A bit surprised at crappiness of "multi-cade" machines

[Cynicaster]

I work for an engineering firm and last night we were taken out on a “team building” exercise, without being told ahead of time what it was going to be. It ended with dinner and drinks, then to top it all off, we were handed rolls of quarters to use at an arcade next door to the restaurant. I was like “is this really happening? The sales director is handing me quarters to go play arcade games?” Sitting at the table, I was trying to keep my cool and not nerd out too much in anticipation.

 

Anyway, I headed over to the arcade and there were a few legit cabinets but most of the games I wanted to play were on those “multi-cade” type things. I played some DK, Frogger, Centipede, 1943, Qix, Juno First, Ms. Pac-Man, and Smash TV to name a few. I was enjoying myself but I must say I was a bit surprised at how crappy these games were represented. These cabinets looked pretty nice from a distance but they were obviously sub-par emulation boxes, the monitors were LCD which made the pixels all blocky, the sound effects were off, and there was noticeable screen tearing at times.

 

There was a machine that had dual sticks and a marquee with a bunch of Williams games on it, so I was like sweet, let’s play some Smash TV and Robotron. I didn’t even bother with Robotron because when I played Smash TV I discovered that both the joysticks were freakin’ 4-WAY STICKS…. Wtf good is that? How could any self-respecting operator deploy this machine to the field? And I thought it was disgraceful to release classic arcade games on iPad… at least with touch controls it’s theoretically possible to hit diagonals.

 

I still had a blast, because it was just fun to play these games in the ambience of a real arcade with co-workers, even if they were crappy knock-offs. I was a bit surprised at how much more faithfully MAME represents these games than these machines that are actually out in arcades taking money from people; it’s really night and day, no comparison. The more I think about it, the more I wonder if these machines are even legal (that’s the only reason I’m not naming the arcade). Anybody seen anything like this?

[akator]

The multi-cades I've played have felt pretty cheap as well. I would prefer to play a Jakks plug and play than any of the commercial multi-cades I've experienced, let alone MAME and an X-Arcade which beat the multi-cades without contest.

 

Recently I've seen a lot of brand new yet reasonably priced multi-cades on Craigslist. In some cases they are selling for under $1000, which I know from experience would be a difficult price point building my own with high grade materials and components. I have not seen one of these in person, but I suspect the quality and performance would be a massive disappointment.

 

I'm curious to see if and when these multi-cades get powered by Raspberry Pi or similar, that might even be an improvement over the some of the crap I've experienced powering multi-cades now.

[number six]

The Multi-cade boards have varied in quality since they came out about 10 years ago. They are all bootlegs and produced by Chinese Factories so one may not necessarily be as good as another.

 

Universally though they aren't all that great. The emulation is definitely not 100% or even close. Some games are closer than others but most are definitely 'off'. Usually the big tip off is the music / sound, if you see a multicade try Gyruss.. it's simply awful. Gameplay is goofy as well. For example the swams in Galaga are generally not accurate to the original.. the timing is off. I'd imagine this once again has to do with the shoddy emulation.

 

Sad thing about Multicades is for most people it's fine and they'll never notice. They have also become extremely cheap. You can get a 60-in-1 Jamma multiboard for about $60. A legimate PCB like a Namco Reunion (which has 3 games) will cost you $200-$300 on the used market. You can imagine which one most ops go for. They also usually have VGA out in addition to the Jamma connector so if you have an arcade cabinet and an LCD monitor you can literally put one of these together for about $100-$150 in parts. No way you are building a mame for that unless you have a lot of the parts already or cut a lot of corners.

 

I wouldn't hold your breath for these getting better either. I'm sure accuracy isn't a major concern for the factories so much as getting the boards out cheaply.

[Andromeda Stardust]

The Sandbar in downtown area of my hometown is an "adult" arcade/bar (when I say "adult entertainment" It's not the nudey kind, just tons of booze and games everywhere), featuring all sorts of amusement games, including beer pong. I was disappointed to find that there was one single arcade video game cabinet in the whole building, that seemed to get very little attention from the patrons besides myself, and believe me, it was a Saturday night and the place was packed on both floors. The arcade unit was a knockoff multicade, but it consumed a lot of my quarters anyway. The 4-way joystick was a respectable build, and most of the games represented were 4-way and 2-way controlled, so all was good in that regards. The usual stuff, pacman, ms pacman, galaga, donkey kong, centipede, dig dug, etc. I could tell right away they were bootlegs because the copyrights "Namco", "Nintendo" "Atari" etc. were removed from most of the title screens. When in "attract mode" it showcased demos of a variety of the games. Hitting the start button would automatically end the demo reel and return to the menu/insert coin screen. I found that occasionally the game didn't register coin credits during gameplay or in attract mode - I had to be sure to hit start to return to the game menu, then insert a credit and select a game in order to guarantee that it would accept my quarter. It didn't help matters much that the marquee read "Multicade" across the top with no company info on it.

