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New pacman for atari 2600


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#226 Mr SQL OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 15, 2014 1:52 PM

 

Well, these days I've been making some changes to the code to improve the "dying sound", and other parts of the code to save space in rom. 
In this version I've done the first intermission, but still does not have the right music, because the routine occupy more space than I expected. Although I could try to do it another way to save space to include music. :)
 
 

I'll start making a version with 8k to include everything that has the game, and I think probably would have free space on rom. :-D

 

 

 

This game is awesome! :) Since you are starting on a larger ROM size version you might want to try just 6K a la SuperCharger format instead of 8k - still plenty more room.



#227 Albert OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 15, 2014 2:34 PM

This game is awesome! :) Since you are starting on a larger ROM size version you might want to try just 6K a la SuperCharger format instead of 8k - still plenty more room.


An 8K version is easier to produce in cart form.

..Al

#228 WildBillTX OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 15, 2014 5:14 PM

 

Well, these days I've been making some changes to the code to improve the "dying sound", and other parts of the code to save space in rom. 
In this version I've done the first intermission, but still does not have the right music, because the routine occupy more space than I expected. Although I could try to do it another way to save space to include music. :)
 
 

I'll start making a version with 8k to include everything that has the game, and I think probably would have free space on rom. :-D

 

 

That's great news! A options menu like Spiceware has for his games would be sweet.

 

And for the monsters eyes, I edited the graphics with Hackomatic2 to show what I meant, just make them a little larger:

314qefl.jpg


Edited by WildBillTX, Mon Sep 15, 2014 11:09 PM.


#229 Mr SQL OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 15, 2014 5:53 PM

An 8K version is easier to produce in cart form.

..Al

Yes good point Al but DINTAR816 has put an incredible game into 4K already; 6K is more fun programming challenge wise than 8K :)



#230 Albert OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 15, 2014 5:56 PM

Yes good point Al but DINTAR816 has put an incredible game into 4K already; 6K is more fun programming challenge wise than 8K :)


He can still set a limit to 6K if he wishes, even if the hardware has an additional 2K of space that won't be used.

..Al

#231 iesposta OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Sep 20, 2014 10:51 PM

Well, these days I've been making some changes to the code to improve the "dying sound", and other parts of the code to save space in rom. 
In this version I've done the first intermission, but still does not have the right music, because the routine occupy more space than I expected. Although I could try to do it another way to save space to include music. :)
 
attachicon.gifpacman2600_testint.bin
 

I'll start making a version with 8k to include everything that has the game, and I think probably would have free space on rom. :-D


The "dying sound" is much improved. :thumbsup:

Have you considered privately messaging source code to experts like Thomas Jentzsch to help optimize code and get bytes back?

#232 CrazyChris OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Sep 21, 2014 6:47 AM

I'd like a 4k version.

#233 privateers69 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Sep 21, 2014 10:36 AM

I hope @games pick up this for AFB 6. (Royalties and a system going to the programmer)

/pipe dream I know

#234 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Sep 21, 2014 4:30 PM

I hope @games pick up this for AFB 6. (Royalties and a system going to the programmer)

/pipe dream I know

They would need permission from Namco, hence why people never got the original.



#235 DINTAR816 OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 22, 2014 1:25 PM

The "dying sound" is much improved. :thumbsup:

Have you considered privately messaging source code to experts like Thomas Jentzsch to help optimize code and get bytes back?

Well, Omegamatrix sent me a private message and showed where I could optimize the code to save about 42 bytes, and these days I've been checking all the code, and managed to reduce about 20 bytes more, I think it can be optimized even further by changing a little the "kernel" to reduce bytes used for the playfield (maybe about 60 bytes). :-D
I will continue trying to save bytes to put everything I can, but still with 4k is impossible to make the full game so I will continue doing the 8k version too. 
Maybe tomorrow I shows the optimized version, with intermission music. :)


#236 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 22, 2014 2:56 PM

 

 
I will continue trying to save bytes to put everything I can, but still with 4k is impossible to make the full game so I will continue doing the 8k version too. 

8k would be great! :thumbsup:



#237 WildBillTX OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 22, 2014 6:26 PM

Yeah Go for 8K! Why do many programmers here just want to create tiny 4K games like it's 1979 again?

 

I'm really enjoying the game, the higher levels are a lot of fun to play. This is the first 2600 Pac Man where the ghosts really chase you around the maze just like the arcade version. Keep working on it Dintar!



#238 Nukey Shay OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Sep 23, 2014 4:13 AM

Because if the "4k challenge" never existed, this game might not either. IMO he's got the right idea by sticking with 4k until there's no other option...it'll make an expanded 8k version even better (i.e. not jumping in immediately and start squandering resources right away).

#239 Shannon OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Sep 23, 2014 7:15 AM

It's kinda like asking a mountain climber why they climb mountains... :P



#240 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Sep 23, 2014 7:57 PM

It's kinda like asking a mountain climber why they climb mountains... :P

To get "High." Duh... :rolling:


Edited by stardust4ever, Tue Sep 23, 2014 7:58 PM.


