Jump to content

Photo

New Cartridge-Based System! Jag Shell

Jaguar cartridge retro gaming

62 replies to this topic

#51 Torr OFFLINE  

Torr

    Stargunner

  • 1,078 posts
  • Location:Newfoundland, Canada

Posted Fri Apr 17, 2015 10:46 PM

 

Where did you miss this part?    'If it's an FPGA it's nowhere near capable of PS1 era core performance'

 

 

Well fine, even PS1 is beyond my expectations, by which I mean f*** polygons... the 32-bit era should have been about pushing sprites.

Polygons didn't get "good" (IE worth using) on consoles until the Dreamcast. I mean Doom was a helluva fun game, the fact that you couldn't see dead bodies or the trees from ANY angle didn't detract from the FUN one tiny bit... it was still an awesome game...

Unfortunately it's spoiled brats that many game developers have to face, no matter how FUN their game is, they'll be shit upon because the game they made has trees that look "shitty" if you look at them from a 37 degree South by Southwest angle while ducking under the corner of some other bush that looks "totally horrendous" from a specific rooftop that gives them 97 degree overhead angle on it.

Are You having FUN??? That's all that should matter!!! Nobody cared when they guided their Defender ship towards a falling humanoid if he was X miles "into" the screen of "out of" the screen as long as they crossed pixels. Nobody wondered if when they shot the Flea in Centipede that MAYBE he might be hopping over their bullet... it was fun... just... fun.

Spoiled F***ing brats that just want to complain about anything to support their stupid YouTube channel and keep the revenue flowing.

 

*edit*

and this is unfortunately what this new system has to stand up to... people that are just FROTHING at the mouth to attack it for any shortcoming it may have (while also claiming the NES is the KING of consoles despite it's many flaws)


Edited by Torr, Fri Apr 17, 2015 10:55 PM.


#52 Scotterpop OFFLINE  

Scotterpop

    Chopper Commander

  • 106 posts

Posted Sat Apr 18, 2015 8:20 AM

Seriously, a LOT of negativity toward this thing already! I for one would love to see a new cart-based system enter the market (It's so crazy, it just might work!). I guess I'm just at a point where both the nostalgia factor and the disdain for modern game install/updates/patches creates a desire to just plug it and play it. 16-bit is probably my favorite era of video games and it sounds like this console will definitely cater to that style of gaming. I will certainly be following this as it develops. I just hope they go with the sturdy plastic clamshells and not the flimsy Nintendo-style cardboard boxes for their carts!



#53 remowilliams OFFLINE  

remowilliams

    Quadrunner

  • 10,607 posts
  • Location:Detonation Boulevard

Posted Sat Apr 18, 2015 8:45 AM

It's not negativity, at least from me anyway.  I'm just extremely familiar with FPGAs (and I see a lot of people are not...) and responding to the realities of the platform, especially in response to what's been announced and the wild impossible ideas people are throwing around.

 

I'm a huge proponent of FPGA, I have one of the best supported consumer level retail units ever right here on my desk.  I'd love for this new thing to succeed - but it doesn't change the fact that FPGAs do have price/performance limitations far outside of what most people are used to, and that I just don't see how their proposed business/development model is possibly going to work.



#54 Gamemoose OFFLINE  

Gamemoose

    Dragonstomper

  • 697 posts

Posted Sat Apr 18, 2015 11:15 AM

Without the ability to update and/or fix post launch, we have situations like - to use one famous example relevant to AtariAge - Impossible Mission on the Atari 7800, where you can't actually finish the game. Back then there was no way to fix it. Today, we have the technology. There's no reason to ignore modern technology just because it has a chance of encouraging sloppiness. 

Impossible Mission ranks up there with one of those "famous" game-breaking situations. How many games out there were made that had some really annoying bug or problem that halted the game? I think I can count on one hand the number of times I got stuck in a game from a bug and had to either reset or lose a life. Next time around I could 't reproduce it.

I understand technology becomes more complex but still-shouldn't the team developing the tech be more competent as well? When a new console needs a day one patch-that's a problem in my book. Yes it's nice to have the ability to patch but the product should be ready to rock and roll when it hits the shelf with ALL advertised features working. It was pulled off in the past, why can't they do it now?

Edited by Gamemoose, Sat Apr 18, 2015 11:33 AM.


#55 Keatah OFFLINE  

Keatah

    Missile Commander

  • 21,926 posts

Posted Sat Apr 18, 2015 12:12 PM

I'm too lazy to mess with DLC and online games. I'm too lazy to get cartridges off a shelf and put them in a slot, let alone open a plastic clamshell case!

 

Emulation for the win. I can be gaming instantly, and go from machine to machine instantly with perfect reliability on my choice (from thousands) of hardware/rigs.



#56 Keatah OFFLINE  

Keatah

    Missile Commander

  • 21,926 posts

Posted Sat Apr 18, 2015 12:58 PM

I understand technology becomes more complex but still-shouldn't the team developing the tech be more competent as well? When a new console needs a day one patch-that's a problem in my book. Yes it's nice to have the ability to patch but the product should be ready to rock and roll when it hits the shelf with ALL advertised features working. It was pulled off in the past, why can't they do it now?

 

All major bugs should be fixed before a product is released. We all know that.

 

The type of updates I like to see are ones that add features and capabilities, or ones that add accommodation for previously unavailable or previously unheard of hardware.

 

 

I'm a huge proponent of FPGA, I have one of the best supported consumer level retail units ever right here on my desk.  I'd love for this new thing to succeed - but it doesn't change the fact that FPGAs do have price/performance limitations far outside of what most people are used to, and that I just don't see how their proposed business/development model is possibly going to work.

 

I don't like or dislike FPGA. I still think they are novel devices despite being in service more than 20-years. My old Fluke test equipment has some, my older PC has one for bus arbitration. Modern Microprocessors have tiny FPGA's in them for microcode updates.

 

I don't like that development is slow-moving with these things. And that end-user (cause that's what I am) interfaces and general working-with-the-blasted-parts are so crude. Not the HDL tools, but the finished product - when compared against the finest emulators in a PC environment.

 

Look at the extensive options available in Altirra and Stella and M.A.M.E. I'm more than willing to give up a small fraction of accuracy in exchange for all those things to play around with. And to have the power and flexibility of the PC/Windows/NTFS tying it all together. Dude!

 

What I would like to see is an FPGA arcade card that plugs into a PCIe slot. One that emulators and other projects can use. We have some of this capability with openCL and graphics cards, and unfortunately it doesn't get used. Maybe that's another redundant idea when it comes to retrogaming. Modern CPU's are stupid fast and can handle just about anything.



#57 godslabrat OFFLINE  

godslabrat

    Quadrunner

  • 5,490 posts
  • I took the midnight train going a-ny-where...
  • Location:Oklahoma City

Posted Sat Apr 18, 2015 7:13 PM

 
If it's an FPGA it's nowhere near capable of PS1 era core performance.  And why would they sell you something so you could just play all the games you wanted, for free?  Their business model is to sell you games on cart, not be a RetroN 5.



Their goal should be to sell me something I want in the first place. Giving me at least the option of using other carts can't be a bad thing.

#58 remowilliams OFFLINE  

remowilliams

    Quadrunner

  • 10,607 posts
  • Location:Detonation Boulevard

Posted Sat Apr 18, 2015 7:39 PM

Their goal should be to sell me something I want in the first place. Giving me at least the option of using other carts can't be a bad thing.

 

Completely different business model.  Hyperkin wants to sell Retron 5s, they don't have any software to sell you that the platform and their income lives or dies on...



#59 godslabrat OFFLINE  

godslabrat

    Quadrunner

  • 5,490 posts
  • I took the midnight train going a-ny-where...
  • Location:Oklahoma City

Posted Sat Apr 18, 2015 7:48 PM

Well, it's no big deal, I'm just tossing out ideas. It's not like the business model for game systems based on outdated hardware is well-defined or anything.

#60 remowilliams OFFLINE  

remowilliams

    Quadrunner

  • 10,607 posts
  • Location:Detonation Boulevard

Posted Sat Apr 18, 2015 7:58 PM

I agree playing user supplied roms/carts would be fantastic, and probably the sole reason I'd support the product being proposed.  I just don't see it happening.



#61 Papa OFFLINE  

Papa

    Dragonstomper

  • 751 posts

Posted Sun Apr 19, 2015 12:06 PM

I got two words for all non-believers (and this would rock HARD CORE if they got it on cart)!   SHOVEL KNIGHT!! 

 

If they get games like Assaulter and Shovel Knight on this system, on a cartridge, it will be AWESOME!!



#62 Keatah OFFLINE  

Keatah

    Missile Commander

  • 21,926 posts

Posted Sun Apr 19, 2015 1:13 PM

I agree playing user supplied roms/carts would be fantastic, and probably the sole reason I'd support the product being proposed.  I just don't see it happening.

 

If it would accept a modern standard like SD cards that would be nice. I would consider it. or even 2 SD cards, one for the cores and OS. The other for roms. If that's out of the scope of the designers' intended usage, then how about a Harmony style cart? One that acts as an interface to an SD card. Look, there's going to have to be a way for me to easily get my own stuff onto the system for me to get interested in this. It is also going to have to offer me something that emulation (or real collection) cannot.

 

The VCS, Apple II, Atari 400/800, C64 & Vic20, and some TRS-80 models were extraordinarily successful because they had no initial charter. What I mean by that is they were put out there with minimal titles and no launch-party fanfare. They had excellent documentation and mostly open arcitecture. There was no preconceived notion of what each of those systems were to be. Developers were totally free to do what they damned well pleased. There were no restrictions or influences "making" them do certain types of games or applications or having to use a certain style. No marketing restrictions, no financial or business restrictions. No preconceived notions.

 

IMHO it was Apple II which led the pack, shipping with almost 1,000 pages of pages of documentation at one point in time. There was nothing hidden or proprietary in the system. Every tiny detail was open for inspection and and discussion. The only undocumented things were undiscovered bugs.

 

 

I got two words for all non-believers (and this would rock HARD CORE if they got it on cart)!   SHOVEL KNIGHT!! 

 

If they get games like Assaulter and Shovel Knight on this system, on a cartridge, it will be AWESOME!!

 

Ughh...



#63 roland p OFFLINE  

roland p

    River Patroller

  • 2,455 posts
  • $23
  • Location:The Netherlands

Posted Sun Apr 19, 2015 2:03 PM

I think it all boils down to which games will become available. I've heard names like Konami, Capcom which could spark my interest, but I think that sounds too good to be true.

The usage of an FPGA is cool, but if I want to play around with an FPGA I could also consider the MIST.







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Jaguar, cartridge, retro gaming

0 user(s) are browsing this forum

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users