Mr. Turtle Review! Colecovision Homebrew Game!

[TPR]

Since I’ve started getting back into the ColecoVision scene and picking up the homebrews carts, I’ve realized that most of them fall into one of these three categories:

 

1. Games coded from the ground up of either arcade ports or original ideas that look and feel like they could be a polished, original release. (Bagman, Mecha-8, Lock N Chase, Quest for the Golden Chalice, etc…)

 

2. Ports of commercial games from other systems or arcade code that fit nicely into the ColecoVision library (Goonies, Track & Field, Lode Runner, Pac-Man Collection, Circus Charlie, etc…)

 

3. Amateur games that help the homebrew community thrive, are fully enjoyable, but lack the “final polish” of a commercial game. (Frog Feast, Ghostblaster, Jetpack, Crown Jewel Series, etc)

 

I feel as though the homebrew community would not be a “complete family” without all of these categories and each one delivers an experience that I can fully appreciate and enjoy.

 

Mr. Turtle falls in the #3 category and I’m very happy to support the amateur programers who are keeping my childhood system alive, especially creating games that I only remember as a single screenshot posted on the back of my console box and in one of the early catalogs and now I can see what that experience would look like through one persons creative and talented vision. Thankfully, a lot of what I imagined Mr. Turtle to be also comes through in Gerry’s game. Here is my memory of what Mr. Turtle would look like:

 

First off, the packaging is FANTASTIC! I love the artwork! Take a look at the box front and back:

 

I loved the multiple options for the cart label, and I know this is a “little thing”, but I love the insert inside the box that the cartridge fits into:

 

And the manual looks great!

 

It *feels* like packaging from a real game! Great job! But wait...there is one little detail that I think is important to point out... Take a look at the side of the box...

 

Now take a CLOSER look at it...

 

It has the game #2432. Now go back and take a look at the original catalog image I posted above. I love that Gerry made sure that these game numbers matched up and it was included on the box. Such a great little point of detail! I love it!

 

Flipping the “on switch” on the ColecoVision the first thing you notice is that the game looks GREAT! And in almost no time you can see the screen in which the classic Coleco catalog screen shot came from. I personally thank Gerry for that. It’s a childhood moment come to life! Here's the closest I could come to the "classic screenshot" recreation:

 

Original:

 

Now the game brought to life:

 

Looks pretty damn close to me! =)

 

As you get into the game more, note that the game is HARD! Be prepared for that! Some of this comes from the game being more on the “amateur” level and the gameplay not being quite polished, but that doesn’t take away from having a bit of “fun of discovery” figuring out the best way to get through each screen. It might take you a bit more time, but that’s all part of playing the game!

 

 

I love the concept of having to collect the letters to spell Pearl. I'm a huge fan of this in the Universal games like Lady Bug & Mr. Do so I'm happy to see that this was included. It’s something from the concept of the original game that I didn’t even quite notice until this game was in development and there was an “OMG” moment when you realized that a screenshot you had been looking at for years had a gameplay clue right in front of you, but you never quite noticed!

 

I admit that after a couple of hours of playing, I have only collected two letters, but I’m determined to get there!

 

 

There are characteristics of this game you will have to get used to. There are times where the controls seem a little bit clunky and moments where the “water current” makes you feel like you cannot control your character. It’s difficult and can be frustrating, but once I learned my way around those moments I was back in action again.

 

 

Killing enemies is also not the easiest thing to do either. It took some practice to figure it out, and I’m still pretty bad at it! lol I still have yet to be able to get the shark to leave me alone by trying my attack mode.

 

 

I do admit to playing the game in an emulator using a “Save State” has certainly helped. I’m usually not one for “cheating” in a game as I like to play a game as though it’s still 1983 and I don’t have those features available to me, but this one kind of needs it. I sort of wish there was a “continue” built into it. Have it wipe your score so you can still keep track of who has done well without using it, but it’s frustrating to keep dying and having to restart. So the save state was a nice option! =)

 

 

Overall, if you’re looking for a more “polished” game like some of the titles you can find in my category #1 & #2 above, this isn’t it. But that doesn’t make it bad or something I wouldn’t suggest you own in your collection either. The amount of time and passion put into this game is clear from the moment you open the box it was shipped in, and that alone is worth the cost of the game and getting past some of the more amateur characteristics of it and having a really good time! And the most important thing I can point out is that I don't have anywhere near the talent to be able to put together a game like this, and I have a serious amount of respect for anyone who puts out even the most rudimentary "demo" all the way to a finished, boxed game!

