Need VBXE help: Not able to load SDX drivers

[+MacRorie]

Hello,

 

I have installed a VBXE 2 in my 800XL. The XL currently has the following installed in it:

Ultimate 1MB w/ standard BIOS & SDX 4.47

SiDE2 with switch

SIO2USB (internal)

 

The VBXE RGB out is currently connected via the RGBS (5 pin connector) on the GBS-8220. There is not a permanent connection to a VGA/Atari monitor port yet until I can figure out why this is not working.

 

I installed the VBXE and I have no problems with Legacy video or VBXE out if I *just* use the standard VBXE.SYS driver (minimal driver from SDXTK)

 

If I try to load EITHER S_VBXE.SYS or RC_VBXE.SYS the video distorts and eventually the GBS-8220 cannot translate. I then have to boot into the Ultimate BIOS settings, disable the VBXE, save reboot, and remove the driver from CONFIG.SYS.

 

I am presuming this is NOT normal behavior. How might I trouble shoot it?

 

https://youtu.be/Lglf_iJo8FM

 

https://youtu.be/56JKSXtlNP0

 

https://youtu.be/2McEY89qUKw

 

 

Thank you for reading! I *really* appreciate the help I get here. It has been invaluable in getting me back into the A8. The A8 was actually my computer in college (y'know when Reagan was President of the US). I would very much like to use it in a regular basis again. I am in the process of trying to get all of these upgrades stable so I can button it up and restart my BBS (The Bates Motel). Soon, I will probably posting about the Lantronix situation because I have read all of the messages I can on THAT subject and STILL am flummoxed as to what is wrong.

 

Thanks

-MacRorie

[Rybags]

VBXE should output video regardless of whether it's enabled in Ultimate 1 Meg, and irrespective of any Dos drivers that are present or not.

 

Disabling VBXE just means that it becomes invisible to software that looks for it (the hardware registers become inaccessable).

 

It might have some bearing but are you running with a Rambo or standard firmware? If you're using Ultimate 1 Meg then you should be running the standard (A suffix) firmware, as you don't want VBXE providing extended Ram via PortB as well as that coming from Ultimate 1 Meg (although in theory you could do it using U1Meg in 64K mode).

 

It also seems real strange with that last video and the video corruption. Do you have a CRT monitor that you can test with to see what happens there?

I would guess there might be some problem either with the VBXE install or the sync hookup - VBXE doesn't provide any sync for the standard non-VGA config that most of us are using, you get that from the legacy video generation.

[+MacRorie]

VBXE should output video regardless of whether it's enabled in Ultimate 1 Meg, and irrespective of any Dos drivers that are present or not.

 

Disabling VBXE just means that it becomes invisible to software that looks for it (the hardware registers become inaccessable).

I thought so as well. However, if I do not disable it in U1MB, then I get nothing (legacy OR VBXE) until I reboot and, of course, remove the S_VBXE/RC_VBXE from the config.sys and/or boot another DOS, I guess.

It might have some bearing but are you running with a Rambo or standard firmware? If you're using Ultimate 1 Meg then you should be running the standard (A suffix) firmware, as you don't want VBXE providing extended Ram via PortB as well as that coming from Ultimate 1 Meg (although in theory you could do it using U1Meg in 64K mode).

Not sure what you mean here. Do you mean the standard firmware for U1MB or for VBXE? Either way, I am using them straight out of the box--except I flashed the U1MB with 4.47.

It also seems real strange with that last video and the video corruption. Do you have a CRT monitor that you can test with to see what happens there?

I would guess there might be some problem either with the VBXE install or the sync hookup - VBXE doesn't provide any sync for the standard non-VGA config that most of us are using, you get that from the legacy video generation.

I do. I will see what I can do with the SC1124 connection. I was flip-flopping between an HD15/DB9 & the 13pin DIN, but, the only connection that will not require the use of a scan doubler would be the 13pin, so I guess I will do that.

 

Also, the CSYNC is coming from pin 15 of the CD4050. RGB Control is not currently connected. Do you think that could be the issue?

 

Again, thanks for the help. One of the reasons I started to play with this setting was so I could play Moon Cresta!

 

-M

[Rybags]

Firmware, I mean the VBXE. There should be a program in the Release package of software that displays what core is active.

 

RGB control - that is only needed for SCART. It could be that the monitor you use expects some signal there, but I don't know if it's a vital requirement.

 

Yep, the ST monitor will work fine just as the 1084 but the problem is it's a bit trickier to aquire and wire up the plug for one of those vs the C= one.

[+MacRorie]

Firmware, I mean the VBXE. There should be a program in the Release package of software that displays what core is active.

Right. VBXE.SYS is a minimal driver that reports 1.26. No suffix. How do I fix THAT?

RGB control - that is only needed for SCART. It could be that the monitor you use expects some signal there, but I don't know if it's a vital requirement.

okay. Not worrying about it then.

Yep, the ST monitor will work fine just as the 1084 but the problem is it's a bit trickier to aquire and wire up the plug for one of those vs the C= one.

Indeed, I do have both the monitor and the port, so it will be next on my soldering schedule. Thanks

[Rybags]

You could try something to see if VBXE is providing extra PortB Ram.

 

First up set a base 64K only machine in the Ultimate Bios config. Leave VBXE enabled.

 

Then start the computer with Basic only, don't worry about booting Dos or anything else.

 

Enter these commands:

 

POKE 106,128 : GR. 0

 

POKE 54016,129

 

If the screen stays the same, it means that no extra Ram is being enabled anywhere and that the VBXE should be running the right core suffix at least.

[+MacRorie]

Did that. Screen stayed the same. Well, it went back to the Ready prompt which is what I assume you mean. Curses. I will solder up the 13 pin din tomorrow.

 

I suppose I will order another board from Lotharek.. .

[lotharek]

i`m 100% sure new board will not solve Your issue

 

please do :

 

- find decent rgb receiver and test vbxe

 

why ?

 

gbs makes problems as Your vga monitor is out of range,...

[drac030]

I do not think that is a software issue.

 

But if so, could you list your config.sys here? Just the one which makes problems. I know that you show a config.sys file on the first video, but it is not exactly what loads later, e.g. on the "loading" videos (2 and 3) it can be seen that you load VBXE.SYS, but there is no line DEVICE E:>DRIVERS>VBXE in the config.sys shown on the first video. So after loading FATFS on the third video it is not really known, what driver exactly makes the mess.

 

Also, please narrow the config.sys entries just to the ones which allow to reproduce the issue. If FATFS is not relevant, leave it out for now. If you want to "trace" the config.sys execution, use the ECHO command before and after each line to get some debugging messages displayed as the config.sys is being interpreted.

 

Also, loading S_VBXE itself does nothing except installing the code in the system. The driver partly loads to the VRAM, so if you get mess after that, it may mean, that either the VBXE RAM or some other RAM in the computer is not working correctly.

Edited August 27, 2015 by drac030

[+MacRorie]

I do not think that is a software issue.

 

But if so, could you list your config.sys here? Just the one which makes problems. I know that you show a config.sys file on the first video, but it is not exactly what loads later, e.g. on the "loading" videos (2 and 3) it can be seen that you load VBXE.SYS, but there is no line DEVICE E:>DRIVERS>VBXE in the config.sys shown on the first video. So after loading FATFS on the third video it is not really known, what driver exactly makes the mess.

 

Also, please narrow the config.sys entries just to the ones which allow to reproduce the issue. If FATFS is not relevant, leave it out for now. If you want to "trace" the config.sys execution, use the ECHO command before and after each line to get some debugging messages displayed as the config.sys is being interpreted.

 

Also, loading S_VBXE itself does nothing except installing the code in the system. The driver partly loads to the VRAM, so if you get mess after that, it may mean, that either the VBXE RAM or some other RAM in the computer is not working correctly.

