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Trak-Ball Track Ball Missile Command Centipede Reactor Millipede Challenge of... Nexar Marble Craze Plaque Attack

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#601 BigO OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Mar 28, 2017 8:15 PM

Thanks, I was just wondering about the resolution of that vintage of mouse in the context of using a trackball with an A8.

I've used my CX53 to control my Windows machine with mouse acceleration cranked way up (as I recall). I'm guessing the old systems don't have the same level of mouse driver configuration.

http://atariage.com/.../16061-nowwhat/


Edited by BigO, Tue Mar 28, 2017 8:42 PM.


#602 Tangentg OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Jun 8, 2017 7:27 PM

While I find Reactor a lot more fun with the trackball hack, for some reason I get a lot further using the regular joystick control and with the trackball hacks I die so early :/

 

That's not the case in the other versions though, like in arcade Millipede and Atari 5200 Missile Command I can get far like normal. I wonder if it's a matter of getting used to or what?



#603 Tangentg OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 8:56 AM

By the way, are there plans to fix the Millipede bug I mentioned in the other topic? I said that when you shoot the inchworm, the player also moves more slowly, which is not the case in the original 2600 version.



#604 iesposta OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 9:03 AM

While I find Reactor a lot more fun with the trackball hack, for some reason I get a lot further using the regular joystick control and with the trackball hacks I die so early :/
 
That's not the case in the other versions though, like in arcade Millipede and Atari 5200 Missile Command I can get far like normal. I wonder if it's a matter of getting used to or what?


I haven't compared Reactor joystick to Trak-Ball, mostly because I can't stand playing it with the joystick :)

I played Millipede into the 350,000's and didn't notice the inchworm problem, however that could have been a build older than V6.
I will try to repeat your reported slowdown.

#605 VectorGamer OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 9:06 AM

While I find Reactor a lot more fun with the trackball hack, for some reason I get a lot further using the regular joystick control and with the trackball hacks I die so early :/

 

 

I find this to be true as well. It seems that the joystick game is more precise over the control of your ship.



#606 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 9:09 AM

Thanks for testing.

 

If you have any idea what's the reason and how I could update the controls, please let me know.



#607 Tangentg OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 9:43 AM

I haven't compared Reactor joystick to Trak-Ball, mostly because I can't stand playing it with the joystick :)
I played Millipede into the 350,000's and didn't notice the inchworm problem, however that could have been a build older than V6.
I will try to repeat your reported slowdown.

I have v5 I think. Is there a newer version? Well I found this out by comparing the speeds of the ship when I moved my mouse at top speed during the normal vs during the inchworm speed and I noticed that it was definitely slowed down as well.

  

Thanks for testing.
 
If you have any idea what's the reason and how I could update the controls, please let me know.


I read that the entire ROM was changed before the trackball hack was added so its probably the change? Maybe in the hack, after the inchworm was shot, it did a global game slowdown thing? Haven't looked at the code but I'd assume removing the slowdown application from the ship or speeding the ship up during the inchworm speed could fix it.
 

I find this to be true as well. It seems that the joystick game is more precise over the control of your ship.

And it isn't just reactor. It's the case with Millipede and Missile Command as well, though I found the speed in Millipede too fast and it seems like the vertical speed is faster than the horizontal which messes up my judgement, though it could just be in my head.


Edited by Tangentg, Fri Jun 9, 2017 9:45 AM.


#608 iesposta OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 9:50 AM

I have v5 I think. Is there a newer version? Well I found this out by comparing the speeds of the ship when I moved my mouse at top speed during the normal vs during the inchworm speed and I noticed that it was definitely slowed down as well.

 ...

 

First post of this thread Millipede says V6: http://atariage.com/...ames/?p=3338227



#609 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 10:19 AM

I should have been more precise: I was just asking about Reactor (Millipede is not my hack).



#610 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 11:36 AM

 

 

And it isn't just reactor. It's the case with Millipede and Missile Command as well, though I found the speed in Millipede too fast and it seems like the vertical speed is faster than the horizontal which messes up my judgement, though it could just be in my head.

I got much further in Millipede with the Trackball. More improtantly, as the game got more frantic (getting further along) I had more fun playing with the trackball. And the CX-22 7800 hack currently in the AA store is the bees knees.

 

A lot of Shmups were designed around a joystick/Dpad and play fine, but the trackball does add a speed dimension. Twitchy 16-bit era SHMUPs wouldn't work well with a trackball IMO due to the precision and twitch action involved. Trackball lets you get from point A to point B much faster as well as fine control, but it all really depends upon the control system the game was developed around.