Well done, Gerry!

 

 

I'm curious to hear other people's thoughts on the game as well.

To order a copy of Mr. Turtle, here is the information: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/242534-mr-turtle-for-colecovision-for-sale/

[jblenkle]

No offense intended to the reviewer, but if you spent 100s of hours programming a game like this would you want it called "amateur"?

[TPR]

No offense intended to the reviewer, but if you spent 100s of hours programming a game like this would you want it called "amateur"?

As someone who spent 22 years of their life working on commercially released games I have worked with programmers and designers of all varying degrees of talent. I do not mean any disrespect by using the term "amateur", but there is a huge difference between a programmer or designer that has spent most of their lives working full time (read usually 60-80 hours per week) with a professional game development team and someone who does a "homebrew title."

 

Many people I hired at Activision for doing game design came out of the homebrew community. Those people were absolutely "amateur" before they turned professional.

 

I don't know of any other term to use that has a better descriptor. Perhaps "professional amateur?" I don't know. You're the one complaining about my review, perhaps you could suggest a better term I could use?

 

It's a shame you underlined one word to focus on out of what I think was a very complimentary review. I should have snuck in the word "Eskimo" in there somewhere!

(Wonder if anyone will get that reference!)

[TPR]

No offense intended to the reviewer, but if you spent 100s of hours programming a game like this would you want it called "amateur"?

Also, I spend hundreds of hours working on roller coaster and theme park videos now. Some of them have even been released commercially on the Travel Channel. I am totally "ok" with the fact that I am considered an "amateur videographer" even though it's pretty much my full-time job as I know that if I had to stack up one of my videos against someone who is a professional cameraman or director making commercially released movies or television shows, I would lose every time. But I like what I do and I'm happy to produce my homebrew "amateur" YouTube videos for our niche audience.

[jblenkle]

Amateur just seems a little harsh. If he programmed this game for the fun of it and gave it away, he would be an amateur. If he programmed the game and sells it, he is no longer an amateur.

 

I don't really care if you worked at Activision or that you spent 22 years working on commercially released games.

 

This game looks on par with most of the other games that are currently being produced -- some of which are better than original Coleco releases -- and yes, your review was mostly favorable until you delivered the programmer a slap in the face with the word "amateur."

 

Why did you feel it necessary to even include a statement like that? It didn't add anything to your review other than to cast a negative shadow on it.

 

"You're the one complaining about my review, perhaps you could suggest a better term I could use?"

 

Sorry...I've been a professional writer for 41 years. If you want me to edit your review, pay me. I'm not an amateur.

 

 

 

As someone who spent 22 years of their life working on commercially released games I have worked with programmers and designers of all varying degrees of talent. I do not mean any disrespect by using the term "amateur", but there is a huge difference between a programmer or designer that has spent most of their lives working full time (read usually 60-80 hours per week) with a professional game development team and someone who does a "homebrew title."

Many people I hired at Activision for doing game design came out of the homebrew community. Those people were absolutely "amateur" before they turned professional.

I don't know of any other term to use that has a better descriptor. Perhaps "professional amateur?" I don't know. You're the one complaining about my review, perhaps you could suggest a better term I could use?

It's a shame you underlined one word to focus on out of what I think was a very complimentary review. I should have snuck in the word "Eskimo" in there somewhere!
(Wonder if anyone will get that reference!)

[TPR]

I don't really care if you worked at Activision or that you spent 22 years working on commercially released games...I've been a professional writer for 41 years.

So what you are saying is that you are totally discounting my professional experience while at the same time bragging about yours. I cannot think of a more un-professional way for someone to come across in this discussion. I respect the many years you have spent as a writer and in an instance where we are discussing commercially published books versus self-published titles, I would look to your area of expertise. It's a shame you can't have the same sort of respect in return.

 

 

Your review was mostly favorable until you delivered the programmer a slap in the face with the word "amateur."

Sorry...I've been a professional writer for 41 years. If you want me to edit your review, pay me. I'm not an amateur.

Since you've been a professional writer for 41 years I would expect you to know the definition of the word "amateur" which according to Webster is:

 

"1. One who engages in an art, science, study, or athletic activity as a pastime rather than as a profession."

 

I'm pretty sure anyone who does anything "homebrew" as I do with my video work understands my use of the term is not meant as a slap in the face at all.

 

And thank you for totally derailing what is a very favorable review for Gerry's game to something completely trivial.

 

Oh, and one other thing:

Sorry...I've been a professional writer for 41 years. If you want me to edit your review, pay me. I'm not an amateur.

