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#776 Jin OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Sep 18, 2016 7:43 AM

Really amazing work Joe! You did an outstanding job on just about every aspect of this game, though there was one question I was wondering about. Will there ever be a version of D.K. VCS with sloped girders in the first level? All three of the other levels are absolutely brilliant recreations of the arcade originals, so I was just a little puzzled as to why the first level wasn't laid out like the arcade game too. Other than that it's really perfect!

#777 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Sep 18, 2016 4:45 PM

Really amazing work Joe! You did an outstanding job on just about every aspect of this game, though there was one question I was wondering about. Will there ever be a version of D.K. VCS with sloped girders in the first level? All three of the other levels are absolutely brilliant recreations of the arcade originals, so I was just a little puzzled as to why the first level wasn't laid out like the arcade game too. Other than that it's really perfect!

Sloped Girders would probably require major changes to the engine. As well, with slopes, a dual color playfield (different colors for ladder and stage) would be impossible without major flickering. The Barrel stage isn't perfect but plays very well. My only gripe is that after collecting the hammer and killing the fireball on the second level, the barrels do not file down so for a brief moment, I'm left holding the hammer with nothing to do. :P



#778 SpiceWare OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 19, 2016 11:39 AM

Sloped Girders would probably require major changes to the engine. As well, with slopes, a dual color playfield (different colors for ladder and stage) would be impossible without major flickering.

 
Major kernel change would be true, but slopes on a dual color playfield is possible without flicker - from Timmy!:
 
timmy.png timmy_1.png
 
timmy_2.png  timmy_3.png

#779 iesposta OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 19, 2016 11:46 AM

Really amazing work Joe! You did an outstanding job on just about every aspect of this game, though there was one question I was wondering about. Will there ever be a version of D.K. VCS with sloped girders in the first level? ... Other than that it's really perfect!

 

Shameless plug: Try Byte Knight and my D.K. Arcade 2600?

http://atariage.com/...demo/?p=2818302

DemoE = easy, screens 1,2,3, 4;  DemoH = hard, screens 5,6,7,8


Edited by iesposta, Mon Sep 19, 2016 11:49 AM.


#780 Jin OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Sep 20, 2016 3:04 AM

 

Shameless plug: Try Byte Knight and my D.K. Arcade 2600?

http://atariage.com/...demo/?p=2818302

DemoE = easy, screens 1,2,3, 4;  DemoH = hard, screens 5,6,7,8

 

 

Thanks for the heads up! D.K. Arcade 2600 definitely looks fantastic from the screenshots and user feedback, but sadly the .bin demo files don't seem to work in port of Stella for the Wii that I do all my emulation in. Yet another reminder that I seriously need to get a Harmony cart one of these days. Thank you anyway though! :)


Edited by Jin, Tue Sep 20, 2016 3:05 AM.


#781 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Sep 20, 2016 8:59 PM

 

 

Thanks for the heads up! D.K. Arcade 2600 definitely looks fantastic from the screenshots and user feedback, but sadly the .bin demo files don't seem to work in port of Stella for the Wii that I do all my emulation in. Yet another reminder that I seriously need to get a Harmony cart one of these days. Thank you anyway though! :)

All the homebrews should work in Stella, unless the Wii version has bugs in it or is extremely old. I think some like the 2600 EMU and other emulators don't work with DPC+ games though.



#782 iesposta OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Sep 20, 2016 9:24 PM

All the homebrews should work in Stella, unless the Wii version has bugs in it or is extremely old. I think some like the 2600 EMU and other emulators don't work with DPC+ games though.

 

Extremely old. Wiibrew 2600 is built off of Stella Version 2.7.2.

DPC+ was added in April 2010 to version 3.1.

Most updated emulators go up to 3.9.3.

 

Stella is currently at 4.7.2 and the big thing about version 4 was SDL2 and OpenGL & OpenGLES which may be too new:

"Ported Stella to SDL2, which brings many new features. Among the largest improvements is native hardware acceleration support for Windows (Direct3D) and Linux/OSX (OpenGL). It is also now possible to port Stella to iOS and Android devices using OpenGLES..."