 

There are a lot of factors that can make one control preferable to another, namely speed. Joysticks are generally fixed speed whereas trackballs are variable. But I'm even open to trackball hacks of games that were never released in the arcade or even arcade ports that never used trackball in the original as well. Look at all the 5200 games that got trackball support out of the box. Much better than those janky analog joysticks, though probably rubbish for games like Pacman.



#611 VectorGamer OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 12:12 PM


But I'm even open to trackball hacks of games that were never released in the arcade

 

That reminds me of another trackball hack that was made: Spacemaster X-7 (I think it's called). I actually play better using the joystick versus the trackball.



#612 Tangentg OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 2:57 PM

 

First post of this thread Millipede says V6: http://atariage.com/...ames/?p=3338227

 

I found the Millipede hack from another website actually, though still from the same author, cause it's hard to find relevant results using the search feature here. Though clicking on the link from the first post did bring me to v5 so I didn't notice it.

 

I should have been more precise: I was just asking about Reactor (Millipede is not my hack).

Reactor runs fine I suppose. I got to the red stages so probably I just need to get used to the new control. I noticed how the difficulty switch no longer has any effect which makes sense, though I thought of it as reminiscent of the power button in the arcade version.


Edited by Tangentg, Fri Jun 9, 2017 2:58 PM.


#613 DrVenkman OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 4:23 PM

Though clicking on the link from the first post did bring me to v5 so I didn't notice it.

 

 

The download link for v6 of Millipede is right in the first post.  :? 



#614 Tangentg OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 5:17 PM

As I said, I went to the linked "link" post so I didn't notice the v6 version under it (and also that I didn't download it from this website). I wanted to read any description that came with the ROM. I'll test out whether the slowdown still happens.


Edited by Tangentg, Fri Jun 9, 2017 5:22 PM.


#615 Tangentg OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 9, 2017 5:25 PM

OK tested. Yes the slowdown is still happening.



#616 DrSidneyZweibel OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 18, 2017 10:38 AM

Here's an idea for a game that might be better with Trak-Ball:

 

Lost Luggage by Apollo. The player has 360 degree movement around the playfield, like Centipede. No idea if this can be done, or if even a disassembly of it exists, but it might make it more fun if it could be!

 

lostLuggage2600Screen.jpg


Edited by DrSidneyZweibel, Tue Jul 18, 2017 10:38 AM.


#617 Kosmic Stardust OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:07 PM

LOL! :grin:



#618 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Jul 27, 2017 3:49 AM

OK tested. Yes the slowdown is still happening.

Millipede is Omega's project and unfortunately he is MIA for quite some while. So how serious is the problem? Should this block a release on cart?

 

Also, could you post a Stella savestate which shows the problem?



#619 Tangentg OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Jul 27, 2017 10:07 AM

The problem is instead of just the bugs slowing down, the player is also slowed down after the inchworm is shot.

#620 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jul 28, 2017 3:54 PM

The problem is instead of just the bugs slowing down, the player is also slowed down after the inchworm is shot.

Can you try one of these? I think I removed the slowdown, but I am not sure if there are not any unwanted side effects now.

 

EDIT: Ignore these, see below!

 

BTW: Which controller are you using?

Attached Files


Edited by Thomas Jentzsch, Sat Jul 29, 2017 3:28 AM.


#621 RamrodHare OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Jul 29, 2017 2:10 AM

Not to derail the discussion, but I found an almost mint condition Atari Pro-Line Trak-ball in the box, before I joined AtariAge. It was while I was working at the local comic/collectables store. I found it in the back room while sorting through some stuff and asked if I could take it, since I was working for store credit. I got it home and just did a quick google search for 2600 trackball games and just read the first thing I came to, which said there were no games made for the 2600 that used the trackball. I took it back the next day and traded it for some joysticks and a few games.  It sold for $60 soon after it was put on the shelf. Now I'm wishing I still had it. :_(  



#622 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Jul 29, 2017 2:12 AM

Update: Please ignore 6.1, these should be better working.

Attached Files



#623 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:41 AM

I added ver 6.3 of Millipede to the first post. This has Thomas's fix for the inchworm, as well as changing ST Mouse to be Atari Mouse, and CX22 and CX80 to simply be Atari Trak-ball.

 

 

I don't believe there are very many CX80's out there that are not wired like a CX22.



#624 stephena OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:31 AM

I probably should get the next small point release of Stella done, as it greatly improves trakball handling.



#625 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:09 PM

I found a bug in Millipede from the original game. It was using cmp ($F7,X) to delay six cycles, but this would occassionaly trip a hotspot. I fixed it and added ver 6.4 to the first post.







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Trak-Ball, Track Ball, Missile Command, Centipede, Reactor, Millipede, Challenge of... Nexar, Marble Craze, Plaque Attack

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