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SpartaDOS X 4.48


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#201 drac030 OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Mar 7, 2017 7:43 AM

@__The_Doctor__: as FJC said, it would be best if you provide a step-by-step example how to reproduce the issue. What program you run?

And if it occurs while doing normal DIR from the CP, then something is seriously screwed. You can try reflashing the SDX (maybe the flash got bad, it happens).

If this does not help, try starting with the default configuration and see if the issue is still there. In any case, try to find out what causes this behaviour, because it is definitely not normal and I do not observe it either.

#202 _The Doctor__ OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Mar 7, 2017 10:57 PM

well I reflashed... and it is the same ....   set up your copy to con 64 and do a dir:*.* /w and see what happens..... some segment loaded games with a title screen will flash blue in between now.... I am using NTSC machines.. after re reading the release notes it says this was on 4.49b the change was made... Like I said I love all the bug fixes it is more stable as I have found but the gr.0 call is just not worth it... I would rather the software I am using or I myself change the mode.... otherwise I would prefer that sparta return me to whatever mode I was using before sparta was called... if I am in a mode I don't want sparta taking me to gr.0 I want to stay in whatever mode I am in...  If it were subtle I would not have noticed...it does not happen in 4.48 or 4.47 .. if I set my screen color to white on a black background or black on a white black background I don't want it flashing light blue either...

 

I will use a different cartridge and re flash it I am using super sparta carts by the way on real hardware... not an emulator...

 

heck I poke 82,0 to get more on the line and it clears the screen and resets the margin....

 

I am starting to believe the mantra... if it ain't broke don't 'fix' it...

 

I will reflash with the default included config.sys changing nothing using a fresh cartridge do a manual con 64  followed by a poke 82,0 and perform dir car:*.* and see what happens


Edited by _The Doctor__, Tue Mar 7, 2017 11:33 PM.


#203 _The Doctor__ OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 8, 2017 12:25 AM

dowloaded 4.49b fresh from the server, flashed a different super sparta cart... did not touch the environment or config.sys so as to use default set up....

manual device con64.sys loaded

manual con 64

same thing happens with poke 82,0   light blue flash screen cleared and margin not set... due to gr.0 call of sparta

dir         directory prints and on return right as prompt appears screen clears.....

 

these problems do not occur with the other sparta images... 4.47 is fine... 4.48 is fine... 4.49b fail


Edited by _The Doctor__, Wed Mar 8, 2017 1:08 AM.


#204 Kyle22 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 8, 2017 2:13 AM

I run 4.49b and when and only when I am in 64 col. mode, the screen does clear after a poke 82 0.

 

Did 4.48 work without clearing the screen in 64 col. mode?

 

Will the CON64.SYS driver from 4.48 work with 4.49b?



#205 _The Doctor__ OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 8, 2017 3:17 AM

it all works fine in the other versions like I was saying... just 4.49b has the odd clearing behaviors and blue flashes. 

I used superspartaxcart(both versions), maxflash1 and maxflash8 versions to verify the older versions work as expected...

it looks like the problem is in 4.49b's cp and and possibly x commands.... they way it manifests itself... the two work in tandem....

 

I will now do the custom configs for 80 columns on them all again and see what happens as well. I don't use the standard blue...  I use different colors and zero the margins on all my disks... it helps to keep from mixing things up and looks nice... I know when I have the correct disk by the color I see


Edited by _The Doctor__, Wed Mar 8, 2017 3:50 AM.


#206 a8isa1 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 8, 2017 6:36 PM

@__The_Doctor__: as FJC said, it would be best if you provide a step-by-step example how to reproduce the issue. What program you run?

And if it occurs while doing normal DIR from the CP, then something is seriously screwed. You can try reflashing the SDX (maybe the flash got bad, it happens).

If this does not help, try starting with the default configuration and see if the issue is still there. In any case, try to find out what causes this behaviour, because it is definitely not normal and I do not observe it either.

I can confirm this behavior, in Altirra and on a real 800XL.   Any command I issue or any program I run the screen clears when the task is done. This in 64 column mode.  Also happens with old CON80.SYS driver but I guess that one is obsolete. 

 

On my 800XL I can run SDX 4.49 only with an Atarimax 8mbit cartridge.  In Altirra I've also tried the SIDE2 image.  Same behavior.

 

There is only one exception that I've noticed.  The TYPE command works fine.

 

[edit]

That is of course 4.49b, the current beta


Edited by a8isa1, Wed Mar 8, 2017 7:30 PM.


#207 Stephen OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 8, 2017 6:42 PM

4.49 works perfectly fine with RC-GR*.sys being used for 80 col output.  I did not try CON 64.  I also did not have time to flash to the latest 4.49b.



#208 DrVenkman OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 8, 2017 7:39 PM

I can confirm this behavior, in Altirra and on a real 800XL.   Any command I issue or any program I run the screen clears when the task is done. This in 64 column mode.  Also happens with old CON80.SYS driver but I guess that one is obsolete. 

 

On my 800XL I can run SDX 4.49 only with an Atarimax 8mbit cartridge.  In Altirra I've also tried the SIDE2 image.  Same behavior.

