toptenmaterial Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 So I found an Apple II Plus at my work. A guy there plugged it in for me and hooked it up to the TV. It powers on, but displays this pixelated multicolored tile mess on the TV. He popped the top off and pushed in a few chips that were loose, but no luck. What are the odds of me fixing this up? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesD Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 Everything on the II Plus is off the shelf and socketed so it's easily replaced. Most likely culprit is bad RAM. ROMs can occasionally go bad and you just have to find a source for a replacement. The 6502 can go bad but not very often. Those would be the most likely candidates based on the symptoms. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgeld Posted May 24, 2013 Share Posted May 24, 2013 pretty good, but I recommend you go to the apple II nerd hive https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/comp.sys.apple2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptenmaterial Posted May 24, 2013 Author Share Posted May 24, 2013 I picked it up today for $30. Is there anywhere that I can get 16K ram? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkO Posted May 24, 2013 Share Posted May 24, 2013 I picked it up today for $30. Is there anywhere that I can get 16K ram? Jameco possibly... DRAM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptenmaterial Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 Off-topic, but I don't want to flood AA with Mac threads. When did Apple/Mac get a graphic OS? Can I get one on my II Plus? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgeld Posted May 26, 2013 Share Posted May 26, 2013 (edited) if you have an 80 column card giving you the ability to display high res graphics, yes, there is the apple II desktop, which is a mac like file launcher and disk manager, or gem which is more like a full OS to awnser your other question the first apple with a gui was the LISA in 1983, then the mac in 84 the apple II desktop came about in 86 though other mouse applications existed Edited May 26, 2013 by Osgeld Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptenmaterial Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 if you have an 80 column card giving you the ability to display high res graphics, yes, there is the apple II desktop, which is a mac like file launcher and disk manager, or gem which is more like a full OS to awnser your other question the first apple with a gui was the LISA in 1983, then the mac in 84 the apple II desktop came about in 86 though other mouse applications existed Thanks. If I can get this beast running, and can install the component than you suggests, then it is possible to have something like an early Mac-line graphic OS? Interesting. I have some challenges ahead of me in terms of getting this beast up and running. The first, and greatest challenge, is that I have zero machanical intelligence. So I'll have to compensate with lots of reading an patience. Secondly, I have no video output cable (I tested the unit with a friend's at work). Third, diagnosing the problem. Tempest told me in a PM that there is a command for running diagnostics, or something like that. Fourth is acquiring parts, which might mean buying and cannibalizing more Apples. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgeld Posted May 26, 2013 Share Posted May 26, 2013 (edited) video cable is easy enough, any yellow rca jack cable works the computer will do a basic power on self test, and there are utilities on disk, but of course to get them on disk you need a functioning computer or have someone send it to you, but if its still not booting it wont help much you can get replacement ram, but as I stated before, many times if you just take them out and put them back in it will spring to life Edited May 26, 2013 by Osgeld Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptenmaterial Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 Just tried popping the RAM out... do I need a special tool? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptenmaterial Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 Is the RAM the 24 seperate chips that say RAM, or the 3 chips that say 16k? The 16k ones ain't going anywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgeld Posted May 26, 2013 Share Posted May 26, 2013 (edited) they are in sockets right? you can carefully rock them out with a flat head screw driver, but try to not bend the pins and it should be the 24 chips (sounds like you got 48k of ram) Edited May 26, 2013 by Osgeld 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptenmaterial Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 I took all of the RAM out and put it back in. The machine now makes a horrible whine and some of the RAM chip get hot as hell. Did they have to be in sequence? Did I just cook my machine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgeld Posted May 26, 2013 Share Posted May 26, 2013 (edited) no but they have to go in the same direction they came out one side is marked with a dot or a U shape, make sure they are all pointing the same direction Edited May 26, 2013 by Osgeld Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Usotsuki Posted May 26, 2013 Share Posted May 26, 2013 Apple II Desktop needs a //e... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted May 26, 2013 Share Posted May 26, 2013 Hard to say, hope you turned it off pretty quick. Check that they're all pointed the same way and not staggered or offset in the sockets. As an aside note, I'm seeing tons more and more bad Apples these days. And it's mostly ram causing it. That, and corrosion on the pins. Clean the pins on the inside portion of the chip, that's where they make contact. Visible oxides on the outside means little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptenmaterial Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 They are not all pointed in the same direction, and the pins took a beating when they came out I straighted all of the points with my fingernail before putting them back in. Hope I didn't fry the board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgeld Posted May 26, 2013 Share Posted May 26, 2013 (edited) nah worst case is you might have killed some ram chips (you would be surprised how tough stuff can be) and if you did kill them, they are only a buck a pop http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_41339_-1 Edited May 26, 2013 by Osgeld Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptenmaterial Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 Thanks again. I saw RAM in much higher kb than 2, will the machine think it's 2kb if it's actually, say, 614kb? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptenmaterial Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 So I went back though it and put all of the ram in the right direction. The horrible high frequency whine is gone now, and nothing gets hot. That must be a good thing! However there is a very rapid 'on off' clicking noise... odd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClausB Posted May 26, 2013 Share Posted May 26, 2013 Did anyone besides me get teary-eyed reading this thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted May 26, 2013 Share Posted May 26, 2013 (edited) Did anyone besides me get teary-eyed reading this thread? Bahh.. blowing up a computer by putting parts in backwards is nothing! As a kid I used to do the strangest of experiments to my old II+ unit. You can only really do 16/32/48 KB configurations, anything else requires modification. So you need 4116. Next best step is to replace all the RAM. This will eliminate the chips you might have blown, or were bad when you first powered it up. Keep the old chips nearby. Edited May 26, 2013 by Keatah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptenmaterial Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 Hopefully this clicking abates when I get some new RAM in there. I had removed a large ROM chip earlier to see how easily I could pull out the chips. I put it back in with the writing facing the correct way, but a small logo facing the other way (?). I have been lucky in getting my hands on old equipment that works perfectly. My 800, for example. This Apple will be a challenge to me. Now, the question is, what the hell is that rapid clicking noise? And will fresh RAM stop it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.Cade Posted May 26, 2013 Share Posted May 26, 2013 That's the power supply "crowbaring" or shorting out. You have something in wrong, or you have shorted one or more chips internally. You've made the situation much worse than it was originally, unfortunately. You can carefully remove everything and put it in correctly, or better yet find a friend who knows something about electronics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toptenmaterial Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 Anyone wanna fix this for me? Work something out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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