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Leaving Modern Gaming Behind?


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#26 English Invader OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Jul 28, 2014 2:45 PM

I recently started to embrace the modern gaming world when I built my Linux gaming rig.  I really like Steam and love the way you can just download the software you want straight onto the hard drive without having to rely on disc media.  I'm quite pleased with the library I've built up so far:

 

Steam (mainstream)

 

Football Manager 2014 (first FM game to get ported to Linux)

Euro Truck Simulator 2

Half-Life (first person shooter with linear sci-fi story)

Team Fortress II (arcade style FPS with Metal Slug style graphics)

 

Steam (indie)

 

Democracy 3 (sim)

Game Dev Tycoon (sim)

Fez (platform/puzzle/strategy game)

Amnesia: the Dark Descent (survival horror)

 

Open Source

 

Super Tux Kart (Mario Kart clone based on the Linux penguin and his friends from the open source world)

Super Tux (Super Mario Bros clone based on the Linux penguin)

Pingus (Lemmings clone based on the Linux penguin)

Battle for Wesnoth

Open TTD

 

Emulators

 

Hatari (Atari ST emulator that is so good it almost makes me wonder why I have hundreds of pounds worth of ST gear in my home)

Stella

VICE (C64 and VIC-20)

Nestopia (NES)

Kega Fusion (Sega 8/16 Bit)

DOS Box



#27 Algus OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Jul 28, 2014 4:30 PM

I haven't heard of Pingus, I may have to check this out. Battle for Wesnoth is great. Lately, I've been toying with the idea of building my own "Steambox" just to mess with Linux. My Linux machine is a hacked Chromebook and it only has 16 GB local storage, which is not quite enough for a gaming system.

I really want to build a FreeBSD machine though if I put another computer together so that might scratch that plan.

#28 Emehr OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:37 PM

The Wii was my last modern console. After sitting through half a dozen company logos, an animated menu screen, lengthy cinematic introductions, pointless banter between your character and the NPC getting you started, and an unwanted tutorial of unreasonable length and pandering, I've completely lost interest in playing the game. I'll play an hour or so of it, get distracted by grown-up stuff, come back to it a month later, and not feel like putting the disc into the machine because I forgot everything that was going on or forgot all of the controller functions.

 

I watched my nephew play a WWII fighter game on his PS4 this past weekend and thought to myself "There's nothing happening here that couldn't have been done on the PS2." Seriously. Gameplay-wise it was extremely primitive.



#29 cimerians OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:40 PM

I love modern games just like I love old games. Give me some Doom or a Call of Duty, I'm all in. Yep I like the new Tomb Raider too.

 

Throw me a Colecovision and I'll play that all weekend as well.

 

If your into the indie scene and your active on Steam this is arguably the best era of gaming (other than maybe the 80's).

 

The thing is I've always played computer games. C64 back then and PC these days and in the 90's. 

 

Doesn't mean that like all modern games. A lot of them stink. Just like a lot of old games stink. Every decade has it's garbage. 



#30 Bixler OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Jul 28, 2014 10:08 PM

Super Tux Kart (Mario Kart clone based on the Linux penguin and his friends from the open source world)

Battle for Wesnoth

 

I play both of these regularly, they're awesome.



#31 atarian63 OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Jul 28, 2014 10:09 PM

Not a huge fan either,too involved too long too many buttons.not a fan of analog or dual analog either. And NO PC games ugh,could not stand them from the 80,s forward. Just give me a nice simple console,one with 3 buttons or less.

Edited by atarian63, Mon Jul 28, 2014 10:10 PM.


#32 Ripdubski OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 29, 2014 9:12 AM

When I bought my PS2, I got it for 1 game.  I've repeated that behavior all the way back to NES.  I stopped doing that after the PS2.  I have an XBOX 360 now, and a Wii that I hate.  

 

There are a few games I enjoy on the Xbox (mainly driving), and I only like the SNES/N64/TGFX16 virtual games on the Wii.  Because I only use the Wii on occasion and mainly for emulated classics, I've not bought into a getting a new Wii U.  Sorry Nintendo.  

