How successful was the Xegs?

[Ransom]

I remember seeing 7800s at Games Unlimited (in The Willows Shopping Centre in Concord, CA), and then later seeing XEGSes there. The only other place I ever saw either in a retail store was at B&C Computervisions. I've been told Toys 'R' Us sold 7800s, but I don't recall seeing them when I would go in there for NES games. Doesn't mean they weren't there -- just that they weren't merchandised in such a way that I'd notice them.

[DesertJets]

I remember seeing 7800s at Games Unlimited (in The Willows Shopping Centre in Concord, CA), and then later seeing XEGSes there. The only other place I ever saw either in a retail store was at B&C Computervisions. I've been told Toys 'R' Us sold 7800s, but I don't recall seeing them when I would go in there for NES games. Doesn't mean they weren't there -- just that they weren't merchandised in such a way that I'd notice them.

 

I have a vague memory of being at a Toys R Us in suburban Chicago (most likely by Hawthorn Mall) in the late 80s and seeing the XEGS on display. I was very well aware of them, thought it was cool, remembered a TV ad or two, spent endless time looking at it in the Sears Catalog. But it was a long time ago and I was 8 or 9 at the time. I do remember they still have 2600 games there and I had picked something out that I wanted but my mom wouldn't let me get it. In fact now that I think about it I am not sure why we were in that Toys R Us in the first place -- and now I am kind of pissed I couldn't get a new 2600 game in 1988.

 

 

 

About the buying something that is a computer to justify the purchase of a game console. It just seems silly that you'd buy a computer with the hopes that your kid will learn something useful with like, like programming or something, without having any sort of instruction or classes to go along with it. I do buy that there are/were some kids that would have just taken to it and played around and learned something. But then the other 99% would get bored and wonder why they can't play SMB on their Atari. Sort of like the time my parents bought me one of those cheapie little Casio keyboards in the hope I'd learn to play -- just because I liked goofing around on the organ we had in the house.

[RickR]

 

About the buying something that is a computer to justify the purchase of a game console. It just seems silly that you'd buy a computer with the hopes that your kid will learn something useful with like, like programming or something, without having any sort of instruction or classes to go along with it. I do buy that there are/were some kids that would have just taken to it and played around and learned something. But then the other 99% would get bored and wonder why they can't play SMB on their Atari. Sort of like the time my parents bought me one of those cheapie little Casio keyboards in the hope I'd learn to play -- just because I liked goofing around on the organ we had in the house.

I've had a 25 year software development career thanks to having a VIC-20 and Atari 800XL as a kid. And I have numerous friends that have a similar start. Maybe it was more of a thing for those about 10 years older than you...when home computers were new and cool. I mean, your casio keyboard analogy does make perfect sense. Parents hope. Sometimes it sticks, and sometimes it doesn't.

[Ransom]

I've had a 25 year software development career thanks to having a VIC-20 and Atari 800XL as a kid. And I have numerous friends that have a similar start. Maybe it was more of a thing for those about 10 years older than you...when home computers were new and cool. I mean, your casio keyboard analogy does make perfect sense. Parents hope. Sometimes it sticks, and sometimes it doesn't.

 

I think you're right about the age thing. It was just assumed at the time that if you bought your kid a computer, he or she would learn to program and it would be great preparation for the future, when computers would be everywhere.

 

Pretty prescient, as it turned out.

[Jakandsig]

Atari's status in the arcades sunk as early as the mid-eighties, and by 1990 they had pretty much lost their standing their. The kings of the arcade were companies such as Sega, Capcom, Konami, Namco, SNK and Midway.

 

 

Have you ever seen their numbers? The rest of their business had already started breaking away when the Jaguar was released.

Because of the development of the JAguar. The lynx was making money, they closed the 7800 and 2600 at a time when they were both brigning modest profit, and the computers were mixed.

 

Also no, Atari was still top game in the early 90's with Midway basically becoming the leader and going into the 2000's.

[Jess Ragan]

 

You sound like my cousins. They had an XEGS, back before I realized home games existed (I was 6). I was impressed, asked my parents for one... received an NES set for Christmas a year later. And then the NES never got Dig Dug.

 

Sure it did! Uh, in Japan, anyway.

[+Cafeman]

I remember doing a double-take at seeing 7800 consoles for sale at K-mart. This must've been 1986-87. But I never noticed XEGS for sale. I would have scoffed at it, since I had owned an A8 and 5200 for many years already at that point and I was tired of it by the mid/late 80's.

 

I only recently learned of the XEGS existence, in the 2000's. I do own one now and it's what I use to play A8 games.

[108 Stars]

Because of the development of the JAguar. The lynx was making money, they closed the 7800 and 2600 at a time when they were both brigning modest profit, and the computers were mixed.

