Keatah Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 We all know that emulation is the future of gaming past. There will be a time when the last bit of original classic hardware ceases to function. It may be 50 years from now? Maybe more? But in the meantime, people are using emulation for convenience, development, and quick fixes for when original hardware is too difficult to set up. So what can be done to make using the emulators of today more enjoyable and easy and practical? 1- Have an organized set of roms. Have them organized in a way you can understand but at the same time devise a structure that enables you to add to the library over time with minimal effort. Sometimes this may mean deduping a collection and/or getting rid of material you'll never ever play. But yet at the same time making sure the library is complete. 2- Have all the video and controller options set up right. Sound is simple, so I don't mention that. But most emulators have seemingly endless options for video modes, formats, styles, resolutions, APIs, and all that. And the number of controllers and exactly how they are mapped and configured is even higher. It is important to take the time to set all this up just right for your existing hardware. The last thing you want to be doing is playing tempest with the numeric keypad in a postage-stamp sized window with lagging sound! Please no smart-ass answers like dumping emulation for the real thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LidLikesIntellivision Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 Without dumping emulation for the real thing, you can make your emulation more real. The first thing I seek to improve emulations is to connect the original controller or a third party fully compatible. For instance, talking about Atari 2600, you can have the stelladaptor or an usb adapted atari joystick. The best solution, would be an original port in your PC case. After this, the second improvement consists in choosing a PC - it can be an old one depending on the systems you emulate - to be used only for your gaming emulator. When you do this, you can start to see your pc in a different way. Then maybe you want to use some nice stickers or paint it to make it looks like a gaming machine... You can also configure your OS to resemble a gaming machine. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxpressed Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 Output to a CRT TV. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Dart Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 Output to a CRT TV. Give the man a prize! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sega_SHARK Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 (edited) But most emulators have seemingly endless options for video modes, formats, styles, resolutions, APIs, and all that. I want all of that stuff. I don't care if it's a pain in the butt to configure. In the past, I had Metal Gear Solid running on a Mac with a ton of filters applied to it. It looked gorgeous, It was comparable to running the game on a Bleemcast! disc on a Dreamcast. When I downloaded the same game from PSN on a PS3 there was no smoothing applied to it, and it looked jagged as all get out. It was accurate, but disappointing. The same can be said for running Nestopia, I like having a "Super Eagle" filter applied to it, the game I'm playing looks updated and more cartoon like. Filters, filters, filters. I want more of them. Edit: Super Eagle, not double eagle Edited March 12, 2014 by sega_SHARK 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Algus Posted March 13, 2014 Share Posted March 13, 2014 OpenEmu We have a topic about it elsewhere. It is still early in its life so it only supports a handful of the more popular systems but this thing is ~great~ to use. Nice graphical front end that incorporates downloading cover art from the web, allows you to rate your games and filter by rating, tracks data on the last time you played, etc. and condenses all those nonsensical technical menus into a few easy to click option screens. Works great with most modern BT gaming controllers. People will always want to be able to play their games on the TV I think, so the big vendors (Sony, Microsoft, etc.) ought to be delivering emulation environments though as long as licensing and such restricts the raw usability and ease of access to classic games, I think the shady grey area of illegal emulation will remain the quickest and most convenient way to play games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaughan Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 I'm different from most here in that my purpose of having emulation is purely about access to some great games. What I mean is, I prefer to use a 360 Controller for all my Atari needs. I play on a LCD screen with no effects. On Mame I make use of Autofire (unless I participate on the High Score Comps on this site, of course). I want the games emulated properly, so they play the same, with the same level of difficulty etc. But for other things, such as how they look on the screen, and how I control them, I prefer settings and controllers that maximize the benefits of a modern age. I don't have a desire to use a CRT, for example, not when I'm already using a 52 inch LCD. More power to everyone doing things the way that brings them pleasure. For me, it's the games, not the hardware. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Retron 5 goes half-way in enabling emulation features on real carts. The second step is to allow ROMs since flash carts cannot be supported. Tying up my main computer for emulation no longer excites me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Phruby Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Are we sure the Retron 5 won't allow SD flash carts? Did they do something special to keep Everdrive carts from working on it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+wongojack Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Output to a CRT TV. Yes but manufacturing on these has now almost completely stopped worldwide, so the point applies here. They will all be gone someday. I actually had one just die on me last week which was surprising (although I think it is just a fuse somewhere). Tying up my main computer for emulation no longer excites me. So get another computer? I have an old laptop hooked to my TV. I took the screen off and it takes up less space than any game console. It runs anything I want to do in emulation up to PS1. I haven't tried every system of course. I like using the original controllers, so that is a big deal for me. Having just one emulator that can do it all WOULD be nice . . . I think it'd be cool if technology advanced far enough that re-coding could be almost automatic. So someone could invent a magic retro engine and you could "format" old roms for that engine and it would just work. Somewhere between having a new emulator that does everything and actually having to re-code every game. This could enable things like high score sharing and online multiplayer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
israelg Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 Output to a CRT TV. This is great, and using original controllers !!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dualcam Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 This is great, and using original controllers !!! At the risk of a shameless plug, you can use original controllers now (and more than just the joysticks) - http://2600-daptor.com/ Tom 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Dart Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 Are we sure the Retron 5 won't allow SD flash carts? Did they do something special to keep Everdrive carts from working on it? Pretty sure all they've said is that it's "not supported", meaning they won't help you solve it if you plug one in and it doesn't work 100%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+wongojack Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 At the risk of a shameless plug, you can use original controllers now (and more than just the joysticks) - http://2600-daptor.com/ Tom I have this product and love it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted April 26, 2014 Author Share Posted April 26, 2014 (edited) After this, the second improvement consists in choosing a PC - it can be an old one depending on the systems you emulate - to be used only for your gaming emulator. When you do this, you can start to see your pc in a different way. Then maybe you want to use some nice stickers or paint it to make it looks like a gaming machine... I got to thinking - maybe make some Activision SpaceShuttle style control panel overlays for the keyboard. These would be 2" strips running the entire length of the keyboard and rest atop it right above the F1-F12 keys. It would simply be a nicely laminated cheat-sheet done up in the style of the system being emulated. Each system would then have its own "overlay" depicting the major keyboard functions. They could also contain a small-print list of other secondary functions. And the boarder and background of each strip there could stylized and done up in system colors. On the cheat-strip would be each machine's logo. It would also serve as a temporary reminder (as if we'd actually need it) of what system is being run, but more importantly it would bring some essence and substance to the experience. Sort of like having the console sitting on the floor, in view while playing games, but in the background. You'd always have the Atari or Colecovision logo and stylized badge & graphics visible. Edited April 26, 2014 by Keatah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted April 26, 2014 Author Share Posted April 26, 2014 I'm different from most here in that my purpose of having emulation is purely about access to some great games. What I mean is, I prefer to use a 360 Controller for all my Atari needs. I play on a LCD screen with no effects. On Mame I make use of Autofire (unless I participate on the High Score Comps on this site, of course). I want the games emulated properly, so they play the same, with the same level of difficulty etc. But for other things, such as how they look on the screen, and how I control them, I prefer settings and controllers that maximize the benefits of a modern age. I don't have a desire to use a CRT, for example, not when I'm already using a 52 inch LCD. More power to everyone doing things the way that brings them pleasure. For me, it's the games, not the hardware. For me it is about both the hardware and the games. I'm interested in being able to play them as trouble free as possible. AND having the ability to go back and forth instantly between systems and games. LCD's rock hard. I am NOT sorry to have seen the CRT go away. It can take all it's problems, headaches, adjustments, tweaks, and distortions with it! A directly-addressable dot-matrix display is perfect for repeatability and reliability. If the system wants to put a pixel "here" it can do so. An LCD is like an enlarged portion of a framebuffer memory chip. You can't get any more intimate than that. Think about it! Without dumping emulation for the real thing, you can make your emulation more real.Then maybe you want to use some nice stickers or paint it to make it looks like a gaming machine...You can also configure your OS to resemble a gaming machine. Sure, just as long is it isn't one of those bling-bling cases with blue lights and plastic chrome and shit or a piece of luggage full of airline stickers. I think it'd be cool if technology advanced far enough that re-coding could be almost automatic. So someone could invent a magic retro engine and you could "format" old roms for that engine and it would just work. Somewhere between having a new emulator that does everything and actually having to re-code every game. This could enable things like high score sharing and online multiplayer. The closest thing would be a a single directory full of all your emulators, and your only task is to match the rom to the emulator. Granted there is no commonality in control conventions and keyboard options, but you can come close. I always thought MESS was supposed to be like that, in a way, but the user interface is beyond terrible and shows no signs of improving. I suppose one can distill (via command line and front-end-like menuing) all their roms down into 1 access scheme. This is a highly personalized area so I shall leave it at that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schizophretard Posted May 4, 2014 Share Posted May 4, 2014 But in the meantime, people are using emulation for convenience, development, and quick fixes for when original hardware is too difficult to set up. I want to focus on what is in bold because it is important. A big reason someone becomes a console gamer as opposed to a PC gamer is because a console is convenient and easy to set up. They are designed to be as plug and play as possible. You don't have to know anything about specs, adjustments, you can be entirely computer illiterate, you don't have to know what is in the console, etc. You just take a console out of its box, read the simple instructions to hook it up, read what the very few buttons on the console and controllers do, and then after you try out the pack-in-game you possess all the knowledge of how to play every future game afterwards. In other words, about an hour or so after taking a console out of its box you are an expert. Emulation is not like that. You can feel its "PCness". Each emulator is a program that you have to learn and it takes more than an hour to learn how to make every game function and appear on your TV in the same way as if it were the real thing. So, my point is to increase the enjoyment of emulation it needs to not just emulate the games and consoles but emulate the convenient easy to set up console experience. It needs to be one program that emulates them all, it needs to have a common easy and very user friendly UI, it needs to have default settings that matches the consoles' original settings with most other settings being advanced settings that most don't need to touch, it needs to be able to just drop in ROMs that self organize into the correct folders that are folders you never really have to see, it needs to have a virtualized game room environment, it needs to automatically detect which controllers are hooked in, etc. To give an idea of what I'm imagining, I download a program, hook my computer to my TV, and launch the program. What I see is like a virtualized mansion with consoles organized in a massive living room. There will be rooms for each video game collection with them on book shelves with them in their boxes with manuals. It would look like the kind of place you hope to see when you die. All you have to do is just throw all the ROMs you want in it and then navigate your avatar around to pick what to play. There would be advanced settings, shortcuts, etc. and even ways to add other things like digital video game magazines and so forth but the average Joe could just launch the program, fill it with ROMs, and use it as is to feel like they died and went to video game heaven. It would feel like a video game about playing video games with that plug and play console experience. You would have your own virtual game collection mansion. It could even have online functionality where if you are looking at a game you could look up where to buy it online, look up information about the game, etc. Anyway, it would be like a virtualized version of what a video game collector would have in real life if they were a millionaire and it would be extremely simple to use. It would be like learning only one video game to play all of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roland p Posted May 4, 2014 Share Posted May 4, 2014 A directly-addressable dot-matrix display is perfect for repeatability and reliability. If the system wants to put a pixel "here" it can do so. An LCD is like an enlarged portion of a framebuffer memory chip. You can't get any more intimate than that. Think about it! Yes you can: A crt memory tube. People prefer crt's for (maybe they don't know yet ) their color reproduction, responsiveness and lack of motion blur (yep, the memory effect of an tft lcd is something you do NOT want). Also the effect of bright dots being larger adds some of the nostalgia. A scanning device is a nice way of drawing an image (set some bright dots which immidiatly fade away). Maybe just a small OLED tv would do the thing and achieve 90% of crt goodness. (I think old games where never meant to be displayed on 50" tv's YMMV) Of course crt's suck for their weight, not-flatness (expect the sony wega ones and the likes), overscan areas, convergence errors. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyChris Posted May 4, 2014 Share Posted May 4, 2014 I have this product and love it! I also have this product and love it! One thing that I hate about VIC20 emulation is trying to get the correct settings to run a game. Memory size, NTSC or PAL, joystick... I have given up at times. There should be a wrapper for these images with the correct settings. I hope we will see this in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariLeaf Posted May 4, 2014 Share Posted May 4, 2014 At the risk of a shameless plug, you can use original controllers now (and more than just the joysticks) - http://2600-daptor.com/ Tom I'm thinking about getting this for use on the Ouya, anyone know if it works? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NinjaWarrior Posted May 12, 2014 Share Posted May 12, 2014 I use my Wii to play VCS, Intellivision, SNES, NES, TG-16, Genesis, Master System, Game Gear, Game Boy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwilove Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 I use Altirra a lot - on a laptop - I am designing the graphics for AtariBLAST! - and don't have my old Atari hardware anymore. I do want to check out other A8 software - but find some simply don't run - probably because I don't know what the settings should be set on? I'm not into the hardware side nor am I a technie. Same with trying to get some 5200 programs to run. AtariBLAST! is for A8 and 5200 hardware. I am using tools specially for this project - running within a browser. They are certainly more convenient, etc etc than using A8 software to design with... and never had such good tools, etc back then. But Fontbyter was the best general editor available back then, that was published in Compute magazine. Harvey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted May 13, 2014 Author Share Posted May 13, 2014 (edited) Yep, HARDWARE - FIRMWARE - MEMORY SIZE are the first areas I play with when I encounter something that doesn't work. I found.. HARDWARE: 65XE/130XE or 600XL/800XL FIRMWARE: 600XL/800XL MEMORY SIZE: 320K (rambo) ..works good for a lot of demos and more recently written software. Be sure you have the right ROMS set up. And picking the right memory map for a cartridge makes a difference too. If you find something that isn't working in Altirra, try Atari800 Emulator 3.0.0. While it is not as full-featured as Altirra, it is more amicable to drag'n'drop operation. And it has better NTSC effects. What software are you having difficulty with? Edited May 13, 2014 by Keatah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nebulon Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 I'd love it if someone would refine the Keil emulator for the Color Computer so that the sound is clean. I've yet to be able to run it without the sound coming out scratchy. The OP mentions the main things (audio synch, organized ROMs, properly configured keys, etc..). I think the rest comes down to convenience and presentation (and controllers or course). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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