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Ultra Star Raiders-What is the reality here?


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#1 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Aug 10, 2014 2:40 PM

Over the years i've seen Ultra Star Raiders 'listed' as 1 of many mythical unreleased Lynx games and later the claim that Jeff Minter was handling it, yet try as i might i cannot seem to find anything of substance behind said claims.

 

Can anyone shed any light on where the rumour started from and if it actually got started, let alone by Jeff Minter, as i've read numerous interviews with him in Edge, PC Format, RG, etc etc over the years and whilst he shed light on plans for a Star Raiders-esq game on the Panther (which a few of the tech.demo's he did for the Panther were proof off concept routines he planned to use in his game), i never heard him talk of any plans for Lynx development.

 

Is this another proposal only (at best) game, ie Atari looked at doing it, Jeff was 1 of a few coders approached? or just utter myth?.



#2 Lynxpro OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Aug 16, 2014 12:09 PM

Myth. Jeff Minter didn't work on any Lynx projects. Straight from Mr. Lamasoft's mouth on Twitter just a few minutes ago...

 

@The_Jeremy No. I would've loved to've worked on an official SR port but I never got to do anything at all on Lynx :(



#3 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Aug 16, 2014 2:16 PM

Huge thanks for this.Always thought it ruddy strange that Jeff, who'd been so happy to go into such depth over his concept for a Star Raiders type game on the Panther, when talking to Edge magazine few years ago, never said anything about similar plans for the Atari Lynx, nor mentionbing any Lynx development in any interview or column i've seen him do over the years in magazines like Edge, PC Zone etc etc.

 

Finally i get the facts behind the claims.

 

Would have loved to of seen what Jeff could of done on the Lynx mind you.



#4 Lynxpro OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Aug 16, 2014 2:44 PM

Huge thanks for this.Always thought it ruddy strange that Jeff, who'd been so happy to go into such depth over his concept for a Star Raiders type game on the Panther, when talking to Edge magazine few years ago, never said anything about similar plans for the Atari Lynx, nor mentionbing any Lynx development in any interview or column i've seen him do over the years in magazines like Edge, PC Zone etc etc.

 

Finally i get the facts behind the claims.

 

Would have loved to of seen what Jeff could of done on the Lynx mind you.

 

Sounds like an interview I'd like to read up on. I had no idea he proposed a Star Raiders update for the Panther.



#5 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Aug 16, 2014 2:56 PM

EDGE issue 120 (Unity on front cover, Minter Returns etc).4 Page 'Inside Llamasoft' feature (P46 onwards).Jeff talks of the Panther hardware and how he coded various demo's on it for his 'space game with Star Raider-y aspects....influenced by Iain M Banks Culture Novels, which he was heavily into at the time') the leaping Antelope demo for example was basicaly a test routine for his planned 'planet surface' scrolling sequence.

 
IF you cannot find the interview online, just drop us a PM, i'll happily loan you the magazine.


#6 kogden OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Aug 25, 2014 12:59 PM

Too bad it's a myth, a Star Raiders-like game for the Lynx would be pretty awesome!



#7 Songbird OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Aug 25, 2014 2:10 PM

I've always been a big fan of Star Raiders and Starmaster on the old 2600. So, I designed Remnant as a pseudo-3D space shooter for the Lynx to be the foundation for a full Star Raiders sequel, but never got that far.



#8 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Feb 19, 2015 10:30 AM

Thread bump:But just to be clear, I had Jeff Tweeted on behalf of this claim, after it was claimed by an individual that he'd spoken to Jeff and quoted Jeff as having said, as well as seeing it merely listed in Lost Lynx game sections on other sites.

 

As someone who invests a lot of free time in assisting likes of Unseen64 and GTW who are serious about trying to track down Lost Game claims and archive what can be found, if people out there did'nt make up such statements, the work of research would be far easier.

 

It's bad enough contacting coders Edge claimed were ninja's on the Saturn only to find they'd never touched the hardware, without wasting more valuable time chasing up false claims oh X speaking to Y.



