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Developers/testing required for mini-itx clone system - ÉclaireXL


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#176 foft OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:55 PM

Interesting. Mostly out of curiosity, are you planning "true" replacements with Pokey analog output and GTIA color oscillator? Or with sound and video only digital (which would require then a custom output)?


Both I guess, but so far not much actual planning!

#177 ijor OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:58 PM

The analog portion of Pokey probably is not a big problem. Just a DAC, I guess. But GTIA might be challenging.



#178 foft OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 3:18 AM

The analog portion of Pokey probably is not a big problem. Just a DAC, I guess. But GTIA might be challenging.

Do you mean because of the higher frequencies?
I thought gtia output digital luma (4 bits on 4 pins) and digital chroma (phase shifted square wave on 1 pin).

#179 Level42 OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 3:37 AM

AFAIK GTIA is fully digital.

IMHO going with one type of POKEY replacement that would 100% compatible would be most practical. Remember that these are also used in arcade games and there's a market there too.

Edited by Level42, Thu Dec 28, 2017 3:39 AM.


#180 ijor OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 6:48 AM

AFAIK GTIA is fully digital.


GTIA is not fully digital. The delay line (pin 17) is analog. But that's just the easy part that an ADC should solve.
 

Do you mean because of the higher frequencies?
I thought gtia output digital luma (4 bits on 4 pins) and digital chroma (phase shifted square wave on 1 pin).


Yes, I mean the higher frequencies on the chroma output. While it is not analog in the sense of the voltage level, it's a VCO (voltage controlled oscillator) output. Of course, the VCO output can be implemented digitally if the device works with a clock at a frequency high enough. But considering that the exact frequencies need to be adjusted at runtime depending on the calibration input, the working frequency required might be too high for a low cost device.


Edited by ijor, Thu Dec 28, 2017 6:52 AM.


#181 seastalker OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 11:17 AM

Thank you for the clarification on the Eclair and MIst comparisons! Also, I am grateful for the new form factor A8 projects and they are well worth doing. I hope inspires others to run with it for OTHER projects. Enjoying my MIst FPGA computer and with a limited budget for WHICH new toys to get, the features I'm looking for would have to justify redundancy. A C64 Reloaded / Speccy Next type of A8 project would be that justification for me. No aging capacitors to worry about, Svideo and audio out port to replace RF and channel selector, low power consumption to replace an aging brick, dual POKEY support, and #1 or course: styled to fit an 800xl case/keyboard. IF I didn't have a Mist, this would greatly tempt me.  It looks wonderful and I'm thrilled others can get interested in FPGAs.

 

I will be looking out for the later MIst core updates, and support any FPGA chip replacement projects. Big thanks for this project!!


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#182 foft OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 2:39 PM

Re gtia colour: Shame there are no fractional plls on the max10. I think it will be good enough, though might have to forget the dynamic colour adjustment via the variable resistor. I think 400MHz clock should be possible and with ddr outputs that gives 800MHz resolution. So ~200 different delays per colour clock.

#183 mytekcontrols OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 2:50 PM

Perhaps we can get this High School Student Who’s Building His Own Integrated Circuits to build some new Atari VSLI chips for us. I believe Curt had the manufacturing data for the various chips.

 

Mjk5NjExNA.jpeg

 

Sorry for sliding farther off topic  :( .



#184 ijor OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 7:12 PM

Re gtia colour: Shame there are no fractional plls on the max10. I think it will be good enough, though might have to forget the dynamic colour adjustment via the variable resistor. I think 400MHz clock should be possible and with ddr outputs that gives 800MHz resolution. So ~200 different delays per colour clock.

 

On a second thought, the analog calibration input might not be needed. If I'm not mistaken its purpose is to compensate for manufacturing variations on the analog delays inside GTIA. Not for board level variations. That shouldn't be a problem in this case.



#185 seastalker OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:34 PM

Has the naming origin of Éclaire ever been addressed? A creator can name it what they like and I like it fine, yet it does seem random. Numerically, Atari had 400/800/600xl/800xl/1200 etc and then the console naming with Lynx and Jaguar.  How did a wonderfully delicious French pastry win the title?  Yes I do know Atari anything can be deemed 'delicious.' LOL

 

Also, as this is an FPGA project, is it possible to run other system's cores in theory if ported?  That would be cool to see. .



#186 brenski OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:59 PM

Has the naming origin of Éclaire ever been addressed? A creator can name it what they like and I like it fine, yet it does seem random. Numerically, Atari had 400/800/600xl/800xl/1200 etc and then the console naming with Lynx and Jaguar.  How did a wonderfully delicious French pastry win the title?  Yes I do know Atari anything can be deemed 'delicious.' LOL

 

Also, as this is an FPGA project, is it possible to run other system's cores in theory if ported?  That would be cool to see. .

 

Éclaire is French for enlightened. so possibly not such a random name, after all?


Edited by brenski, Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:02 PM.


#187 foft OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:06 AM

I had recently moved to French speaking Switzerland and was (and still am!) learning French. It was meant to be lightening XL, though due to my poor spelling it has an extra e on the end!

éclair:
https://www.google.ch/search?q=éclair&tbm=isch

éclaire:
Which according to larousse is: http://www.larousse.fr/dictionnaires/francais/éclaire/27547?q=éclaire#27401
"Ouverture pratiquée dans le pont d'un bateau de pêche, pour permettre de jeter le poisson dans la cale."
"Opening in the deck of a fishing boat to allow the fish to be thrown into the hold."

Which wasn't really my intention!

Though as you say it could read as light/enlightened - I'll have to ask a native speaker!
http://www.wordreference.com/fren/éclairer

edit: Still shows lightening, so perhaps its a common spelling error? Or just google luck! https://www.google.c...claire&tbm=isch

Edited by foft, Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:12 AM.


#188 seastalker OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:48 PM

I love how one letter can make a whole new meaning out of a word.  I still like the idea of an atari that is named after a legendary dessert.



#189 917k OFFLINE  

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Posted Today, 1:37 AM

This project is ridiculously cool but to be honest I think the name is a little weird and kind of confusing. Named as it is, it I do not think it is obvious to people that this is an implementation of an Atari computer. Personally I'd like to see it assigned a proper number but perhaps with an LT on the end for LighTning. But that is just my opinion. :)






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