Jump to content

Photo

Open Sesame! vs. Apples and Dolls vs. I want my Mommy

Zimag Emag Vidco CCE

40 replies to this topic

#26 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

Rom Hunter

    VCS Games Archivist

  • 8,976 posts
  • Obtainer of Rare Antiquities

Posted Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:38 AM

So are we thinking that some of those missing Zimag part numbers might go to Mysterious Thief and Fire Spinner?

 

Yes, I'm almost certain of that.

8)



#27 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

Rom Hunter

    VCS Games Archivist

  • 8,976 posts
  • Obtainer of Rare Antiquities

Posted Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:41 AM

From the DP Psychopedia:

 
The Zimag library also consists only of Bit Corp titles with different game names.
Since the game Open Sesame has a sampled voice at the beginning in the PAL version, while its NTSC counterpart "I want my mommy" does not, it appears that the Bit Corp games are the originals, and that Zimag was just another distributor for Bit Corp.
It seems very unlikely that enough space could be found in a 4K game to add voice for the PAL conversion, if the NTSC was the original. 
Therefore, it looks like the Zimag/Emag/Vidco prototypes of Pizza Chef, Mysterious Thief and Fire Spinner are actually Bit Corp games that never got released under the Bit Corp label.
Instead they later were released them under the CCE label in Brazil.

Only IMO it's the other way around: Puzzy/Bitcorp took out the complete second level and the animated bosses of the ZiMAG/Emag/Vidco versions, added an opening screen with speech and replaced the bosses with one static 'boss'.

The Home Vision versions look closest connected to the ZiMAG versions.
 
8)
 

Edited by Rom Hunter, Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:57 AM.


#28 Tempest OFFLINE  

Tempest

    Fallen Moderator

  • 27,124 posts
  • Location:Dark Places

Posted Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:48 AM

Too bad we don't know any of the programmers for these games.  Even if we could get a hold of only one, they could probably sort this whole mess out.   



#29 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

Rom Hunter

    VCS Games Archivist

  • 8,976 posts
  • Obtainer of Rare Antiquities

Posted Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:54 AM

Too bad we don't know any of the programmers for these games.  Even if we could get a hold of only one, they could probably sort this whole mess out.   

IMO checking and comparing the code of the different versions is the only way to deal with this.

 

The ZiMAG/Emag/Vidco versions look like the most 'finished' (most genuine) ones to me.

 

8)


Edited by Rom Hunter, Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:56 AM.


#30 Supergun OFFLINE  

Supergun

    Stargunner

  • 1,099 posts
  • Location:Orlando, Florida

Posted Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:01 PM

Just caught up on this thread. Excellent research & deductive reasoning at work here. I really enjoy it when information is uncovered simply by analyzing the evidence. Especially if & when product numbers are involved! Thanks!

#31 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

Rom Hunter

    VCS Games Archivist

  • 8,976 posts
  • Obtainer of Rare Antiquities

Posted Fri Jul 21, 2017 1:09 AM

Almost forgot the bizarre ZiMAG background history:
http://atariage.com/...emag/?p=3085065

As you can see from Waggie's excellent research, Emag and Vidco were indeed founded later: both in october 1983.

Vidco included the ZiMAG carts (with a ZiMAG label on the front and a molded Vidco logo on the back) in their Copy Cart boxes:
http://www.atarimani...cart_20117.html

And Vidco most probably used the left-over Home Vision stack of Repro Carts:
http://www.atarimani...cart_20253.html

8)

 


Edited by Rom Hunter, Fri Jul 21, 2017 1:21 AM.


#32 jhd OFFLINE  

jhd

    Stargunner

  • 1,840 posts
  • Location:Calgary, Alberta, Canada

Posted Fri Jul 21, 2017 9:37 AM

I am really enjoying this discussion; the level of analysis is truly astounding!

 

Are there contemporary reviews and/or advertisements for any of these titles? 

 

That sort of external evidence may help determine which version came first. 



#33 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

Rom Hunter

    VCS Games Archivist

  • 8,976 posts
  • Obtainer of Rare Antiquities

Posted Fri Jul 21, 2017 12:52 PM

According to Omega's findings many years ago the Home Vision logo is too long to fit in the ZiMAG logo position of Dishaster.

This could also lead to the conclusion that the ZiMAG version is the original one.

It would be interesting to know if Plate Mania from Home Vision carries the Home Vision logo.

Unfortunately we still don't have the ROM dump of this one...

8)


Edited by Rom Hunter, Fri Jul 21, 2017 12:55 PM.