#9 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Jun 3, 2015 9:04 AM

Thread Bump, Jeff talking to Tal Funke-Bilu, about why he never did any Lynx development (sadly):

 
'Jeff:At the time it came out I would have killed to write Lynx games.
However Llamasoft wasn't a big enough company to sustain the cost of
developing and publishing our own games on ROM, and I didn't know of
any larger companies who would let me do the kind of games I wanted to
do - so I carried on with the ST.'


#10 Lynxpro OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Jun 6, 2015 10:09 AM

 

Thread Bump, Jeff talking to Tal Funke-Bilu, about why he never did any Lynx development (sadly):

 
'Jeff:At the time it came out I would have killed to write Lynx games.
However Llamasoft wasn't a big enough company to sustain the cost of
developing and publishing our own games on ROM, and I didn't know of
any larger companies who would let me do the kind of games I wanted to
do - so I carried on with the ST.'

 

 

Wasn't Tal with Beyond Games - Battlewheels for the Lynx, Ultra Vortek for the Jag - before he joined Atari Corp for the last hurrah?

 

Man, they should've focused on porting Battlewheels to the Jag instead of wasting time with Ultra Vortek



#11 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Jun 6, 2015 12:41 PM

Not sure as name did'nt jump out at me, but then i'm not overly familar with Beyond Games Coders etc myself.

 
Everytime i saw them talk of Jaguar Battlewheels, they still seemed 'unsure' what direction to take game in.Think (going off Unseen64 comment) game only got as far as 3D models being done and nothing else, but don't quote me on that.
 
The last quote i saw from them regarding it was that something had arrived in the pipeline and this might mean a 180 degree turn on Battlewheels.
 
Add that to the claim they were working on AVP II for Jaguar from them, i assume they meant Battlewheels had been put on the back burner on Jag?.
 
But then 'working on' (AVP II) could of just meant contract signed and design documents drawn up?.


#12 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Jun 14, 2015 4:47 PM

What is it with Beyond Games (well Ex-staffers of) and promising canned projects?

 


#13 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Aug 19, 2018 9:29 AM

Just to document everything, Jeff talking in mid 1994 on why he never did any Lynx coding:


Jeff:...Basically, when Lynx came out I would have killed to program
the thing, but Llamasoft is but a small company and we couldn't afford to
get into producing and distributing ROM-based games.  AUK didn't seem
interested in having me program any Lynx titles and I didn't fancy
selling my soul to some large software house just to get at the Lynx,
they'd have probably made me do some conversion or other without much
scope to do my own thing.  It would have been fun to do Lynx games, but I
guess the Jaggi's got me now

-- Y a K

Edited by Lost Dragon, Sun Aug 19, 2018 9:30 AM.


#14 Tidus79001 OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:10 PM

It is too bad that Star Raiders never was developed for the Lynx. It is easily one my top favorite video games of all time. I gave countless hours of my childhood playing Star Raiders, finally earning the "mystery rank" of Atari on the hardest difficulty. Also played the 5200 version quite extensively as well, but will always have a special place in my heart for the 2600 version. I am a big fan of the space combat sim style gameplay that Star Raiders pioneered, and unfortunately we don't see many games in that genre these days. I would have loved for the 7800, Lynx, and Jaguar to have each gotten a Star Raiders game. It is especially disappointing that the Jaguar version never saw the light of day as that is known to have been in development at some point before getting cancelled.

Hopefully someday we will see another proper Star Raiders game on a system like the new Atari VCS, and not some crappy game with the name Star Raiders slapped onto it like they did in 2011 for the game released on the XBOX Live Arcade, and PlayStation Network.

Edited by Tidus79001, Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:16 PM.


#15 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:30 PM

Very wise words there from you.

Reading Jeff talking about Atari UK not marketing ST/Amiga Defender II well enough did surprise me a little, it and Photon Storm were part of the magazine ads i saw for various ARC games at the time.

But when he talks of Atari UK not being interested in having him develop on Lynx, does make me wonder what that was all about.