 

There is only one exception that I've noticed.  The TYPE command works fine.

 

[edit]

That is of course 4.49b, the current beta

 

 

4.49 works perfectly fine with RC-GR*.sys being used for 80 col output.  I did not try CON 64.  I also did not have time to flash to the latest 4.49b.

 

This is a fascinating topic. My SDX usage is very, very basic - so much so that I was unaware of the 64-column functionality at all. Just for grins I booted up to SDX 4.49b command prompt in Altirra (using the SDX rom flashed to a virtual U1MB, which mirrors my main setup on real hardware). I manually loaded CON64.SYS, switched to 64-column mode, then did a simple D1:DIR command to read a floppy directory. The directory loaded and flowed down the screen, then the screen cleared itself. This is kind of ... impractical, at least for displaying the directory of the disk you just read. :) 

 

Further, I then verified that the same behavior occurs on real hardware with my 800XL booting to SDX from my U1MB. I did not check to see how the SIDE2 copy of SDX behaves on my hardware. 



#209 Kyle22 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 8, 2017 8:42 PM

Now I see it.  It cleared the screen for me on real hardware.  This is a very real bug.

 

Edit: it's especially bad to clear after a DIR command.


Edited by Kyle22, Wed Mar 8, 2017 8:45 PM.


#210 drac030 OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Mar 9, 2017 7:43 AM

Yes, this is a bug. Funny that it has escaped everyone's notice for so long. It does not occur with 40-column display and does not occur with 80-collumn drivers.

The 64-column driver has not changed since 2014, so the problem is probably in the 4.49b command processor. I will have to take a look at the code.

Thanks for the report, anyway. There is finally some substance for a new beta version :)

As for the sentence "if it ain't broke, don't fix it": never ever is anything fixed in SDX when it really works. The fixes are applied when a problem is detected. Sometimes apparently new problems arise, but that is why beta releases are for: so that beta testers catch such errors. :)

#211 Stephen OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Mar 9, 2017 9:09 AM

Yes, this is a bug. Funny that it has escaped everyone's notice for so long. It does not occur with 40-column display and does not occur with 80-collumn drivers.

The 64-column driver has not changed since 2014, so the problem is probably in the 4.49b command processor. I will have to take a look at the code.

Thanks for the report, anyway. There is finally some substance for a new beta version :)

As for the sentence "if it ain't broke, don't fix it": never ever is anything fixed in SDX when it really works. The fixes are applied when a problem is detected. Sometimes apparently new problems arise, but that is why beta releases are for: so that beta testers catch such errors. :)

That would explain why I never noticed it.  I am only ever in 40 or 80 column mode.  I didn't even know 64 col was still supported until this topic came up.



#212 fujidude OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Mar 9, 2017 9:31 AM

That would explain why I never noticed it.  I am only ever in 40 or 80 column mode.  I didn't even know 64 col was still supported until this topic came up.

 

Yeah, I only ever use 40 or 80 as well.  Perhaps if I had real hardware instead of emulation, and was not able to get a VBXE rigged up, then I would have a reason to try 64 column.



#213 DrVenkman OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Mar 9, 2017 8:01 PM

So ... not to beat this 64 column thing into the ground, but I find it works pretty well on my real hardware and I like it now that I know it's there. Now having said that, is there any reason the CON64.SYS driver is included in 4.49b ROM for the U1MB but *not* included for the 4.49b ROM for the SIDE2 cart? 



#214 _The Doctor__ OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Mar 9, 2017 11:38 PM

they move stuff from time to time to the utility disk making it so you have to use the the sdx imager utility and put the stuff you want in the 'user area' of a rom image this is where you can put custom configs and environment etc.. then copy that resulting file alongside your favorite flasher and make your cartridge or ultimate / side use...

 

Many people are surprised to find all the things Sparta has available to it..  When an 8 bit friend comes around these parts they almost always become a Sparta user... the 64 column mode is one of the selling points.... but I have been Sparta entrenched since it first came about....  I still use OS A+, DOS XL, and Sparta as my disk os, sometimes MyDOS and lately a bit of REALDOS.... SPARTAX is always in the slot and ready to go.....   I couldn't have imagined running a BBS without sparta batch and configs selection all those years ago... such a convenience all set up and ready to go... 

 

I may have another difficulty now, accessing the hard drive on the S-100 through the critical connection and sparta x..... the hard drive appears as pseudo Atari disk but I will have to test further before I certain what is going on.


Edited by _The Doctor__, Thu Mar 9, 2017 11:39 PM.


#215 Kyle22 OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Mar 10, 2017 12:45 AM

Doc, did you get Critical Connection running?  Inquiring minds want to know. :)



#216 DrVenkman OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Mar 10, 2017 7:24 AM

they move stuff from time to time to the utility disk making it so you have to use the the sdx imager utility and put the stuff you want in the 'user area' of a rom image this is where you can put custom configs and environment etc.. then copy that resulting file alongside your favorite flasher and make your cartridge or ultimate / side use...

