How have early 3D games aged in your opinion?

[JaguarVision]

I feel like people who bring up SNES StarFox as an example of a early 3D game that has aged well never actually played Star Fox on an SNES but instead an emulator.

 

Star Fox was almost all spectacle.

[godslabrat]

Star Fox was almost all spectacle.

So is this thread, but you dont see me complaining.

[JaguarVision]

You did see the mod say stay on topic right? Hmm yes.

 

I feel like people who bring up SNES StarFox as an example of a early 3D game that has aged well never actually played Star Fox on an SNES but instead an emulator.

[godslabrat]

I feel like that’s an unfair conclusion for you to draw.

[JaguarVision]

What aspect?

[godslabrat]

The fact that if someone says they think a game ages well, they probably played it on an emulator. You have no way of knowing that, least of all for a game that was well-recieved at the time and has consistently made the lists of best games for the system ever since.

 

In other words, no.

[JaguarVision]

Read the context of why the think so. I don't think a below 15fps game that studders is a smooth running game. It's been mentioned a few times in this thread and another as an example of a smooth action title when it runs like jank.

 

The comparison to Star Fox 64 makes me more curious of his method of playing the game. Most people I know or seen on the net who say SF is better than 64 don't play SF on a SNES.

 

Also it was hyped back in magazine for being 3D. Don't recall much about for it controls which only some reviewers covered minimally. 3D hype was real and a playable 3D game that wasn't a cluster fuck got good scores as the 3D titles were coming in.

 

I say the same for all this A's and 9'd

S Crash N Burn got. Game is fiddly and has zero sense of speed.

Edited October 31, 2017 by JaguarVision

[godslabrat]

You don’t think so. That’s fine.

 

But to extrapolate your view into some conclusion that everyone but you is using emulators is, as diplomatically as I can put this, stupid. Speaking for others seldom ends well.

[JaguarVision]

I never said it wasn't an assumption, just an assumption that seems to be correct most of the time.

 

I also worded the statement to get him to chime in if he did or not.

 

Despite the above I have ran into players that still love the original SNES version just not often.

 

Also uh "everyone but you is using emulators" is a misleading paraphrase of something I never said and would appreciate you don't do that.

[SignGuy81]

Yes godslabrat you were wrong, he wasn't saying that everyone else but him is using emulators, just anyone with a different view than him is using emulators.

[Gabriel]

You did see the mod say stay on topic right? Hmm yes.

 

I feel like people who bring up SNES StarFox as an example of a early 3D game that has aged well never actually played Star Fox on an SNES but instead an emulator.

 

I'm not sure if I've ever played Starfox in an emulator. If I have, it was only to test if the emulator handled FX chip games well. The vast majority, if not all, of my opinion on Starfox comes not from emulation, but from play on an actual console.

I don't know how much I've babbled about it here over the years, but I'm pretty big on original hardware. I will use flash carts, but I don't view those as emulation. Besides, Starfox doesn't work on currently available flashcarts anyway. The way I play Starfox is actual cart I purchased in 1993 on an actual SNES, definitely not emulation. So no SNES Classic either.

[+MrBlackCat]

Sometimes I play Wolfenstein 3D, DooM, Heretic, HeXen, Quake, Duke Nukem 3D, and several others, with my husband on a LAN. These games look terrible on a big monitor, but on the small ones (14, 15) they look fine. The gameplay is still fun to me.

As far as anything that I actually notice that hasn't aged well... the objects in the environment. Wolfenstein is noticeably bare, and DooM has much better textures on everything, but there just isn't much in the rooms other than health, ammo, and barrels. Really other than that I don't mind the aging of all these.

 

MrBlackCat

[Tanooki]

Most my time playing Starfox too then and now is still on my original cartridge. The game plays fine. I think it has aged fairly well too. Even the year it came out it was never a high polygon affair or much of a show off if you also had a PC to compare it against which I did. The game stands on the polygonal art style it chose, but mostly because the levels are damn well done, choices where to go, the hidden stuff, and it was and still remains fairly well engaging. People who crap on it now I think mostly do it as a sheep gang up type thing along with the fact they've gotten used to playing it sped up and cleaned up with emulators or got more attached to later games and are the type who can't look back and still enjoy.

 

People getting all jacked up one FPS have their own personal selfish problems to get over. Starfox doesn't shimmy into a level of unplayability of it slide showing along or jacking around various points on the screen that'll get you killed. Sure it's slower, but it flies smooth and you won't get shot down because it's clipping.

[CGQuarterly]

I was playing those games when they were cutting-edge, so for me they're still the same game that they were back then. But I don't play very many modern games, which probably helps to avoid re-calibrating my expectations.

[djour]

I played Doom 32X yesterday. It was enjoyable, but part of me kept thinking... man, these graphics are hard to take.

[Keatah]

The minimum spec for classic DOOM/Doom2, IMHO, is about a 386-40, a very popular and industry-accepted as a standard for powerhouse gaming prior to the 486.

 

I can't imagine Doom playing well on any classic console. I believe it was a case of "we gotta have that title no-matter-what!" Framerates and resolutions be damned. And that made for some really lousy ports.

Edited November 1, 2017 by Keatah

[BydoEmpire]

I think they've aged poorly, but mostly due to low framerate and it's very dependent on the specific game. Games that were smoother hold up fine. No particular or overarching issues with control or gameplay, but 15fps is hard to adjust back to. I wasn't a big fan of that generation in general anyways.

[JaguarVision]

Apparently the Jaguar version of doom runs the best of the classic consoles though sacrifices had to be made.

 

Which is interesting, you would think the PSX would have no trouble.

[Flojomojo]

1. PSX Doom is fast and fun, much smoother than any of the contemporary ports on mid-1990s consoles. Jaguar has more colors, that's its main achievement.

 

2. Someone who praises 3DO Need for Speed doesn't have much credibility when complaining about SNES Star Fox's framerate.

[godslabrat]

[Tanooki]

Flojo got it. I keep that PSX game around as it really was the best conversion of the game to the console market up until we hit the DOOM3 era with the BFG release of the old 2, android ports of that too after the source went free. Jag was nice but it lacked a lot of stages, odd tweaks, and some missing features compared to both PSX and PC. I keep a psone+lcd around but don't use it much, but when I do the games I have are very few and there are quite a few PC games (Diablo, Doom, Dune 2, and Warcraft 2) and barely any others. PSX was pretty solid when it came to some computer conversions.

[Silverfleet]

Early polygon games tend to look better to my eyes than early texture-mapped games. For example, Virtua Racing looks better to me than, say, Ridge Racer, especially the console versions. Back in the day, I was blown away by both Starfox and the Genesis version of Virtua Racing, and even Hard Drivin' on the Genesis. While those games are rough by today's standards, I still like them.

[spacecadet]

While those games are rough by today's standards, I still like them.

 

Hard Drivin' on the Genesis is basically unplayable for me. It's like 1fps, especially when you need it to be at its smoothest (when there's a lot going on).

 

I did think Hard Drivin' in the arcades was amazing. I'm remembering that being the first polygonal arcade game, is that right? It played pretty smoothly in the arcade but I think even that would probably seem choppy nowadays. I'm remembering it being about 10-15fps.

 

I also played Stunts on my 486 PC, which was basically a direct ripoff but with some added features, and it ran like butter. But I don't think it'd be much fun today except for nostalgia purposes. There are a lot of games since then that do similar things better.

[Silverfleet]

I did think Hard Drivin' in the arcades was amazing. I'm remembering that being the first polygonal arcade game, is that right? It played pretty smoothly in the arcade but I think even that would probably seem choppy nowadays. I'm remembering it being about 10-15fps.

 

 

I, Robot was released back in 1984. I think that was one of the first ones, if not the very first one. I played Hard Drivin' a few years ago in an arcade, and it was still playable. The 4-speed manual transmission rules!

[Skippy B. Coyote]

I'm one of those weirdos who really likes big chunky polygons; textured or untextured. I still find early PlayStation games like Battle Arena Toshinden and Assault Rigs very visually appealing, and all the Virtua games on the 32X and Saturn (Virtua Racing, Virtua Fighting, Virtua Cop, etc.) look great to me too. The same goes for games like Cybermorph, Iron Soldier, and I-War on the Jaguar; none of which I've ever had the pleasure of playing but I definitely hope to some day.

 

As far as non-polygonal sprite based 3D games go, I really dig them too. The graphics in first-person shooters like Wolfenstein 3D, Doom, and Blake Stone give me some seriously nostalgic warm fuzzies every time I play them.

Edited November 1, 2017 by Jin