Why after he produced games for the A8 and ST was he not considered for Lynx?.

The statement creates just more questions.

I kept hearing different stories about Jaguar Star Raiders, it morphed into Space War 2000 as it deviated so far from the basic Star Raiders gameplay and that itself was killed off in favour of Battlesphere..

Lynx Star Raiders had been started but delayed,yet no coder or team had been named when comment about it being delayed was made.

I was never keen on A8 Star Raiders II,looked great,but just lacked the feel of the original and ST Star Raiders had a similar effect, seemed far too easy and lacking the spirt of the original.

It's a real shame as for old farts like myself, A8 Star Raiders was really the 1st Killer App we ever saw...a game you'd so badly want the hardware,just to play that 1 game on.

That it never became a flagship game for later Atari hardware does sadden me.

:'(

#16 doctorclu OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 12, 2018 12:44 PM

I've always been a big fan of Star Raiders and Starmaster on the old 2600. So, I designed Remnant as a pseudo-3D space shooter for the Lynx to be the foundation for a full Star Raiders sequel, but never got that far.

 

Was just about to suggest that.  I would love to see Remnant more fleshed out.



#17 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Nov 10, 2018 4:46 PM

It is too bad that Star Raiders never was developed for the Lynx. It is easily one my top favorite video games of all time. I gave countless hours of my childhood playing Star Raiders, finally earning the "mystery rank" of Atari on the hardest difficulty. Also played the 5200 version quite extensively as well, but will always have a special place in my heart for the 2600 version. I am a big fan of the space combat sim style gameplay that Star Raiders pioneered, and unfortunately we don't see many games in that genre these days. I would have loved for the 7800, Lynx, and Jaguar to have each gotten a Star Raiders game. It is especially disappointing that the Jaguar version never saw the light of day as that is known to have been in development at some point before getting cancelled.
Hopefully someday we will see another proper Star Raiders game on a system like the new Atari VCS, and not some crappy game with the name Star Raiders slapped onto it like they did in 2011 for the game released on the XBOX Live Arcade, and PlayStation Network.


Just stumbled across this old quote from Jeff Minter :


"All I know is that what was going to be Star Raiders 2K has now ended up being Space War. The fate of the SR title is undecided at the moment. Maybe after I've done Defender, and Robotron, and Major Havoc, and Revenge of the Mutant Camels (if only!)...

\
(:-) - now, I gotta put in the wave structure and the planet blowing up
/

#18 Tidus79001 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Nov 10, 2018 4:58 PM

Just stumbled across this old quote from Jeff Minter :


"All I know is that what was going to be Star Raiders 2K has now ended up being Space War. The fate of the SR title is undecided at the moment. Maybe after I've done Defender, and Robotron, and Major Havoc, and Revenge of the Mutant Camels (if only!)...

\
(:-) - now, I gotta put in the wave structure and the planet blowing up
/

Wow, that would be a dream come true :)



#19 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Nov 11, 2018 3:05 AM

Wouldn't it just? B-)

This is the thing with Jeff on the Jaguar though.

He's been quoted as saying how he'd like to approach doing titles like Sinstar, Llamatron,Major Havoc and now Star Raiders (as well as how he saw a Jaguar version of Virus being done on Jaguar and his concepts for a Star Raiders type game on the Panther)...

But other than a few test routines done on the Panther, we never got to see Jeff really try his hand at Star Raiders.

Majority of his work has been based around Tempest or updating his own back catalogue of games (they themselves inspired by coin ops).


Unity was an evolution of his light synth stuff and Polybius is the Furthest he has tread for a good while.

I still live in hope that 1 day he will do the Star Raiders came he's always dreamt of.

Edited by Lost Dragon, Sun Nov 11, 2018 3:08 AM.


#20 Lynxpro OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:20 PM

Wouldn't it just? B-)

This is the thing with Jeff on the Jaguar though.

