Simius Posted December 1, 2017 Author Share Posted December 1, 2017 The only difference is an interface. Rev.A/B boards have the analog output (RGB/YPbPr), HSYNC=15.5/15.7kHz; VSYNC=50/60Hz. Rev.C has the DVI-D digital output with 1536x960 resolution, HSYNC=62/63kHz; VSYNC=50/60Hz; Pixel clock=113.5/114.5MHz (PAL/NTSC). 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 (edited) Hi Jacek, My Sophia arrived safely today, thanks ! Is there any website or central location with installation instructions/jumper set-up, it would be really handy as there are also no instructions included on paper...... digging through all the threads is not so handy Edited December 2, 2017 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zap! Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 Hi Jacek, My Sophia arrived safely today, thanks ! Is there any website or central location with installation instructions/jumper set-up, it would be really handy as there are also no instructions included on paper...... digging through all the threads is not so handy This video seems like it'll do the trick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 Yeah but it says nothing about the jumper settings,., It's easy enough to install of course but we technicians should always think about less technical people who need a step by step...just MHO of course 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simius Posted December 3, 2017 Author Share Posted December 3, 2017 http://atariage.com/forums/topic/258702-new-development-gtia-in-cpld/page-19?do=findComment&comment=3744242 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 This is the problem with all these threads as they get long and bloated... trying to find specific information. That is why I created a website with one of those free web services to gather all of the specific technical information in one place, thus a lot fewer pages to search through. I think something like the Sophia board could be covered in one page, showing the differences between the 3 different types, jumper settings, connections, and the pricing. Just a thought . - Michael 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zap! Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 This is the problem with all these threads as they get long and bloated... trying to find specific information. That is why I created a website with one of those free web services to gather all of the specific technical information in one place, thus a lot fewer pages to search through. I think something like the Sophia board could be covered in one page, showing the differences between the 3 different types, jumper settings, connections, and the pricing. Just a thought . - Michael Excellent idea. Perhaps also a link to where to buy an RGB SCART cable. I'm flat-out against making my own, I'd much rather buy one. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RupanIII Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 I'm just finding out about this today, and,exactly.... I have SCART to HDMI boxes... and a SCART switch. debating my options as I don't want to remove RF to be honest. I could just solder in a SCART to a ribbon, but, i am doing an XEGS... Gotta think about this. Excellent idea. Perhaps also a link to where to buy an RGB SCART cable. I'm flat-out against making my own, I'd much rather buy one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 Excellent idea. Perhaps also a link to where to buy an RGB SCART cable. I'm flat-out against making my own, I'd much rather buy one. You can get one here if you catch the restock at the right time, Mondays I think. Their cables are fantastic. https://www.ebay.com/usr/retro_console_accessories Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H454 Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 (edited) You can get one here if you catch the restock at the right time, Mondays I think. Their cables are fantastic. https://www.ebay.com/usr/retro_console_accessories That eBay store got switched to a real website: https://retro-access.com/ Also really good (I ordered all my scart / RGB cables from them): https://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/ Edited December 3, 2017 by H454 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 (edited) Uh, am I the first one to install Sophia in a 600 XL ? I literally "bumped" into a little problem.....the dual op-amp for the sound is in the way of securing Sophia into the socket. Simius.....am I corect assuming this is a 2 layer board ? If so it looks like I can cut away a bit of the top-right corner, right ? Luckily it looks like there is nothing there on the PCB so maybe you can include a cut-out in the design of the PCB at that spot for future batches. Don't know where you have the PCBs made but irregular shapes are possible for sure....although I'm not sure if there is any extra cost. Edited December 4, 2017 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simius Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 (edited) The first one was mine. Cut the board? Very bad idea. Remove the socket. A long time ago it seemed to me, that the fully socketed motherboard is an advantage. I was wrong. It is serious weakness leading to worsening reliability. All you need are 40-pin sockets, but only precision, round hole type. Maybe also 28-pin OS ROM, that's all. Edited December 4, 2017 by Simius Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 Uh, am I the first one to install Sophia in a 600 XL ? I literally "bumped" into a little problem.....the dual op-amp for the sound is in the way of securing Sophia into the socket. Simius.....am I corect assuming this is a 2 layer board ? If so it looks like I can cut away a bit of the top-right corner, right ? Luckily it looks like there is nothing there on the PCB so maybe you can include a cut-out in the design of the PCB at that spot for future batches. Don't know where you have the PCBs made but irregular shapes are possible for sure....although I'm not sure if there is any extra cost. Add another precision 40 pin socket underneath Sophia to give it a lift, and thus clear the other chip. Not sure how that will affect clearance underneath the keyboard, so you'll have to check that out. - Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 (edited) Pretty sure that won't fit,,,,,I put a lot of uhmmmm investigation about the clearance between the "thickest" keyboards and the "VLSI front row" and believe me.....it's tight, even on the 800XL. I think I found another solution that will work... Edited December 4, 2017 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haightc Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 I put mine in a socketed 600xl no problem. I cut out a square on the top RF shield as the Antonia and Sophia stand slightly to proud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 (edited) low profile sockets people, they make them and they work... if the chip sits slightly too high after that and you see its got space between the socket.... nip a 32nd off the legs and re insert. rinse repeat... Edited December 5, 2017 by _The Doctor__ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhawk668 Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 (edited) I fitted my Sophia RGB also in a 600XL. I had the same problem with the small opamp chip, I removed the socket and soldered the chip straight to the PCB. It now fits perfectly in the GTIA socket. I am now in the proces of fitting a second one in an 130XE. To fit it in this machine, I desoldered the Antic socket, soldered the chip straight to the PCB, desoldered GTIA and installed a socket. I attached a second socket on the Sophia RGB board and inserted that into the GTIA socket. Fits perfectly and enough clearance between the board and the Antic chip. RF shielding does not fit anymore.... Now, remove the modulator to make room for the d-sub connector. Edited December 5, 2017 by redhawk668 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 (edited) Well...okay....thanks for all those ideas. I can fix this and I know i will work it out one way or the other. And I find it hard to be critical because I've learned Jacek is a nice and helpful guy (he gave me some very good information/help through PMs) but......I'm going to have to be honest. IMHO..... 1) if you design a PCB upgrade for the A8 machines, try to make them fit in as many as _possible_ machines without any needed mods..........this could have easily been solved by PCB design, PCB manufacturers make irregular shapes no problem...of course sometimes stuff will not fit all machines I realise that, but this could have been prevented. 2) why shift the issue to the buyer. Installing an upgrade should IMHO be as easy and simple as possible. Many users are simply not handy with the soldering iron. With an XL you have all chips socketed and Sophia is otherwise plug and play....really a shame to have to grab the soldering iron for it....even while I am handy with it, I prefer not to use it if not really necessary.... 3) no way in the world will I do any removing of sockets and soldering chips directly to my main board !! The 600XL I have is one I found after buying about 5 of them. This one has the right keyboard (the one I had and loved BITD) and is in totally NEW condition. I absolutely LOVE the fact that ALL (and I mean ALL) chips are socketed and have never had any issues because of them. So removing sockets and directly soldering chips to the PCB is IMHO the least smart move to make, it's what I hate most about the XE series !! .....especially in the light of possible future upgrades (noticed anything on those pics I posted ????? :D ) It is not smart to directly solder chips !!! Jacek, please see this as positive feedback not destructive.... One question: is the Sophia board 2 layer or multi layer? Edited December 5, 2017 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 (edited) I put mine in a socketed 600xl no problem. I cut out a square on the top RF shield as the Antonia and Sophia stand slightly to proud.I have long removed the top shield because mods like U1MB and Stereo POKEY will never fit with it. Apart from that, there are various keyboards. I have the one with really thick metal on the underside and clearance is extremely tight. What might fit on you machine might not fit on mine. Another note, I won't use the included sub-D because I've learned to hate any directly mounted stuff to the case. I will go for a solution that fits on the PCB (I like JFC's idea....I need to see if it will allow stereo audio out though) Edited December 5, 2017 by Level42 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 Another note, I won't use the included sub-D because I've learned to hate any directly mounted stuff to the case. I will go for a solution that fits on the PCB (I like JFC's idea....I need to see if it will allow stereo audio out though) God bless you! And yes: DIN13 allows stereo audio out, and thanks to mytekcontrols, the pinout is completely compatible with ST cabling with the exception of right audio. See the 1088XEL schematic for the wiring scheme we have adopted for VBXE/Sophia, etc. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 Add another precision 40 pin socket underneath Sophia to give it a lift, and thus clear the other chip. Not sure how that will affect clearance underneath the keyboard, so you'll have to check that out. - Michael I ended up using this solution. But I didn't use a regular precision socket but an ultra-low profile one. This gives "just" enough clearance and still keeps Sophia low enough to fit under the keyboard. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 I don't know why you guys are running into height restrictions, when i was able to install two Sophia boards in my machine . Sophia-DVI stacked on top of Sophia-RGB in 1088XEL Ok I'll stop kidding around . When I look at this next photo it really does look like it would be a simple matter of creating a notch in that corner to clear the offending chip. Obviously as has been suggested that would be best done as part of the manufacture of this board, but unless I'm mistaken I don't see anything critical in that area that would prevent someone from filing a notch in that corner. Am I mistaken? I know Simius said this wasn't a good idea... but.... Note: Actually that doesn't look like either one of my Sophia boards. What rev is that? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 (edited) revision A2 Edited December 5, 2017 by _The Doctor__ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 (edited) When I look at this next photo it really does look like it would be a simple matter of creating a notch in that corner to clear the offending chip. Obviously as has been suggested that would be best done as part of the manufacture of this board, but unless I'm mistaken I don't see anything critical in that area that would prevent someone from filing a notch in that corner. Am I mistaken? I know Simius said this wasn't a good idea... but.... Note: Actually that doesn't look like either one of my Sophia boards. What rev is that? Exactly Michael, the only thing that stopped me from doing it was the slight uncertainty if it's 2 layer.I also first wanted to know for sure the Sophia is OK before modding anything to it... No idea what Ref, I received it just this week so I assume it's the latest it's an RGB one of course....nothing better than CRT beauty in RGB Edited December 5, 2017 by Level42 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 I'd let them know so it the next run is modified Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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