 

Unfortunately, there's no good way to include both 4-way and 8-way games in a single multicade box. My custom Atari Joystick has a mag-stik that I pull up and rotate the handle to switch modes, but as far as I know, there's no multicade in existence that auto switches between 4-way and 8-way operations. Perhaps an emulator could be trained to ignore diagonals by returning the last used cardinal direction (for instance, if you hit "R" then momentarily trigger "UR", the emulator would still return an "R" input. If you want the "Rolls Royce" of joysticks, there are "49-position" joysticks or "analog" joysticks with rotary encoders, that can be connected to a microcontroller which will select from a variety of virtual baffle shapes for 4-way and 8-way operation, however interfacing these with a MAME emulator would require a sophisticated hardware/software setup. Also, analog joysticks used for digital input do not provide the tactile feedback that real micro-switches do. Most bootleg machines use cheap parts anyway, and most operators who would care enough about user experience to upgrade the machines with quality parts, would probably buy the real licensed arcade units.

Edited April 30, 2013 by stardust4ever

[Cynicaster]

The emulation is definitely not 100% or even close. Some games are closer than others but most are definitely 'off'. Usually the big tip off is the music / sound, if you see a multicade try Gyruss.. it's simply awful. Gameplay is goofy as well. For example the swams in Galaga are generally not accurate to the original.. the timing is off. I'd imagine this once again has to do with the shoddy emulation.

 

No doubt; I did notice that some were better than others, but only slightly. At times, the games felt more like "ports" than emulation.

 

1943 was horrendous; the frame rate was inconsistent and choppy, the music was almost unrecognizable, and the sound effect the game is supposed to make when you down one of the bigger green planes was completely absent.

 

I'm no pro at DK, but in the last 100 or so credits I've played in MAME, I bet I've not died on the first screen more than 3-4 times, as I don't grab the first hammer and generally take a low-risk approach. Last night on the multi-cade I played 4 games of DK and lost a life on the first screen all 4 times. It just seemed off, in particular the hit detection seemed awfully unforgiving.

[Great Hierophant]

Sorry to bump an old thread, but the reason why these things are so crappy may be because they are pirated devices :

 

Edited August 24, 2017 by Great Hierophant

[Keatah]

Only the roms and perhaps the artwork are pirated. The rest can be made to high-quality standards if desired.

[mr.bill]

it depends on what you use. Lcd can not display cga graphics very well. you need to use a crt to make it look right. Plus 16x9 lcd make 4x3 video look like crap.

 

Its also a you get what you pay for situation. emulating games across multiple lines lends to compromises. the biggest is emulating the audio. back the 80's they used different sound chips. So when your paying $75-$200 for a xxx in 1 board, your bound to have poor results.

 

If you want to improve the quality use a better emulator board like arcade sd. If you want to improve it more, run it off a computer and use mame.

 

the guys in the above video are morons. they obviously know nothing about it. the 60 in one boots up as donkey kong, pacman, galaga. there are no fake names. There is nothing wrong with the color pallets. If colors look off, then its the lcd and people not settign it up correctly. The differences are more subtle than that. I would bet they could not tell the difference in most of the games if they deleted the menu selection. where you notice stuff is audio or controls. If they put an 8 way stick in it, pacman games are unplayable. but if you use a 4 way, it plays great. Maybe you might notice a difference in game speed. Once you move up the line to arcade sd or mame, if its setup correctly, it should be 100%.

Edited August 25, 2017 by mr.bill

[Jumpman1981]

I have a restored Pac-Man that has a 60 in 1 in it and I agree, the emulation is terrible.

[Newsdee]

These are likely powered by one of those "X in one" arcade PCB easily found online. The one I experimented with was a customized MAME box... the UI felt very similar to an old version if it (probably MAME for ARM).

 

Aside from the legality, the main problen they have is being underpowered and using and old emulator. Some are okay for older games, though.

[Jumpman1981]

My board has died, for absolutely no reason at all.

Edited November 19, 2017 by Jumpman1981

[Keatah]

My board has died, for absolutely no reason at all.

 

Ohh it died for a reason. Cheapness being at the top of the charts.

 

 

I have a restored Pac-Man that has a 60 in 1 in it and I agree, the emulation is terrible.

I was enjoying myself but I must say I was a bit surprised at how crappy these games were represented. These cabinets looked pretty nice from a distance but they were obviously sub-par emulation boxes, the monitors were LCD which made the pixels all blocky, the sound effects were off, and there was noticeable screen tearing at times.

 

There was a machine that had dual sticks and a marquee with a bunch of Williams games on it, so I was like sweet, let’s play some Smash TV and Robotron. I didn’t even bother with Robotron because when I played Smash TV I discovered that both the joysticks were freakin’ 4-WAY STICKS…. Wtf good is that? How could any self-respecting operator deploy this machine to the field? And I thought it was disgraceful to release classic arcade games on iPad… at least with touch controls it’s theoretically possible to hit diagonals.

 

Well that's just it. Someone with a "business idea" sees this, and invests in the circuits and controls, slaps it in, and I mean slaps it in, and then deploys these. Could be a local guy, could be the store owner, practically anyone.

 

There is no testing, no control matching or calibration, no monitor aligning, no system configuration. Plug it an and instant Arcade Game! These shitbox boards are NOT intented for anything near enthusiast level. Their only purpose is to make a barely passable arcade cabinet with the intent of sucking your money. None of these 60-in-1 boards even approach pre-entry-level hobbyist grade material.

 

This isn't any different than the "business" my old apartment buddy had going. He'd "get" motherboards and build computers out of them. There'd always be a burned out onboard IDE controller on them somehow. And he'd give me the parts and ask me to make a working system. We'd use a PCI drop-in replacement. Do anything, try anything, just enough to make it work and get it out the door. Quality, attention to detail, and functionality be damned.

[Keatah]

Sad thing about Multicades is for most people it's fine and they'll never notice.

 

[..]

I wouldn't hold your breath for these getting better either. I'm sure accuracy isn't a major concern for the factories so much as getting the boards out cheaply.

 

Well, yeh, these are made for the casual one-off player. Ohh look! There's a 1943 machine! I'mna go play it! They play once or twice, get a blast of nostalgia, and move on to whatever it was they're doing - waiting in line, playing on their phone, waiting for the kids to come out of the bathroom. Heh.. These aren't enthusiasts by any stretch of the imagination. And all the inaccuracies are going to slide right under the table, or remain bottled up in the machine itself.

 

As far as costs go. I've seen them sell for 34.99. And a complete conversion kit, with some controls and switches for $89. How can this possibly compare against your custom emulation rig where just the power supply alone is going to cost you more than that whole kit? It can't. So, yeh..

[virtvic]

Some of the games on a 60 in 1 are unrecognisable compared to the original boards. Donkey Kong is spot on (I have a 60 in 1 board and an original 4 layer pcb in my dk jr cab)

But! Donkey Kong Jr has missing sounds (on the hide out) and the movement on grabbing vines on the chains level is bad - he misses completely sometimes where the original pcb is spot on, obviously.

 

Sound is the main concern on the 60 in 1 - especially Scramble and 1942. If they corrected that, it would be 100% better in my opinion. So far as to say, I'd use one in an original cab as a substitute until I could get the original.

[Cubaherrera]

Hello guys and girls . I found this old post and Yes I will try responding to because after having read every comment here , I felt moved , everyone of you was so helpfull and honest with each other even when you were dissagreeding with each other and you all made sense to me at least , I learn a lot by reading this post , Now let tell you about what happen to me just today , I got a free MULTICADE , The one with dongkikon in front in green , I am a 46  yrs gamer and Gaming Paraphilinia collector ,  where I live in PA we dont see a lot of the arcades you all mention and I think around here they will just be happy to see one working , I Plan to fix it real nice and put it in a stored close to me and see how much money they really can make . Thanks for all the info and anybody happen to want to continued the discussion ?,  please do so ... I have tons of questions

[Keatah]

Today the quality of the multicade or bartop seems to have increased. Time seems to have filtered out the trash. If not in materials then in the electronics and execution.

[Mik's Arcade]

that's why i just built my own. It was hard work, but it has paid off

[Keatah]

It's almost 2023 and the traditional MAME cab has been eclipsed by smaller bartops or standard PCs with separate parts like monitor, keyboard, mouse, xarcade stick & gamepad. Especially at home. Then there's MiSTer or R-Pi if you're in the mood for playing with hardware and settings and stuff. But in the end, for a little DIY time, you'll get a better experience.

[Cynicaster]

Yeah, I'm SO glad I built my MAME cabinet when I was at a narrow slice of time in my life where I simultaneously had the cash, time, and will to do it.  There is no way on earth I'd be able to do such a project now, based on time alone.  

 

My cabinet is in its 3rd home now, on it's 3rd (or 4th?) PC, has a few dings on it from being moved, but at almost 12 years on it's still going strong and still gets played often (usually multiple times per week, even if just for an hour or so.)

 

I remember when I was building it and it was taking forever to finish, I said to myself "it's really going to suck if I put all this time and effort into this thing, play it for a few months, then push it off into the corner where it collects dust."  Turned out to not be an issue. 
 

  

 

 

[Keatah]

I would not have built the two barcades I built years ago today. Thankfully they're just large enough to accept all kinds replacement parts and upgrades including the monitor. And I don't mind wrenching on them from time to time however - if there's better parts than what's already installed. But to build them from scratch, today, not likely.

