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Amiga 1200 vs Atari ST.


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#1 Major_Tom_coming_home OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Mar 3, 2018 8:38 PM

a few years ago the Garage Sale gods smiled upon me for all of my loyalty and devotion. I found a clean working Amiga 1200 + Amiga Monitor + lots of pirated software for $120. I thought I would never own an Amiga but holy fracking crap I do!!!... 

 

Now I find myself curious about the Atari ST, but the impression I get is that they mostly have the same game library and a game developed for one of them will often be ported to the other. That said, i'm curious to know if there are reasons to get both of them for gaming? The ST is great for music but I'm not really interested in that - it's all about the games :-).. 

 

 



#2 oracle_jedi OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Mar 3, 2018 11:34 PM

You're right.  With respect to original era commercial games, pretty much anything that was popular on the ST was ported to the Amiga with more or less the same graphics and often much improved music and sound effect.

 

There were exceptions, such as Oids, but they were few.

 

Beyond that, there are public domain/homebrew titles from then and now.  Last years Pole Position is an amazing example of what the STE can do.

 

Still, I imagine the number of titles you would find that were not ported to the Amiga, or simply better on the ST, would be a short list.



#3 ParanoidLittleMan OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Mar 4, 2018 2:53 AM

More interesting from this nonsense comparison (much later Amiga 1200 with 68020 vs. Atari ST :? ) would be to see how much of original Amiga 500 games work well on 1200 without patches, mods.



#4 CyranoJ ONLINE  

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Posted Sun Mar 4, 2018 3:09 AM

More interesting from this nonsense comparison (much later Amiga 1200 with 68020 vs. Atari ST :? ) would be to see how much of original Amiga 500 games work well on 1200 without patches, mods.

 

Possibly nearly all of them work now, thanks to a non-demo, fart-inflated polygon obsessed demo community.



#5 spacecadet OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Mar 4, 2018 2:02 PM

More interesting from this nonsense comparison (much later Amiga 1200 with 68020 vs. Atari ST :?

 

He didn't say which ST. "Atari ST" is just a generic term for the whole line, same way "Amiga" is. I took it as he got a specific Amiga, and is wondering if he should get *any* kind of Atari ST.



#6 Major_Tom_coming_home OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Mar 4, 2018 2:43 PM

Yeah, that was kind of absent minded of me. I knew there were different models but had a senior moment there...For a budget of up to about $200 I'm guessing the best model I could get would be the 520STFM.?  I know the fair comparison for the Amiga 1200 would be the Atari Falcon but if the current status of Ebay is an indication the Falcon is made of unicorn blood, fairy dust, and unobtainium.

 

 

 

He didn't say which ST. "Atari ST" is just a generic term for the whole line, same way "Amiga" is. I took it as he got a specific Amiga, and is wondering if he should get *any* kind of Atari ST.

 

 

He didn't say which ST. "Atari ST" is just a generic term for the whole line, same way "Amiga" is. I took it as he got a specific Amiga, and is wondering if he should get *any* kind of Atari ST.



#7 ParanoidLittleMan OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Mar 5, 2018 3:03 AM

Well, Falcon was manufactured in much smaller quantity than Amiga 1200, so normal that is now more expensive.

And retro computing is not about prices. It is not even about how good is graphic, scrolling on that machine. Some, mostly now older people just wants to run old, for them known SW. Some even like to make some program for oldie. Even if modern machines can do it 100x faster and with much more resolution, colors.

Indeed, if just gaming is aim, Amiga wins.

But I still don't know how good is compatibility of Amiga 1200 with Amiga 500 SW ...



#8 zzip OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Mar 5, 2018 8:50 AM

a few years ago the Garage Sale gods smiled upon me for all of my loyalty and devotion. I found a clean working Amiga 1200 + Amiga Monitor + lots of pirated software for $120. I thought I would never own an Amiga but holy fracking crap I do!!!... 
 
Now I find myself curious about the Atari ST, but the impression I get is that they mostly have the same game library and a game developed for one of them will often be ported to the other. That said, i'm curious to know if there are reasons to get both of them for gaming? The ST is great for music but I'm not really interested in that - it's all about the games :-)..


The commercial game library is much the same. Some games run identically on both, others the Amiga version is superior. The STe/Falcon could give Amiga more a run for its money, but games that support STe/Falcon features are a small minority.

There are some interesting ST shareware/homebrew games, but I'm not sure if it's worth owning for that

#9 tjlazer OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Mar 5, 2018 7:30 PM

I own both and unless you have some Nostaliga with the ST I would say you can pass!  The Amiga 1200 is a great machine that can run ALL Amiga software, even older Amiga 500 games!  (You do need some degrader tools or WHDLoad)



#10 Sugarland OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:04 PM

Pass as well. Stick with the A1200 it's a great machine. I hope you removed the old battery from it. The original batteries leak corrosive acid and ruin the computer. Maybe if you find something you'd really like to do on the ST line then get one.



#11 Keatah OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:09 PM

To directly answer the OP's question.. There's little or no reason to get the ST if you have the Amiga.



#12 MrMaddog OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:43 AM

To directly answer the OP's question.. There's little or no reason to get the ST if you have the Amiga.

 

And if you do have to run Atari ST applications (no games), you can also get something like the Medusa emulator or even an EmuTOS kickstart ROM to use.



#13 ParanoidLittleMan OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Mar 29, 2018 12:48 AM

What anti-Atarian talk is this ? Some enjoy doing it, obviously, in middle of Atari forum. There are many reasons to have Atari, regardless from having some Amiga or not. I could say: why having some prehistoric Amiga when I have 5000x faster PC ? This is not about power, how many colors you have in games and like.  For instance, I prefer some ST(E) to Falcon in gaming.



#14 Keatah OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Mar 29, 2018 1:35 AM

[..]

But I still don't know how good is compatibility of Amiga 1200 with Amiga 500 SW ...

 

I hear it needs work, and I do not have direct experience with that specific issue.



#15 DarkLord OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Mar 29, 2018 11:26 PM

Agree with PPera here. Love my ST's. Have owned several Amiga models.

 

They were...okay.

 

I'll keep my STacy, Mega ST, Mega STe, thank you very much.   :)



#16 English Invader OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Mar 30, 2018 4:21 AM

To directly answer the OP's question.. There's little or no reason to get the ST if you have the Amiga.

 

It depends on the games you want to play.  If you're looking at the ST purely in terms of how it runs Lemmings and Cannon Fodder, you're wasting your time but if you want to play games from the mid-late 80s without the bombastic sound of the Amiga (and with slightly faster processing time) you'll love the ST.

 

My #1 desert island game for the ST is Skulldiggery (a superb Boulderdash clone).  Sometimes I feel like it's worth having an ST for that game alone.  Also check out r0x, Giana Sisters STe and Super STario Land.


Edited by English Invader, Fri Mar 30, 2018 4:34 AM.


#17 high voltage OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Mar 30, 2018 8:54 AM

Goth both (1040, 1200), put prefer Amiga (sorry). For me, the Amiga is the real Atari 32 bitter (VCS, 800, Amiga).



#18 DarkLord OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Mar 30, 2018 12:00 PM

Goth both (1040, 1200), put prefer Amiga (sorry). For me, the Amiga is the real Atari 32 bitter (VCS, 800, Amiga).

 

Umm, comparing the A1200 to a 1040 is like comparing the Atari Falcon to the A500... Just sayin'. :)



#19 pacman000 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Mar 31, 2018 9:21 AM

 

This might be relevant.



#20 English Invader OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Mar 31, 2018 12:16 PM

 

This might be relevant.

 

Not really because he only plays popular post-1990 Amiga favourites on the video which is worse than useless for an Amiga fan who wants to know more about the ST because it will only ever lead to an unfavourable comparison without giving him/her the chance to see where the ST comes into its own.

 

I'm generally a big fan of Dan's videos but this one is a bit off the mark IMO.


Edited by English Invader, Sat Mar 31, 2018 12:18 PM.


#21 Christos OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Apr 2, 2018 12:28 PM

 

Not really because he only plays popular post-1990 Amiga favourites on the video which is worse than useless for an Amiga fan who wants to know more about the ST because it will only ever lead to an unfavourable comparison without giving him/her the chance to see where the ST comes into its own.

 

I'm generally a big fan of Dan's videos but this one is a bit off the mark IMO.

 

I found that video watchable, which is way better than what you see when Amiga users try to review the st. Truth is that in many games the ST gives the Amiga quite a run for its money, but most late games are better on the Amiga. It mostly depends on what you want to do with the machine. If it's gaming, then the amiga is better, if you want to explore more stuff then an ST is quite interesting.



#22 Foebane OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Apr 5, 2018 12:00 AM

#20

 

And where DOES the ST "come into its own"?

 

Every time I hear Atarians defend the ST over the Amiga, they usually spout how "the processing speed of the ST is faster", or "the ST can do MIDI" - I respond that "the Amiga custom chips make up exceedingly well for any shortfall in the processing speed, and essentially can do more stuff that the ST simply can't", and "what use is MIDI if you have to pay for an expensive secondary hardware add-on just to use it? I don't think many people have cheap MIDI keyboards".

 

And yes, I have owned an ST myself, so I'm not speaking from ignorance.



#23 atarian1 OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Apr 5, 2018 12:51 AM

"what use is MIDI if you have to pay for an expensive secondary hardware add-on just to use it? I don't think many people have cheap MIDI keyboards".

 

And yes, I have owned an ST myself, so I'm not speaking from ignorance.

 

Yes you are ignorant. The MIDI ports are built in already. What is this "expensive secondary hardware add-on" that you are talking about? :? I know you certainly need an expensive MIDI interface for the Amiga, but not the ST. You certainly can use professional (i.e. expensive) keyboards reliably with the built in MIDI ports. That's why it was so popular with professional and amateur musicians. :music:


Edited by atarian1, Thu Apr 5, 2018 12:53 AM.


#24 Foebane OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Apr 5, 2018 1:12 AM

 

What is this "expensive secondary hardware add-on" that you are talking about? You certainly can use professional (i.e. expensive) keyboards reliably with the built in MIDI ports. That's why it was so popular with professional and amateur musicians. :music:

 

The keyboards are what I mean. How many people bought an Atari ST and then decided to buy a MIDI keyboard to go with it? Did I not make that obvious? I'm sure the price doubled to at least £600 with both!



#25 Christos OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Apr 5, 2018 2:16 AM

 

Yes you are ignorant. The MIDI ports are built in already. What is this "expensive secondary hardware add-on" that you are talking about? :? I know you certainly need an expensive MIDI interface for the Amiga, but not the ST. You certainly can use professional (i.e. expensive) keyboards reliably with the built in MIDI ports. That's why it was so popular with professional and amateur musicians. :music:

 

I would ignore Foebane really.






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