 

Also no, Atari was still top game in the early 90's with Midway basically becoming the leader and going into the 2000's.

I would have to disagree on all accounts. The Lynx was not selling well,it had a few markets such as the UK were sales were moderate, but overall it was not going well at all. Hell, they had problems getting anyone to do software for the system. Atari tried to give it a second breath of life with the Lynx II, but that also failed.

 

And no, Atari was not anywhere near the top of arcades in the early 90ies. The last thing that may have been a hit was probably Hard Drivin'. Later games like Rampart, Primal Rage or S.T.U.N. Runner were not flops, but a far cry from the top of arcade games.

 

Just like on home systems the age of japanese game developers started to really come into gear in the mid to late 80es. The hits of the late 80ies and 90ies were games like Outrun, Space Harrier, Double Dragon, Final Fight, Street Fighter II, Golden Axe, Ridge Racer etc. Midway played a huge role with things like Mortal Kombat and NBA Jam, the highest grossing arcade game ever.

 

Atari Games was nowhere near that level anymore.

[Rybags]

Atari's arcade exploits after the mid 1980s don't really matter - Atari Games and Atari Corp were 2 distinct companies with little association other than name once Warner split them up.

 

Arcade games were on the wane by the mid 80s anyway.

As for the Tramiel owned Atari Corp, as we all know the ST was the big success story, they never really made inroads with the new consoles and 2600 + 8-bit computer sales went up but eventually trailed off by the late 80s.

 

The Lynx did very well in the early test markets, but the big problems were price, lack of titles and the Gameboy and Sega GameGear. Gameboy was technically inferior on practically every point but Atari didn't have much chance due to better marketing and pricing by Nintendo.

 

Jaguar - great at the time but failings included marketing, price, cartridge media instead of CD.

Problem also being that it was one of those unlucky consoles like Dreamcast, Saturn and Gamecube that was more of a half-generation leap rather than full generation.

As we all know, Playstation came along and swept the floor with the competition. Game Over.

[108 Stars]

Even if Atari Games was a seperate entity from Atari Corp, they did have a close relationship, as arcade ports mostly came to the Atari home systems even if no other systems received them.

 

In general your account is correct, but the reasons why have been discussed over and over; what matters in the end is that in the 1990ies, Atari was a sinking ship as none of their endeavors proved successful. The ST lost more and more ground to the Amiga, with the homecomputer market dying soon. The Lynx was not serious competition for the GB or even the GG. The Jaguar sold even worse. And Atari Games' arcade business had also been left behind by a lot of other companies.

 

There was just nothing from either Atari company to make an impact on the market in the 1990ies, and that trend started in the mid 80ies where the ST was Atari's only real hit, with systems like the 7800, the 8-bit computers and the XEGS having moderate sales, but still being way behind the competition of the time.

[high voltage]

Yeah, Nintendo's got a lot to answer for....

[108 Stars]

To add something positive about the XEGS: It looked much nicer than its contemporary computer-turned-console, the C64GS.

 

 

But the Amstrad GX4000 beats them both in regards to a stylish design.^^

 

 

How many games were really available on cartridge and compatible withthe XEGS out of the box (meaning no keyboard input required or anything)?

Edited December 7, 2013 by 108 Stars

[+pboland]

How many games were really available on cartridge and compatible withthe XEGS out of the box (meaning no keyboard input required or anything)?

 

Many actually. The reason being is a lot of those games just used the "option", "select", "reset" and "start" buttons which is right on the XEGS console itself. The only function button not on the XEGS console is the "help" button, but that is on the keyboard. I'd have to say Atari's XEGS was a much better execution than the C64GS, considering I've never actually seen a C64GS in person (I've been collecting since 1995). I don't even remember seeing it in the stores. I do however remember seeing the XEGS at Children's Palace and Toys R Us back in the day.

Edited December 7, 2013 by pboland

[Jess Ragan]

I heard the C64 game system was just a way to burn through PCBs designed for a crappy German version of the Commodore 64 that nobody wanted (or was it the other way around?). And I'd agree, a Commodore 64 game system without a keyboard was a very bad idea. The C64 was known for having games on disc; the Atari 8-bit series did a lot more with its cartridge slot.

[high voltage]

Approx 400 cartridge titles on XEGS (From Star Raiders to Flight Simulator II)

[8th lutz]

Even if Atari Games was a seperate entity from Atari Corp, they did have a close relationship, as arcade ports mostly came to the Atari home systems even if no other systems received them.

 

 

That was not always the case. Atari Games Corp. affected the Atari 7800 in a negative light. While the Atari 7800 had Food Fight, Asteroids, Centipede, those were started for the Atari 7800 before Jack Tramiel became the owner of the computer and game divisions of Atari and Atari Games wasn't a separate company yet. The other thing with the Arcade games I mentioned was they were going to be launch titles for the Atari 7800 in 1984.

