Atari CX-40 vs. Competition Pro

[+GoldLeader]

I think fundamentally you may be all saying the same thing, but with minor differences...At times these differences are almost argued rather than debated...But I can't disagree with any of you...You all make very good points.

 

I'd definitely say this is a "Preference" topic which makes it an "Emotional" topic and an "Opinion" topic. One of those things that gets glossed over all the time on the internet is that opinions can be wrong. Facts can be wrong. If it's an opinion, i.e. My Opinion, it can't be wrong (for me) It can only be wrong (for you)...Unless of course Invasion of the Body Snatchers was real and aliens are now putting up fake opinions for me or you on the internet ...

 

[AW127]

Okay, seems like nearly all agruments shared on this. I don`t go into your sentence "the CX-40 had a better form-factor" now *lol*. It`s just funny. I give newbies to both sticks the advice, to buy both, then compare both in playing with both and then it`s clear anyway, which joystick they will use in the future. The Competition Pro. Believe me, its the much better stick.

 

And when people which dont know the Competition Pro`s, would ask me "which is the best model", then from my experience with all the different models, i would recommend the "Competition Pro Star". He has automatic Autorire, a triangle-rapidfire-button, a slow-motion triangle button (i never used this by the way) and an automatic slow-motion function. Then it has a very precise steering and a little bit stronger spring-pressure which centers the stick automatically. I personally like this very much.

 

The most stable "Competition Pro" in my experience, is the "Competition Pro Extra", which had a rubber instead of a spring surrounding the shaft. The back-pressure when the user steers is less than with the "Competition Pro Star" and this stick is really really really hard to break. Maybe when the user plays "Decathlon" or "Track & Fields" every day, but apart from that this really stick works for lot of years without the need to change any parts.

 

Now finally i have a funny story to tell about the Quikshot II joystick. I know, that this is not the thread-title, but its only short story. When i was about 15 years old, which was 1987 by the way, i and two friends visited the big "CONRAD" store here in Bavaria. They had everything concerning computers, consoles and other electronical things back in the days. So we drived with train to the city where this shop was and visited the big shop for the whole day. There are really much things to look and this needs time and we had time on this day. Then we came to the computer-division and everybody looked at different things. I looked at some C64`s, friend of me on joysticks and other friend monitors or something like that, i can not exactly remember. Later we all looked at the big selection of joysticks and from alot models they had a exhibition-piece so that people can try it. There were also two Quickshot II sticks as exhibit. I and one of my friends then go away to another division, because at that day we dont needed a new joystick, but my other friend stayed at the joysticks. About 10 minutes later, the friend which stayed by the sticks came to me and whispered "shit" and he said, we should go near to the joysticks and look what happened. Then we did this and we saw the two Quickshot II exhibibition-pieces and that the shaft of them looked in different directions but was not centered. But this sticks normally auto-centers the shaft. I asked my friend "what have you done?" and he said "i only played a little bit with this sticks but they break. They was so sensitive". Then we quickly leaved the joystick-division in this shop. This was our experience with the Quickshot II joystick. But later i had two by myself and they survived a little bit longer than the two in the shop. This was often a problem with Quickshot sticks. They had very good form-factor and feels good in the hand, but they was absolutly not stable. Against the Quickshot II sticks, even the CX-40 was a stable stick.

[Andromeda Stardust]

^^Funny you mention the quickshot. I have an NES quickshot and an Atari quickshot. The NES quickshot and Atari quickshot look the same on the outside except for the colors. But upon closer examination, the Atari quickshot has craptastic leaf switches inside it that barely work and the NES quickshot has snappy spring-loaded microswitches and excellent feel to it.

 

I briefly considered doing a conversion of the NES joystick to operate as an Atari 7800 mode joystick. Only problem is keeping the functionality of the turbo circuit would be difficult to incorporate due to the fact the 7800 buttons don't use a common ground.

[Jinks]

Well my joystick is still stiff in the morning after 39 years of abuse but it gets real limp after play time..

See this is what happens when RT does not add to the topic...

Actually RT woulda came up with something worse... along the lines of alien donkey dicks on leap year getting brittle after a harvest moon VS. nacho eating werewolves on the fourteenth sunday before chanukah. Who would win?

[AW127]

Well my joystick is still stiff in the morning after 39 years of abuse but it gets real limp after play time..

Maybe you need a new spring that centers your stick or do it like the Competition Pro Extra and use a rubber surrounding the stick.

[AW127]

^^Funny you mention the quickshot. I have an NES quickshot and an Atari quickshot. The NES quickshot and Atari quickshot look the same on the outside except for the colors. But upon closer examination, the Atari quickshot has craptastic leaf switches inside it that barely work and the NES quickshot has snappy spring-loaded microswitches and excellent feel to it.

Some of the Quickshot-Joysticks are not bad and they really have a wide range of models, especially with 9pin-connector. But also for SNES, Megadrive and like you wrote for NES exist some and these are selled under the brand Quickshot and also under TecnoPlus. I like some of them, but the most must be handled with care. I would not recommend to play fast action- or sport-games like "Speedball 2" on the Amiga or Atari-ST with a Quickshot, because then i would have fear, it could break.

 

I briefly considered doing a conversion of the NES joystick to operate as an Atari 7800 mode joystick. Only problem is keeping the functionality of the turbo circuit would be difficult to incorporate due to the fact the 7800 buttons don't use a common ground.

I am a big fan of adapters that allows connecting joysticks or gamepads from one system to another. Especially when these adapters than have switchable button-layouts. The Raphnet shop has a very good SNES-to-9PIN adapter, but sadly i don`t see something like a NES-to-9Pin adapter there. And also the Atari7800 sticks should have two different wired-up buttons which the SNES-to-9Pin adapter don`t has. But here i found an interesting thread on this subject:

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/195781-playing-a-5200-with-a-nes-controller-wirelessly/?hl=%20camerica%20%20freedom%20%20stick&do=findComment&comment=2499224

 

One question comes to my mind here. I have here a 9Pin TecnoPlus gamepad which belongs to the Amiga and which has two different buttons. Will both buttons on the Atari7800 work with such a gamepad or is the second Atari7800 button different to the second Amiga button. I also don`t know this for the Master-System, this would also interest me. Somebody knows this here or has these hardware to test this at home?

[Andromeda Stardust]

Some of the Quickshot-Joysticks are not bad and they really have a wide range of models, especially with 9pin-connector. But also for SNES, Megadrive and like you wrote for NES exist some and these are selled under the brand Quickshot and also under TecnoPlus. I like some of them, but the most must be handled with care. I would not recommend to play fast action- or sport-games like "Speedball 2" on the Amiga or Atari-ST with a Quickshot, because then i would have fear, it could break.

 

 

I am a big fan of adapters that allows connecting joysticks or gamepads from one system to another. Especially when these adapters than have switchable button-layouts. The Raphnet shop has a very good SNES-to-9PIN adapter, but sadly i don`t see something like a NES-to-9Pin adapter there. And also the Atari7800 sticks should have two different wired-up buttons which the SNES-to-9Pin adapter don`t has. But here i found an interesting thread on this subject:

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/195781-playing-a-5200-with-a-nes-controller-wirelessly/?hl=%20camerica%20%20freedom%20%20stick&do=findComment&comment=2499224

 

One question comes to my mind here. I have here a 9Pin TecnoPlus gamepad which belongs to the Amiga and which has two different buttons. Will both buttons on the Atari7800 work with such a gamepad or is the second Atari7800 button different to the second Amiga button. I also don`t know this for the Master-System, this would also interest me. Somebody knows this here or has these hardware to test this at home?

Using NES controller with an SNES-to-9pin adapter would not be hard. The NES controller can be converted to SNES pinout using a simple adapter fabricated from extension cables. Assuming the adapter is meant for Genesis 9pin standard, the controller will map the SNES buttons to Genesis buttons.

 

If the diamond on the SNES controller maps

[Y][A]

 

to Genesis

[A][C]

 

then using an SNES-NES patch cable with the adapter wouldmap NES to SNES [Y] and NES [A] to SNES . This would match the button on the Genesis controller, which translates to FIRE on the Atari.

 

So using a standard NES controller through patch cord to a SNES to Genesis adapter for play on an Atari VCS would likely work.

 

= = = = = = = =

 

But modding the NES Quickshot for Atari VCS standard would be easier than this convoluted daisy chain of adapters. One could even wire the relavent CD4021 inputs to a 9pin header to make the NES stick natively compatible with Atari without cutting the NES cord. Just don't connect to two consoles simultaneously. That would be really bad to cross voltage supplies!

[AW127]

Using NES controller with an SNES-to-9pin adapter would not be hard. The NES controller can be converted to SNES pinout using a simple adapter fabricated from extension cables. Assuming the adapter is meant for Genesis 9pin standard, the controller will map the SNES buttons to Genesis buttons.

 

If the diamond on the SNES controller maps

[Y][A]

 

to Genesis

[A][C]

 

then using an SNES-NES patch cable with the adapter wouldmap NES to SNES [Y] and NES [A] to SNES . This would match the button on the Genesis controller, which translates to FIRE on the Atari.

 

So using a standard NES controller through patch cord to a SNES to Genesis adapter for play on an Atari VCS would likely work.

Then this would be a good solution for you. This SNES-to-9Pin adapter is meant for normal 9pin systems (Atari/C64/Amiga) and so on, not for the Mega-Drive. Look here:

 

http://www.raphnet-tech.com/products/snes_to_db9/index.php

 

You can connect to Mega-Drive also, but i think it`s not healthy either for the console and also not for the adapter, because there is this "5 Volt on a certain pin" difference between Megadrive 9Pin and other 9Pin wiring. A C64 can be damaged (the CIA) by a Megadrive controller and the controller sometimes dies too in such a case.

 

And i was wrong this SNES-to-9Pin adapter HAS a Fire-2 function. When NES to SNES is easy to realize, like you wrote, then this could work for your Atari7800, i think.

 

Raphnet also has a "SNES-to-Megadrive" and "SNES-to-NES" adapter by the way. But until now sadly no "NES-to-SNES", like i said. Aaaah all this nice adapters.

Edited August 2, 2016 by AW127

[Andromeda Stardust]

Then this would be a good solution for you. This SNES-to-9Pin adapter is meant for normal 9pin systems (Atari/C64/Amiga) and so on, not for the Mega-Drive. Look here:

 

http://www.raphnet-tech.com/products/snes_to_db9/index.php

 

You can connect to Mega-Drive also, but i think it`s not healthy either for the console and also not for the adapter, because there is this "5 Volt on a certain pin" difference between Megadrive 9Pin and other 9Pin wiring. A C64 can be damaged (the CIA) by a Megadrive controller and the controller sometimes dies too in such a case.

 

And i was wrong this SNES-to-9Pin adapter HAS a Fire-2 function. When NES to SNES is easy to realize, like you wrote, then this could work for your Atari7800, i think.

 

Raphnet also has a "SNES-to-Megadrive" and "SNES-to-NES" adapter by the way. But until now sadly no "NES-to-SNES", like i said. Aaaah all this nice adapters.

Dude, NES and SNES use the same standard. Just get two retrobit extension cables and splice them together. NES A = SNES B and NES B = SNES Y. SNES Y, A, L, and R do not function on an NES as they are beyond the 8-bits normally requested by an NES. NES controllers may have compatibility issues with SNES games because there is no input on an NES controller for A, Y, L, or R buttons. Also some games will not allow the controller to run at all because the upper four bits send by an SNES controller are control bits that identify the controller type to the SNES. If these last four bits are not correct, some SNES games display a "no controller" message.

 

Also I was not aware whether the SNES adapter used Atari or Sega standard regarding VCC pin as I did not click the link. I only assumed it was for Genesis.

[hizzy]

I got 3 comp pros on the way! I also have a bunch of different switches. I am curious to see what switches are best!

[AW127]

Also I was not aware whether the SNES adapter used Atari or Sega standard regarding VCC pin as I did not click the link. I only assumed it was for Genesis.

I gave the link, because i thought, it could be a solution for your NES-to-9Pin problem. When its to much work to click the link, no problem.

[adamchevy]

I have always liked the feel of the joystick that comes with the heavy sixer consoles. The later CX-40 feels to stiff and breakable to me.

[hizzy]

I just got two comp pros in the mail (I'm expecting another two this week!), and I have to say that I love this joystick! It's way different than the CX-40. The two feel so different. I still like the CX-40. It has a smaller footprint, and great ergonomics. It's a stick with a button that fits perfectly into the hand. I find it a responsive stick, but I've had a number of them break on me. The issue for me is the plastic stick withing the rubber boot. That has always been the thing that breaks in my stick. I am curious to try a gold best electronics CX-40, but I've never had a problem with the "domes" on the circuit board. The plastic on the stick always breaks. If someone could make a new plastic stick that could last, then the CX-40 would be really something. When it works, I love the CX-40. Now, on to the Comp Pro...

 

Wow! The Comp Pro is well made, and well designed. It fits more comfortably in my hand than the Wico. There are different versions on the Comp Pro, and they all feel different. Before buying, do your homework to figure out which one you prefer. There is an all leaf comp pro, one with leaf buttons and micro switch joystick, one all micro switch. I have the leaf button/micro switch joystick model, and I'm expecting others soon.

 

Right away, I like the leaf buttons on the Comp Pro better than the Wico. The design is totally different, and I think it leads to greater sensitivity. I don't find the micro switches loud and all, and the handling is EXCELLENT. The level of control & accuracy is spot on. The "feel" of the stick is quite good. It's bigger than a CX-40, but smaller than a Wico. It's a good compromise. Repairing the stick is a breeze. You can change the micro switches very easily. Swapping out switches also lets you adjust the stick to your preferences. There are super quiet switches, ultra-sensitive switches. It feels like the Comp Pro is infinitely customizable. It`s the next best thing to owning an arcade stick. The main thing is: do your homework. Get familiar with the variety of Comp Pros out there, so as to find the model best suited to you. Switches/leaf. Rubber boot/spring. Vintage/recent. They're all different.

[NinjaWarrior]

My FB2, CX-40 and my modded NES 2600/7800 Controller

[Andromeda Stardust]

My FB2, CX-40 and my modded NES 2600/7800 Controller

Am I supposed to see pics?

[NinjaWarrior]

Why?? Do you wanrt to see a pic?

[chavert]

The best of the best: the original cx-40

[Andromeda Stardust]

The best of the best: the original cx-40

Even the "best" can use improvement now and then!

[chavert]

Miss the atari logo .

[Polybius]

I chose "other" , the Cx-40 is ok, but a little stiff and prone to breakage. I have quite several Cx-40s, (1 pair of '77 launch editions, with the better springs and buttons, 2 modern ones from a FB2, 2 1980, 2 1986) Besides the launch editions, there doesn't seem to a difference with them.

 

Wico's Command Control are a little better control wise, not by much. more durable, though. Coleco Gemini Paddle-Troller, not bad, paddle could be better. Spectravideo Quickshot, Looks cool, but mine broke rather quickly, the up contact stopped working. feels weird in the hand, the stick is bigger than the base, hard to use.

 

My personal Favorite, 500XJ Epyx from Konix. Clicky, precise, fits in the hand nicely, button is very responsive, its by far the best 2600 compatible controller I have used , I picked up a pair 13 years ago at the Agape Help House Thrift Store for $1.00 . I still use them to this day.

(Image is not mine)

[Polybius]

I have always liked the feel of the joystick that comes with the heavy sixer consoles. The later CX-40 feels to stiff and breakable to me.

Agreed, the heavy 6er version is way better than the later, they are more responsive, the fire button has a better tactile feel, not mushy like the later cx-40.

[AW127]

Even the "best" can use improvement now and then!

 

 

That`s a big children (the junior) when you compare it to the original CX40.

[tbb033]

The only Competition Pro I really know of was a NES pad sort of rounded like a Genesis pad (and of course added 3rd party standard turbo). I assume CX-40 is the standard 2600 stick? I'd go with that probably. It's got it's problems but it's a classic.

 

Edited November 20, 2017 by tbb033

[AW127]

The only Competition Pro I really know of was a NES pad...

 

I suppose you are not from Europe? Because here the Competitions was very famous in the second half of the 80`s. Nearly everybody knows them here. But i noticed this in different retro-forums now, that the Competition Pro`s were not so famous in other parts of the world than they was in the european countries.

 

Here is a good overview: https://www.c64-wiki.de/wiki/Competition_Pro

It`s in german, but here it is translated: https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=de&sl=de&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.c64-wiki.de%2Fwiki%2FCompetition_Pro

[zaneiken]

I just bought a bunch of Suzo "The Arcade" joysticks. Very happy with them.