 

I find I enjoy the old Atari console and computer games more.  The visual eye candy from the new consoles is nice, but the game re-playability is lacking.  Modern games are once and done type things in my opinion.  I also enjoy the casual mobile games that have good re-playability.



#33 Curious Sofa OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 29, 2014 1:44 PM

I agree with the person far up above who said that there's just nothing that draws me to the Xbone or the PS4.  Not a thing.  I figure it won't be too long before the 360/PS3/Wii will be considered "classics" and I can keep my Retro status.  :)

Things I love about modernish game systems:  Wireless controllers, HD graphics, free demos.  Things I dislike:  too many to list.  But just a sample: add on packs that get shoved down your throat, advertisements on menu screens, too much focus on online play (which I never play), poor reliability / crashing, overly grandiose production for mediocre games.

 

So I very seriously think the Ps3/360/Wii will be my last generation of consoles.  And I don't even know that I consider the Xbone / PS4 / WiiU generation to be game consoles in my limited definition anymore.  They're much more media boxes that happen to play games, or so it strikes me.  Yuck.  Give me a damned Genesis any day over that nonsense. :)



#34 Random Terrain ONLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:12 PM

If a company eventually makes a good modern game console that won't be staring at me the whole time, I'll buy it. Until then, I'm not going beyond the Xbox 360.



#35 82-T/A ONLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:09 PM

Yeah... but, I think it has more to do with US than it has to do with THEM.

 

I also realized that the last music I actually listened to was around ~2000. Disturbed, Papa Roach, stuff like that, while mostly not all that great, was still listenable to me since I was still in my early 20s back then. Most of what I grew up listening to was stuff from the 90s (grunge) and I've got an appreciation for 60s, 70s, and 80s music (even the cheesy / gay stuff from the 80s and Disco). But modern music is just total crap.

 

Same thing with games... unless it's an honest remake of a game I played when I was younger, like the new X-Com, or maybe BioShock (me hoping it was going to be like System Shock).... other than games like those, I just have NO interest.

 

 

If I'm being a bit less pragmatic about it... I think modern games just suck... they're crap, there's no plot... it's just all based on graphics. I could have said that though comparing half the games from the 90s with Pool of Radiance from the 80s... but I think it really holds true today. Developers are more about building a good engine and spitting out a game, rather than having something with complex puzzles or story line.



#36 Osgeld ONLINE  

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Posted Thu Jul 31, 2014 7:04 PM

Battle for Wesnoth

 

I just got this, maybe I need more time with it, but the first scenario was boring cause all I could do is move while 50 npc's danced around, second one was good but easy, third one ok nevermind I figured out how to recruit


Edited by Osgeld, Thu Jul 31, 2014 7:08 PM.


#37 Cynicaster OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 5, 2014 11:27 AM


It drives me nuts when some of my friends and family look at me playing my "retro games" and automatically assume that the only reason I'm doing it is because I'm some kind of man-child who wants to be 11 years old again. They just don't get it. The truth of the matter is, it has very little to do with nostalgia or "reliving the old days" because upwards of 90% of the time, I'm playing games that I never played--and often, never even heard of--as a child or teenager.

Retro games simply deliver for my tastes in ways that modern games do not; that's all there is to it.

Here are characteristics that I need a video game to have in order for there to be any chance I'll be interested:

- easy to learn, difficult to master (this is becoming a classic game cliche, but it's important)
- relatively constant "stimulus" via skill-testing action (i.e., no running around doing nothing)
- a scoring system that allows me to objectively measure my performance
- full games can be played from start to finish in short/discreet sessions, without leaving that "unfinished game" feeling

Note that blocky graphics and chip tunes are not listed here. If a "modern" game adheres to the above design parameters, there's a very good chance I'll like it (Pac-Man CE-DX, Super Stardust HD, and Geometry Wars are all absolutely fantastic, IMO).