#241 iesposta OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Sep 23, 2014 8:38 PM

And for the monsters eyes, I edited the graphics with Hackomatic2 to show what I meant, just make them a little larger:
314qefl.jpg


That is easy to do with Stella. At least for the 4 color ghosts, blue I didn't find, but they look fine as is.
Anyone can PM me if you want the Large Eyes hack. (I won't post it in respect to the author.)

#242 WildBillTX OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 24, 2014 6:51 AM

Because if the "4k challenge" never existed, this game might not either. IMO he's got the right idea by sticking with 4k until there's no other option...it'll make an expanded 8k version even better (i.e. not jumping in immediately and start squandering resources right away).

 

That's a good idea, I understand the need to write tight compact code.

 

BTW while playing it tonight, I think I passed through a ghost, is this possible on this version?


Edited by WildBillTX, Wed Sep 24, 2014 6:59 AM.


#243 save2600 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 24, 2014 7:11 AM

 

BTW while playing it tonight, I think I passed through a ghost, is this possible on this version?

 

Being able to pass through a ghost once in a great while, is a feature of the original arcade game. Since he spent so much time on so many details (A.I. especially), I bet he purposely incorporated that little gem.   :)



#244 DINTAR816 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 24, 2014 2:52 PM

Hi, right now I'm optimizing the 4k version by changing the kernel to save 67 bytes of "PF", but meanwhile I have already compiled the 8k rom this way: 
In the first bank contains the codes of "AI" pacman movement, collisions, sound, game logic, etc ... leaving about 1600 bytes free. 
In the second bank are the "kernel" (the score, the playfield and status) and data graphics, leaving about 2400 bytes free. I still have not added anything so I will not publish yet.

That's great news! A options menu like Spiceware has for his games would be sweet.

 

And for the monsters eyes, I edited the graphics with Hackomatic2 to show what I meant, just make them a little larger:

314qefl.jpg

 

That is easy to do with Stella. At least for the 4 color ghosts, blue I didn't find, but they look fine as is.
Anyone can PM me if you want the Large Eyes hack. (I won't post it in respect to the author.)

That I had tried it before, I'll change and see what others think.
 
This is the optimized version (without changing the "kernel" to save the 67 bytes), with intermission music test but faster than normal, as I have to change some things. :)

Attached Files



#245 save2600 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 24, 2014 4:30 PM

^  Hey, the second intermission animation is exactly the same as the first... I_want_my_money_back!     :rolling:

 

On a serious note and re: optimization, would it make much of a difference if you made the point value after you chomp a ghost smaller? Seems a bit large right now, or maybe the aspect ratio is a bit off. Seems like maybe the height could be reduced? 



#246 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 25, 2014 3:07 AM

Being able to pass through a ghost once in a great while, is a feature of the original arcade game. Since he spent so much time on so many details (A.I. especially), I bet he purposely incorporated that little gem.    :)

I would call it a bug, not a feature. :)



#247 WildBillTX OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 25, 2014 12:34 PM

I would call it a bug, not a feature. :)

 

I didn't know it was a timing bug in the 80's. I thought it was programmed in. I heard for years that if a ghost wasn't looking at Pac-Man you could pass right through him.

 

Exploiting the bugs in the original game like memorizing patterns, wiggling the joystick to make the ghosts change directions and also the infamous 256 level crash was part of the arcade experience.



#248 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 25, 2014 1:48 PM

Yeah ghosts can occasionally pass through Pacman if the position swap occurs on the same video frame AND the tiles intersect at a multiple of 8 pixels. Pretty rare but Pacman, or the ghost if in blue mode, occasionally get away with it.

In Pacman 4k, there is a minor glitch that sometimes occurs if Pacman collides with the fruit and a ghost at the same time. One of these two collisions, Pac-Ghost or Pac-Fruit, will be ignored. I've witnessed it happen both ways whether the ghost was edible or not. :P

Honestly I'm not too worried if minor glitches such as these can occur, as long as the conditions triggering the event are infrequent enought not to interfere with gameplay, or occur at some extraordinary play depth that I'll never reach, such as the kill screens in arcade DK or Pacman.

#249 NE146 ONLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 25, 2014 3:16 PM

It's pretty well documented out there (e.g.. the pacman Dossier ) when and how the pass-through happens.  Easy to replicate too once you find a pattern that does it consistently.

 

You can even do it in Ms Pac's 2nd stage 100% consistently with that one well known pattern in the first few seconds.. you don't have to be Billy Mitchell :lol:

 



#250 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 25, 2014 6:51 PM

One thing I noticed, there are "safe zones" like at the start where you can "park" Pacman indefinitely in the arcade. One of those is the T piece at the ipening. But if you park pacman in the "safe zone" next to the intro location, Pacman will eventually die after a few moments. But saying so is the equivalent of Arcade paths not working with the game (which would be a tough feat to pull off using any non-emulated port).




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