2600 Warlords was released before the Arcade version? Yes, according to EGM

[Big Player]

Forgive me if this has been known for a while. But when I first read Will Nicholes excellent interview with Warlords designer Carla Menisky, I was surprised to see her say that the 2600 version of Warlords was released before the arcade version:

 

"After Dodge ’Em, I went straight to Warlords which was on the list as Kings in the Corner break-out game. I would like to set the record straight here—I did the 2600 game before the coin-op game even existed! I think that was the first time a coin-op game derived from the console game."

 

Here is a link to the interview. The quote is from page 2: http://willnicholes....rlaMeninsky.htm

 

I wrote it off as another old game designer who hasn't quite remembered the facts correctly. But then later in the week, I was reading through the PDF scans of Electronic Games Magazine at Digital Press and came across this, from the first issue of the magazine:

 

"Warlords (Atari). If you've only played the home version of Warlord, this coin-op newcomer should prove to be a pleasant surprise. It is perhaps the most visually sensational videogame ever designed. . .Again, you've got to see Warlord to believe it. The VCS version is a delightful variation of Breakout, but its coin-op big brother is sure to restore your arcading sense of wonder."

 

So at least here is some independent verification of her story. I knew of the 2600 version since the early 80's but I had not seen a Warlords arcade machine in person until the 2003 Philly Classic. Heck, I wasn't aware there was an arcade version until I started using MAME in the mid-90's. And then I had assumed the 2600 version was an arcade port, just like most of the other early 2600 games.

 

Here is a link to the Digital Press Electronic Games archive: http://www.digitpres...ronic_games.htm The quote comes from page 64 of the Winter 1981 issue. Thanks to Chris++ for providing a link to the archive in another thread.

 

Also, here is the original thread with Will's interview: http://www.atariage....lost-interview/

Electronic Games Magazine - Winter 1981 page 64.pdf

[+Random Terrain]

Looks like somebody might need to update their web site:

 

http://www.arcade-mu...p?game_id=10405

 

They claim the arcade game was manufactured in 1980.

 

 

And according to the following page, Atari 2600 Warlords wasn't in the catalog until 1981:

 

http://www.atariage....ml?CatalogID=29

 

 

 

Sumpin' ain't right somewhere.

 

 

The Wiki page seems to agree with the links above, saying the arcade version was released in 1980 and the home version was released in 1981:

 

http://en.wikipedia....0_video_game%29

 

 

 

But the arcade flyer has 1981 on it:

 

http://flyers.arcade-museum.com/?page=thumbs&db=videodb&id=1348

 

 

 

Sumpin' ain't right somewhere.

[Mayhem]

The 2600 version could have been written, then the coin-op version created, but the coin-op ended up being released before the 2600 version, making it appear like the original was a conversion. Seems a plausible series of events... in the same way Blaster was actually written for the Atari computers first.

[ComputerSpaceFan]

I too was surprised to hear about the coinop coming after the 2600 version. Will's interview was amazing!

[Big Player]

Sumpin' ain't right somewhere.

 

Agreed. Some of those sites have more credibility than others. I would not use Wikipedia as a primary source, since it generally aggregates information from other web sites.

 

What is interesting about KLOV is that they have a PDF of the Warlords Operations, Maintenance and Service Manual. Take a look at it. The copyright date is 1981 (page 4.) It also says first printing at the top of page one.

 

My guess is that Atari didn't start printing the manual a year after the game was released. So it seems that the 1980 release date for the arcade game is becoming less credible.

[high voltage]

Carla would know better than any website, obviously.

[Big Player]

Carla would know better than any website, obviously.

 

But you don't just accept it when someone tells you something that contradicts most of the known literature about a topic? Without looking for any other corroborating evidence?

 

It does suck that we have only websites to use as the known literature for old video games. Almost every website says that the arcade version of Warlords was released in 1980. From what I can tell, the primary source for these websites is KLOV.

 

My guess is KLOV gets 1980 from the copyright that appears on-screen during the attract mode. It is there in roman numerals.

 

But this doesn't mean that was the release year. 2600 Pac-Man has an on-screen copyright date of 1981 but was released in 1982.

 

But I still don't know for sure. I would like to see some evidence supporting a 1980 release date.

 

It doesn't help that Warlords was a relatively unpopular arcade game and not seen by many. I was hoping that someone who was an arcade game dealer back then would know more. Or possibly our resident Atari historians Curt and Marty would have some internal documents that tell us something?

[Syntaxerror999]

Ill buy it. I always wondered why the home version of the game didn't eat the wall away if you held the ball

 

 

[ComputerSpaceFan]

It doesn't help that Warlords was a relatively unpopular arcade game and not seen by many.

 

Really? Was Warlords rarely seen back in the day? I saw it fairly commonly here in Vancouver BC back in the 80's and even on a family trip to Disneyland in the hotel lobby. I'm just wondering if I fluked out in seeing it so often. Was it rare?

[+Random Terrain]

Really? Was Warlords rarely seen back in the day? I saw it fairly commonly here in Vancouver BC back in the 80's and even on a family trip to Disneyland in the hotel lobby. I'm just wondering if I fluked out in seeing it so often. Was it rare?

 

I couldn't afford to go to arcades that much, but when I was able to go, even if it was just to watch other kids play, I don't remember seeing it anywhere. I didn't even know it existed.

[Big Player]

I don't know if you would say the game is rare. But my experience is the same as RT's. I never knew it existed until 1996 when I first got on the Internet and started downloading roms for MAME.

