Fix an old paddle controller?

[zander21510]

So i was letting my girlfriend and sister and her boyfriend enjoy my TD Video Volley pong console tonight. At one point, my girlfriend decided to play around and move the paddle up and down very fast. Being a 30+ year old analog paddle controller, I told her to stop, but it was too late and the already small amount of twitching and jumping turned into serious twitching that was impossible to control.

 

So at this point, obviously this thing is a one-of-a-kind very rare device, so getting another one to replace the bad controller is out. So is there a way to fix these old controllers? Or replace the bad potentiometer? It looks pretty simple, just a potentiometer and some wires. I've attached a picture, I don't know how helpful it will be, but any pointers to what I can do would be appreciated.

[zylon]

You could try cleaning the pot out with contact cleaner or even a little WD40. If that doesn't work, you'll have to replace it.

[CatPix]

Those old pots are very finicky, if only because they don't get used enough.

Turning it many time may save it - this will cause the dried grease to move away from the path; but it may not work well, and it will restart to flicker.

You can as suggested pour WD-40 or a electrical contact cleaner inside. I know there is special pots cleaners but I never used them.

If you wanna stay 100% original, you can open the pot, clean it and replace electric grease inside.

Or you can just look the specs on the pot and buy a new one.

[Tales from the Game Room]

http://www.addoway.com/viewad/Video-Volley-TD-Manufacturing-Dallas-TX-Pong-Game-Vintage-3472188

 

If you cannot repair the controller, I found this link where you can purchase a whole new system...

[zander21510]

Those old pots are very finicky, if only because they don't get used enough.

Turning it many time may save it - this will cause the dried grease to move away from the path; but it may not work well, and it will restart to flicker.

You can as suggested pour WD-40 or a electrical contact cleaner inside. I know there is special pots cleaners but I never used them.

If you wanna stay 100% original, you can open the pot, clean it and replace electric grease inside.

Or you can just look the specs on the pot and buy a new one.

Thanks for the tips all...

 

I looked up how to identify the pot...the numbers are useless because its some old part number from the 70s, the company doesn't have it listed at all. I have a multimeter that I tested it with...how would I tell say a salesman or a website what pot I need from what I read on the multimeter? I get .593 on the 2M setting with it turned all the way

Edited November 10, 2014 by zander21510

[Osgeld]

measuring a broken pot might be fruitless, if you are going to trust that do it from the two outside terminals

 

what do the numbers actually say on the pot

Edited November 10, 2014 by Osgeld

[Keatah]

Measure the other pot from the other "working" controller. Measure between the left and right terminals, not the center. The position of the slider arm shouldn't matter. That would be a good comparison and reference. And report back the numbers, both from the meter and what is stamped on the metal casing.

 

These pots can be disassembled and professionally cleaned with proper grease re-applied. Or using the actual original grease that is laying around inside the casing or what got pushed "off-track". Assuming it isn't dried to a crisp. Salvage it with a toothpic tip. WD40 and other cleaners can remove the grease and redistribute (for better or worse) other debris - resulting in a temporary fix. The part works, but the wear rate is now increased. The feel of the pot rotation (in this application, lever action) is also changed because the shaft is totally free to rotate. Won't have a buttery rich feel to it anymore. Makes it feel cheap-o.

 

It is also possible to adjust the wiper arms to read a slightly different position in the resistive track - thus restoring original lifespan. Provided the track conductivity is stable and in-spec end-to-end. This takes care and a basic microscope to do right.

 

It's probably best to replace or clean & refurbish these pots, because, another unit you buy would have old pots anyway. Maybe worse off.

Edited November 10, 2014 by Keatah

[TheGameCollector]

All I did with the Atari 2600 paddle controllers was open up the pots and clean the contact path with rubbing alcohol. No new grease. I put them back together and there is no jittering anymore and no grease to get all caked up again.

[CatPix]

Grease protect the metal parts and ease the sliding of the pot - but on some, there was only a thin film of oil, so it's not needed. I would say, if you plan to pull out your Pong once a month, use oil or grease.

If you use it very often... oil it at least, because when the metal will be eroded, it will be doomed to be replaced.

[BigO]

I use Deoxit to clean and protect potentiometers. I suspect the Fader Spray variant would probably be ideal for this, but I've used the Gold variant successfully.