As a writer for 41 years, you should also know that statement is far more obnoxious and rude than anything I wrote in my review. So are we even now?

[digress]

Hey, Thanks for taking the time to do a detailed review.

 

I think it's fair and any game may be more to one person's style of game than another. When a few others try it out please let us know what you think.

 

"I sort of wish there was a “continue” built into it."

 

There is. I wanted everyone to try it straight up first and I'll reveal the cheat code in a week or so which will make it much easier to continue from where you are at with full lives.

 

“fun of discovery”

 

There are a few tricks that are not in the manual which also may help.

 

To attack the shark do it from above not below. And attacking in general just hold both buttons... it's just easier. If he pins you on the bottom just wait he'll wander away in less than 10 secs.

 

You can walk on clouds if you push up continually while over them.

 

Gerry

[TPR]

Hey, Thanks for taking the time to do a detailed review. I think it's fair and any game may be more to one person's style of game than another.

 

You're welcome and you're absolutely right! I felt the title was absolutely "review worthy" which in itself shows how much I was impressed with it!

 

To attack the shark do it from above not below. And attacking in general just hold both buttons... it's just easier. If he pins you on the bottom just wait he'll wander away in less than 10 secs.

Yay! That's super helpful! Just tried that technique and was able to protect myself from the shark! =)

[TPR]

Oh! One more thing, Gerry... I was very happy to see you fixed Coleco's typo from the original game description on the back of your box!

[phattyboombatty]

I have to weigh in on this review albeit brief, as I am currently mobile.

 

In agreement with some of what jblenkle stated, I was a bit blown back by your categorizing digress' game as "amateur ". TPR, no matter what shoulderboards you choose to flare, you are still a neophyte to this community. I suggest showing deference in more instances. Most of us here have watched thousands of hours, many days, months, and years go by in support of community projects like Mr. Brophy's. An undertaking like his, and making 75 copies of it, is a MASSIVE one for which he clearly deserves loads of respect. This game, although I still await playing it, is in no way comparable to "Jetpack". The colors, detail in graphics, and game mechanics are detailed art.

 

Thank you for your work Gerry, and I may decide to find some time to put up my own intellectual review of your fine work with far less a focus on the critical.

Edited September 21, 2015 by phattyboombatty

[Tkat5200]

I think TPR is dead on here and I also feel that jblenkle needs to be more respectful. the guy worked as a pro game maker for 22 years. so my thought is...unless you've beat him out in the game industry by a few years...you need to respect his opinion cause it carries a LOT more weight than yours.

 

TPR is not slamming the game...matter of fact I just asked to buy a copy BECAUSE of his review.

 

Second edit: you all act like parent here...(well you came in second place but its JUST as good as first)

TPR is not saying the game is bad...he's just calling out some areas that needed a bit more tightening.

 

but instead of just fawning over a game because someone spent lots of time and passion on it...tell the truth in your reviews.

 

because if we are going to play the game on here that you two are doing now...every game I worked on should have been held high as AMAZING because we all bled for those games and worked 60-80 hour workweeks to get them out...sometimes for 24 months a clip.

 

and yet...my games were slammed...some way more than Mr Turtle which I do not think was slammed at all here, nor was the developers skills...which are as you can EASILY see...high based on his ability to even FINISH this game

Edited September 21, 2015 by Tkat5200

[phattyboombatty]

Oh, and one other thing:

 

As a writer for 41 years, you should also know that statement is far more obnoxious and rude than anything I wrote in my review. So are we even now?

Gee, for an amateur video game critic, you really seem quite sensitive!

[TPR]

TPR, no matter what shoulderboards you choose to flare, you are still a neophyte to this community.

Wow. So because I'm new to AtariAge I don't get to have an opinion where others do? Thanks. That's VERY welcoming. I would think a community like this would want to encourage MORE PEOPLE to contribute rather than try to shut people out based on the amount of time they've been typing words onto a forum. I have run Theme Park Review's forum since 2005. We are a very active community with about 10,000 posts per month. I treat our new members who just joined yesterday with the same respect as those who joined in 2005. I don't care of someone has been a member for ten years or ten minutes. We welcome them to our community and they are treated the same. If someone joins our forum today and writes a review of a theme park, they aren't going to get belittled by the longer-term members simply because their join date is younger. I cannot imagine that Albert would want anything less than that on his forum.

 

I might be new to this particular community, but I'm not new to the Colecovision collecting scene or to the video game industry.