[82-T/A]

On 4/30/2013 at 9:27 AM, Cynicaster said:

Anyway, I headed over to the arcade and there were a few legit cabinets but most of the games I wanted to play were on those “multi-cade” type things. I played some DK, Frogger, Centipede, 1943, Qix, Juno First, Ms. Pac-Man, and Smash TV to name a few. I was enjoying myself but I must say I was a bit surprised at how crappy these games were represented. These cabinets looked pretty nice from a distance but they were obviously sub-par emulation boxes, the monitors were LCD which made the pixels all blocky, the sound effects were off, and there was noticeable screen tearing at times.

 

There was a machine that had dual sticks and a marquee with a bunch of Williams games on it, so I was like sweet, let’s play some Smash TV and Robotron. I didn’t even bother with Robotron because when I played Smash TV I discovered that both the joysticks were freakin’ 4-WAY STICKS…. Wtf good is that? How could any self-respecting operator deploy this machine to the field? And I thought it was disgraceful to release classic arcade games on iPad… at least with touch controls it’s theoretically possible to hit diagonals.

 

It seems to be hit or miss, if we're talking about "arcades." There's one that I visited a year ago in Ashville, North Carolina. The arcade requires you to make a reservation, because they want to reduce the wear and tear on the games, and increase the enjoyment of the people going to the arcade, so it's not totally packed. It's done really well. 99% of the arcade machines there are original cabinets that have been completely restored... like a perfect Tron, Dragon's Lair, etc. It's absolutely fantastic, and out of the 70+ arcade machines there, all of them but one was working (which was a near-50 year old pinball machine).

 

But there are others I've gone to where some of the arcade machines are those crappy particle board cabinets that they sell now at Walmart, I don't know what you call them... but the ones where they're like half height, and it's total garbage.

 

Definitely hit or miss... but I'm happy at least that the hobby is still on-going, and that people still enjoy playing a single game on a single cabinet.

 

 

[Keatah]

6 hours ago, 82-T/A said:

The arcade requires you to make a reservation, because they want to reduce the wear and tear on the games, and increase the enjoyment of the people going to the arcade, so it's not totally packed.

This is always a positive point. Much more so than having 900 games crammed in under one warehouse-like roof. I simply don't go to any arcade that's overcrowded - and that means all in my area.

[schuwalker]

13 hours ago, Keatah said:

This is always a positive point. Much more so than having 900 games crammed in under one warehouse-like roof. I simply don't go to any arcade that's overcrowded - and that means all in my area.

Eh, I don't mind that at all especially with the amount of stuff he has... What did you do bitd? You would be hard pressed to find an arcade not packed back then.

[82-T/A]

16 hours ago, Keatah said:

This is always a positive point. Much more so than having 900 games crammed in under one warehouse-like roof. I simply don't go to any arcade that's overcrowded - and that means all in my area.

 

Yeah, I totally agree. And to be clear, it's not like it wasn't busy. They "reach capacity" every single day...

 

Apparently it's called the Ashville Pinball Museum: https://ashevillepinball.com/photos

 

... which is right across the street from a large restored structure called the Grove Arcade (not to confuse the term Arcade as video games, but the traditional term arcade as a gallery building supported by trusses).

 

But yeah, really fantastic place. if you have a second, check out the pictures... it really doesn't do it justice. The place makes money from alcohol of course, but you pay a single fee and have unlimited play for essentially as long as you want to stay. Even when they shut down for the night, they don't just shut down your machine... as people get off the machines, they turn them off, so they won't stop you from finishing a game. It's pretty fantastic, very well done, and the machines are in fantastic shape. They even have coin changers... not for any other reason than because they're nostalgic.

 

You know... you still have to wait for games because there are people playing them, but it's not "packed" as in... you're not feeling like you just wasted your money.

[Keatah]

7 hours ago, schuwalker said:

Eh, I don't mind that at all especially with the amount of stuff he has... What did you do bitd? You would be hard pressed to find an arcade not packed back then.

Tried my best to go off-hours. Prime time for GalaxyWorld in the late 80's was like FRI-SAT after 5PM. A madhouse! Otherwise it was nearly empty.

 

The Aladdin's Castle and PinPan Alley were a little out of the way. So we got dropped off there for a couple of hours. Aladdin's was in a new mall in an area not built up yet. So not too crowded. PinPan Alley was next to DataDomain - an Apple II and CP/M and "micro" store that had most all software in baggies. So I could hang out there if my fav game wasn't available at the moment.

 

I tended to like more technical games like Liberator or Tempest or Lunar Lander. Less mainstream stuff. And not the cutesy crap like Pac-Man or Donkey Kong. And that helped.

 

But overall there were crowds, and I certainly had more tolerance back then. Today I have zero.