 

Okay, I get that. My question though is two-fold: why is the U1MB version of 4.49b different than the SIDE2 version? And second, where is the CON64.SYS driver on the Toolkit? I downloaded the current Toolkit Beta .atr and can't find it.

 

EDIT: disregard the second part; found it on the Toolkit Beta disk. The first part of my question stands though. 


Edited by DrVenkman, Fri Mar 10, 2017 8:07 AM.


#217 _The Doctor__ OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Mar 10, 2017 10:49 AM

Critical connection has always run albeit the cord is flakey and has to be held a certain way.... I use modified OS A+ for floppy drive access of which I finally have one drive working that needs complete alignment but does read and is bad news if it writes!....  original hard drive is still dead but a replacement drive is working.... I was using Sparta but now it's acting strange now and since I can't be sure what's going on it's best not to cause any more synchronization errors....

 

back to the thread...

 

as I understand it, there are slight differences between each of the hardware choices available,  a custom scheme with appropriate configs etc etc is made for each one...

The end user just picks, flashes/saves, and is good to go.



#218 Kyle22 OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Mar 10, 2017 8:18 PM

The main thing is that you choose an SDX version that is compatible with your hardware.  Banking address and ROM size are the main factors.



#219 DrVenkman OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Mar 10, 2017 8:41 PM

The main thing is that you choose an SDX version that is compatible with your hardware.  Banking address and ROM size are the main factors.

 

Yes, I understand that. I currently have 4.49b installed on both my U1MB and my SIDE2 cart. I was experimenting with the CON64.SYS driver to verify the screen clearing bug when I realized that CON64.SYS is not included in the default SIDE2 SDX rom but it *IS* included in the default U1MB rom. That's what prompted my question.



#220 Kyle22 OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Mar 10, 2017 8:45 PM

I always need to add stuff to the cart, and when I run out of space, I start deleting man files. They are fine on the hard drive.

#221 drac030 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Mar 11, 2017 10:05 AM

The reason why stuff is getting shifted to the Toolkit is of course the limited space on CAR:. The basic version is still the SDX128, all others are variations of it. SIDE2 had to have the FDISK etc. included, that is why CON64.SYS had to give way. You can still load it from the hdd via custom CONFIG.SYS.

#222 DrVenkman OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Mar 11, 2017 10:52 AM

The reason why stuff is getting shifted to the Toolkit is of course the limited space on CAR:. The basic version is still the SDX128, all others are variations of it. SIDE2 had to have the FDISK etc. included, that is why CON64.SYS had to give way. You can still load it from the hdd via custom CONFIG.SYS.

 

Thanks, that makes perfect sense. And in fact, that's what I figured out how to do yesterday. Working great on my 800XL. Now when that little screen-clearing bug in 4.49b is fixed, I'll be in a position to know how to get the 64-column display working correctly with my SIDE2 cart. :)


Edited by DrVenkman, Sat Mar 11, 2017 10:52 AM.


#223 drac030 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Mar 11, 2017 11:17 AM

I am a bit surprised, though, that people prefer the 64-column mode over the 80-column one (RC_GR8.SYS+CON.SYS). That is true that the 64-column one has a more pretty and more readable font, but with SVideo or Sophia the video output should be sharp enough to make the 80-column GR.8 stuff readable, and on the other hand the 80-column mode is much faster than the 64-column one.

Of course the best choice is the hardware 80-column mode supported by the VBXE (S_VBXE.SYS+CON.SYS).

#224 _The Doctor__ OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Mar 11, 2017 6:44 PM

I choose con 64 as a starting point since I may be using the Atari on any number of displays.... it allows me to see what I am doing no matter what someone puts in front of me.. I switch to 80 if the monitor has a decent dot pitch... you don't even need luma chroma (svid) if the display is what in the USA was called a monitor class television with a good dot pitch and decent convergance.... software 80 was perfectly readable on those... a nice NEC composite yielded the same excellent results even, no need to switch cords 80 was legible and artifacting still worked on games... a feat not easy for most monitors to do.... there was a thread about things you wish you hadn't gotten rid of..... there were three.. The NEC monitor was one, the RCA monitor/television was another, and last but not least was a stereo monitor class television from radio shack that had a SHARP cathode ray tube in it.. I loved it.... 80 columns easy to read and could still play Star Fleet from interstel with the ship still being proper color...   But that is of course my going off on a tangent again....

 

The 64 column display with zero margin is my goto for all around simplicity and multipurpose game machine, 80 columns is on my dedicated LCA display machine. I never had low quality monitors till the current days... The first time I saw dot crawl moire patterns I made it a mission to never have crappy large dot pitch monitors ever... todays LCD's are a crap shoot you never know what they will do... and most people it would seem never understood dot pitch cause they have a zillion crappy ones out there... No one ever wanted to go back to a crappy commodore monitor after seeing the NEC or the Sharp that was in use when they visited.. They always bought one or the other within 6 months to a year. They even made the 130XE display look good.


Edited by _The Doctor__, Sat Mar 11, 2017 6:49 PM.


#225 w1k OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Mar 20, 2017 8:15 AM

ehm, i forgot.. i need change ROM file (edit config.sys).. which util i can use?






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