 

 

 

Thanks for the heads up! D.K. Arcade 2600 definitely looks fantastic from the screenshots and user feedback, but sadly the .bin demo files don't seem to work in port of Stella for the Wii that I do all my emulation in. Yet another reminder that I seriously need to get a Harmony cart one of these days. Thank you anyway though! :)



#783 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 21, 2016 1:35 AM

Extremely old. Wiibrew 2600 is built off of Stella Version 2.7.2.
DPC+ was added in April 2010 to version 3.1.
Most updated emulators go up to 3.9.3.

But shouldn't any 32k homebrews work if they use standard mapper without DPC+? What about the Xbox version?



#784 Albert Penello OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Oct 3, 2016 4:22 PM

Cart release? I'm in if so.

 

It's amazing what you've done with a 2600. 

 

The AI in the game (especially the random flames in the girders level) *feels* so much like the arcade. Little details like the bounce of the barrels coming down the ramp, or Mario's "Back" sprite are a great attention to detail.

 

Really what you've captured here is amazing. It's so perfect visually, but has the charm of a 2600 adaptation. Remarkable. 

 

Some questions / thoughts (please, don't take these as criticism just questions and suggestions)

 

1. Level 1 (Ramps): I would make the fire off the oil barrel a little smaller, or reduce the bounce, or the hitbox of the sprite, because from a gameplay perspective you need to be able to hide on a ladder to see what's coming from above or it's random luck since jumping over is so difficult. Otherwise, you *have* to use the hammer or just get lucky. Many times I was able to get up the ladder to observe the barrels coming down, but get hit by the fire. Feels like it would add more strategy if you were able to sit above the fireball on a ladder. 

 

2. Level 1 (Ramps). I'm curious why no hammer to the left of the top ramp? Technical challenge or other reason? 

 

3. Level 4 (Rivets). Are you able to turn the fire blue when you grab the hammer? It would be great if the AI occasionally had them move down the ladders even when you're not going up one. 

 

4. Level 3 (Elevators) Does DK always have to be in the center? It's actually fine for all the levels except the Elevator level, where you have done great work on the (often missing!) springs. It would be a tad more challenging if you had to time more than one spring jump, by either moving DK over to the left, or changing the location of the ladder you have to climb to complete the level. 

 

Overall I think the speed ramps up a little too fast. The 2nd go-around was much harder than the first, but I wanted to keep playing. I would ramp up the speed in smaller increments because this is a joy to play, and it gets hard faster than I think it needs to. 

 

Last thing - purely a wish-list, would be options for level order, or even the real arcade level stacking which takes you back through levels differently. 

 

Honestly thought, again, great work. 


Edited by Albert Penello, Mon Oct 3, 2016 9:21 PM.


#785 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Oct 3, 2016 9:20 PM

 

 

Extremely old. Wiibrew 2600 is built off of Stella Version 2.7.2.

DPC+ was added in April 2010 to version 3.1.

Most updated emulators go up to 3.9.3.

 

Somebody mentioned in another thread the PSP version of Stella also is built on version 2.7.2. So no space Rocks on PSP either. And the less said about the Atgames portable emulator, the better. :ponder:



#786 Neuronic OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Oct 5, 2016 8:15 PM

Blown away by how much difference memory makes in a 2600 game! Well done. In my top 5 home-brews. If a cart version comes out I will definitely purchase it!



#787 Joe Musashi OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Oct 8, 2016 11:32 AM

Some questions / thoughts (please, don't take these as criticism just questions and suggestions)


The game is practically done, there will be only bugfixes (if any) and micro updates (I'll post one later), but thanks for the suggestions.
 

1. Level 1 (Ramps): I would make the fire off the oil barrel a little smaller, or reduce the bounce, or the hitbox of the sprite, because from a gameplay perspective you need to be able to hide on a ladder to see what's coming from above or it's random luck since jumping over is so difficult. Otherwise, you *have* to use the hammer or just get lucky. Many times I was able to get up the ladder to observe the barrels coming down, but get hit by the fire. Feels like it would add more strategy if you were able to sit above the fireball on a ladder.

 
I intentionally made the fireball follow Mario on a ladder so that you cannot hide from it there (like in the arcade). The idea is that you kill it with the hammer, which gives you enough time to watch out for barrels.
 

