+Andrew Davie Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 And that goes for all the coin op ports and inspired games in the homebrew community, not just Star Castle. You've singled me out because you think my price is absurd and I've wagged a finger at piracy. No. I held Boulder Dash® close to my chest and TOTALLY respected the copyright holder's ownership rights for 7 YEARS before releasing a binary. I went out of my way to seek prior permission to even PROGRAM it, yet alone release it. I have never offered to sell property that I don't have the rights to. I can speak with a clear conscience, proven honesty, and absolute integrity on this issue. Your claim is false. In many cases, the copyright holder may not even care anymore. But it's best to ask. I've contacted the copyright holder of Star Castle just to see what they have to say. I'll share their reply, if any. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidcorp Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 This is all very interesting and so wrong. I can understand keeping a binary from the unwashed hoarders. I also understand the pride and desire to seek acclaim for one's work. I even understand wanting a reasonable return on your time. Good luck. However, there's a line where pride and sensibility ends and pure tackiness begins and this particular one is way way over it. Put whatever ridiculous price you want on your cartridge, and maybe some idiot will buy it. That's your right, but it doesn't make it right. And despite your "many months of very hard work", or words to that effect, and your laughable asking price of $32K... no matter HOW hard you worked and HOW clever you think you are... that pales to insignificance compared to the work that many other homebrewers have done on their games which have, generally, freely been available as playable binaries. And no matter what you write, and how good you think it is, there are far better programmers out there who can do just as good a job. You may not get this -- the REAL reason that most of us program '2600 is... because we enjoy the challenge. Not for the money, not for the fawning accolades of those begging for copies, nor for the feeling of self importance you may get. We do it because we can and because it's fun. It's a real pity you don't share that community spirit and sense of fun with the rest of us. I did it for the challenge and love coding on the 2600. Tacky or not, I put a price on it in response to last years 14 page conversation (here) and I've offered to release all the source and binaries along with it. Your attacks on my programming prowess are unfounded. My work on Star Castle is not insignificant compared to other home brewers. How many have designed their own cartridge, implemented their own bank switching or even programmed an EEPROM? There are some but not many. There are certainly comparable programmers out there, and probably a very few who are clearly better. The only fact here that speaks to my programming ability is that I took the initiative to write a good game that a very brilliant, famous, and influential man said would suck, something others had only talked about for 29 years. There are other great programmers and a long list of fantastic homebrew titles, none of which take away from my efforts, accomplishments, or abilities. I encourage anyone who is interested in writing Star Castle or any other title to do so. As for Star Castle, I've proven it can be done and practically laid out a road map for anyone who would care to try. I've done my best to thank those who have offered kind words. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidcorp Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 How many game variations are on the cart? Just one, single player Star Castle. I made the graphics for two player and had to cut it when I ran out of room. Two player is just taking turns with the single player game anyway and I decided to focus on the most faithful port of its appearance and game play. I've had to go back and "make room" three times now, I'm sure all the low hanging fruit is gone. At this point I don't even have the bytes to add code to read the select switch properly or display the mode without throwing out the title screen graphics. I did add an invincibility cheat for VGS so people could get a good look at the game without getting killed. Scott 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidcorp Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 If you don't want your work stolen, your in the wrong business. There has always been software piracy and it will not go away. This is an unfortunate fact. The only way to avoid it is to not produce software or never make it publicly available. I've been making games professionally for 24 years, I know and agree which is why I wasn't going to release it at all. The thing you need to realize about this small 2600 software market is that your primary audience are collectors who will buy the game because they want to hold the physical cart in their hands, not just play it. The people who download the rom without paying for it are cheapskates who would have never bought it in the first place. The number of carts you sell is not going to be substantially affected by the availability of the rom file. That is why I made my own cartridge. I wanted it to be unique and I also have an almost irrational aversion for repurposing old Atari carts. I cringe every time I see someone make a lamp or some other kitsch out of a stack of carts. I know that millions were made and they are still plentiful, but I can't help wondering what my Harmony cartridge started its life out being 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidcorp Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 Yars Revenge label: it says clearly "Label, Program, & Audiovusual © 1981 ATARI, INC." Speaking of that, for people who are reading this and weren't alive or paying attention back then, although the date on it is 1981, it wasn't released until May of 1982: www.randomterrain.com/atari-2600-memories-history-1982.html#may Cool 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Random Terrain Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I know that millions were made and they are still plentiful, but I can't help wondering what my Harmony cartridge started its life out being It was probably an E.T. cart. But don't worry, although they were all sent back and buried, there are still millions of them out there somehow. I think it was a 1982 Christmas miracle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidcorp Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 I know that millions were made and they are still plentiful, but I can't help wondering what my Harmony cartridge started its life out being It was probably an E.T. cart. But don't worry, although they were all sent back and buried, there are still millions of them out there somehow. I think it was a 1982 Christmas miracle. Wow, In an interview Howard said he kind of liked having the distinction of having made the best game, Yars Revenge and the worst game, E.T. (his words, not mine, and in his defense he made E.T. in a ridiculously short amount of time, something like 4 weeks I think) It would be really cool if by a twist of fate, I used one of his E.T. carts in the development of Star Castles 2600. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck D. Head Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Well. That was a waste of time. The only way to be sure no one ever "steals" this would be to give it away freely. The only way to convince people that money wasn't a consideration would be to go back in time and not throw a "price" on it. If someone can program this or something close, my $32.76 will be waiting. CDH out. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 (edited) I made Star Castle on the 2600 because Howard Scott Warshaw made Yars Revenge instead of a port of Star Castle and repeatedly said that a "decent version couldn't be done" or "it would suck" in subsequent interviews. I did it to prove it could be done. In his defence maybe HSW felt flicker was an unacceptable compromise AFAIK it's not used in any of his games - supercat outlined how a nice version could be done with 30hz flicker a few years ago - http://www.atariage.com/forums/blog/142/entry-5136-star-castle-anyone/ - I think it's quite similar to your implementation? Also in his defense, a programmer must judge whether a game can be done in the time allowed. If a particular game takes months or years with modern tools and emulators, imagine how long it would have taken back in the day. Edited July 21, 2011 by Bryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Climber Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Well. That was a waste of time. Yeah, I've lost interest as well. All this homebrew talk got me thinking about buying a new game but the AA store is offline for a while? Boooooo Oh well, I do need an excuse to play Pier Solar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck D. Head Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Well. That was a waste of time. Yeah, I've lost interest as well. All this homebrew talk got me thinking about buying a new game but the AA store is offline for a while? Boooooo Oh well, I do need an excuse to play Pier Solar Same here. Last night, I busted out Jack and the Beanstalk which I believe Atari2600Land did; what fun it is. You should try it. It got me thinking about another homebrew; I really only have a few. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keilbaca Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Well. That was a waste of time. Yeah, I've lost interest as well. All this homebrew talk got me thinking about buying a new game but the AA store is offline for a while? Boooooo Oh well, I do need an excuse to play Pier Solar It has been offline for a while, I have been wanting to get my own copy of Medieval Mayhem and have yet to do so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 As a homebrew author who has developed bank-switching cartridges for three systems and given away the executable for his biggest project, I find this whole thread to feel like a giant psychological game. I'm proudest of the fact that those who bought my game and those who downloaded it for free write me to tell me how much they enjoy it. When I decided to develop for obsolete platforms I had to come to grips with the fact that although I wouldn't make much money, I could make people happy and make a name for myself. 25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPUWIZ Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 As a homebrew author who has developed bank-switching cartridges for three systems and given away the executable for his biggest project, I find this whole thread to feel like a giant psychological game. I'm proudest of the fact that those who bought my game and those who downloaded it for free write me to tell me how much they enjoy it. When I decided to develop for obsolete platforms I had to come to grips with the fact that although I wouldn't make much money, I could make people happy and make a name for myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayhem Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 **Are there any sales performance numbers of previously sold homebrew games? Particularly 2600 action titles? I think 250-300 is probably about as far as any homebrew title has managed to push since the scene really took off again (post 2000). Given the numbering on some of Randy's very early productions, I think maybe one of those at least surpassed the 300 barrier. (cue "madness" joke here heh) Knowing the hardware requirements of Boulderdash though (as in it won't work on Melody, and should work on a Kroc despite some people having issues), it might be entirely possible a proper release of the game on cartridge could easily reach those levels too. But thousands? Definitely not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Iacovelli Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 speaking as a game programer: I understand some parts what scott is saying he don't want his game to pirated so he decided to keep it to him self. it's basically the same thing why I did two versions of laserman'88 a free rom version that only has the 5 levels and the cart version that has the 5 levels plus two bonus levels. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roland p Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 You may not get this -- the REAL reason that most of us program '2600 is... because we enjoy the challenge. Not for the money, not for the fawning accolades of those begging for copies, nor for the feeling of self importance you may get. We do it because we can and because it's fun. It's a real pity you don't share that community spirit and sense of fun with the rest of us. Quoted for truth, this pretty much describes how I look at homebrewing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian O Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I'm a bit disappointed that Cynicaster hasn't written a limerick about this yet. -B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck D. Head Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I'm a bit disappointed that Cynicaster hasn't written a limerick about this yet. -B Hmmmmm, what might possibly rhyme with Star Castle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian O Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I'm a bit disappointed that Cynicaster hasn't written a limerick about this yet. -B Hmmmmm, what might possibly rhyme with Star Castle? How about "hassle"...seems fitting. -B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 vassal? (I'd love to see someone make it relevant) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cebus Capucinis Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I'll just be over here making my "kitsch"......and sharing it with the community. Thank you for your words of support! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidcorp Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 I'll just be over here making my "kitsch"......and sharing it with the community. Thank you for your words of support! So, like a lamp or bookend or something? All stuck together with hot glue and maybe epoxy? I was referring to using cartridges as a craft material, NOT for homebrew carts. There was someone who was offering new injection molded cartridges a while back but they disappeared. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cebus Capucinis Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Yes. Exactly that. I make Atari 2600 lamps. I am the creator of the "kitsch" you singled out. Perhaps it would be better if I just took pictures of the things I make and tell everyone they can't have one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Random Terrain Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 vassal? (I'd love to see someone make it relevant) I don't care what the dictionary says. That word sounds kind of penisy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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