Atari XE Game System sales?

[DracIsBack]

 

Of course my story is anecdotal. But when the biggest store of the largest retailer in the biggest market fails to move a single unit for 1/3 of 1988, that's telling.

 

Still very anecdotal. Not so much in the context of the XEGS, but in context of the 7800, when you look at Atari's actual US Sales for it. Doesn't match your "20% SMS" view at all. Unless the SMS sold like 10 million units in the USA. That's my point. One guy, working in one store, in one market doesn't necessarily translate to all markets across the entire country.

 

https://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/MattMatthews/20090526/84050/Atari_7800_Sales_Figures_1986__1990.php

[Bill Loguidice]

 

Still very anecdotal. Not so much in the context of the XEGS, but in context of the 7800, when you look at Atari's actual US Sales for it. Doesn't match your "20% SMS" view at all. Unless the SMS sold like 10 million units in the USA. That's my point. One guy, working in one store, in one market doesn't necessarily translate to all markets across the entire country.

 

https://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/MattMatthews/20090526/84050/Atari_7800_Sales_Figures_1986__1990.php

 

That was potentially debunked as being the figure for both 7800 hardware and software sales instead of just hardware sales: http://armchairarcade.com/perspectives/2017/11/07/atari-7800-pro-system-beat-sega-master-system-us/ based on the discussion in this AtariAge thread: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/268266-what-atari-sales-numbers-do-we-have-for-their-systems-research-thread/page-1

 

The conclusion that I agree with is that the SMS outsold the 7800 in the US.

[DracIsBack]

 

That was potentially debunked as being the figure for both 7800 hardware and software sales instead of just hardware sales: http://armchairarcade.com/perspectives/2017/11/07/atari-7800-pro-system-beat-sega-master-system-us/ based on the discussion in this AtariAge thread: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/268266-what-atari-sales-numbers-do-we-have-for-their-systems-research-thread/page-1

 

The conclusion that I agree with is that the SMS outsold the 7800 in the US.

 

Well - I see you personally arguing the number tooth and nail in that thread anyway

[Bill Loguidice]

 

Well - I see you personally arguing the number tooth and nail in that thread anyway

 

So what? If you don't agree, debunk it.

[DracIsBack]

 

So what? If you don't agree, debunk it.

 

LOL - you want me to debunk the person trying to do the debunking in the first place?

[Bill Loguidice]

 

LOL - you want me to debunk the person trying to do the debunking in the first place?

 

"LOL", I want you to debunk the guy in that thread who gave credible evidence and analysis of why the 4 million console figure sold was not as it seemed. I understand if you don't want to be bothered with facts that might displease you. Again, the 7800 outselling the SMS in the US never passed the sniff test for a lot of us, and there is a viable explanation in that very thread of why it likely didn't.

[_The Doctor__]

97 million in profits? Maybe the numbers sold are real. who knows. Margins were really tight and I remember a crap ton of promotions and sales at a bottom dollar value at Strawbridge and Clothiers, Clovers, Hess's and the like. Clearing them out as fast as they could with pack in games (that would also mess with the margins). Glad I checked in...

Potentially this maybe that. More weasel words. The figures were for the most part correct. But don't go by those documents. My grandparents, my Aunts and my Uncle bought 7800's, as well as I, but only I bought a SMS. I still have my Sega Master System.... Sonic and Mortal Combat is all I use it for. They had no desire to play my Sega.... They loved putting old 2600 carts in the 7800 and were happy as could be.... you don't know the market it seems... The 2600 players bought the 7800 and bought and used old 2600 carts... once again you don't get it. I guess if you take market forces into account you can potentially debunk the debunk of the potential debunker.

Edited February 15, 2018 by _The Doctor__

[Bill Loguidice]

97 million in profits? Maybe the numbers sold are real. who knows. Margins were really tight and I remember a crap ton of sales and promotions at a bottom dollar value at Strawbridge and Clothiers, Clovers, Hess's and the like. Clearing them out as fast as they could. Glad I checked in...