For me, the problem with the archetypal "modern game" is that, for all of its big budget production and whiz-bang audiovisual wankery, it fails at bringing the most fundamental aspects that make video games even worth playing. I tried to play Uncharted 2 and I got about 85% of the way through it and just gave it back to my friend, because it just wasn't ending soon enough. As good as it looked, I was getting absolutely no gratification from it. It takes no skill whatsoever--anybody with enough patience will "beat" the game, just like the last guy did. Then what? A few months later you will have completely forgotten what the game was about and all you'll be left with is the knowledge that you spent 100 hours on your ass in front of the tube, achieving absolutely nothing.

Now, I know the modern gaming guys would turn that around on me and ask "you say we're achieving nothing, what exactly are you achieving by playing your retro games?" Admittedly, not much. But at least I'm working at, seeing my skills get better, gradually moving up my score targets, comparing notes with others... etc. When you get a new personal best score in a well-designed, skill-based game, even if 99.9% of society couldn't care less, it feels like an achievement. It's gratifying. You know that not just anybody could do what you've done. These little things are what make the time worth wasting.

#38 Keatah OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 5, 2014 12:55 PM

I had (have) to deal with the same stigma about older games, they tend to create an illusion of retarded-ness. And newer games create the 40 year-old hipster-wanna-be manchild still living at home. There have been many many social occasions where I kept my gaming interests under wraps so as not to create the wrong first-impression. But, now, I don't really give a rat's ass what others think. If they think "retard", well, that must be what's on their mind and they're probably not far from it in the first place.

 

At any rate I enjoy both the simple and complex alike:

Video Olympics (1977) (Atari).png 11.11.05 02-17-53 GL-01.jpg

Air-Sea Battle (1977) (Atari)_4.png xpss_21.png



#39 Keatah OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 5, 2014 3:23 PM

The reasons I like retrogaming don't include "because it's old" and "from my childhood". Nostalgia and good times aside, I like the format and presentation. Simple plug-in cartridge in the case of consoles. There is no calling home, no long load times, no updates, no seemingly endless streams of corporate logos and credits. None of that.

 

A good game presents you with immediate playability and a simple instruction manual. You can start right away and work your way up with practice and technique refinement. A good game allows multiple ways to achieve the same goal, or even better yet - create your own goal. Similar to a carnival game - things are immediately obvious as to what needs to be done. But doing it is a whole'nother animal.

 

On the PC side of things, the ideal game should be entirely contained within its own directory folder and not go pissing all over the registry and OS directory. Nor should it go blabbering all over the internet calling home and crap. Being that hands-on type I like to add-on my own add-ons. Get under the hood a little, edit configuration files, install new ships and planets and instruments. New scenery, new airplanes. Perhaps make one myself. Interact with the developers and see your suggestions get implemented. Sandbox! None of that happens with mainstream DLC.

 

I used to be a stickler for physical media and all that. But I slowly and very gradually discovered the benefits of online distribution. As long as I can get complete documentation and full install/zip files that can be saved to USB HDD and set up on a PC without an internet connection I'm happy. One of my favorite games (Orbiter) has way over 1,500 pages of docs and having that in printed form would be a mess. Not to mention the inability to search.

 

Incidentally Orbiter (and flight simulators) have the same control schema as Star Raiders. The joystick for flight control, and the keyboard instrumentation. Some of this genre's offerings have reconfigurable layouts, therefore somewhat lessening the burden of having to relearn controls.

 

Regarding controllers. There's a lot to discuss, but I don't feel like ranting on that now. I prefer a simple joystick with 2 buttons max. One button is even better. And then there is the PC keyboard with 100+ buttons and complex flight control joysticks and custom switch panels and all that. Contradictorily I enjoy both extremes. It's the poorly thought-out mainstream crap in-between that I dislike with a passion.

 

 

 

I can no longer buy a system for a game.  Or buy a game without having companies brutalize my privacy and property rights.

I can either watch another forced firmware update or take two seconds and pop in Chrono Trigger and enjoy my life.

Yep. The most annoying thing.. The stiff requirement of having to be online and enduring all the pitfalls that come along. One of the reasons I dislike Windows 7, the amount of updates. Why so many? Is it that poorly made where they need to keep fixing things? Sheesh! I don't take my car to the mechanic after every drive!

