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1088XEL Atari ITX Motherboard DIY Builders Thread

1088XEL JOY2PIC-STIK XEL-CF-][ UAV Sophia U1MB

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#51 mytek OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:03 PM

On those stacked video connectors, observe that two of the anchor points that will be soldered have a plastic post on one half (don't know why they made them this way  :? ). So be sure to only apply heat to the metal side when soldering, otherwise you'll have a stinky mess.



#52 Firedawg OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Dec 26, 2017 4:43 PM

On those stacked video connectors, observe that two of the anchor points that will be soldered have a plastic post on one half (don't know why they made them this way  :? ). So be sure to only apply heat to the metal side when soldering, otherwise you'll have a stinky mess.


Yeah, I see that too. Save money? Not real sure but agree on the care when soldering it in. When I get home tonight I'm soldering it in. Fingers crossed on every working out of the gate;-) I will be surprised, but hopeful.

Mike

#53 Firedawg OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:08 PM

In stalled the video connector and attached a S-Video cable from one of my old 8mm Camcorders (yep, still have them) to find a black screen (see video).  Keyboard lights up (Num Lock, Caps Lock, Scroll Lock) during boot.  I tested the composite port with the same results.  I replaced both the U1MB (Candle v1) and UAV with my extras, also the same result.  Rechecked all solder connections for defective joints, as I found none.  Tested the S-Video cable with another device on the same monitor (Sceptre X240), which check out good.  I believe my weak link, besides me, is my U1MB Candle v1 board.  I have not installed or tested these U1MBs in any other computer so there is an element of unknown.  I have spare pokey, cpu, gtia, antic, etc, but have not gone to that as of yet.  Prior to plugging in my chips I tested all the sockets for voltage and everything checked out.  I think Stephen hex me a bit  :P.  Any ideas on what is going on or not going on?

 

Attached File  1088xelboot.mp4   11.98MB   98 downloads

 

1088xelboot.jpg

 

 



#54 Stephen OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:44 PM

In stalled the video connector and attached a S-Video cable from one of my old 8mm Camcorders (yep, still have them) to find a black screen (see video).  Keyboard lights up (Num Lock, Caps Lock, Scroll Lock) during boot.  I tested the composite port with the same results.  I replaced both the U1MB (Candle v1) and UAV with my extras, also the same result.  Rechecked all solder connections for defective joints, as I found none.  Tested the S-Video cable with another device on the same monitor (Sceptre X240), which check out good.  I believe my weak link, besides me, is my U1MB Candle v1 board.  I have not installed or tested these U1MBs in any other computer so there is an element of unknown.  I have spare pokey, cpu, gtia, antic, etc, but have not gone to that as of yet.  Prior to plugging in my chips I tested all the sockets for voltage and everything checked out.  I think Stephen hex me a bit  :P.  Any ideas on what is going on or not going on?

 

attachicon.gif1088xelboot.mp4

 

attachicon.gif1088xelboot.jpg

 

 

1st, I see the X2 socket is empty.  I think that will need populated (or is that only for PAL)?



#55 Firedawg OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:51 PM

1st, I see the X2 socket is empty.  I think that will need populated (or is that only for PAL)?

 

Thx Stephen.  I think Michael had told me that it was not required as I was using NTSC only.  I'm seeing the screen aspect changing but no display of text, not sure if that can be seen in the video.

 

Mike



#56 BillC OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 2:00 PM

On those stacked video connectors, observe that two of the anchor points that will be soldered have a plastic post on one half (don't know why they made them this way  :? ). So be sure to only apply heat to the metal side when soldering, otherwise you'll have a stinky mess.

Maybe those 2 outside anchors aren't meant to be soldered, the plastic piece has a tooth to catch on the underside of the PCB.



#57 Dropcheck OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:54 PM

In stalled the video connector and attached a S-Video cable from one of my old 8mm Camcorders (yep, still have them) to find a black screen (see video).  Keyboard lights up (Num Lock, Caps Lock, Scroll Lock) during boot.  I tested the composite port with the same results.  I replaced both the U1MB (Candle v1) and UAV with my extras, also the same result.  Rechecked all solder connections for defective joints, as I found none.  Tested the S-Video cable with another device on the same monitor (Sceptre X240), which check out good.  I believe my weak link, besides me, is my U1MB Candle v1 board.  I have not installed or tested these U1MBs in any other computer so there is an element of unknown.  I have spare pokey, cpu, gtia, antic, etc, but have not gone to that as of yet.  Prior to plugging in my chips I tested all the sockets for voltage and everything checked out.  I think Stephen hex me a bit  :P.  Any ideas on what is going on or not going on?

 

attachicon.gif1088xelboot.mp4

 

attachicon.gif1088xelboot.jpg

 

 

 

Check for audio output.  Are you getting audio clicks when you type on the keyboard?



#58 Firedawg OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:43 PM

 

Check for audio output.  Are you getting audio clicks when you type on the keyboard?