2. Level 1 (Ramps). I'm curious why no hammer to the left of the top ramp? Technical challenge or other reason?


No more RAM/ROM to handle the state of a second hammer.
 

3. Level 4 (Rivets). Are you able to turn the fire blue when you grab the hammer? It would be great if the AI occasionally had them move down the ladders even when you're not going up one.


That was on my wishlist, but had to be scrapped in favor of other things. For example, adding color tables for blue flames alone would require 96 bytes (as the color needs to be set per line). It also would make the hammer blue, too.
 

4. Level 3 (Elevators) Does DK always have to be in the center? It's actually fine for all the levels except the Elevator level, where you have done great work on the (often missing!) springs. It would be a tad more challenging if you had to time more than one spring jump, by either moving DK over to the left, or changing the location of the ladder you have to climb to complete the level.


DK has to be at the same position as the score so that the sprites do not need to be repositioned. In principle, it is possible, as seen in the climbing sequence, but takes too many cycles on a game screen.
 

Overall I think the speed ramps up a little too fast. The 2nd go-around was much harder than the first, but I wanted to keep playing. I would ramp up the speed in smaller increments because this is a joy to play, and it gets hard faster than I think it needs to.


Like all things that were added late, the speed ramping is a hack. It's not a function that can be arbitrarily changed. It's also not linear but logarithmic. While it would be possible to invert it to be exponential, I did not do that so that a speed change is really noticeable when you get to L=2.
 

Last thing - purely a wish-list, would be options for level order, or even the real arcade level stacking which takes you back through levels differently.

 
Well, at least that's there -- Press Select at the title to switch between US and Japanese level order.



#788 Joe Musashi OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Oct 8, 2016 12:04 PM

Just a tiny update. While cleaning the source, I found a few more cycles in the attract mode demo to make it a little bit more arcade like. Mario now jumps before running to the right.

 

Attached Files



#789 Albert Penello OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Oct 8, 2016 12:55 PM

Joe

 

Thanks for responding. I've become somewhat obsessed with this, it's so amazing. After reading the entire thread, I understand you actually addressed a bunch of these issues. 

 

What I want to comment again on (having been in the game business a long time), is that not only have you achieved a technical miracle, the game is FUN. It feels SO much like the arcade, it plays SO much like the arcade, and the responsiveness and control is amazing. I'm playing it a bunch every day. 

 

Two things - if you need help funding for a cart, PM me. I'm happy to put up the money to get a cart run of this going.

 

Second, I'd really be interested to hear what you think you would get in a 64K version. Beyond more work for you, reading the thread it seems like the limitations are more on the Atari side, but what would be your wishlist that could be achieved with a 64K version? I'm just curious.

Thanks again!



#790 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Oct 12, 2016 2:18 PM

This may be a bit old, but I was playing the "TEST" ROM from this post:

http://atariage.com/...-vcs/?p=3517549

 

with infinite lives enabled. I managed to the 3rd rivet stage playing on Japanese screen order.

 

At one point, I hit a fireball with my hammer while simultaneously clearing a rivet. The screen rolled briefly. Not sure if this has been fixed, and it's not a glitch that likely happens often, but colliding with a rivet and fireball simultaneously while carrying a hammer may cause the scanline count to be exceeded for the current frame.

 

Sorry I haven't updated my harmony cart recently. Playing with infinite lives was fun though to see how the difficulty progressed. I turned it off after clearing the barrel stage on loop 4.



#791 Joe Musashi OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:09 PM

This may be a bit old, but I was playing the "TEST" ROM from this post:

http://atariage.com/...-vcs/?p=3517549

 

with infinite lives enabled. I managed to the 3rd rivet stage playing on Japanese screen order.

 

At one point, I hit a fireball with my hammer while simultaneously clearing a rivet. The screen rolled briefly. Not sure if this has been fixed, and it's not a glitch that likely happens often, but colliding with a rivet and fireball simultaneously while carrying a hammer may cause the scanline count to be exceeded for the current frame.

 

Sorry I haven't updated my harmony cart recently. Playing with infinite lives was fun though to see how the difficulty progressed. I turned it off after clearing the barrel stage on loop 4.

 

Thanks for reporting this issue!

