Atari 1050 questions

[mr_gw454]

Hi everyone,

 

I was able to obtain a good deal on an Atari 1050 (time will tell, I guess). In any case, I have an Atari 800XL and would like to try using the 1050, however, I do not have have any floppy disks with any type of DOS on them. What type of 5.25" disks are preferred for this drive? SS, DS, 48tpi, etc.? Unlike the TRS-80 Color Computer world that I normally come from, I understand that Atari's DOS is not ROM based, but on the disk media, correct?

 

I do have access to a SIO2BT adapter as well as a SIO2PC-USB adapter. Can either of these be daisy chained to the 1050 so I can copy a DOS from one of them to a blank diskette in the 1050? I realize I have more modern storage peripherals, but wanted the more "retro" experience with a real floppy drive for some tinkering.

 

I'm a newbie with Atari 8bit computers and peripherals, so please pardon my very basic questions.

 

Thanks!

 

 

[Kyle22]

Hi everyone,

 

I was able to obtain a good deal on an Atari 1050 (time will tell, I guess). In any case, I have an Atari 800XL and would like to try using the 1050, however, I do not have have any floppy disks with any type of DOS on them. What type of 5.25" disks are preferred for this drive? SS, DS, 48tpi, etc.? Unlike the TRS-80 Color Computer world that I normally come from, I understand that Atari's DOS is not ROM based, but on the disk media, correct?

 

I do have access to a SIO2BT adapter as well as a SIO2PC-USB adapter. Can either of these be daisy chained to the 1050 so I can copy a DOS from one of them to a blank diskette in the 1050? I realize I have more modern storage peripherals, but wanted the more "retro" experience with a real floppy drive for some tinkering.

 

I'm a newbie with Atari 8bit computers and peripherals, so please pardon my very basic questions.

 

Thanks!

 

 

 

You need 5.25" DSDD 48TPI disks.

 

Here are some DOS images that you can use with the SIO2PC=USB adapter that you can boot from: http://ftp.pigwa.net/stuff/collections/holmes%20cd/Holmes%201/ATR%20Programs/Applications%20A-Z/index.html

 

Use RespeQt or APE, whichever works better with your USB adapter.

 

After you have successfully booted DOS on the Atari, you may format and write DOS on the real 1050 floppy drive set as D2:. After you have created your DOS disk, you may switch the drive settings to boot from the 1050 if you like, and have the SIO2PC as D2: (or whatever).

[mr_gw454]

 

You need 5.25" DSDD 48TPI disks.

 

Here are some DOS images that you can use with the SIO2PC=USB adapter that you can boot from: http://ftp.pigwa.net/stuff/collections/holmes%20cd/Holmes%201/ATR%20Programs/Applications%20A-Z/index.html

 

Use RespeQt or APE, whichever works better with your USB adapter.

 

After you have successfully booted DOS on the Atari, you may format and write DOS on the real 1050 floppy drive set as D2:. After you have created your DOS disk, you may switch the drive settings to boot from the 1050 if you like, and have the SIO2PC as D2: (or whatever).

 

Hi Kyle22,

 

What you said sounds good with the exception of how to attach the SIO2PC-USB adapter and the 1050 at the same time? I can set the 1050 as D2 and the SIO2PC-USB defaults to D1 (I believe). Do I plug the SIO2PC-USB into the 2nd SIO port of the 1050? The first SIO port of the 1050 would be directly connected to the Atari 800XL?

 

Thanks for your help!

[Rybags]

The 1050 will go fine with SS/SD floppies.

 

But yeah, you can get an annoying situation if you get a drive but no Dos disk or alternate way to transfer data or emulate a peripheral.

[BillC]

 

Hi Kyle22,

 

What you said sounds good with the exception of how to attach the SIO2PC-USB adapter and the 1050 at the same time? I can set the 1050 as D2 and the SIO2PC-USB defaults to D1 (I believe). Do I plug the SIO2PC-USB into the 2nd SIO port of the 1050? The first SIO port of the 1050 would be directly connected to the Atari 800XL?

 

Thanks for your help!

The SIO2PC/USB device doesn't have any default as it doesn't act as a drive, this is up to the emulation software used. Some generic USB based adapters require a diode when used with a floppy drive.

[Kyle22]

 

Hi Kyle22,

 

What you said sounds good with the exception of how to attach the SIO2PC-USB adapter and the 1050 at the same time? I can set the 1050 as D2 and the SIO2PC-USB defaults to D1 (I believe). Do I plug the SIO2PC-USB into the 2nd SIO port of the 1050? The first SIO port of the 1050 would be directly connected to the Atari 800XL?

 

Thanks for your help!

Yes, the SIO daisy chains computer <---> 1050 <---> SIO2PC.

 

If you can find SD disks they will work, but these days most of us have US Doublers installed and we use DD disks. DD disks work fine for SD or DD. Just Don't use HD disks (They won't work).

[mr_gw454]

Yes, the SIO daisy chains computer <---> 1050 <---> SIO2PC.

 

If you can find SD disks they will work, but these days most of us have US Doublers installed and we use DD disks. DD disks work fine for SD or DD. Just Don't use HD disks (They won't work).

 

Hi Kyle22,

 

I appreciate you confirming the SIO2PC-USB can be daisy-chained to the 1050. The drive ID for the SIO2PC-USB is done through software, so I would just select the first drive for it and the 2nd drive for the 1050 and I should be good. Looking forward to testing this.

 

Thank you again!

[Rybags]

You can assign as many drive IDs to the SIO2PC device as you want, and whether it's physically first or last in the daisy chain shouldn't matter.

Of course if you have a real drive with the same ID there'll be problems since they'll both respond to commands to that unit.

[mr_gw454]

You can assign as many drive IDs to the SIO2PC device as you want, and whether it's physically first or last in the daisy chain shouldn't matter.

Of course if you have a real drive with the same ID there'll be problems since they'll both respond to commands to that unit.

 

Hi Rybags. I do seem to have an issue that may be timing related. I am getting ERROR 138 when trying to format or copy to the 1050 from the SIO2PC-UCB device. The SIO2PC-USB has a disk image mounted in slot 1 using AspeQt. Nothing else in the other slots, so I'm assuming that means it's the SIO2PC-USB device is only configured as D1. I have the switches set on the 1050 for D2. The Atari 800XL has an updated ROM (i.e. EPROM) to allow for faster speeds with the SIO2BT module (I also have). The SIO2PC-USB device seems to work fine with it, but I'm wondering if perhaps the 1050 is affected by it and that's why I get the ERROR 138 errors on it?

 

It seems like the 1050 will write for a while and then Ii get the error. It's not immediate when I use it. In the end, there's always a failure. I'm trying to format a real 5.25" floppy and copy DOS 2.5 to it (from the SIO2PC-USB device).

 

Thanks

[Rybags]

Maybe try formatting with the 1050 without any turbo IO going on.

 

Format on a real drive takes 30+ seconds while on emulated devices it's almost instant. If the Dos assumes a short timeout then you can get problems with format on real drives.

[mr_gw454]

Maybe try formatting with the 1050 without any turbo IO going on.

 

Format on a real drive takes 30+ seconds while on emulated devices it's almost instant. If the Dos assumes a short timeout then you can get problems with format on real drives.

 

Would you happen to know how to disable Turbo IO? I have to load DOS on the SIO2PC-USB device first.

 

Thanks!

[1050]

Not really up to speed on these as I don't have

any such new toys as USB-SIO2PC but it's sounding

like the diode issue to me. The daisy chain is based

on open collector devices talking to each other and

the USB-SIO2PC isn't going to play well with others

as they say until you mount a diode that blocks the

off state current from stopping other devices on the

daisy chain from working. In other words the newer

device isn't playing by open collector rules and needs

a diode to allow it to work with other daisy chain

devices.

 

Sorry I don't know more about it, but there are

threads that speak of it in more detail unless

someone drops in here to confirm and instruct where

the diode(s) are to be placed. I could easily be all

wet yet again too. Search the forum would be my

advise so you can confirm or deny this is a possible

issue yourself.

[+kheller2]

We are assuming the 1050 is functioning properly. Suggest using a diagnostic disk image.

[mr_gw454]

I will start searching for that information -- thank you for your help!

 

 

Not really up to speed on these as I don't have
any such new toys as USB-SIO2PC but it's sounding
like the diode issue to me. The daisy chain is based
on open collector devices talking to each other and
the USB-SIO2PC isn't going to play well with others
as they say until you mount a diode that blocks the
off state current from stopping other devices on the
daisy chain from working. In other words the newer
device isn't playing by open collector rules and needs
a diode to allow it to work with other daisy chain
devices.

Sorry I don't know more about it, but there are
threads that speak of it in more detail unless
someone drops in here to confirm and instruct where
the diode(s) are to be placed. I could easily be all
wet yet again too. Search the forum would be my
advise so you can confirm or deny this is a possible
issue yourself.

[mr_gw454]

We are assuming the 1050 is functioning properly. Suggest using a diagnostic disk image.

 

 

I would love to do that, but don't have a means to copy any disk images on to a floppy disk since I don't have any DOS on any floppy disks at the moment. This is why I've been trying to use the SIO2PC-USB to help with that, unfortunately, the drive is getting timeouts. I agree I need to find out if the drive is even OK, too. Does anyone know of an inexpensive source of DOS floppies or even the diagnostic disk?

 

Thank you

[BillC]

The ID switches on 1050 drives sometimes don't operate correctly, it can still be configured as D1: even though the switches are set to D2:. To test this have the 1050 powered down, boot from the ATR, once in DOS unmount the ATR from D1:, power up the 1050 and see if it will respond to a directory command, try drive IDs 1 to 4 just in case there is a problem with the ID switches.

 

To rectify an issue with the the switches move them back and forth several times, spraying some contact cleaner into them before doing this may help as well. Try setting both switches to the right, this is the D3: setting.

 

Boot a DOS ATR that is configured for 4 drives from your SIO2PC/ emulator software. By default DOS2.0/2.5 are only configured for 2 drives. DOS 2.5 can be configured to 4 drives via a "POKE 1802,15" in BASIC, if you want to keep this configuration you will also need to return to DOS and then write the DOS files back to the boot floppy/ATR.

 

After booting the ATR try to get a directory of a floppy in the 1050, try drives 2/3/4 just in case there is still a problem with the ID switches.

The drive should spin up if it receives a directory command for its configured ID, if the disc format isn't recognized it will still give an error.

Edited August 4, 2017 by BillC