He's been quoted as saying how he'd like to approach doing titles like Sinstar, Llamatron,Major Havoc and now Star Raiders (as well as how he saw a Jaguar version of Virus being done on Jaguar and his concepts for a Star Raiders type game on the Panther)...

But other than a few test routines done on the Panther, we never got to see Jeff really try his hand at Star Raiders.

Majority of his work has been based around Tempest or updating his own back catalogue of games (they themselves inspired by coin ops).


Unity was an evolution of his light synth stuff and Polybius is the Furthest he has tread for a good while.

I still live in hope that 1 day he will do the Star Raiders came he's always dreamt of.

 

 

Hated Space Giraffe with a passion but TxK was dope on the PS Vita...and the PS TV. I've only played it on the PS TV because I don't have a Vita.

 

Lots of people have stated Tempest 4000 is awesome. I should get it for my Xbox One.



#21 Flojomojo OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Nov 15, 2018 3:03 PM

If you like TxK you'll love Tempest 4000.

I prefer Space Giraffe for the same reason I love The Last Jedi --- finally, something NEW AND DIFFERENT

#22 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Feb 16, 2019 10:02 AM

Is it safe to assume that Carl from Songbird,never got any further than the ideas stage for Remnant II on the Lynx?


I believe there was talk of more strategy elements and a 'Star Raiders' classic-style feel?


The original being more of a 3D Galaxians type affair?.

#23 Flojomojo OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Feb 16, 2019 10:11 AM

Seems like someone is taking the "unreleased games" list a bit too seriously ... especially after 25 years has passed. 

 

Remember the Jaguar FAQ's list of "unreleased games?"

 

 

 

Q. What were the unreleased Jaguar games?

A: The following games were announced at one time or another as being planned
for the Jaguar. With the dissolution of Atari, the chances are very slim
that any of these games will ever be produced or released. However, a few
enterprising companies and individuals have considered plans to either
finish their Jaguar titles for release, to sell finished-but-unreleased
games, or to produce new games on their own.

Announced Jaguar cartridge games (? = Uncertain entry):