Potentially this maybe that. More weasel words. The figures were for the most part correct. But don't go by those documents. My grandparents, my Aunts and my Uncle bought 7800's, as well as I, but only I bought a SMS. I still have my Sega Master System.... Sonic and Mortal Combat is all I use it for. They had no desire to play my Sega.... They loved putting old 2600 carts in the 7800 and were happy as could be.... you don't know the market it seems... The 2600 players bought the 7800 and bought and used old 2600 carts... once again you don't get it. I guess if you take market forces into account you can potentially debunk the debunk of the potential debunker.

 

That's your response? OK.

[suspicious_milk]

The 7800 sold 4 million is concervitive. I don't know or care about SMS. Never even heard of it until after the Genesis.

 

Credible sources have already been sighted; and ignored by some, while anecdotal stories are elevated.

 

I'll paraphrase Mark Twain ...

 

Never argue with an idiot, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference.

[Bill Loguidice]

The 7800 sold 4 million is concervitive. I don't know or care about SMS. Never even heard of it until after the Genesis.

 

Credible sources have already been sighted; and ignored by some, while anecdotal stories are elevated.

 

I'll paraphrase Mark Twain ...

 

Never argue with an idiot, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference.

 

If, after reading that thread, you think "4 million is conservative," I just don't know what to say. I guess passion trumps all.

[_The Doctor__]

You would think a 'historian' would value paper and filings. I'm not sure what to make of you at all. I don't trust much of what you write anymore, as I've gone back to look at a few of your books. I can see why I didn't remember much of your work. Subjective, shallow, the quick answer. Some digging here and there. I wonder if you have someone do the actual digging and research, I can imagine the difficulty they must have getting straight information in. Self promotion appears to have gotten you further than maybe it should have. Hats off to you for turning a buck. I think you should run for office somewhere... You will do great! I wonder if there's a block function on the forum. I really need to shut the foolishness out. I'm sure I could ignore it, but it wastes my time sifting through it.

Edited February 15, 2018 by _The Doctor__

[Bill Loguidice]

You would think a 'historian' would value paper and filings. I'm not sure what to make of you at all. I don't trust much of what you write anymore, as I've gone back to look at a few of your books. I can see why I didn't remember much of your work. Subjective, shallow, the quick answer. Some digging here and there. I wonder if you have someone do the actual digging and research, I can imagine the difficulty they must have getting straight information in. Self promotion appears to have gotten you further than maybe it should have. Hats off to you for turning a buck. I think you should run for office somewhere... You will do great! I wonder if there's a block function on the forum. I really need to shut the foolishness out. I'm sure I could ignore it, but it wastes my time sifting through it.

 

There sure is a block function. Since I clearly bother you so much for whatever reason, it would certainly make sense for you to use it. I'd actually consider using it on you, but I don't do those kinds of things. You're anonymous anyway, with opinions of similar weight.

[_The Doctor__]

hhhmmm, you really are all about you. I wasn't going to go that far as others have stated... but they are indeed correct. I really wish you valued hard work and papers of record, but as you like to point out.. they mean nothing to you. Have fun being the armchair quarterback of revisionist and flawed history. In my humble opinion you're intellectually dis-honest and believe in your thoughts more than the factual information people present you. I don't know what's perfect, but I'll trust Curt's papers over you anytime. I'm pretty sure they were reviewed by accountants, the company, possibly the Government, and shareholders. I'm sure your better than all of those folks too. Have a good day.

 

 

I think this reverberates through peoples heads as you approach... OOOOHH NNOOOOOO it's Mr. Bill!

Thanks again for pointing me to this thread... had fun... loved seeing how it goes 'round you....

Edited February 15, 2018 by _The Doctor__

[Bill Loguidice]

hhhmmm, you really are all about you. I wasn't going to go that far as others have stated... but they are indeed correct. I really wish you valued hard work and papers of record, but as you like to point out.. they mean nothing to you. Have fun being the armchair quarterback of revisionist and flawed history. In my humble opinion you're intellectually dis-honest and believe in your thoughts more than the factual information people present you. I don't know what's perfect, but I'll trust Curt's papers over you anytime. I'm pretty sure they were reviewed by accountants, the company, possibly the Government, and shareholders. I'm sure your better than all of those folks too. Have a good day.