 

 

 

Have you considered the possibility that you're enjoying those games more simply because the controller is easier on your brain and your hands? No analog sticks, less fire buttons to worry about, just move your ship/character/cursor/whatever around and do the desired actions at the press of a button, ergonomically-speaking.

Years ago, I spent the first week of playing Metroid Prime on Game Cube cursing the controls because there were simply too many buttons on the Game Cube controller compared to what I was previously accustomed to, and too many menu options within the game. Switching weapons was okay, but switching visors was a chore for me. Once I truly got the hang of circle-strafing and other basic techniques, then I began to enjoy the game to its full extent. But then, looking at all the other consoles with similar controllers, I couldn't help but ask myself if the controls in every new "modern" game I was going to play afterwards was going to be a chore to learn. Eventually, I just figured I didn't have enough free time to play modern games anyway, so I decided to concentrate on pre-PlayStation consoles and handhelds.

Yes all that. I only play a few complex PC simulations and have had time to learn them in great detail. 15+ years in the case of Flight Simulator, X-Plane and Orbiter. Shit.. Some of the flight computers in Orbiter have 100 page manuals alone. But since these are long-running institutions that don't change their control layouts much, you can commit them to memory and at worst have a quick-reference chart at the ready.

 

Hmmm, haven't faffed with Doom in a while.... :evil:

doom...Doom...DOOM...DOOM!


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Doom. I thought you'd never mention it. I remember setting up the controls for this a certain way that I liked. And when I got into Duke Nukem 3D I also those controls up identically. The ability to customize can make even the most intimidating layouts seem like old-hat.

 

Aside from the gameplay, Doom's infrastructure and lay of the land was nice. It had a storyline that was vague enough where you could put yourself inside it. It didn't fuck with the registry or dump all over the system. It had a manual that was only a few pages long. There were several strategy guides available. It had downloadable content you could manage on your own terms - like getting levels from dial-up BBS' or the then-fledgling 15-year old internet. You could even make your own. It pioneered 3D gaming. And today it's open source.

 

I just don't see this versatility and longevity happening with today's console wares.

 



#40 wongojack OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 5, 2014 3:24 PM

I love modern games just like I love old games. Give me some Doom or a Call of Duty, I'm all in. Yep I like the new Tomb Raider too.

 

Throw me a Colecovision and I'll play that all weekend as well.

 

If your into the indie scene and your active on Steam this is arguably the best era of gaming (other than maybe the 80's).

 

The thing is I've always played computer games. C64 back then and PC these days and in the 90's. 

 

Doesn't mean that like all modern games. A lot of them stink. Just like a lot of old games stink. Every decade has it's garbage. 

 

 

As usual, I pretty much agree 100% with Cim.  I don't really like to play FPS games, but that is just a genre preference.  Frankly, modern gaming encompasses so many different genres that I don't see how you couldn't find something you like.  Geometry Wars and Pinball FX have both gotten mentioned on this thread.  They are available on modern platforms and may be some of the best "classic" games I've ever played.  Not to mention the fact that motion and touch gaming has more in common with the pure gameplay of the arcades than any modern gaming trend in recent memory.

 

I tend to go in phases where I will play classics heavily and then switch to playing modern games.  This gives me a taste of both and prevents me from getting burned out on the same type of game.  During modern gaming "bursts,"  I'll frequently break up gaming with some short breaks of arcade classics as I find the variation appealing.  Right now, I'm playing Dragon Age II which is probably one of the best examples of what the thread starter hates.  I dig the story, so I'm into it.  I've been breaking it up with games of Lady Bug and Time Pilot on my MAME cabinet.  When I finish DA2, I'll probably get into my classic phase again and play some of the 7800 and 2600 homebrews that I've got backlogging.

 

I will say that the complaints about tutorials or the game forcing your camera perspective confuse me.  Both of those things are generally over too fast for me to complain about.  And hey -  I appreciate being told how to play.  The comment about not having time to get through them is confusing because I feel like tutorials save me time and let me get into the basics without time consuming trial and error.  When they force me to look at something, I appreciate it as I don't want to miss a key story element when I'll have plenty of time to explore later.