Title Players Publisher Developer Type
----------------- ------- ------------ ------------ --------------
Allegiance 1-2? ? Team 17 Action/Strategy
Al Michaels 1-2 Accolade/Atari Atari Sports
Announces Hardball
Apeshit 1-2 Ocean Ocean Action/Arcade
Arena Football 1-8 Atari V-Reel Prod. Sports
League
Assault: Covert Ops 1-2? Midnite Sw Midnite Sw Action
Automaniacs 1-2 Visual Dim. Visual Dim. Action/Driving
Bases Loaded 1-2 Jaleco/Atari Atari? Sports
Batman Forever 1-2? Atari Atari Action
Battlewheels 2025 1-2 Beyond Games Beyond Games Action
Bong+ 1999 1-2? ? Just Claws Action
Brett Hull Hockey 1-2 Atari Ringler Sports
Casino Royale 1-2? Telegames Telegames Strategy
Center Court Tennis 1-2 Zeppelin ? Sports
Charles Barkley 1-4? ? Ringler Sports
Basketball
Cisco Heat 1? Jaleco/Atari Atari Action/Arcade
'Dactyl Joust 1? Atari High Voltage Action/Arcade?
Deathwatch 1-2 Atari Data Design Action
Demolition Man 1? Atari Virgin Action/Shooting
Dino Dudes 2 1 Atari Imagitec Puzzle/Strategy
Dune Racer 1-2 Atari ? Action/Driving
Dungeon Depths 1 Midnite Sw Midnite Sw Adventure
Droppings 1? Delta Music ? ?
European Soccer 1-2 Telegames Telegames Sports
Challenge
F1 Racer 1-2 Atari Domark Sports
Frank Thomas "Big 1-2 Atari Acclaim Sports
Hurt" Baseball
Galactic Gladiators 1-2 ? Photosur. Action/Strategy
Gorf 2000 1-2? ? Krunch Corp. Arcade
Gotcha! 1? ? ? ?
Graham Gooch's World 1-2? Telegames Telegames Sports
Class Cricket
Gunship 2000 1 Microprose ? Strategy
Hammerhead 1 Atari Rainmaker Action/Arcade
Indiana Jags 1 ? Virtual Exp. Action/Platform
Iratan Supremecy 1-2 ? Level Seven Action/Fighting
Iron Man/XO-Manowar 1-2 Atari Acclaim Action?
James Pond 3 1 Telegames Telegames Platform
Jagmania 1 ? Matthias Domin Action
Jagmarble 1 ? Matthias Domin Action
Jagtris 1 ? Bastian Schick Action/Puzzle
Kick Off 3 1-2 ? Anco Software Sports
Legion Force Jidai 1? ? FORCE Design Action/Arcade
Legions of the 1? Atari Rebellion Action/Adventure
Undead
Lester the Unlikely 1 DTMC DTMC Action/Strategy
Live Wire 1-2? Black Scorpion ? ?
Max Force 1? ? ? Action/Shooter
Miniature Golf 1-2 DTMC DTMC Sports
Mountain Sports 1-2 DTMC DTMC Action/Sports
Nanoterror 1? ? Delta Music ?
Native 1? ? Duranik Sw. Action/Shooter
Nerves of Steel 1? ? Rainmaker Action/Adventure
Painter 1? ? Sinister ?
Phase Zero 1-8 Atari Hyper Image Action
Phear 1-2 Atari H2O Design Puzzle
Pinball Dreams 1-2 Atari 21st Century Arcade
Powerdrive 1? Telegames Elite Action/Driving
Quake 1? Atari id Software Action
Rainbow Warrior 1? ? 3D Games Action?
Return of Magic 1? ? Virtual Art. Adventure?
Rise of the Robots 1 Time-Warner Williams Br. Action/Adventure
Robotron:2084 1-2 Atari ? Action/Arcade
Rollcage 1-2? ? Team 17 Sports/Driving
Star Alliance 1-2? Starcat Dev. Starcat Dev. Arcade/Action
Star Raiders 2000 1? Atari ? Action
Sudden Impact 1-2 Atari Creative Tal. Action/Driving
Super Off-Road 1-2 Telegames ? Arcade/Driving
T-Mek 1-2? Time-Warner ? Arcade
The Assassin 1 OMC Games OMC Games Adventure
Thea Realm Fighters 1-2 Atari Atari Arcade/Action
Thunderstalker 1? Telegames Telegames ?
Tin Head 1-2? Microprose Microprose ?
Tiny Too Adventures 1-2 Atari Atari Action/Arcade
Ultimate Brain Games 1-2? Telegames ? Puzzle
Virtuoso 1? Telegames Williams Br. Action
Virtual Warriors 1-2 ? Rainmaker Action/Fighting
Waterworld 1? Ocean Ocean ?
Wild Cup Soccer 1-2? Telegames ? Action/Sports
Witchwood 1-2 Atari Team 17 Action
World Cup 1-2? ? Anco Software Sports
Zzyorxx II 1? ? Virtual Exp. Action/Shooter


Announced Jaguar CD-ROM games:

Title Players Publisher Developer Type
----------------- ------- ------------ ------------ --------------
Age of Darkness 1 ? OMC Games Action/Adventure
Artemis 1? Springer Sp. Springer Sp. Adventure
Battlechess 1-2 Interplay Interplay Strategy
BIOSFear 1? Atari All Systems Go Action/Adventure
Black Ice/ 1? Atari ? Adventure
White Noise
Brett Hull Hockey 1-2 Atari Ringler Sports
Chaos Agenda 1? Atari ? Adventure
Circle of Four 1 ? JV Enterprises Adventure
Commander Blood 1? Atari ? Adventure
Commando 1 Atari Microids Action/Strategy
Country Grid 1-8 Atari High Voltage Puzzle
Creature Shock 1 Virgin Argonaut Sw. Action/Adventure
Dante's Inferno 1 Atari Gorilla Sys. Adventure
Defcon 1 1 Dark Knight Dk Kngt/Vis.D Action/Adventure
Demolition Man 1 Atari Virgin Action
Deus ex Machina 1 ? Silmarils Adventure
Dragon's Lair II: 1 Readysoft Readysoft Arcade
Time Warp
Evidence 1 ? Microids Action/Adventure
FIFA International 1-2 ? Elec. Arts Sports
Soccer
Freelancer 2120 1 Atari Imagitec Action/Adventure
Highlander II 1 Atari Lore Design Action/Adventure
Highlander III 1 Atari Lore Design Action/Adventure
Horrorscope 1? ? V-Reel Prod. Action/Fighting
Hosenose and Booger 1-2? Atari All Systems Go Action
Jack Nicholas 1-2 Atari DTMC Sports
Cyber Golf
Ishar Genesis 1 Atari Silmaris Adventure
Kid Grid 1-8 Atari High Voltage Puzzle
Litil Devil 1 ? Gremlin Int. Adventure?
Lobo 1? ? Ocean Action?
Magic Carpet 1 Atari Bullfrog Action/Arcade
Max Force 1 Atari Genus Action
Mind-Ripper 1? Atari ? Strategy?
Mortal Kombat III 1-2 Atari Williams Arcade/Fighting
Need For Speed, The 1 ? Elec. Arts Driving
Neurodancer 1? ? PIXIS Int. Adventure?
Orb of Bangzai 1 ? OMC Games Action/Adventure
Powerslide 1 Telegames Williams Br. Driving
Return Fire 1-2 ? Alexandria Action/Strategy
Return to Zork 1 ? Activision Adventure
Robinson's Requiem 1? Atari Silmarils Adventure
Rocky Horror 1 Atari? ? Adventure
Interactive
Scottish Open 1-2? ? Core Design Sports
Virtual Golf
Sinister Missions 1-2 ? OMC Games Action/Shooter
Soul Star 1 Atari Core Design Action/Shooter
Starlight 1-2 ? V-Reel Prod. Action/Sports
Bowl-A-Rama
Striker '95 1-2 Time-Warner Rage Action/Sports
Swagman 1 ? Core Design Adventure
Thunderhawk 1 ? Core Design Action/Shooter
Tomb Raider 1 ? Core Design Action/Adventure
Varuna's Forces 1 Atari Accent Media Action/Adventure
Virtuoso 1 Telegames Williams Br. Action
Wayne Gretzky NHL 1-2 Time-Warner Time-Warner Sports
Hockey
Wing Commander III 1 ? Elec. Arts Action/Strategy


Announced Jaguar Virtual Reality Headset games:

Title Players Publisher Developer Type
----------------- ------- ------------ ------------ --------------
Gravon 1 ? Suma Action/Sim.
Zone Hunter 1 Atari Virtuality Action


#24 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Feb 16, 2019 11:07 AM

Mine is more a case of it being a crying shame there was never an anything close to a more modern Star Raiders on the Lynx.

Ultra annouced by Atari and very little known on it, it seems.

Carl having the ideas and ambition to rework an existing Lynx title, but one would assume sales of the original were not enough to warrant it's development?

If your reading Carl, any extra info would be ideal.

HMS were kind enough to detail why Lynx Elite never made it.

Lynx seems associated with a number of Space based games that could of been great, but never progressed that far.

Edited by Lost Dragon, Sat Feb 16, 2019 11:10 AM.


#25 davidcalgary29 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:17 PM

Mine is more a case of it being a crying shame there was never an anything close to a more modern Star Raiders on the Lynx.

Ultra annouced by Atari and very little known on it, it seems.

Carl having the ideas and ambition to rework an existing Lynx title, but one would assume sales of the original were not enough to warrant it's development?

If your reading Carl, any extra info would be ideal.

HMS were kind enough to detail why Lynx Elite never made it.

Lynx seems associated with a number of Space based games that could of been great, but never progressed that far.

 

Wait a minute...let's not forget about Karri's Star Dreamer...






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