 

The fact is Atari Games didn't have a close relationship with Atari Inc. before later in the life of the Atari 7800 and it was too late for the Atari 7800. Atari 7800 had arcade games from Atari Games Corp planned in Klax, Steel Talons, Pitfighter, and Rampart, but weren't released.

 

Atari 7800 didn't have Gauntlet, Gauntlet 2, Marble Madness, Paperboy, 720 degrees, Super Sprint, Toobin, Road Blasters, Skull and Crossbones, Vindicators unlike the NES and those games weren't even planned for the Atari 7800. The Atari 7800 had a lot issues such as not a lot of good original games that weren't arcade or computer ports, but not having any games that were created after the arcade division of Atari being renamed Atari Games didn't help matters.

Edited December 7, 2013 by 8th lutz

[108 Stars]

Well, I am no 7800 expert, so thanks for the info. what I meant to say was mostly that Atari's later arcade games were not nearly as hot as other companies games (in response to someone stating Atari was the big thing in the arcades until 2000 or so), and other publishers were not even interested enough to pick them up for release on other consoles.

 

The games were also released by Atari Games themselves (ie Tengen). If Tengen didn't do it, nobody else did either. Games like STUN Runner or Xybots only ever made it to the Lynx, nobody seemed to shed a tear about missing out on those later arcade "hits"...

 

Not to say that the games were all bad, but they just weren't big hits. Atari Games had become just aonether company in the arcade sector instead of being a leader.

 

Many actually. The reason being is a lot of those games just used the "option", "select", "reset" and "start" buttons which is right on the XEGS console itself. The only function button not on the XEGS console is the "help" button, but that is on the keyboard.

Approx 400 cartridge titles on XEGS (From Star Raiders to Flight Simulator II)

That's actually quite good. The C64GS suffered from even when you had C64 cartridges, some games were designed to require a keyboard. The number of cartridges released specifically for the GS was very low (as was the number of GX4000 carts). Edited December 7, 2013 by 108 Stars

[+pboland]

Approx 400 cartridge titles on XEGS (From Star Raiders to Flight Simulator II)

That's 400 carts total that were compatible and some of those required the keyboard. If I recall only about 32 title were actually released/repackaged (meaning released in the matching light grey XE cart casings) as XE cart titles during the time of the XEGS. I don't know how many of the other 368 carts (of the 400 total) were available for purchase during the run of the XEGS.

Edited December 8, 2013 by pboland

[BassGuitari]

Call me crazy, but I actually think the C64GS is kind of a slick-looking piece of hardware. It has kind of a Sega Mark II/III vibe, but is more minimalistic and streamlined. I don't see the point of it without any sort of keyboard though. Even some F keys somewhere on the console would have been helpful. How many C64 cart games could there possibly be that don't require ANY keyboard input?

Anyway, this thread is inspiring me to collect more XEGS stuff. I got a CIB XEGS for free earlier this year and all I've got for it -- not including my other 400/800 carts and disks and tapes -- is Flight Simulator II and Bug Hunt. (Those games have to rank as two of the worst pack-in games ever, BTW.)

[Jakandsig]

I would have to disagree on all accounts. The Lynx was not selling well,it had a few markets such as the UK were sales were moderate, but overall it was not going well at all. Hell, they had problems getting anyone to do software for the system. Atari tried to give it a second breath of life with the Lynx II, but that also failed.

 

And no, Atari was not anywhere near the top of arcades in the early 90ies. The last thing that may have been a hit was probably Hard Drivin'. Later games like Rampart, Primal Rage or S.T.U.N. Runner were not flops, but a far cry from the top of arcade games.

 

Just like on home systems the age of japanese game developers started to really come into gear in the mid to late 80es. The hits of the late 80ies and 90ies were games like Outrun, Space Harrier, Double Dragon, Final Fight, Street Fighter II, Golden Axe, Ridge Racer etc. Midway played a huge role with things like Mortal Kombat and NBA Jam, the highest grossing arcade game ever.

 

Atari Games was nowhere near that level anymore.

 

You seem to be losing track fow hat your saying because you say things don't sell well and later say they sold modestly.

 

the lynx WAS selling well. It was making money.

 

Just like on home systems

 

 

You do realize this only applied to hardware and not software right?

 

Atari was not anywhere near the top of arcades in the early 90ies

 

 

yes they were. Just because you want to believe they were not, does not mean it's true. it's why Midway brought the arcade division and the arcade IPS the main division could not hold, because they were successful.

[Jakandsig]

Well, I am no 7800 expert, so thanks for the info. what I meant to say was mostly that Atari's later arcade games were not nearly as hot as other companies games (in response to someone stating Atari was the big thing in the arcades until 2000 or so), and other publishers were not even interested enough to pick them up for release on other consoles.