#34 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

Rom Hunter

    VCS Games Archivist

  • 8,976 posts
  • Obtainer of Rare Antiquities

Posted Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:41 AM

Some other leads to ZiMAG versions being the originals:
TV_Gamer_Issue_1984_03_0012.jpg TV_Gamer_1983-12_Boytonbrook_GB_0045.jpg Digital_Press_Issue_12_1993-07_Santulli_Joe_US_0020a.jpg

Digital_Press_Issue_13_1993-09_Santulli_Joe_US_0015.jpg Digital_Press_Issue_13_1993-09_Santulli_Joe_US_0016.jpg

8)


Edited by Rom Hunter, Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:42 AM.


#35 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

Thomas Jentzsch

    Thrust, Jammed, SWOOPS!, Boulder Dash, THREE·S, Star Castle

  • Topic Starter
  • 23,972 posts
  • Always left from right here!
  • Location:Düsseldorf, Germany, Europe, Earth

Posted Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:40 PM

Cool findings. It is nice to see when a technical analysis result and speculation is confirmed that way.

 

Then the only question left for me is: Why does the "Mommy" look like an apple?



#36 up2knowgood OFFLINE  

up2knowgood

    Moonsweeper

  • 278 posts

Posted Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:54 PM

Cool findings. It is nice to see when a technical analysis result and speculation is confirmed that way.
 
Then the only question left for me is: Why does the "Mommy" look like an apple?


You mean your Mother isn't a giant apple?

#37 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

Thomas Jentzsch

    Thrust, Jammed, SWOOPS!, Boulder Dash, THREE·S, Star Castle

  • Topic Starter
  • 23,972 posts
  • Always left from right here!
  • Location:Düsseldorf, Germany, Europe, Earth

Posted Sat Jul 22, 2017 1:49 PM

Some other leads to ZiMAG versions being the originals:

Have you checked CloneSpy
 
For I want my Mommy, you can identify two very distinctive groups (A..F and G..I) and some sub-groups within those groups. For example you can clearly see, that Teddy Apple is an independent hack and that Abre-te Sesamo! is probably (the percentages are too close to be sure) the original hack, where all other Open Sesame hacks are based on. 

 

You should do the same for other ZiMAG games and draw your own conclusions.

 

Attached Thumbnails

  • I want my Mommy.png


#38 Rom Hunter OFFLINE  

Rom Hunter

    VCS Games Archivist

  • 8,976 posts
  • Obtainer of Rare Antiquities

Posted Sat Jul 22, 2017 2:08 PM

Have you checked CloneSpy
 
For I want my Mommy, you can identify two very distinctive groups (A..F and G..I) and some sub-groups within those groups. For example you can clearly see, that Teddy Apple is an independent hack and that Abre-te Sesamo! is probably (the percentages are too close to be sure) the original hack, where all other Open Sesame hacks are based on. 

 

You should do the same for other ZiMAG games and draw your own conclusions.

 

 

Yes, CloneSpy confirms my I Want My Mommy findings.

I'll check the other three.

The four ZiMAG games were released in january 1983 at the winter CES, the first Home Vision titles were released in september 1983.

LOL, the mother isn't a giant apple.

Mommy shows up in level two, Thomas.

8)


Edited by Rom Hunter, Sat Jul 22, 2017 2:08 PM.


#39 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

Thomas Jentzsch

    Thrust, Jammed, SWOOPS!, Boulder Dash, THREE·S, Star Castle

  • Topic Starter
  • 23,972 posts
  • Always left from right here!
  • Location:Düsseldorf, Germany, Europe, Earth

Posted Sat Jul 22, 2017 2:14 PM

Hm, looks more like a doll to me.



#40 up2knowgood OFFLINE  

up2knowgood

    Moonsweeper

  • 278 posts

Posted Sun Jul 23, 2017 5:32 AM

Hm, looks more like a doll to me.


Considering you're a teddy bear in that game, I think it's entirely possible that 'Mommy' is a doll.

#41 Thomas Jentzsch OFFLINE  

Thomas Jentzsch

    Thrust, Jammed, SWOOPS!, Boulder Dash, THREE·S, Star Castle

  • Topic Starter
  • 23,972 posts
  • Always left from right here!
  • Location:Düsseldorf, Germany, Europe, Earth

Posted Sun Jul 23, 2017 9:43 AM

Makes sense.







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Zimag, Emag, Vidco, CCE

0 user(s) are browsing this forum

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users