 

I think this latest generation of games has seen a lot of progression toward storytelling.  It has been an obvious goal and is seen as bringing more people into playing games.  There are good examples and bad ones, but I really don't mind the movie-like aspects when they are done well.  Someone mentioned Uncharted which I loved, and even with all the complaints about the ending, I really think the Mass Effect series took us forward and added new interactivity to the Role Playing genre.  If you don't have the patience for it - I get that, but I really like great stories and have been waiting forever to be able to experience them in games too.



#41 save2600 OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 5, 2014 3:47 PM

If they think "retard", well, that must be what's on their mind and they're probably not far from it in the first place.

 

No worries Keatah! Probably the same spuds that think "Beats" headphones are da bomb after listing to a shitty mp3 demo at Worst Buy!   :rolling: 



#42 cimerians OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 5, 2014 3:49 PM

 But, now, I don't really give a rat's ass what others think. 

 

Totally agree. I bought a couple of Capcom shirts (Ghosts n' Goblins and 1942) and sometimes wear them outside when I go out. I also mention I game when someone asks and tell them its a great hobby and proud of it. I get replies like: "Oh, I only play a few games on my phone...Candy Crush". At that point I say, "You're a gamer too".

 

 

I will say that the complaints about tutorials or the game forcing your camera perspective confuse me.  Both of those things are generally over too fast for me to complain about.  And hey -  I appreciate being told how to play.  The comment about not having time to get through them is confusing because I feel like tutorials save me time and let me get into the basics without time consuming trial and error.  When they force me to look at something, I appreciate it as I don't want to miss a key story element when I'll have plenty of time to explore later.

 

 

With manuals gone and more complex modern games I don't mind tutorials. Saves me the time googling. I guess it depends on the game (and the way they go about doing it) but anything to save me time these days is most welcome. I have an insane backlog.....



#43 am1933 OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 5, 2014 4:29 PM

elite-jpg_181807.jpg

EliteDangerousAlpha04.jpg

 

 

Elite before and after, the only "new" game in years that has got my juices flowing!!!!!



#44 Gregory DG OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 5, 2014 4:41 PM

elite-jpg_181807.jpg

EliteDangerousAlpha04.jpg

 

 

Elite before and after, the only "new" game in years that has got my juices flowing!!!!!

 

Me too! Elite Dangerous looks AMAZING!



#45 Cynicaster OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 6, 2014 8:37 AM

I had (have) to deal with the same stigma about older games, they tend to create an illusion of retarded-ness ... There have been many many social occasions where I kept my gaming interests under wraps so as not to create the wrong first-impression.


I hate to admit it, but I completely keep this hobby to myself in real life. I don’t bring it up, talk about it, or otherwise provide any indication that I’m into it unless I know for sure that the other people are like-minded or at least somewhat interested. I guess there are various reasons for this.

First, I’m just a private person in general. It doesn’t matter what it is, I don’t divulge anything more than the bare minimum to anybody but the absolute closest people in my life.

Second, I can’t stand when I’m around people who blather on about things I care nothing about, so I don’t want to be “that guy”. For example, I was at lunch with some work people recently, and this one guy talked about bicycling from the moment we got in the car to leave the office, to the moment we got back in the car to leave the restaurant. It’s hard for me to think of anything more dull than that, and I wanted to fucking scream.

Third, the allure of retro-games is something only very few people around my age “get”. Either you get it, or you don’t. If you don’t get it, then it’s probably very difficult to look at it as being any different than a full grown adult playing with He-Man figures. While I personally think that view is flawed, I don’t want unfair judgments being quietly placed on me (especially among professional colleagues) as a result of that unfortunate perception. The easiest way to avoid such a thing is to keep the hobby to myself while at work.

Before getting together with my girlfriend, I was doing the online dating thing for a few years, and I met all kinds of women with all kinds of personalities. I was always a bit nervous about the “bombshell” of women first coming to my house and seeing a big old MAME cabinet on my basement wall behind the TV area. Some liked it (and actually played games with me, enthusiastically), some didn’t even acknowledge it (probably not a good sign), and some were clearly disgusted by it. Nobody’s perfect, I guess.