 

I was able to reproduce it with the latest version, however very sporadically. This does not look like something that can be fixed easily :( but I will give it a try.



#792 Joe Musashi OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Nov 13, 2016 12:48 PM

I think I could fix the problem. Here's a new version that has optimized overscan code, which frees up about 140 cycles.  With this change I was not able to trigger any screen rolling.

 

It's not impossible that there are further game situations that can cause screen rolling. I attached another "Test" version that has infinite lives enabled, so people can try some of the higher levels. If you happen to find more bugs please let me know.

 

Attached Files



#793 doctorclu OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Nov 17, 2016 6:17 AM

Recently got a Flashback Portable and decided to try DK VCS out.

 

Attached are the results.  I would like to try previous versions of DK VCS to see if the results would be different/better.

Attached Files


Edited by doctorclu, Thu Nov 17, 2016 9:53 AM.


#794 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Nov 17, 2016 7:11 AM

99% compatibility is not enough. 



#795 doctorclu OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Nov 17, 2016 1:49 PM

Tried all these on the Flashback Portable:

 

    •      D.K.VCS_161008_NTSC.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_161008_PAL60.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_161113_NTSC.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_161113_PAL60.bin   32KB 
    •      D.K.VCS_TEST_161113_NTSC.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_TEST_161113_PAL60.bin   32KB  

 

On all when it paints the platforms it paints half a screen from the top of the screen and then freezes.



#796 save2600 OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Nov 17, 2016 5:39 PM

Played the latest version today on my Harmony cart… regular version games ends after one life - is that intentional? Didn't have much time to play today, so gave up after a few games, ending on the elevator stage.  



#797 Joe Musashi OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Nov 18, 2016 3:07 PM

Tried all these on the Flashback Portable:

 

    •      D.K.VCS_161008_NTSC.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_161008_PAL60.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_161113_NTSC.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_161113_PAL60.bin   32KB 
    •      D.K.VCS_TEST_161113_NTSC.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_TEST_161113_PAL60.bin   32KB  

 

On all when it paints the platforms it paints half a screen from the top of the screen and then freezes.

 

Interesting. When the game freezes that's usually a sign that the extra SARA RAM is missing (which is used to store Mario's state). Perhaps the F4SC bank switching is not detected correctly.

 

The display glitches are not too surprising. I haven't tried recently, but some time ago Mess and Javatari also had problems.

 

When the source gets released, maybe someone with a flashback might want to try and make a flashback version.



#798 Joe Musashi OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Nov 18, 2016 3:18 PM

Played the latest version today on my Harmony cart… regular version games ends after one life - is that intentional? Didn't have much time to play today, so gave up after a few games, ending on the elevator stage.  

 

You can change this with the left difficulty switch: A: 1 life, B: 3 lives. (Right switch: A: extra life at 20,000 points, B: extra life at 10,000 points.)

 

The switches behave similarly to the DIP switches on the arcade board. In the arcade version you can select 3-6 lives, though. I went for 1 or 3 lives since the arcade is more difficult in general. Also I can only display three Mario lives.



#799 Trebor OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Nov 18, 2016 6:03 PM

Tried all these on the Flashback Portable:
 
    •      D.K.VCS_161008_NTSC.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_161008_PAL60.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_161113_NTSC.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_161113_PAL60.bin   32KB 
    •      D.K.VCS_TEST_161113_NTSC.bin   32KB  
    •      D.K.VCS_TEST_161113_PAL60.bin   32KB  
 
On all when it paints the platforms it paints half a screen from the top of the screen and then freezes.

 
The compatibility list indicates a slew of games with numerous issues including several self-published games.  Some original retail games with issues are listed in the spoiler below.
 

Spoiler

Hopefully someone may look to increase flashback compatibility by improving upon its simulation/emulation.



#800 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Nov 19, 2016 1:05 AM

 
The compatibility list indicates a slew of games with numerous issues including several self-published games.  Some original retail games with issues are listed in the spoiler below.
 

Spoiler

Hopefully someone may look to increase flashback compatibility by improving upon its simulation/emulation.

I actually passed up on the Atari portable for this exact reason. Bitd stuff like Galaxian and Berzerk (which don't even use special bankswitching hardware) not playing properly is unacceptable.






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