 

 

I may decide to find some time to put up my own intellectual review of your fine work with far less a focus on the critical.

But that wouldn't really be a "review" right? This is just my personal opinion, but a "review" should be something where you speak honestly about something, and not just point out either only the good or only the bad. Now it's possible that something you are reviewing you might not have anything either good or bad to talk about, but saying "I'm going to post a review but ONLY talk about the positive things" just seems kind of pointless to me, sorry.

 

 

Most of us here have watched thousands of hours, many days, months, and years go by in support of community projects like Mr. Brophy's. An undertaking like his, and making 75 copies of it, is a MASSIVE one for which he clearly deserves loads of respect.

Oh trust me, I get it. Perhaps you'd like to come over to our house when we do one of our Club TPR mailings for over 1,000 members? It's a lot of packages and items to put together. We usually spend a solid week having to do it. I'm also not sure if you read the entire review because if you did, I cannot imagine your take away would be that I have nothing but absolute respect for Gerry's work:

 

And the most important thing I can point out is that I don't have anywhere near the talent to be able to put together a game like this, and I have a serious amount of respect for anyone who puts out even the most rudimentary "demo" all the way to a finished, boxed game!

creating games that I only remember as a single screenshot posted on the back of my console box and in one of the early catalogs and now I can see what that experience would look like through one persons creative and talented vision.

 

I really don't understand how some of you keep taking away words and pieces from my favorable review and turning it into something grossly negative. If you want, I can just re-write and edit my original post and remove anything slightly negative and water it down so that people who don't have that thick of skin can pat themselves on the back. Or maybe I just shouldn't do reviews at all? If people are going to put published works out there, I would think they would expect it to get reviewed. Should I tell my friends that self-publish books that they shouldn't read reviews on Amazon? Or my other friends who do indie horror films that they shouldn't expect reviews on IMDB or Rotten Tomatoes?

 

And like I said, the fact that I took the time to write a review of it already shows that I felt the game was "review worthy" because I've certainly played some that weren't.

 

Anyway... just my thoughts....

[TPR]

TPR is not slamming the game...matter of fact I just asked to buy a copy BECAUSE of his review.

 

I have been told by many people that they have made the decision to buy a game based on the reviews I have written. Isn't that what a homebrew programmer or publisher would want??? MORE exposure??? Personally, I'd be a little bummed if I released a homebrew game and nobody talked about it or posting thoughts online.

 

And I'll be honest, I wouldn't write a review for a game if I felt it would reflect negatively on the homebrew community because I respect the work that goes into it. While I absolutely will point out areas of a game that might need work or aren't perfect, if you see me post a review of something, that's a game you should pick up!

 

I don't understand how anyone here can think that's a bad thing, other than they have some self-entitled seniority issues because they've "been on the forum longer" which IMO is insanely stupid.

[sega_SHARK]

wew lads...

 

 

 

 

TPR, you keep writing reviews.

 

 

digress, you keep making games.

 

 

phattyboombatty, you should make a box for Tournament Tennis that has a yellow stripe to it so it matches the rest of the Imagic titles. Because the Lord of the Dungeon Probe 2000 box you did is kick ass.

 

 

I'm going back to getting my ass kicked at Grog's Revenge for the High Score Club Challenge.

[Tkat5200]

cause they like to whine...just like the majority of this country...everyone is getting soft.

 

Look, when we made a game and it was panned...we didn't cry...we dealt with it and learned from the mistakes.

Mr Turtle does NOT sound like a mistake...matter of fact. I can't wait to play it. when i first saw the video I was like "i'll pass" but now i'm dying to check it out.

Edited September 21, 2015 by Tkat5200

[sega_SHARK]

 

Mr Turtle does NOT sound like a mistake...matter of fact. I can't wait to play it. when i first saw the video I was like "i'll pass" but now i'm dying to check it out.

Just sent an email to see if there are any left. Hope so.

[TPR]

Look, when we made a game and it was panned...we didn't cry...we dealt with it and learned from the mistakes.

 

Dude, at one point in my life, I got assigned to work on "Mall Tycoon" and the reviews were just amazing! lol http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/mall-tycoon

 

And you know what? Then I went on to work on Return to Castle Wolfenstein. So sometimes even when you've made one of the worst games ever, it's not gonna stop you from moving forward.

[Tkat5200]

I think I may have beaten you...I was the producer on Turning Point - Fall of LIberty for Xbox 360 and PS3...OMG..what a shit show. but man we had EVERYTHING against us and we still got it done.