 

The only time I've played the game was the cocktail version at a classic gaming convention. If I remember correctly, it seems that the game was a new sight for most of the other convention attendees. I have still never seen an upright Warlords game.

[jhd]

The only time I've played the game was the cocktail version at a classic gaming convention. If I remember correctly, it seems that the game was a new sight for most of the other convention attendees. I have still never seen an upright Warlords game.

 

I spent a good chunk of the early-1980s haunting video arcades.

 

The first time that I ever saw/played Warlords it was also the cocktail version. It was located in a very small arcade in the Champlain Mall in Dieppe, New Brunswick. This would have been around 1981 or 1982. I never saw one anywhere else.

 

There was a regular, upright version on exhibit at a video game show here in Calgary in October, but it was not working.

[fiddlepaddle]

I worked in an arcade while in college for a time 1979-1980 and although we didn't have one, I remember playing a stand-up 4-player warlords at a nearby bar sometimes. I also remember reading around that time (or maybe even 1982 or 1983) that the coin-op was based on the 2600 version. You can count this as personal testimony, but I won't sign anything.

[Big Player]

So we have some concensus that the arcade game was uncommon. I've read 2,000 units were made, compared to Centipede's 50,000 units, also released in 1981. Yes, I am now convinced of the 1981 release date.

 

Here is where I got the production numbers: http://web.archive.org/web/20081225035126/http://www.marvin3m.com/video/atari.htm

 

In defense of KLOV, they only list Warlords as manufactured in 1980. They say nothing about the release date.

 

The other interesting thing at KLOV is that if you sort all of Atari's arcade games by year, there were no games manfactured in 1981. Interesting, at the start of the arcade boom? http://www.arcade-mu...game_id=&sort=3

[Austin]

Do you think a manufacture date would be on the game's board itself? That's provided someone can get in contact with someone that owns one of these things.

[Big Player]

That could help. I do wish I had posted this thread in the arcade forum, so we could hear from the experts and collectors who might not read the 2600 form.

 

I also wish I had put Electronic Games magazine in the title of this thread, not EGM. But I didn't realize EGM stands for Electronic Gaming Monthly, a magazine that wasn't even arround in the early 80's.

[rhindlethereddragon]

With this thread, video game history has been re-written, once again. The "first home to arcade" has been re-written several times over the years.. I remember some of the games holding that dubious honor were: Pitfall, Cosmic Chasm, and at least one or two others. Could this be the definitive answer?

[Godzilla]

would be nice to add to the list of 2600 firsts...

[high voltage]

So besides Space War, which was the first computer to arcade conversion, and Tennis/Pong, which was the first console to arcade conversion, we can truly say Warlords was the second console to arcade conversion.

[fiddlepaddle]

So besides Space War, which was the first computer to arcade conversion, and Tennis/Pong, which was the first console to arcade conversion, we can truly say Warlords was the second console to arcade conversion.

 

or, we can say Warlords was the first programmable console to arcade conversion...

[Godzilla]

warlords was the second? what was the first console to arcade?

[+Random Terrain]

Here's a page from Electronic Games Magazine:

 

archive.org/stream/electronic-games-magazine-premiere/Electronic_Games_Issue_01_Vol_01_01_1981_Winter_Premiere#page/n63/mode/1up/

 

Look on the right side of the page.

[Retro Rogue]

People going by the screen copyright in coin-ops is a common problem. Those dates are just not an accurate source. They're put in by the programmer during development, well before copyright is actually filed for, simply because the game is being shown during development and it's then being field tested.

 

Warlords was first shown at the Amusement Trades Exhibition in London, in cocktail format. It went in to production in April, 1981.

 

There were 1014 standup cabinets produced and 1253 cocktail.

 

Scott Evans already publicly released the Atari Games internal document that keeps count of manufacture date and numbers produced - though numbers produced starts in '76.

 

http://www.atarigames.com/atarinumbers90s.pdf

 

As far as which was programmed first, the 2600 game was programmed first.

 

 

The other interesting thing at KLOV is that if you sort all of Atari's arcade games by year, there were no games manfactured in 1981. Interesting, at the start of the arcade boom? http://www.arcade-mu...game_id=&sort=3

 

Which is competely inaccuarate of course.

 

[+Random Terrain]

Scott Evans already publicly released the Atari Games internal document that keeps count of manufacture date and numbers produced - though numbers produced starts in '76.

 

http://www.atarigame...inumbers90s.pdf

 

Does something like that exist for Atari 2600 games?

[the.golden.ax]

People going by the screen copyright in coin-ops is a common problem. Those dates are just not an accurate source. They're put in by the programmer during development, well before copyright is actually filed for, simply because the game is being shown during development and it's then being field tested.

 

Warlords was first shown at the Amusement Trades Exhibition in London, in cocktail format. It went in to production in April, 1981.

 

There were 1014 standup cabinets produced and 1253 cocktail.

 

Scott Evans already publicly released the Atari Games internal document that keeps count of manufacture date and numbers produced - though numbers produced starts in '76.

 

http://www.atarigames.com/atarinumbers90s.pdf

 

As far as which was programmed first, the 2600 game was programmed first.

 

 

The other interesting thing at KLOV is that if you sort all of Atari's arcade games by year, there were no games manfactured in 1981. Interesting, at the start of the arcade boom? http://www.arcade-mu...game_id=&sort=3

 

Which is competely inaccuarate of course.

 

...and now I'm kicking myself even more for getting that cheapo After Burner and taking up the space I could have used for the Warlord cab at MGC in 2011. Don't get me wrong I love the After Burner II, but there are plenty of those. Man that cab was awesome!