My current girlfriend isn’t all that interested in it outside of certain games like Dr. Mario, SMB, and Lemmings, but she accepts that I am, and leaves me at it. That’s good enough for me.

This past weekend, I had a few guys over, and there was this friend-of-a-friend who I had never met before that showed up. He walked up my driveway, into my garage, then stopped dead in his tracks, staring at the far wall. His friend asked “are you OK?” and he said, “yeah, I’m just staring at that…. Is that a Sega over there? That’s awesome!”

Of course, it wasn’t a “Sega” at all, but an Atari 2600 Vader, but he seemed to have the right attitude. :D

#46 VectorGamer OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 6, 2014 8:52 AM

I hate to admit it, but I completely keep this hobby to myself in real life. I don’t bring it up, talk about it, or otherwise provide any indication that I’m into it unless I know for sure that the other people are like-minded or at least somewhat interested. I guess there are various reasons for this.

 

 

That's the thing I like about going to the arcade tournament at Funspot. While I'm there, I know I'm surrounded by people that are interested in the hobby which "opens me up." Same can be said if you go to gaming expos in your area.

 

A couple of friends of mine are totally into me having an arcade in my house. When I used to throw my annual classic gaming parties, they had a blast and were the life of the party (even when I gave them a spanking on Galaga).

 

Otherwise, the majority of people aren't interested in my love for the hobby. So, I generally don't initiate the topic in conversation.



#47 Cynicaster OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 6, 2014 11:36 AM

That's the thing I like about going to the arcade tournament at Funspot. While I'm there, I know I'm surrounded by people that are interested in the hobby which "opens me up." Same can be said if you go to gaming expos in your area.
 
A couple of friends of mine are totally into me having an arcade in my house. When I used to throw my annual classic gaming parties, they had a blast and were the life of the party (even when I gave them a spanking on Galaga).
 
Otherwise, the majority of people aren't interested in my love for the hobby. So, I generally don't initiate the topic in conversation.


Yeah, I’m not sure what I’d even do with myself if I were surrounded with so many fellow enthusiasts. Seems like it would be cool to be able to talk openly and unabashedly with relative strangers about surviving a “condition red” in Bosconian, or executing a “spray ‘n pray” in Missile Command. I really have no idea what that is like.

I suppose I’m somewhat fortunate to at least have my older brother and younger sister to geek out with on classic games, but that’s about the extent of it for me.

I kind of shudder to think of all the poor arcade collectors out there who have amassed these large collections of games yet are forced to enjoy them year after year in utter solitude. Move to my neighborhood, and I’ll put some miles on those sumbitches, dammit! :D

#48 VectorGamer OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 6, 2014 12:19 PM

Yeah, I’m not sure what I’d even do with myself if I were surrounded with so many fellow enthusiasts. Seems like it would be cool to be able to talk openly and unabashedly with relative strangers about surviving a “condition red” in Bosconian, or executing a “spray ‘n pray” in Missile Command. I really have no idea what that is like.

 

 

If you have the time and money, come out to Funspot for the annual tournament sometime. patbb goes every year and I go every other year.



#49 Cynicaster OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 6, 2014 2:44 PM

If you have the time and money, come out to Funspot for the annual tournament sometime. patbb goes every year and I go every other year.


Believe me, I’ve considered it, but it’s hard to justify. Last time I priced out a trip down there (airfare, hotel, food, etc.) I couldn’t get the total below $1100 for a weekend, and that’s before dropping a single quarter. Driving is out of the question. :(

#50 Rex Dart OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Aug 7, 2014 8:08 AM

 I think modern games just suck... they're crap, there's no plot... it's just all based on graphics. I could have said that though comparing half the games from the 90s with Pool of Radiance from the 80s... but I think it really holds true today. Developers are more about building a good engine and spitting out a game, rather than having something with complex puzzles or story line.

 

Escape Goat 2 came out this year; did you try it?   

 

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