[TPR]

^ I can't think of a single person I know that I worked with in the games biz that doesn't have "Wow, I worked on some crappy games" stories. It's all part of the experience!

[+5-11under]

I read the review, and it all seemed good. I'm not sure it belongs in category 3, though. This game is sort of a special case, I think (being based on a screen shot from what I understand).

Upon re-reading and seeing all the "amateur" talk, I can see how it could affect people. It's all semantics - the word "amateur" can have different connotations

This is definitely no JetPack!

[TPR]

I read the review, and it all seemed good. I'm not sure it belongs in category 3, though. This game is sort of a special case, I think (being based on a screen shot from what I understand).

Upon re-reading and seeing all the "amateur" talk, I can see how it could affect people. It's all semantics - the word "amateur" can have different connotations

This is definitely no JetPack!

I agree with this. It was hard to categorize. I feel like #3 is a fairly broad range of games going from titles that are VERY close to being more of a commercial release but not *quite* (like Mr. Turtle) to games like Jet Pack that are fun, but a bit more on the polished "demo" side of things.

 

Maybe instead of some of the more senior members of this forum slamming me for those comments they could help suggest a better way to classify things? I'm open to suggestions. All I know is that the game felt "less polished" than a commercially released game or some of the other homebrews by Pixelboy, Eduardo, or CollectorVision. So how do you categorize it?

[+5-11under]

I agree with this. It was hard to categorize. Maybe instead of some of the more senior members of this forum slamming me for those comments they could help suggest a better way to classify things? I'm open to suggestions. All I know is that the game felt "less polished" than a commercially released game or some of the other homebrews by Pixelboy, Eduardo, or CollectorVision. So how do you categorize it?

 

I haven't played it, so I can't comment on the "polish", except to say the screen shots look good. 1 or 3 depending on that, I guess.

 

I would categorize differently, but I'm not sure how, exactly. Right now we have everything from completely original (or as close as you can get) to completely unoriginal (SG-1000 games). In between is a large range of different ways one could categorize. As far as the "polish" goes, I'd probably rank that outside the realm of originality. For example, Dac-Man and Pac-Man Collection are both very unoriginal (one slightly more than the other), but the polish of one is miles away from the other (not that they can't both be fun in their own way).

[phattyboombatty]

I agree with this. It was hard to categorize. I feel like #3 is a fairly broad range of games going from titles that are VERY close to being more of a commercial release but not *quite* (like Mr. Turtle) to games like Jet Pack that are fun, but a bit more on the polished "demo" side of things.

 

Maybe instead of some of the more senior members of this forum slamming me for those comments they could help suggest a better way to classify things? I'm open to suggestions. All I know is that the game felt "less polished" than a commercially released game or some of the other homebrews by Pixelboy, Eduardo, or CollectorVision. So how do you categorize it?

Very sorry you took it as "slamming". I believe I posted a qualified, dignified response as a commentary on your critique. In turn, you seemed to show a lot of defensiveness. I believe that if you stick your neck out with a critique, you yourself can take somewhat of a review as well. Clearly this is not the case. I hope you become better at taking things softly and don't feel such a need to defend yourself all for a fun little game for a budding homebrew community <-----read as: suggestion

 

And yes, the word "amateur", does tend to carry a pejorative meaning along with it. I would suggest a term that might be more euphemistic toward the people you support.

 

By the way, great review.

[TPR]

For example, Dac-Man and Pac-Man Collection are both very unoriginal (one slightly more than the other), but the polish of one is miles away from the other (not that they can't both be fun in their own way).

THIS! "Polish" is something very hard to quantify and to one person it could feel different to another. For me, I think about all the commercial games I worked on and remember how a game felt at the start of development versus how it felt when it was released. During that process there is sometimes hundreds up to thousands of hours spent on layers of polish from everything to button presses, level design layout, character movements, controls, etc...

 

Not all released games are fully polished either, in fact, most games probably could have used a few weeks of not months more of testing before the publisher decided to cut the game loose!

 

In the case of Mr. Turtle, I felt the level of polish just didn't feel as close to a commercial game which is why I put it more in that "amateur" category. (geez, there is that horrible word again! lol) But like you said, it's not that they both can't be fun in their own way.

 

I just realized you are the one who made Jetpack, and I gotta be honest, I really like that little game a lot! While it is VERY simple, it feels polished to me, but it also doesn't seem like it fits in the #1 or #2 category, and that's not me being negative on your game at all!

 

I don't know how many times I need to say it, but I would not have written the review if I didn't feel this was a game that every one of us should own!