Atari Flashback Classics for the XB1/PS4

[Bill Loguidice]

 

I don't have a PS 4 (or Xbox One) so I am obviously not going to buy this collection at any price, but I do have to wonder how large a segment of the potential audience has not already purchased this compilation in a different form.

 

Personally, I already have the PC and the PS 2 Atari Anthology collections on disk (as well as the Android collection on my phone and even the Atari arcade compilations for the PSX)! I assume that many other collectors feel likewise -- there is insufficient "new" content here to justify the purchase (even if I had the appropriate hardware).

 

As usual, people who frequent AtariAge are not necessarily the target audience for this type of product. It's everyone else who doesn't know how to or want to bother with emulation (or original hardware) or isn't actively maintaining copies of the same type of software on other platforms. Naturally, if you have Atari Vault on PC or the Atari collection on mobile, you really don't need this unless you really want to play it on a PS4 or Xbox One. Nevertheless, there is a big "other" category of buyers for this type of product. In my case, even if I weren't involved in a small way in this, I'd still likely purchase these for the umpteenth time just to play it on my Xbox One (I also have a PS4, of course, but I have two Xbox One's, so a product like this would make sense for me digitally). I don't think I'm alone.

 

Perhaps future volumes will appeal more to the AtariAge type of crowd. Perhaps not. While I think there is a hardware product we have coming out that will absolutely appeal to the AtariAge type of crowd, I can guarantee it still won't please everyone and there will be something about it that will set someone off. That's normal, though.

[cimerians]

 

Perhaps future volumes will appeal more to the AtariAge type of crowd. .

 

Would be wonderful to play some Colecovision games on a current console.

 

Don't think that's ever been done. I remember the Intellivision collection a while back but never one for the CV.

[jhd]

 

As usual, people who frequent AtariAge are not necessarily the target audience for this type of product. It's everyone else who doesn't know how to or want to bother with emulation (or original hardware) or isn't actively maintaining copies of the same type of software on other platforms.

 

I will defer to your knowledge of the (mass) marketplace for this product. I am just surprised that the "retro" market has not yet been completely saturated.

 

Personally, I, have only ever met a very small handful of people who are interested in these older games, and they are all sufficiently comfortable with the technology to be able to set-up an emulator (or they know someone who can help them). That is not to say that great hordes of people exist who would like to play retro-games but who are also unable to figure out how to do so on their phone, PC, vintage hardware, etc., I have just never encountered anyone like that.

[Bill Loguidice]

 

I will defer to your knowledge of the (mass) marketplace for this product. I am just surprised that the "retro" market has not yet been completely saturated.

 

Personally, I, have only ever met a very small handful of people who are interested in these older games, and they are all sufficiently comfortable with the technology to be able to set-up an emulator (or they know someone who can help them). That is not to say that great hordes of people exist who would like to play retro-games but who are also unable to figure out how to do so on their phone, PC, vintage hardware, etc., I have just never encountered anyone like that.

 

The sales numbers are pretty clear and consistent, which is why you see the same Atari Flashback and Sega Classic Console products year in and year out, and why the retailers were very specific about what they wanted in terms of these disc-based compilations. Again, there are LOTS of reasons why people buy the same stuff over and over again and even those of us who have literally dozens of other ways to play the exact same thing.

 

In any case, future products will feature fresh content (or at least content not available outside of "illegal" emulation), so that may prove a more interesting gauge of overall interest.

[Agent X]

 

I agree about being combined in a single interface. At this time, that's just not practical because of the idea of volumes and the fact that it's not digital only. The concept is not permanently tabled, though. We'll see how things go. In the best of all worlds, we'd have a single interface for ALL volumes, so you'd have hundreds of games across multiple volumes from one interface, but right now that's not happening. The best way to think of the first two volumes is that they're coincidentally related, like if one volume were a ColecoVision collection and another volume were a Midway collection. Instead, we happen to have two Atari collections that consist of Atari 2600 and arcade games (because that's the easiest to start with).

 

This shines a spotlight on yet another problem with the decision to split up the collection, as well as manner in which the collection was split up. The games in each of these packages don't share any thematic consistency.

 

If we absolutely must have this pool of games segregated into multiple "volumes", then it would have made much more sense to distinguish the collection along thematic lines, such as chronology, genre, or platform of origin. For instance, volume 1 would be the "Atari 1970s collection" and volume 2 would be the "Atari 1980s collection". Or volume 1 would be the "Atari arcade collection" and volume 2 would be the "Atari 2600 collection". As it stands now, there's no rhyme or reason why these particular games were separated the way they were. I just don't get it.*

 

This collection is coming many years after Atari's last effort, on a completely new generation of hardware. They have a fresh start with a clean slate. This would have been the perfect opportunity for them to integrate games from other platforms such as Atari 5200, Atari 7800, etc., into the mix. It looks like they're going to miss the boat on this one, and the best we can do now is cross our fingers and hope that maybe, just maybe they produce a 5200/7800 collection later. The problem is that so many of Atari's best and most popular first-party home video games were licensed from other companies--already very evident with the 2600, but maybe even more so with the 5200 and 7800. Unless they're willing to pony up licensing fees to Namco, Warner (Midway/Williams), Square Enix (Taito), LucasArts, etc., the collection of "pure" Atari games on 5200/7800 is scant, and would consist mostly of repeats of arcade/2600 games.

 

Adding 5200, 7800, Lynx, Jaguar, and computer games really could have added a lot of value to the collection, and painted an encompassing picture of Atari's history and evolution throughout the years. Sadly, the opportunity was wasted.

 

* Oh, I do get it, alright. After taking into consideration the most well-known, highly-recognized marquee games in the library, it's painfully obvious what criteria was used. I mean, we already knew this collection is just a quickie slapdash cash grab, whored out into development existence for no reason other than to milk off of the nostalgia of the unsuspecting casual market. I just wish they weren't so flagrant about it.

[Bill Loguidice]

It's fine you don't agree, "Agent X." Certainly future plans do include completely different systems and games, but volumes 1 and 2 are set the way they are for very good business reasons. If you want to call a new retro release from a company that has and will continue to do them (and in fact will be increasing their previous pace) "a quickie slapdash cash grab," that's certainly your prerogative. Your opinion and tone are both noted.

[Iwantgames:)]

I plan to get both of these, hopefully they can get some homebrews on future releases that would be cool. And some 5200, 7800, jag and lynx stuff would be sweet

[moycon]

Pre-ordered

Atari Flashback Classics: Volume 1

Atari Flashback Classics: Volume 2

ORDER PLACED

June 2, 2016

TOTAL

$34.22

Looking forward to the achievements!! Would be cool if they came out with a way to play with the classic controllers.

[Atariboy]

Bill, any chance of Battlezone making a return someday?

 

I would think Rebellion would want to keep the classic accessible to help the value of the name but might not want to be bothered to bring the arcade and VCS game to market themselves if they have bigger visions in mind for it that they're focusing on.

 

Maybe a DLC add-on?

Edited June 3, 2016 by Atariboy

[Agent X]

It's fine you don't agree, "Agent X." Certainly future plans do include completely different systems and games, but volumes 1 and 2 are set the way they are for very good business reasons. If you want to call a new retro release from a company that has and will continue to do them (and in fact will be increasing their previous pace) "a quickie slapdash cash grab," that's certainly your prerogative. Your opinion and tone are both noted.

 

It's obvious that it is a cash grab. Every time you mention the decision to hack the collection into two parts, you state that it was done in order to cater to retailers' desires. What happened to consumers' desires? What good is producing a collection like this if its development has been constantly steered by some stuffed suits sucking up to the perceived whims of retailers who don't have a damn clue what the games are all about? They don't know what the fans want, and evidently they don't care what the fans want.

 

Could you please explain how it's possible that a collection of 87 games was able to sell previously on PlayStation 2 and Xbox for the same price as a mere 50-game pack is selling for here? Why are we regressing now? Doesn't it bother you that today's gamers are getting less for their money?

 

I want to see a product like this that is driven by a desire to satisfy a wide range of Atari fans, hardcore and casual alike. I want to see a product that is developed by people who have a true passion for the industry and its rich history, who lovingly pour their hearts into the process to create something they can be proud of and would endure the test of time. I want to see a product that showcases the progress of Atari, and likewise showcases the progress of the overall industry by exceeding what previous iterations of the product have offered.

 

This product is none of those things.

[Akito01]

"Could you please explain how it's possible that a collection of 87 games was able to do sell previously on PlayStation 2 and Xbox for the same price as a mere 50-game pack is selling for here? "

 

I certainly don't want to be contentious, as I kinda rolled my eyes when I first heard was it being split into two volumes as well, but in answer to this specific question; the PS2 didn't have to deal with 1080p resolutions, online functionality or trophy/achievement systems, all of which require additional work to account for.

[moycon]

 

I want to see a product like this that is driven by a desire to satisfy a wide range of Atari fans, hardcore and casual alike. I want to see a product that is developed by people who have a true passion for the industry and its rich history, who lovingly pour their hearts into the process to create something they can be proud of and would endure the test of time. I want to see a product that showcases the progress of Atari, and likewise showcases the progress of the overall industry by exceeding what previous iterations of the product have offered.

 

This product is none of those things.

 

That product you described sounds fascinating for sure. Let us know when it'll be available.

[Agent X]

I certainly don't want to be contentious, as I kinda rolled my eyes when I first heard was it being split into two volumes as well, but in answer to this specific question; the PS2 didn't have to deal with 1080p resolutions, online functionality or trophy/achievement systems, all of which require additional work to account for.

 

This is a thoughtful answer, and probably the best "justification" that I've seen so far. That being said, I still disagree, as the addition of high-def or trophy/achievement systems kind of "comes with the territory" with generational leaps nowadays.

 

When going from PS2 to PS3, we've seen several compilation packs such as God of War, Metal Gear Solid, Devil May Cry, and others, all of which were had added HD visuals and trophies/achievements. Yet, they didn't feel the need to break the original games into smaller portions. On the contrary, they combined multiple games into a single package for an affordable price.

 

Heck, this very collection of Atari classics on PC was able to add each and every one of these features, without the need to break up the collection or increase the price. The R&D for HD, online, trophies/achievements was already done with the PC product. They just need to translate these features over to PS4 and Xbox One. This doesn't seem to be any problem for other reputable video game publishers.

 

If other PS2 games were able to make a generational leap, and successfully add both features and value simultaneously, then why does the publisher of this collection struggle to do the same with a two generational leap? Atari fans deserve better treatment than this.

[godslabrat]

I'll be honest... the price isn't an issue with me. I could even see paying a full $50 for the collection, although maybe at that price I'd want a few more titles. But splitting it across two discs is absolutely needless and would only serve to take up more shelf space.

 

Of course, since there's no Wii-U version, I'm out as a potential customer anyway. However, I think it's worth noting that I'm one guy who actually would pay more money if they did the collection right.

[Bill Loguidice]

Bill, any chance of Battlezone making a return someday?

 

I would think Rebellion would want to keep the classic accessible to help the value of the name but might not want to be bothered to bring the arcade and VCS game to market themselves if they have bigger visions in mind for it that they're focusing on.

 

Maybe a DLC add-on?

 

Sorry I can't be more specific, but yes, we are constantly evaluating stuff like that. I absolutely agree Battlezone is a great IP. Everyone else thinks so too. Whether that translates into being able to use it is a different story, though, but it's definitely on our mind.

[Bill Loguidice]

I'll be honest... the price isn't an issue with me. I could even see paying a full $50 for the collection, although maybe at that price I'd want a few more titles. But splitting it across two discs is absolutely needless and would only serve to take up more shelf space.

 

Of course, since there's no Wii-U version, I'm out as a potential customer anyway. However, I think it's worth noting that I'm one guy who actually would pay more money if they did the collection right.

 

The NX will definitely be under consideration if it performs well, but obviously there's no market left for the Wii U. I understand about not wanting the games split across multiple volumes (and having to load each volume individually), but at this time it comes down to a practical consideration, particularly since this is also disc-based releases. Hopefully the fact that consumers get 50 games in each volume for $20 or less softens some of the potential frustration with switching between volumes. Also, it's a bit more glaring now because these first two volumes are just Atari 2600 and arcade games. Future volumes will feature different stuff, so psychologically you (the general you) won't necessarily feel like "why don't they just let me play Vol. 5's games when I'm in Vol. 1?".

[Bill Loguidice]

 

It's obvious that it is a cash grab. Every time you mention the decision to hack the collection into two parts, you state that it was done in order to cater to retailers' desires. What happened to consumers' desires? What good is producing a collection like this if its development has been constantly steered by some stuffed suits sucking up to the perceived whims of retailers who don't have a damn clue what the games are all about? They don't know what the fans want, and evidently they don't care what the fans want.

 

Could you please explain how it's possible that a collection of 87 games was able to sell previously on PlayStation 2 and Xbox for the same price as a mere 50-game pack is selling for here? Why are we regressing now? Doesn't it bother you that today's gamers are getting less for their money?

 

I want to see a product like this that is driven by a desire to satisfy a wide range of Atari fans, hardcore and casual alike. I want to see a product that is developed by people who have a true passion for the industry and its rich history, who lovingly pour their hearts into the process to create something they can be proud of and would endure the test of time. I want to see a product that showcases the progress of Atari, and likewise showcases the progress of the overall industry by exceeding what previous iterations of the product have offered.

 

This product is none of those things.

 

You're either failing to understand the realities here or choosing to not understand the realities. Either way, it's not that complicated. If the retailers won't carry the product, there will be no product, period. We come up with the fully formed idea and then present it to retailers to see if they want to carry it. If they do (or if they do and want tweaks to make it something they'd feel more comfortable selling), the retail buyers agree to buy x number of units, which makes it possible for us to produce y number of units to meet that demand and any additional demand. So, like almost every other product, retailer input is critically important here. Obviously the hardcore Atari fans make up a portion of the audience for this type of product, but it's not the only audience. If $20 or less for 50 games is somehow an affront to hardcore Atari fans, then perhaps said fans can't ever be satisfied by a mainstream product.

 

Also, considering we have something like five months to develop the product and bring it to market, I think we might be cut just a little slack that the first two products consist of games that have been collected before. Again, it's not intended as the only volumes we bring out, but you've got to start somewhere.

 

Anyway, that's the last I'll say on this particular aspect of the subject. You can be offended, feel it's a rip off, feel like we don't have gamer interests in mind, etc. I'm part of it and telling you that none of that is true, which you can take or leave. I'm here because I care about the community, I care about the product, etc. Normally, you'd just be pissing in the wind here, just bitching with no context. I'm giving you rare context here, something I probably shouldn't even be doing, but I do because when I'm on the other side I love to know the "why" of things.

 

Yes, it's a business. Yes, they want to make money like every business. Yes, there are many other ways of presenting an offering like this, but no, none of those other options were practical at this time. You don't have to be happy with what is being offered here - and the simple solution to that is just don't buy it - but hopefully you can understand the difference between your lovely, idyllic vision, and the realities of business.

[cimerians]

Now all we need is an Activision Anthology 2

[StormSurge]

I have the Atari Anthology which I play on my 360, I have emulators & I have original hardware. I'm still picking these up, solely for the achievements. Bill, let us know when you can "leak" the list.

 

I can't wait to see what's next! (I'll echo what others have said about controller adapters. Paddle games will be a struggle)

[Flojomojo]

Future volumes will feature different stuff, so psychologically you (the general you) won't necessarily feel like "why don't they just let me play Vol. 5's games when I'm in Vol. 1?".

Remember the Game Room on XB360? It was too expensive, too late, but at least it had everything in one place. If the XB/PS frameworks allow you to build a hub world for launching content from other purchases, please consider it for the future.

 

Zen Pinball on PS4 does this, albeit in a super-clunky way -- you need to "import" prior purchases, and to get them on PS4, you need to buy them for PS3 or Vita or they won't be forward-compatible. And getting the individual purchases on Vita needs to happen via manually installed updates.

 

You know what? Separate volumes is probably OK. Sigh.

[Flojomojo]

Now all we need is an Activision Anthology 2

I would buy that if it included all the Imagic games, as well as Intellivision and Colecovision versions, and achievements with patches. 1980s tunes would be OK too, but not strictly required.

[cimerians]

I would buy that if it included all the Imagic games, as well as Intellivision and Colecovision versions, and achievements with patches. 1980s tunes would be OK too, but not strictly required.

 

Yeah, I think I can go without Come on Eileen Or maybe change it with different songs. Centerfold and Down Under? lol

 

Would be really cool to have some Imagic games and the CV as well. The CV would as usual probably not include any Nintendo stuff even though it was known for Donkey Kong. Bugs me.

[Flojomojo]

 

Yeah, I think I can go without Come on Eileen Or maybe change it with different songs. Centerfold and Down Under? lol

 

I'm not sure exactly when it happened, but at some point when playing those games to the strains of "We're Not Gonna Take It" and "Mexican Radio," a switch flipped in my brain from "wow, I feel like I a kid when I play these games" to "GOD I'M OLD for liking these silly dinosaur games and dorky songs."

[Bill Loguidice]

I have the Atari Anthology which I play on my 360, I have emulators & I have original hardware. I'm still picking these up, solely for the achievements. Bill, let us know when you can "leak" the list.

 

I can't wait to see what's next! (I'll echo what others have said about controller adapters. Paddle games will be a struggle)

 

The lists were posted on the Amazon listing, but I also posted the lists here, which should be easier to parse: http://armchairarcade.com/perspectives/2016/06/03/news-atari-flashback-classics-volume-1-volume-2-playstation-4-ps4-xbox-one/

Edited June 3, 2016 by Bill Loguidice

[StormSurge]

 

The lists were posted on the Amazon listing, but I also posted the lists here, which should be easier to parse: http://armchairarcade.com/perspectives/2016/06/03/news-atari-flashback-classics-volume-1-volume-2-playstation-4-ps4-xbox-one/

 

Not the games, the list of achievements.