 

drac030,

Okay, I will detail it out. I will eliminate everything from the CONFIG.SYS except for S_VBXE.SYS. I will edit this message in a few minutes to detail the contents. Thanks for there reply

 

 

i`m 100% sure new board will not solve Your issue

 

please do :

 

- find decent rgb receiver and test vbxe

 

why ?

 

gbs makes problems as Your vga monitor is out of range,...

 

Lotharek,

Thanks for the reply and the email. I wired up a 13pin DIN and attached it to an SC1224. I have verified that the pins are connected, but all I get on the SC1224 is garbled video. I tried to lock it down by adjusting the V-Hold and the H-Hold on the SC1224, but no change.

 

I will try and pull CVBS and connect that to pin2 on the 13pin DIN and see if it makes a difference. Will report back.

 

 

I am also going to try to wire a straight connection to a 1435 and see if that makes a difference.

[+MacRorie]

ALLLLLLLL riiighttty then!

 

Sorry, but I have spent the last 6-8 hours wiring up cables and parsing how to connect different monitors, etc.

 

So, the update:

CONFIG.SYS file contains a lot of things, BUT (as seen in the video) I pared it down to this:

USE BANKED

DEVICE SPARTA

DEVICE SIO

DEVICE X:>DRIVERS>S_VBXE.SYS

DEVICE ATARIDOS
DEVICE ULTIME

 

It still does the same thing it did before. I have connected it to an SC1224 (BTW, CSYNC tied to pin 2 of the DIN13 does not lock it down, I tied in HSYNC/VSYNC/CSYNC and it settled down. I suppose if I tied CVBS it might lock immediately, but that seemed too much work to prove what I already saw with the 1435.

 

Speaking of which, I built a cable for the 1435. Connection worked immediately EXCEPT for the S_VBXE and R_VBXE drivers.

 

Here are the videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckOmzU-xezg

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCGu_iwfDsw

 

 

I ordered a new board yesterday. The VBXE may not be the problem, but with a new known good board at least I can rule it out. If it is not the board, I suppose I will use it for the BBS (which is what started all of this A8 resurgence!)

 

I look forward to some answers. I would LOVE to button this unit up and call it 'upgraded.' I am trying to add the StereoPokey after this, but I do not want to add additional variables until I run this down.

 

Thanks!

-M

[drac030]

I used your config.sys to start the SDX here, no problems. I also took a look at the driver's source, the only thing that it does at init time (besides loading itself to the memory) is writing a $00 to the video_control register.

 

By the way, the issue looks like it was a problem with horizontal sync. To my knowledge, VBXE does not generate sync signals at all (GTIA does), but perhaps it can have some indirect control on those (I am not sure). So it seems that it is either a problem with the hardware OR with the FX core. Before doing anything else, maybe try reflashing the cores.

 

Also, you can try to do POKE $D099,0 from the SDX console. That should reset the board. See if it makes any difference.

[Rybags]

You have to use CSync from the legacy video - VBXE in 16 KHz RGB mode does not generate any type of sync.

 

If I remember rightly, some people experienced problems using the CSync from the suggested pickup points, I think an alternate method was to just use the composite video signal as CSync (you'd need to trawl through the old threads from 5-6 years ago).

[+MacRorie]

You have to use CSync from the legacy video - VBXE in 16 KHz RGB mode does not generate any type of sync.

 

If I remember rightly, some people experienced problems using the CSync from the suggested pickup points, I think an alternate method was to just use the composite video signal as CSync (you'd need to trawl through the old threads from 5-6 years ago).

You are correct. Believe me, I have trawled through just about every VBXE thread I could find on AA!

[+MacRorie]

I used your config.sys to start the SDX here, no problems. I also took a look at the driver's source, the only thing that it does at init time (besides loading itself to the memory) is writing a $00 to the video_control register.

 

By the way, the issue looks like it was a problem with horizontal sync. To my knowledge, VBXE does not generate sync signals at all (GTIA does), but perhaps it can have some indirect control on those (I am not sure). So it seems that it is either a problem with the hardware OR with the FX core. Before doing anything else, maybe try reflashing the cores.

