Metal Ghost Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Hi all. Just a random thought going through my head yesterday, but nonetheless I thought it was kind of an interesting question to post out to the community. When working on 7800 projects, what type of machine/set-up do you work on? Classic Atari foundation? Or a modern PC? Or something in between! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Modern PC using CC65, NMAKE, DASM (rarely now) and a variety of custom tools written either in Perl or C/C++ and a couple of art packages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickeycolumbus Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 I used to use OS X with DASM and V7800 run through DOSBox. It was terribly slow... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mellis Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Hi all. Just a random thought going through my head yesterday, but nonetheless I thought it was kind of an interesting question to post out to the community. When working on 7800 projects, what type of machine/set-up do you work on? Classic Atari foundation? Or a modern PC? Or something in between! Computer: Mac Pro, eight-core Assembler: CA65 (the assembler bundled with CC65) IDE: Xcode (configured to compile and link using the CC65 toolchain) Video capture: EyeTV PVR-250 (S-video/composite in) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakasama Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 Wow, I don't see too many programmers that use a Mac often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mellis Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 Wow, I don't see too many programmers that use a Mac often. Funny. The developers I work with the most all use Macs. They're the best UNIX workstations around. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+SpiceWare Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 I do all my VCS development on a Mac. Someday I plan to try my hand at something for the 7800. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DracIsBack Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 I've been at a number of developer conference (even though i've not a developer) with over 1000 attendees. The number of Devs with Macs is a lot more than it used to be. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Usotsuki Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 I haven't been able to dev for Ataris yet, but for Apple (same basic cpu), I usually crossdevelop on a Linux box using cc65/ca65. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Random Terrain Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 In the year 2014, I use batari Basic 7800 with the bB 7800 IDE Visual batari Basic 7800. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakasama Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Funny. The developers I work with the most all use Macs. They're the best UNIX workstations around. I was talking about the programmers around here. I use xcode too but it's just to roll my own MacMAME. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdement Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 An old x86 workstation with CentOS linux installed. HP Kayak dual Xeon 450mhz, 1.5GB RAM, semi-modern IDE drives as the old SCSI finally died. It also runs a more modern video card, the original card was ridiculous. It's my general linux desktop box. That machine has a GUI but I prefer using vim in text mode (not a GUI window). dasm to assemble, sign7800 for the signature (great program, compiles easily with no dependencies). For testing that machine has XMESS, but I don't use it much. I usually use Prosystem from my Windows machine over the network. The main reason I prefer to use linux for 7800 coding is because symlinks come in very handy with some files being shared between projects. Windows has 3 separate imitations of that concept but I didn't find any of them to work as conveniently as a real symlink. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metal Ghost Posted January 21, 2011 Author Share Posted January 21, 2011 In the year 2014, I use batari Basic 7800 with the bB 7800 IDE Visual batari Basic 7800. I love it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metal Ghost Posted February 4, 2011 Author Share Posted February 4, 2011 Do most of the 7800 programmers code in C and then complile their source? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 Do most of the 7800 programmers code in C and then complile their source? Alas no. That's just me at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metal Ghost Posted February 4, 2011 Author Share Posted February 4, 2011 Then is coding in 6502 Assembly the de facto method? Please forgive me if I'm showing my noobness here....I'm just extremely curious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 There was a bit of "C" coding done some years ago on the 7800 too. It was for the Robot Kitten port. If you search the forums you'll find it. 6502 is pretty much the only solution on the 7800 at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bomberpunk Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 i code in qbasic and html. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metal Ghost Posted February 4, 2011 Author Share Posted February 4, 2011 6502 is pretty much the only solution on the 7800 at the moment. Are more tools necessary than CC65 is able to provide in order to facilitate coding in C?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 Are more tools necessary than CC65 is able to provide in order to facilitate coding in C?? For the 7800 you need a78sign to put the signature in the ROM image. I'm assuming that you have your own favourite text editor, art package and the like. I also use NMAKE to control the build process. Many programmers write their own custom tools to help out with certain tasks as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricBall Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 Are more tools necessary than CC65 is able to provide in order to facilitate coding in C?? It all depends on what "coding in C" means. Obviously the 7800 doesn't have I/O which would fit stdio.h, so that's kinda out. The C compiler would also have to do the following (off the top of my head): 1. Provide a peek & poke to modify the TIA, MARIA and RIOT registers. (Although I guess this could be done with pointers.) 2. Handle the 7800 memory map (zero page $40-$FF, RAM space, ROM space) 3. Put code & data on the correct ROM addresses (for holey DMA) But it's certainly possible to use C to develop for the 7800. Much of 7800 code is basically data movement. And it's certainly possible to describe the Display List as a C structure. Of course, it's tough to match the space & speed of hand coded assembly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 1. Provide a peek & poke to modify the TIA, MARIA and RIOT registers. (Although I guess this could be done with pointers.) This is where my game library comes into the equation. Its written in 6502 assembler which allows the game's logic and AI to be handled in "C". The library handles sprite positioning and animation, sound, joystick input and the like. It also has functions to print to the screen, BCD score handling, high score handling and so forth. 2. Handle the 7800 memory map (zero page $40-$FF, RAM space, ROM space) CC65 has a zero page segment. 3. Put code & data on the correct ROM addresses (for holey DMA) In conjunction with appropriate start up code, segment declarations and ROM building script any initialised RAM data is handling correctly as is the BSS. Specifically aligned ROM segments for holey DMA can also be handled. But it's certainly possible to use C to develop for the 7800. Much of 7800 code is basically data movement. And it's certainly possible to describe the Display List as a C structure. Agreed. Of course, it's tough to match the space & speed of hand coded assembly. Agreed. However, flat out speed isn't always needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metal Ghost Posted February 25, 2011 Author Share Posted February 25, 2011 Is ProSystem (V13e??) the 'best' 7800 emulator currently available? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Is ProSystem (V13e??) the 'best' 7800 emulator currently available? Its OK for legacy games. For implementing interesting tricks/quirks its a pain, so that sort of development I do on my CC2 and real hardware. It has no debugger so it's hard going in that respect too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philipj Posted February 26, 2011 Share Posted February 26, 2011 Is ProSystem (V13e??) the 'best' 7800 emulator currently available? Its OK for legacy games. For implementing interesting tricks/quirks its a pain, so that sort of development I do on my CC2 and real hardware. It has no debugger so it's hard going in that respect too. What kind of hardware do you use to program the 7800? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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