+sm3 Posted April 12, 2013 Share Posted April 12, 2013 I figured I would start a new thread on this topic rather than derail further the Incognito board pre-order thread any further. As you may or may not have read, I have installed the Ultimate 1 MB into a 130xe. The MMU and OS ICs were removed easily and I soldered in the adapters with no issues. Now where I have the problem is soldering the 4 wires to the pins on the CPU. I was a little over confident after soldering up the MMU and OS ICs that I figured the wires would be easy. I was wrong. Candle was nice enough to provide a tip on how I should attempt the task. My further questions, does the wire need to actually be connected to the CPU pins on the top side of the PCB? Is there any reason why I can't run a wire underneath to the appropriate pins of the CPU? Also, what type of wire should I use for this? solid core or stranded? 22 AWG maybe? The Ultimate 1 MB I purchased didn't come with all the extras to complete the installation so I've had to locate the items needed on my own and of course I made some wrong selections. Fortunately neither my 130xe or the Ultimate 1 MB is damaged. I'm not that bad with it, just ignorant of techniques to soldering anything other than the underside of a PCB with IC legs sticking through it! Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bumzyman Posted April 12, 2013 Share Posted April 12, 2013 (edited) SM3: You don't have to solder it directly to the CPU's pins, in fact, I would recommend not doing that just in case you have to remove it for whatever reason. You could connect the wires on the bottom of the motherboard to the pins of the socket but an even better idea would be to find a via or through hole on the top of the motherboard. Does anyone have any good pictures of some VIA's or other good connection points that could be used on the top of the motherboard for the 130XE and 800XL? I think I recall FJC posted either on his site or on the forums somewhere the via points for the 130XE but I can't remember exactly where I saw them. I'm going to be installing U1M boards in both 800XL and 130XE machines so pictures would be a great help and time saver. SM3: For wire, I usually use an old floppy or IDE drive cable and peel off the amount of wires that I need. That way they stay together and don't make a rats nest inside your system. Just tin the ends of the wires and the spots on the motherboard (like Candle recommended) before trying to tack them on. Also, only strip off a tiny bit of insulation, you don't want any bare parts laying up against other pins or traces. I also like to use the no-clean solder & flux so you don't have to worry about any nasty residue being left behind. Edited April 12, 2013 by Bumzyman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Android8675 Posted April 12, 2013 Share Posted April 12, 2013 (edited) I'm using 28AWG UL1569 wire. Is it the perfect wire for the job? Probably not, but I hooked up my incognito with it and had no problems. I also have some rainbow colored flat cable. 3M 3302 - (http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/Interconnect/Home/Products/ProductCatalog/Catalog/?PC_7_RJH9U5230O73D0ISNF9B3C3SI1000000_nid=K1TQLWYDK2it6Z44P5GPWMgl9S15H3ZM9Zbl) You want stranded, always stranded. If you look for UL1569 or UL1007 (same thing, older designation) you should be OK. http://www.aaroncake...nics/solder.htm - quick soldering tutorial, doesn't cover wire types, but I used it as a refresher. Edited April 12, 2013 by Android8675 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted April 12, 2013 Author Share Posted April 12, 2013 SM3: You don't have to solder it directly to the CPU's pins, in fact, I would recommend not doing that just in case you have to remove it for whatever reason. You could connect the wires on the bottom of the motherboard to the pins of the socket but an even better idea would be to find a via or through hole on the top of the motherboard. ... Hi Bumzyman, thanks for the information. I think I would be better suited to soldering on the underside of the board since I have more experience doing that and there is more space to work. I did see older photos on the web (maybe Candle's site) with through hole installation, but if I'm not mistaken, they may be old. It seems the latest version of Ultimate 1MB requires a few more wires and doesn't require a fix that the original version required. But who knows, I may be wrong. Android8675 that is good link. I actually think I may have stumbled onto it before! I will go with stranded wire then, and tin the ends as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted April 12, 2013 Share Posted April 12, 2013 same amount of wires, but no fix i would never solder anything directly to cpu no point to, there are plenty other places you can pick up your signals from Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted April 12, 2013 Author Share Posted April 12, 2013 Oh, the SPIFlash.org website shows at least 3 wires connected directly to the CPU. Is that not your site? My install instructions came from the eBay auction where I purchased the Ultimate 1 MB. Of course there it tells me to install all the wires on the CPU pins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted April 12, 2013 Share Posted April 12, 2013 really? link or it never happend Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted April 12, 2013 Author Share Posted April 12, 2013 http://spiflash.org/...p/block/26.html I can't link directly to it because of how the page is, but if you choose "XE line" on this link, it shows the pictures. I'm looking at the picture in the "Connection points" section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdh Posted April 12, 2013 Share Posted April 12, 2013 Oh, the SPIFlash.org website shows at least 3 wires connected directly to the CPU. Is that not your site? My install instructions came from the eBay auction where I purchased the Ultimate 1 MB. Of course there it tells me to install all the wires on the CPU pins. Somebody - atari8warez??? - did a very nice end to end install doc for the 130XE, can't find the link. I've just bought one from Lotharek, yet to install, just finished the Stereo Pokey. I'll be installing it in an 800XL, evidently you can pick-up 3 of the connections from the PBI. I was going to use single core "bell wire", but now I think I will follow the advice and get some stranded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted April 12, 2013 Author Share Posted April 12, 2013 Somebody - atari8warez??? - did a very nice end to end install doc for the 130XE, can't find the link. ... The only issue I see is that early versions of the board required some fixes that aren't required in the latest version. So hopefully people don't follow the old instructions for the new board. But if there are locations that are easier to solder, I'm all for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdh Posted April 12, 2013 Share Posted April 12, 2013 The only issue I see is that early versions of the board required some fixes that aren't required in the latest version. So hopefully people don't follow the old instructions for the new board. But if there are locations that are easier to solder, I'm all for it Is that the resistor tweak? I must admit I was a little disappointed with the lack of documentation for the new version, I guess documentation is for wimps When this bad boy is installed though it will be a nice feeling of accomplishment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted April 12, 2013 Author Share Posted April 12, 2013 Is that the resistor tweak? .. Yes, cutting traces and installing resistors. I'm glad we don't have to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted April 12, 2013 Share Posted April 12, 2013 this one? that ain't cpu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted April 12, 2013 Author Share Posted April 12, 2013 Haha, well OK then, that explains why it's in a different spot for one thing So it's OK to solder wires to other chips but not the CPU? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted April 12, 2013 Share Posted April 12, 2013 nah, bad idea in general, but this one - freddie - is pretty useless and i'm not considering that it will be replaced by some kind of extension i might cook up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted April 12, 2013 Author Share Posted April 12, 2013 nah, bad idea in general, but this one - freddie - is pretty useless and i'm not considering that it will be replaced by some kind of extension i might cook up Ah, that is the freddie chip, OK. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted April 12, 2013 Author Share Posted April 12, 2013 Hmm, I just realized I may have a source of 24 AWG wire already at home. CAT 5 ethernet cables seem to be made of this. Of course I don't think they are stranded. At this small size though, it probably doesn't matter for a wire that isn't going to be moving around that much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillC Posted April 13, 2013 Share Posted April 13, 2013 Hmm, I just realized I may have a source of 24 AWG wire already at home. CAT 5 ethernet cables seem to be made of this. Of course I don't think they are stranded. At this small size though, it probably doesn't matter for a wire that isn't going to be moving around that much. It depends which type of CAT5 cable, patch cables use stranded wire while the plenum rated cable(for installation in commercial drop ceilings) is solid conductor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted April 13, 2013 Author Share Posted April 13, 2013 It depends which type of CAT5 cable, patch cables use stranded wire while the plenum rated cable(for installation in commercial drop ceilings) is solid conductor. Yeah, just talking CAT5 to plugin into home PCs and such. I've never tried to look at the wiring before. I just noticed it was 24 AWG by reading the printing on the cable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atari8warez Posted April 13, 2013 Share Posted April 13, 2013 (edited) The only issue I see is that early versions of the board required some fixes that aren't required in the latest version. So hopefully people don't follow the old instructions for the new board. But if there are locations that are easier to solder, I'm all for it Here's the link to my installation guide. It's for the Candle version of the board, so just ignore the part where it explains how to install inline resistors to the ribbon cable, you can still use the same vias on the motherboard for those 4 wires as that part did not change. Good luck.... Edited April 13, 2013 by atari8warez 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bumzyman Posted April 13, 2013 Share Posted April 13, 2013 Here's the link to my installation guide. It's for the Candle version of the board, so just ignore the part where it explains how to install inline resistors to the ribbon cable, you can still use the same vias on the motherboard for those 4 wires as that part did not change. Good luck.... Awesome guide, that's the one I was talking about earlier, nice work atari8warez. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted April 13, 2013 Author Share Posted April 13, 2013 Wow, nice! Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atari8warez Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Thank you guys hope it helps... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted April 14, 2013 Author Share Posted April 14, 2013 Thank you guys hope it helps... It sure did! Now I have properly soldered in wires instead of jumpers. A question that has popped up now is if the board is working properly (did I do everything correct that is). With regard to the diagnostic program, the detected RAM size is 63488 bytes with Sparta Dos X disabled. What RAM is that referring to? I'm assuming that means 64k from the 130xe? Does it ignore the other 64k on a 130xe? and only use the memory from the Ultimate now? I've got extended memory set to 1088k RAMBO. Also CHKDSK o: shows 944kb available when I do enable Sparta Dos X. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 it tests only 64k of base ram if you enable sdx, then your machine has 8k less ram because of rom being mapped and there is always io space present in atari computers, disabling another 2kb thus 63488 is max you'll see on that test Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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