 

No clicking sound.  I guess I could start swapping out the GTIA and ANTIC chips?  Been working on desoldering two chips on my 130XE for the U1MB board so I can then do the necessary updates on the CPLDs then the BIOS.    



#59 DrVenkman ONLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:46 PM

I'm sorry to read Firedawg's boot woes. I had high hopes it would fire right up for him. :(

 

As for me, still far too cold in the garage still to work, and until the holidays are over I can't clear out a space to work inside. So for now I'm watching Jon's videos and going over my parts packs to ensure I know what goes where. With that in mind ...

 

So two quick questions for Mac if he's reading - First, with regard to the U1MB, Jon's video show him having installed closed IDC box headers on the U1MB to mate with the tall female headers on the 1088XEL board. However, in my kit the only box headers appear to be the ones for the joystick ports and another for the MPBI connector. I do have two long rows of male header pins; am I to replace the existing U1MB 90 degree headers with rows of male headers broken from the two long strips provided in the kit?  

 

And second, also concerning the U1MB installation, my kit has two 20+20 pin tall female 0.1" headers; am I to make the three U1MB female connections to the 1088XEL by cutting (?) these tall female headers to the proper size? 

 

Thanks!



#60 Stephen OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:22 PM

I would very much suggest trying the U1MB in another machine 1st.  Sadly, I won't be building out my final board until well into spring.  Too many other challenges at the moment, combined with -9 wind chills at the moment.



#61 Firedawg OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:37 PM

I'm sorry to read Firedawg's boot woes. I had high hopes it would fire right up for him. :(

 

Don't be.  Having the older Candle U1MB board had me worried about having a clean start from the beginning.  Hopefully, tomorrow I'll have both these U1MB boards updated, and with possibility of needing to swap around a few chips maybe I'll have better news. ;-)



#62 Stephen OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:39 PM

 

Don't be.  Having the older Candle U1MB board had me worried about having a clean start from the beginning.  Hopefully, tomorrow I'll have both these U1MB boards updated, and with possibility of needing to swap around a few chips maybe I'll have better news. ;-)

We made changes to the original board though, so in theory, a 1st generation U1MB should work with no issues.



#63 Firedawg OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:47 PM

We made changes to the original board though, so in theory, a 1st generation U1MB should work with no issues.

 

Yes, that is why Michael told me to go ahead and test it without the updates.  It could be my GTIA or my ANTIC chip.



#64 mytek OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 12:25 AM

Hi Mike,

First of all let me assure you that all of the V1.1 boards that have been built thus far have worked. Although some that didn't when first fired up, were usually due to something being left unsoldered, although that doesn't appear to be the case with your board. So the next possibility is a bad chip, or some other component, and also the possibility of an entirely wrong component substituted for what's suppose to be there.

I did a preliminary test of simply having no X1 crystal to see what that would look like if your primary oscillator wasn't working. Other than a quick white flash, the video output was black just like what you are seeing. Then I tried with the oscillator reestablished but no U1MB and I got a solid red screen. I'll have to do a few other checks when I get a chance tomorrow, such as removing the SRAM to see what else could potentially cause what you are seeing.

#65 mytek OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 12:58 AM

And second, also concerning the U1MB installation, my kit has two 20+20 pin tall female 0.1" headers; am I to make the three U1MB female connections to the 1088XEL by cutting (?) these tall female headers to the proper size?


The answer is: yes you will need to make the 3 required extended female headers that the U1MB will plug into from those 20+20 versions.

And yes you will also need straight vertical male headers on the U1MB, although the choice between box or open version is up to you. For this application I prefer the open ones since it makes it easier to make sure everything's aligned properly when plugging it in so that you aren't shifted over by one pin position. Using a box header will not insure that this does not happen, although in the original ribbon connection strategy employed on a standard A8 it would.

#66 DrVenkman ONLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 6:55 AM

The answer is: yes you will need to make the 3 required extended female headers that the U1MB will plug into from those 20+20 versions.

Excellent, thank you Michael! What’s the appropriate/recommended way to section those female headers to the appropriate length? They don’t really appear scored or perforated to snap apart so ... Dremel? Fine saw?

And yes you will also need straight vertical male headers on the U1MB, although the choice between box or open version is up to you. For this application I prefer the open ones since it makes it easier to make sure everything's aligned properly when plugging it in so that you aren't shifted over by one pin position. Using a box header will not insure that this does not happen, although in the original ribbon connection strategy employed on a standard A8 it would.

Thanks again. That’s basically what I thought. Nice to have confirmation. :)

#67 Firedawg OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 6:55 AM

Hi Mike,

First of all let me assure you that all of the V1.1 boards that have been built thus far have worked. Although some that didn't when first fired up, were usually due to something being left unsoldered, although that doesn't appear to be the case with your board. So the next possibility is a bad chip, or some other component, and also the possibility of an entirely wrong component substituted for what's suppose to be there.

I did a preliminary test of simply having no X1 crystal to see what that would look like if your primary oscillator wasn't working. Other than a quick white flash, the video output was black just like what you are seeing. Then I tried with the oscillator reestablished but no U1MB and I got a solid red screen. I'll have to do a few other checks when I get a chance tomorrow, such as removing the SRAM to see what else could potentially cause what you are seeing.