 

I think it would be best to disassemble the pot to flush it out and possibly remove any debris from the resistive surface with a cotton swab. Though, I've rarely had to take a pot apart to get it working smoothly. I'm lazy like that.

 

When you do clean one thoroughly, they no longer resist movement for that "smooth" feel like a new pot does. I've coated the bearing surface of the pot shaft with a thick silicone grease to reestablish that resistance. I've also tried white silicone heat sink compound and that actually felt stiffer and closer to the original feel. But, ick, it's like an oppositely colored tar: it gets on everything within 15 feet of you when you just open the tube.

 

The back side of the pot in your pictures would indicate the specs, but seeing the shaft and mounting method might give someone a better idea of whether a replacement might be available.

[Osgeld]

The back side of the pot in your pictures would indicate the specs,

it would but the wires cover most of the important parts

[0078265317]

Just get new ones. Not worth fixing.

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Atari-2600-Video-Game-System-Pair-of-Paddles-/351219561259?pt=Video_Games_Games&hash=item51c651332b

[zander21510]

I think I'm ok with getting new pots as far as originality is concerned...since they're so old anyway I might as well replace them.

 

No standardized markings on it at all, only numbers are on the back as pictured. The first number is 1377640, which from research on the internet apparently gives the manufacture company and date, 137 for CTS company, 76 for year 1976, and 40 for week 40 of 1976. The second number is 133-0000-00, which I would assume is a part number, which I found nothing on, the CTS webstie doesn't have a matching part number.

 

I actually measured two times, once with the pot in its extreme position and once on the opposite poles, both read .593 Mohm. After spraying WD40, which did take away the buttery feel , it read .610 Mohm.

 

So I need a potentiometer that is a little less than an inch in diameter, with the specific notched pole that this one has...is there some like potentiometer store or online market I can goto?

Edited November 11, 2014 by zander21510

[BigO]

They look to be a fairly standard pots, at least from the back. The diameter isn't critical unless it fits into a tight spot in the controller or acts as part of the mechanical stability/mounting.

 

I suppose it's possible that they're 600K ohm. I don't recall ever seeing a pot with that specific value. But, 600K would be within tolerance for a 500K with 20% tolerance. (Anything's possible: I have a 7 Megohm pot that I used in a custom controller. Haven't seen another one since)

 

I think I'd try a 500K if I had to find a replacement. If the originals really are 600K and the new ones are exactly 500K, the new one will require more turning to achieve the same amount of resistance change as the old ones. This would have the effect of making the controls slightly less sensitive. And if the console really does utilize that part above 500K, they might not work at the extreme. Given that there's a lever attached, it's unlikely that the full range is used.

 

I've never seen one of those TD games before. Do you have to move the lever over its full range of travel to move the paddle to its extremes? I'm guessing not. You may not even objectively be able to tell the difference between 500K and 600K.

 

The other thing you're going to be looking for is "Linear Taper". (The other common type is audio taper or logarithmic pot.) That's really just a semi-educated guess, but I'd give it a 99.9% chance of being linear taper. That's a measure of how much the resistance changes vs. how much the rotational position changes. With a linear taper, the resistance value changes the same amount for every degree turned.

 

Having said all of that, I'd still take them apart and try to fix them. Did the WD-40 do anything to clean up the jumpy behavior?

[zander21510]

They look to be a fairly standard pots, at least from the back. The diameter isn't critical unless it fits into a tight spot in the controller or acts as part of the mechanical stability/mounting.

 

I suppose it's possible that they're 600K ohm. I don't recall ever seeing a pot with that specific value. But, 600K would be within tolerance for a 500K with 20% tolerance. (Anything's possible: I have a 7 Megohm pot that I used in a custom controller. Haven't seen another one since)

 

I think I'd try a 500K if I had to find a replacement. If the originals really are 600K and the new ones are exactly 500K, the new one will require more turning to achieve the same amount of resistance change as the old ones. This would have the effect of making the controls slightly less sensitive. And if the console really does utilize that part above 500K, they might not work at the extreme. Given that there's a lever attached, it's unlikely that the full range is used.

 

I've never seen one of those TD games before. Do you have to move the lever over its full range of travel to move the paddle to its extremes? I'm guessing not. You may not even objectively be able to tell the difference between 500K and 600K.