 

<super funny stuff snipped>

 

I think this reverberates through peoples heads as you approach... OOOOHH NNOOOOOO it's Mr. Bill!

Thanks again for pointing me to this thread... had fun... loved seeing how it goes 'round you....

 

You obviously didn't look through the thread if you keep saying what you're saying, but please, keep going. I'm sure it's entertaining to someone.

[_The Doctor__]

I took a casual look at the paper, the figures didn't include sales outside of the United States..... so maybe we need those figures added in as well. I knew if I looked at the documents again.. it would clear things up... Have some fun now.

I personally could care one way or another at this point. I'm sure you love to hear yourself talk. Enjoy.

Like I said, I take Curt's word and papers over you any day. No point in talking to you.

Edited February 15, 2018 by _The Doctor__

[Bill Loguidice]

I took a casual look at the paper, the figures didn't include sales outside of the United States..... so maybe we need those figures added in as well. I knew if I looked at the documents again.. it would clear things up... Have some fun now.

I personally could care one way or another at this point. I'm sure you love to hear yourself talk. Enjoy.

Like I said, I take Curt's word and papers over you any day. No point in talking to you.

 

You keep saying that I did the analysis and breakdown (I didn't) and that it's not based on the actual Atari numbers (it is). If, after genuinely reading through that thread you still think a console with limited advertising, limited distribution, a limited library, and few big name titles sold way better than the analysis and breakdown of Atari's own numbers seems to indicate, that's cool.

[_The Doctor__]

I think your possibly brain damaged... it had the full 2600 library to choose from.... I can't for the life of me understand how you can play so dumb about things. In any event placate yourself. I think I'm putting you in the troll bin. The thread title isn't even the system people are talking about. Started about the XE ended up about the 7800. Maybe that's the disconnect. I'm sure you have an equally bad outlook about both... so why bother trolling the Atari threads... There is a commodore section... that's where you can play with a sluggish stick and wax poetic, people will cheer you on. I'm moving on, but I'm sure you'll make the rounds to troll and push your tripe on another thread. Maybe that's your goal or game.

[Bill Loguidice]

I think your possibly brain damaged... it had the full 2600 library to choose from.... I can't for the life of me understand how you can play so dumb about things. In any event placate yourself. I think I'm putting you in the troll bin. The thread title isn't even the system people are talking about. Started about the XE ended up about the 7800. Maybe that's the disconnect. I'm sure you have an equally bad outlook about both... so why bother trolling the Atari threads... There is a commodore section... that's where you can play with a sluggish stick and wax poetic, people will cheer you on. I'm moving on, but I'm sure you'll make the rounds to troll and push your tripe on another thread. Maybe that's your goal or game.

 

Pro tip for this and your other posts: it's "you're," not "your."

 

If you think that Atari 2600 titles were a hot commodity to goose sales of a console in a major way in the 1986 - 1990 timeframe, then I don't think I'm the one with issues. And please, save the troll moniker for yourself.

 

Finally, as someone who literally wrote multiple article, books, and a movie on all kinds of Atari systems, and has owned practically every Atari system ever made, as well as presently works on Atari-branded products, please keep going down the path of me being biased against Atari. It makes perfect sense, because it's definitely not about you having zero patience for anything not 100% pro Atari at the expense of everything else, including facts. Most of us moved beyond the childhood notion of taking sides and can appreciate the positives and negatives of all vintage console and computing endeavors without falling back to personal insults. Most of us.

[+Stephen]

WTF is happening here? Guys, please both step away from your (hmm - didn't notice this one) computers and get some fresh air. Perhaps, get some THC infused smoky air. You're (see what I did there) both above this, and the damage it could cause your (see what I also did there) reputations is not worth it.

 

Let's not look like we wear this: