than usual because of the multiplexing with the dark background.



#40 retroillucid ONLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 2:38 PM

Really? Best news I heard today is that I will be a proud father of a baby boy (in four months)... :D


Congrat Eduardo! :D

#41 Pixelboy OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 2:38 PM

While I was watching that latest video, I kept expecting to see Mario's death animation.

I am a pretty good player, what can I do... :D

On some instinctive level, it actually thrills me to see those fireballs and springs moving around the platforms just like they do in the arcade game. This looks so much better then the original pack-in DK CV game... :lust:

I see you got the Pauline item pickup working, although I notice the score never increases at the top of the screen. ;)

I am playing in attract mode, so no score updates...

Ah, yeah, that explains it. :)

EDIT: Ok, I just found out that (believe it or not), I still have around 50% free CPU in stage. How do I know that? I change a video attribute as soon as NMI happens and change the attribute back once NMI completes. Instant CPU meter on screen. Anyways, the game is still missing sound and a better sprite driver, but the good news is that the sprite driver should indeed be quite efficient with so much free CPU.

Best news I've heard all day! :D

Really? Best news I heard today is that I will be a proud father of a baby boy (in four months)... :D

A-ah! So you'll be painting the baby's room in blue, not pink! :D
(In case anyone here is wondering, I've known about this since last April.)


So do you expect that you will get that same amount of free CPU on all stages? I would expect Stage 1 (the girders stage) to be a bit busier than Stage 3, especially later into the game, when things get more hectic.

That is correct, stage 1 is the busiest. Stages 2 and 4 are similar to stage 3.
In fact stage 1 is so demanding that I will need to multiplex sprites in order to display all the objects. But that is the beauty of the thing, stage 1 will prove many things about this port... :)

Indeed. There can potentially be so many sprite-related things happening on the same scanline simultaneously that you will have no choice but to implement a sprite multiplexer that will manage everything on the screen in a generalized way. To make the flickering acceptable will be quite a challenge indeed. :)

Edited by Pixelboy, Wed Jul 8, 2009 2:40 PM.


#42 Pixelboy OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 2:46 PM

Finally, to celebrate the day, a new video footage of stage 4 mostly playable. Since the sprite driver isn't complete yet, sprites vanish badly. But you know, in the end I am expecting this game to flick slightly less than Pac-Man Collection did on average, or about the same in the worst case scenario. Most the time (95%+) flickering shouldn’t go worst than 20Hz. 20Hz means Mario with the hammer plus 4 enemies in the same scanline. That hardly happens, even in stage 4. Stage 2 uses 2 sprites per cement pan, but sprites aren’t in the same scanline, so probably stage 4 will be the worst case. But even so the game hardly puts 4 enemies in the same scanline. 20Hz was the worst case in Ms Pac-Man. I would say that most of the time we will have Mario and 1 or 2 enemies in the same scanline, and that is 45Hz~30Hz flickering or better. 30Hz looks like interlaced video, the sprites look kind of translucent, darker than usual because of the multiplexing with the dark background.

Looks wonderful! :D

Once the sprite driver is done, the only problem is that you won't be able to show these clips on YouTube anymore. Remember the YouTube problems we had with Pac-Man Collection? :ponder:

#43 opcode OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 2:53 PM

Indeed. There can potentially be so many sprite-related things happening on the same scanline simultaneously that you will have no choice but to implement a sprite multiplexer that will manage everything on the screen in a generalized way. To make the flickering acceptable will be quite a challenge indeed. :)


Pac-Man Collection managed sprite flickering the best way possible (literally). Too technical to explain here, but suffice to say it even used bubble sort. Since we still have enough CPU, I can do the same, albeit in a more optimized way...

#44 opcode OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 2:54 PM

Really? Best news I heard today is that I will be a proud father of a baby boy (in four months)... :D


Congrat Eduardo! :D


Thanks, thanks... :)

#45 retroclouds OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jul 8, 2009 11:49 PM

Hi opcode,

this is very interesting. I understand the part setting an attribute when entering NMI
and setting attribute back once NMI completes. But how do you use this/visualize as CPU meter.

Are you then looking at debugger out/VDP regs? Would you mind sharing some more info
on this (perhaps youtube video of CPU meter in action).

Reason I'm asking is because I'm currently working on a homebrew version of Time Pilot for
the Texas Instruments TI-99/4A () and this
computer has the same VDP as the colecovision.


Thanks
Filip

www.retroclouds.de


First of all let me tell you that your Time Pilot is quite impressive. Loved it. Are you using background and sprites for the clouds?
About the CPU meter, that depends on the way your program work. If everything is done inside the NMI or everything done outside the NMI, you can set the background color (register 7) to some bright color in the beggining of your game control loop, then set it back to default color once the block is done. A frame (NTSC/60Hz) has 262 scanlines more less. You just need to check how many scanlines are left in default color. Then divide the number by 262 and voila, you have your free CPU percentage.


Thanks, well this is still a very early BETA so there is still a lot to do ... and learn along the way ;-)
Currently I'm using 2 sprites for the clouds. But most likely I'll not keep it that way.
Could imagine that the sprite flickering routine checks the gray part of the cloud, if required removes 1 sprite and turn the white part into a solid white cloud.
However using background tiles is an option, but I first need to check how that goes together with the bullet tiles.

Thanks for explaining the CPU meter trick, that is great. I really like the 9918 VDP :-)

#46 opcode OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Jul 9, 2009 6:59 AM

Thanks, well this is still a very early BETA so there is still a lot to do ... and learn along the way ;-)
Currently I'm using 2 sprites for the clouds. But most likely I'll not keep it that way.
Could imagine that the sprite flickering routine checks the gray part of the cloud, if required removes 1 sprite and turn the white part into a solid white cloud.
However using background tiles is an option, but I first need to check how that goes together with the bullet tiles.

Thanks for explaining the CPU meter trick, that is great. I really like the 9918 VDP :-)


Why don't you use tiles for the big clouds and sprites for the little ones? This way you keep the multilayer scrolling, but save sprites for the enemy ships...

#47 retroclouds OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Jul 9, 2009 7:25 AM

Thanks, well this is still a very early BETA so there is still a lot to do ... and learn along the way ;-)
Currently I'm using 2 sprites for the clouds. But most likely I'll not keep it that way.
Could imagine that the sprite flickering routine checks the gray part of the cloud, if required removes 1 sprite and turn the white part into a solid white cloud.
However using background tiles is an option, but I first need to check how that goes together with the bullet tiles.

Thanks for explaining the CPU meter trick, that is great. I really like the 9918 VDP :-)


Why don't you use tiles for the big clouds and sprites for the little ones? This way you keep the multilayer scrolling, but save sprites for the enemy ships...


I currently still have 14 sprites left, which is not that much.
The good news though is that the bullets are already tiles.

Depending on the implementation I guess I can save 4 to 8 cloud sprites.
Don't yet know how big the CPU impact would be for moving/manipulating the cloud tiles
(perhaps doing small clouds as tiles is an alternative option as they move slower)

Would be interesting to see how the bullet tiles cope with the cloud tiles.
Definitly worth checking out, cause saving 8 sprites is a lot (and benefits from less flickering)

Note that the pilot ship is made of 2 sprites and background.

#48 Yurkie OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Jul 9, 2009 8:22 AM

opcode,

The game looks Awesome so far.

Several Questions:

1.) Will this require your opcode module to play?

2.) Is this Module completed and working?

3.) If module is needed what will it cost?

4.) Do you have an approximate completion date yet?

Lastly, I defiantly want to be on the list for a copy of this awesome game.

#49 opcode OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Jul 9, 2009 12:30 PM

Now we have something. Stage 1 mostly playable. Still missing is the oil drum fire animation. Sprites vanish a lot in this stage, because the flicker/multiplexer isn't implemented yet. However the sprite driver evolved slightly and now it is more intelligent in terms of sprite allocation.
Other than the sprites vanishing, I would appreciate comments on this screen, since it seems to be the most complex in terms of enemy movement and such. for all the hardcore DK fans here, please let me know if the patterns, animation, whatever, look right.



#50 Corby OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Jul 9, 2009 12:41 PM

kong sorta grabs the barrels alittle fast doesn't he?




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