 

The games were also released by Atari Games themselves (ie Tengen). If Tengen didn't do it, nobody else did either. Games like STUN Runner or Xybots only ever made it to the Lynx, nobody seemed to shed a tear about missing out on those later arcade "hits"...

 

Not to say that the games were all bad, but they just weren't big hits. Atari Games had become just aonether company in the arcade sector instead of being a leader.

 

That's actually quite good. The C64GS suffered from even when you had C64 cartridges, some games were designed to require a keyboard. The number of cartridges released specifically for the GS was very low (as was the number of GX4000 carts).

 

This was never said. Can you read whole posts? Otherwise you seem to not know what you're saying. Not sure what Tengen has to do with anything actually.

[RickR]

Easy now. No need for this to turn nasty. State your facts. Don't make it personal. Peace on Earth.

[108 Stars]

This was never said. Can you read whole posts? Otherwise you seem to not know what you're saying. Not sure what Tengen has to do with anything actually.

See this quote from you:

 

No pretty sire Atari and Williams/Bally/Midway were still the top in the arcades until 2001.

I simply disagree with you. Atari was just a minor player in the arcade business of the 90ies. And saying that the Lynx sold moderately well in some markets does not contradict it being unsuccessful overall. A few moderately successful markets can't turn the tide if the product is not selling well in most places. The Lynx was clearly the number three in the handheld market... with only three handhelds available. I highly doubt Atari was making money with it. Not good.

 

And no, the dominance of japanese companies was apparent in hard- and software. It was mostly the japanese games that were the big hits in the age of Sega and Nintendo, and later the first PlayStation. It was only in the 2000s that Japan began losing ground and western games rose to the top again. And lack of japanese software was a big factor in the limited attractiveness of Atari systems from the mid-80ies on.

 

What does Tengen have to do with anything? You do know that Tengen was a daughter of Atari Games, and was founded in order to publish ports of the Atari arcade games to home systems? They did so,some games like Rampart did okay. But different from companies like Capcom, Konami and Sega with their arcade ports Tengen was still a third tier publisher in most eyes. Because they had to rely on the Atart arcade games which were NOT exactly the hottest stuff in the arcades. I also bring up STUN Runner and Xybots because while Tengen did not realease ports of those for systems other than the Lynx, nobody else licensed them and did so either. Strange. Maybe nobody was interested? It would not have been unusual to give someone else the license for a cut of the profit if you don't plan to publish a port yourself. But if Tengen didn't do it themselves, nobody else did.

 

As far as I am concerned all you say is incorrect. Japanese games dominated the market; Atari's role in the arcades was minor by 1990; and things did not work out at all for them sales wise when they started pushing the Jaguar.

 

Cheers.

 

Easy now. No need for this to turn nasty. State your facts. Don't make it personal. Peace on Earth.

Agree. People shouldn't get all emotional about video gaming history from 2 - 3 decades ago.

Edited December 8, 2013 by 108 Stars

[Master Phruby]

Back when I was a kid, I learned to program on a 400 and then upgraded to 130xe when the 400 died. I didn't buy a XEGS or 5200 until this year simply because I already had those games on my 400/XE. The XEGS was fun to type in programs again like I did as a kid. I even printed out a game from ANALOG and typed it back in. What a pain in the ass that was! I couldn't believe how small the keyboard was. Did I actually learn to type with this thing? I also felt it was too complicated to have a online set of games setup on it. I could have gotten an SIO2SD but still I would have to deal with DOS and type on the keyboard to start a game. I bought the 5200 and a ultra SD cartridge to make it easier to play the game library. It's much more fun to turn on the machine and select a game from the menu and play for five minutes.

[Charlie_]

Back when I was a kid, I learned to program on a 400 and then upgraded to 130xe when the 400 died. I didn't buy a XEGS or 5200 until this year simply because I already had those games on my 400/XE. The XEGS was fun to type in programs again like I did as a kid. I even printed out a game from ANALOG and typed it back in. What a pain in the ass that was! I couldn't believe how small the keyboard was. Did I actually learn to type with this thing? I also felt it was too complicated to have a online set of games setup on it. I could have gotten an SIO2SD but still I would have to deal with DOS and type on the keyboard to start a game. I bought the 5200 and a ultra SD cartridge to make it easier to play the game library. It's much more fun to turn on the machine and select a game from the menu and play for five minutes.

Actually with Kheffington's 4 game files that use MyPicoDos. Any 64K A8 with sio2sd is extremely easy to use. You only need the KB to hit 1-4 to select the disk images. Then of course you'll need it depending on the game. However selecting and launching the games is just as easy as the SD cart.

I'm a huge 5200 fan and user and love my 5200 gear and SD cart, but the sio2sd on an A8 is really cool as well.