 

The other thing you're going to be looking for is "Linear Taper". (The other common type is audio taper or logarithmic pot.) That's really just a semi-educated guess, but I'd give it a 99.9% chance of being linear taper. That's a measure of how much the resistance changes vs. how much the rotational position changes. With a linear taper, the resistance value changes the same amount for every degree turned.

 

Having said all of that, I'd still take them apart and try to fix them. Did the WD-40 do anything to clean up the jumpy behavior?

Thanks for the info! The WD40 didn't do anything, still the jumping everywhere, now with no smoothness. And it doesn't utilize the full range of motion. I'll search for a new one at Frys or something, one other question: is this a common shaft? Most pictures I've seen online have a notched or ridged circular shaft...I guess I might have to dremmel down a pot with a plastic shaft to match this one:

[Osgeld]

the half cut out shaft is fairly common but it may not be at your local mall

 

the ones at radio shack are usually split down the middle and extra long so you can cut them off to whatever length you need and use a full or half shaft with a few seconds on a hacksaw

[Keatah]

When you do clean one thoroughly, they no longer resist movement for that "smooth" feel like a new pot does. I've coated the bearing surface of the pot shaft with a thick silicone grease to reestablish that resistance. I've also tried white silicone heat sink compound and that actually felt stiffer and closer to the original feel. But, ick, it's like an oppositely colored tar: it gets on everything within 15 feet of you when you just open the tube.

This.

 

 

I actually measured two times, once with the pot in its extreme position and once on the opposite poles, both read .593 Mohm. After spraying WD40, which did take away the buttery feel , it read .610 Mohm.

Yep that will happen.

 

Measure the other working pot to get a good reference. I bet these are 600K ohm.

 

The one chance to fix the jumpiness is to re-align the wiper pad. Carefully. And be sure it remains parallel like before - should you choose to do this.

[zander21510]

Well, progress. I got some 500kohm pots from Frys, wired it up without soldering to try it out, and it worked just fine. But unfortunately as I move the paddle to the lower half of the screen it speeds up ridiculously. Apparently I got audio taper confused with linear taper...audio=logrithmic... Anyways at least I know 500k works, I'll go back to frys to to get the proper linear taper pots tomorrow. If I can replace this one successfully, I'll probably just replace the other controller's pot since it's all jittery too (but not as much as the broken one).

Next challenge will be grinding/working the shaft down to match the original pot. I'll have to get a dremmel to do that I think.

[BigO]

Good to hear there's some hope.
How is it to play Pong with a lever instead of the traditional knob?

[Osgeld]

belt sander works better to make the flat spot heh

[zander21510]

Good to hear there's some hope.

How is it to play Pong with a lever instead of the traditional knob?

 

It's different, but I wouldn't say harder. Still pretty easy to pick up and play.

 

I'll post the finished product after I'm done grinding, soldering & wiring. Maybe this will inspire me to replace some of the bad POTs on my old 60's and 70's tube TVs.

[timdu]

Here is a link to the the FAQ on my web site - 2600 Connection - which explains how to fix paddle controllers.

 

http://www.2600connection.com/faq/vcs_system/faq_atarivcs.html#hardware11

 

 

Enjoy!

 

 

Tim

[zander21510]

Here is a link to the the FAQ on my web site - 2600 Connection - which explains how to fix paddle controllers.

 

http://www.2600connection.com/faq/vcs_system/faq_atarivcs.html#hardware11

 

 

Enjoy!

 

 

Tim

Well now those Atari paddle pots look almost exactly like the one in my Video Volley! But when I looked up the specs on the internet, it says the Atari paddles use 1k pots where mine looks to be 500kish. And the range of motion for the paddle to show on the screen on the 500k pots is only maybe coulple dozen degrees anyway. Gets me thinking, thanks a bunch.

[BigO]

If the full range of on-screen motion with the 500K pot requires, say, 30 degrees of motion in the pot, the 1Meg will be 15 degrees. If you want more "twitchy" controls, go with the higher value pot.

 

You'd also have to compensate for the resistance that correlates to on-screen center now being at about 1/4 of the pot's rotational range instead of about 1/2. You'd just have to create the flat spot on the shaft at different angle. No big deal really if you're modifying the shaft yourself, but the Atari ones might have the flat in the wrong place.

Edited November 15, 2014 by BigO

[pimpmaul69]

Nm

Edited November 15, 2014 by pimpmaul69