 

Totally agree on the v1.1 board.  I verified each component as it was being soldered in, but to its functionality not so much.  I believe its a bad chip, or rather hoping it is.  Once I get through with the U1MB updates, which is allowing me to clear my mind a bit with 1088XEL, then I get back to going through replacing chips & verify components again sometime today.  I've been here before with the Amiga Minimig build, another solid design, and yes it was builder error then too.  I appreciate your support Michael and the rest of the beta team.  The issue will get resolved and hopefully for those building their boards will benefit from it.   



#68 Firedawg OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 7:01 AM

What’s the appropriate/recommended way to section those female headers to the appropriate length? They don’t really appear scored or perforated to snap apart so ... Dremel? Fine saw?
 

 

DrV I used a Dremel 300 with the heavy duty Cut-Off Wheel No. 420 which made the cuts clean and easy.



#69 mytek OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 12:17 PM

I did a video on this many moons ago which can be viewed below.

 



#70 DrVenkman ONLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:33 PM

I did a video on this many moons ago which can be viewed below.


Thanks, Michael (and Mike as well!) for your cutting tips. I have both sharp cutters and a Dremel so .. looks like I should be good to go. :)

#71 DrVenkman ONLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 28, 2017 7:00 PM

And so it begins ... :)

 

I didn't have a lot of time to work tonight - my son is home for the next week or so after traveling across the country to see his mom. He'll be heading back to college after that. But my wife got me a nice 1,500 watt space heater for my workspace in the garage. It's not enough to heat the whole thing, of course, but it does warm my working area up about 10 degrees quite easily, and that's enough. 

 

IMG_9375.JPG

 

IMG_9376.JPG

 

IMG_9377.JPG

 

And hey, let me just give some mad props to MacRorie and his kit: he's individually labeled all the small-quantity resistors with part numbers, and for those with greater quantities, they're labeled by value. I verified the values of these first 5 and they were great - dead on within the accuracy of my meter and the resistor rating. This makes finding the right part delightfully easy. So, thanks, Mac! :)

 

IMG_9374.JPG



#72 cbelcher OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Dec 30, 2017 8:01 AM

So my build has been going well - almost done with the board - my U1MB finally arrived from Lotharek and ... has right angle headers.  I did note on my order to him I was building a 1088xel. Looks like I'm going to have to replace with straight headers -but where has everyone been getting their U1MB's from?

 

So - if you're building - MAKE SURE YOUR U1MB has straight or no headers.

 



#73 DrVenkman ONLINE  

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Posted Sat Dec 30, 2017 8:23 AM

So my build has been going well - almost done with the board - my U1MB finally arrived from Lotharek and ... has right angle headers.  I did note on my order to him I was building a 1088xel. Looks like I'm going to have to replace with straight headers -but where has everyone been getting their U1MB's from?

 

So - if you're building - MAKE SURE YOUR U1MB has straight or no headers.

 

 

I don't think that's an ordering option. Based on some stuff MacRorie has said to folks ordering kits, Lotharek gets these boards 50 at a time in batches from a board fab (in China, I think) and they come at least partially assembled. It'll be later this year before box/straight headers become available - it wasn't clear from Mac's update (Lotharek may not have been that clear to him), but it seems likely that box headers will simply become the norm again. I doubt he'll try to stock multiple header configurations (90 degree/straight/none). The reason MacRorie is interested of course is because he's stocking parts for kits and to build the ones people have paid him to build for them - he's buying U1MBs at least 10 at a time, which must thrill Lotharek, but it's quite an outlay of cash for a hobbyist/supplier. 

 

So long story short, my kit came with a standard U1MB configuration with 90 degree headers. But after watching Jon's video, I'm not worried about removing them. I'm more concerned with making sure everything is lined up perpendicularly when I solder in straight header pins.

 



#74 mytek OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Dec 30, 2017 8:58 AM

So long story short, my kit came with a standard U1MB configuration with 90 degree headers. But after watching Jon's video, I'm not worried about removing them. I'm more concerned with making sure everything is lined up perpendicularly when I solder in straight header pins.


Since the ultimate goal is to be able to plug the U1MB into your 1088XEL, I would suggest mating the vertical male pin headers with the tall female headers (cut-down versions of SparkFun/Adafruit 20+20 headers). Then insert the female side into the XEL motherboard, and the U1MB into the male side (all 3 male/female headers sould be mated and in place to form a stable platform). First solder the U1MB to the male header(s), and then flip over the motherboard and solder in the female header(s). Everything should now be in perfect alignment :).

#75 Firedawg OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Dec 30, 2017 9:01 AM

I'm more concerned with making sure everything is lined up perpendicularly when I solder in straight header pins.


DrV when you solder in the headers to the board for the U1MB and UAV you will do it as complete assembly with devices attached to headers to assure perfect alignment after soldering in, so removing and reattaching will be on point.

Mike





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