Okay. . . . that may be above my pay grade. How does one do that?

 

Also, you can try to do POKE $D099,0 from the SDX console. That should reset the board. See if it makes any difference.

IIRC, I just type that at the SDX "DOS prompt," yes? BTW, this episode has gotten me deeper into the SDX manual. I learned about the CONFIG.SYS menu yesterday while trying to determine how to escape a bad config.sys file! Thanks for the help!

[drac030]

Yes, at the DOS prompt.

 

As about the cores, go there

 

http://spiflash.org/block/15.html

 

get the core pack, read the PDF, then use the FC.COM program to reflash the cores. You do not have to reflash all of them, do just one then set it as the bootbank () and press X to start the new core. You will probably have to reboot the system afterwards. Or simply do a power cycle after quitting the FC.

 

EDIT: you could try to flash the same core into another "slot". Just in case there is a problem with the flash ROM in the VBXE.

Edited August 29, 2015 by drac030

[+MacRorie]

Yes, at the DOS prompt.

 

As about the cores, go there

 

http://spiflash.org/block/15.html

 

get the core pack, read the PDF, then use the FC.COM program to reflash the cores. You do not have to reflash all of them, do just one then set it as the bootbank () and press X to start the new core. You will probably have to reboot the system afterwards. Or simply do a power cycle after quitting the FC.

 

EDIT: you could try to flash the same core into another "slot". Just in case there is a problem with the flash ROM in the VBXE.

 

Thanks. Cores re-flashed. Everything flashed okay. Same results when loading S_VBXE.SYS.

 

Thanks

[drac030]

If so, then I am clueless. Your system is exceptional

[+MacRorie]

If so, then I am clueless. Your system is exceptional

Yeah, I do *feel* so exceptional. bleech. Well, new one coming. I will double-check all of my connections. Question: Would the legacy video out work if any of the connections were incorrect?

 

Thanks

[Rybags]

Legacy video shouldn't be affected, the only common element is the CSync signal.

Though if your normal video was garbled that would indicate maybe CSync generation is being corrupted.

[+MacRorie]

Legacy video shouldn't be affected, the only common element is the CSync signal.

Though if your normal video was garbled that would indicate maybe CSync generation is being corrupted.

Hmm, see, legacy video IS being corrupted. Perhaps that is a lead to the problem? I have pulled a stock 800XL from the attic. I am going to install on that and see what happens.

 

I am going to presume that since the physical chip at U21 is not present on any of the 800XLs I have opened up, that it doesn't matter, correct?

[Rybags]

I don't know what U21 is - my schematics for 800XL have no mention. The socket names are different on each machine so it's not really useful to refer to stuff by board labelling.

 

If your legacy video is bad then it's likely the whole machine has some sort of issue. You could try replacing the CD4050 IC which buffers the luma and CSync signals.

 

Since you have both VBXE and Ultimate 1 Meg it makes debugging problems that much harder since the machine is now so much different to stock (mine has both those too).

[+MacRorie]

I don't know what U21 is - my schematics for 800XL have no mention. The socket names are different on each machine so it's not really useful to refer to stuff by board labelling.

 

If your legacy video is bad then it's likely the whole machine has some sort of issue. You could try replacing the CD4050 IC which buffers the luma and CSync signals.

 

Since you have both VBXE and Ultimate 1 Meg it makes debugging problems that much harder since the machine is now so much different to stock (mine has both those too).

U21 is where the VBXE install docs say I should connect PIN 1 of J6 on the VBXE board

[Rybags]

OK, got it now... U21 is the 74LS74 near the Ram chips.

 

The install pic suggests using a pickoff point for that connection from the bottom of resistor R110 by the looks of things.

The connections for the clock are pretty critical, if the soldering isn't right on you can end up with an unstable or not working system.

[+MacRorie]

Right, but the text box on that picture says that the picture is from an old install and to only remove the Q8 & R110 and then follow the connections in the table above. Those connections are very different from what is in the picture