Jump to content

Photo

Which Videomod at 2609


50 replies to this topic

#26 JohnPCAE OFFLINE  

JohnPCAE

    Moonsweeper

  • 477 posts

Posted Mon Aug 20, 2018 6:21 PM

One of the things on my to-do list is to build one I designed that has the RCA connectors directly on the board. The intent is to minimize noise and create a package that can also fit in an Inty II. This one is laid out for tantalum capacitors rather than electrolytic.

 

https://oshpark.com/...ojects/HWSQGhNd



#27 Ikrananka OFFLINE  

Ikrananka

    River Patroller

  • 2,796 posts
  • Location:Canada

Posted Tue Aug 21, 2018 9:29 AM

One of the things on my to-do list is to build one I designed that has the RCA connectors directly on the board. The intent is to minimize noise and create a package that can also fit in an Inty II. This one is laid out for tantalum capacitors rather than electrolytic.

 

https://oshpark.com/...ojects/HWSQGhNd

 

Well this has convinced me to hold off on buying a composite mod for now.  Do you plan on progressing this in the near future?

 

How would you propose mounting this in an Inty I (2609)? 



#28 -^CrožBow^- ONLINE  

-^CrožBow^-

    Quadrunner

  • 6,592 posts
  • Collector of Fine Atari and Sega Antiquities!
  • Location:Ivory Tower, Fantasia (Oklahoma)

Posted Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:18 PM

One of the things on my to-do list is to build one I designed that has the RCA connectors directly on the board. The intent is to minimize noise and create a package that can also fit in an Inty II. This one is laid out for tantalum capacitors rather than electrolytic.

 

https://oshpark.com/...ojects/HWSQGhNd

 

The current composite mod kits out there now fit in the model II ? 

 

And how does putting the RCAs on the PCB prevent noise? Unless you mean because there aren't any wire leads from a PCB to the AV jacks? I find this to be pretty much a non-issue. Having said that, I do try and keep the wires as short as I can in places and always try to run the audio/video out opposite of where the power is located whenever possible.



#29 Ikrananka OFFLINE  

Ikrananka

    River Patroller

  • 2,796 posts
  • Location:Canada

Posted Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:32 PM

And how does putting the RCAs on the PCB prevent noise? Unless you mean because there aren't any wire leads from a PCB to the AV jacks? I find this to be pretty much a non-issue. Having said that, I do try and keep the wires as short as I can in places and always try to run the audio/video out opposite of where the power is located whenever possible.

 

I wonder if this is where most issues arise with the Inty composite mods, e.g. vertical bars in solid colours, due to it being placed below the power board.  I've seen examples of quite a few placing the composite board in this location.


Edited by Ikrananka, Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:32 PM.


#30 -^CrožBow^- ONLINE  

-^CrožBow^-

    Quadrunner

  • 6,592 posts
  • Collector of Fine Atari and Sega Antiquities!
  • Location:Ivory Tower, Fantasia (Oklahoma)

Posted Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:42 PM

 

I wonder if this is where most issues arise with the Inty composite mods, e.g. vertical bars in solid colours, due to it being placed below the power board.  I've seen examples of quite a few placing the composite board in this location.

 

Wouldn't know because that isn't where I install it. I install the actual board near the RF modulate and velcro it down ontop of the ICs in that area that don't get hot. I then run the actual AV jacks and wiring buy the cartridge slot and out the lower half of the shell on the back left side of the case. 

 

I've never understood the directions to run it in the power board area. Same for the RGB boards. I get it...there is a LOT of empty space there. But that space is to push the power cord into the console when not in use and you certainly don't want to do that if you have the mod board and wiring in there because pushing the power cord up into that space is very likely to get caught on the wiring you have in place and pull it loose. 

 

I don't have vertical bars on the composite mods I've done on the Intellys. Only issue is that my Sony does weird stuff with the brightness when I play a game that didn't happen on my old Samsung and not on CRTs. But that is an issue with my TV and the way the signal is handled by it from the Intellivision. Though I haven't tested this with my new Extron setup. I've heard of the colors being off? but personally I can't tell. Likely because I'm partially color blind anyway, and also because the RF is just so damn dark compared to the composite in most cases that it is just no contest for me. I have only one console that puts out an RF signal nearly as good as the composite and that is my stock Colecovision. I have one that is unmodded and that is because it produces excellent RF quality. The other consoles..ehh..not so much compared to other mods I've done.

 

I think I'm going to purchase one of those mod boards you posted off Ebay as that is currently the cheapest and most available route to go it looks like. Be curious to compare the results on it with others I've seen and installed.


Edited by -^CrožBow^-, Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:43 PM.


#31 JohnPCAE OFFLINE  

JohnPCAE

    Moonsweeper

  • 477 posts

Posted Tue Aug 21, 2018 4:36 PM

That's the idea with the RF connectors: eliminate the leads and any chance of anything causing interference along them. I have one of the mods from Turkey and the first thing that jumped out me was the thin, unshielded wires it came with.

 

As for the Inty II, this is intended to fit in the empty area alongside the cartridge port. It has holes for attaching mounting screws from underneath. As for the Inty 1, there appears to be lots of room to accommodate the board.

 

Will it actually work in the Inty II? That's one thing I intend to find out ;) I've started building the board, but I'm waiting on some resistors to arrive in the mail.


Edited by JohnPCAE, Tue Aug 21, 2018 4:37 PM.


#32 iesposta OFFLINE  

iesposta

    River Patroller

  • 3,855 posts
  • Retro-gaming w/my VCS
  • Location:Pennsylvania

Posted Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:10 AM

Since the retrofixes INTV RGB is out of stock, if I were to build the one with the 2 ICs SN74AC32 and 74HCT244N,
do you recommend 1/4W 5% resistors, or is there a benefit of higher W and/or 1% tolerance?

Thanks.

#33 Ikrananka OFFLINE  

Ikrananka

    River Patroller

  • 2,796 posts
  • Location:Canada

Posted Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:48 AM

Since the retrofixes INTV RGB is out of stock, if I were to build the one with the 2 ICs SN74AC32 and 74HCT244N,
do you recommend 1/4W 5% resistors, or is there a benefit of higher W and/or 1% tolerance?

 

As far as I can tell, the Retrofixes mod is not out of stock : https://store.retrof...kit-coming-soon

 

I wondered too about the tolerance of the resistors but doubt it has much impact.  The mod from Turkey uses 5% while Retrofixes uses 2%.

 

What I find more interesting is the resistance values these mods are using.  Looking at the photos of the resistors on the boards (eBay retro_mood, retrofixes.com and eBay v3*mod) I have done my best to tabulate the resistance values chosen and compared them to what Joe Zbiciak (Intellivision Wiki) recommends.

 

Inty Mods.png

 

The standouts for me are that the Retrofixes mod doesn't use a 51K resistor.  The value is a hard to tell from the photo but as far as I can tell it is nowhere near 51K.  Could this be what causes some to have oversaturated colours and jail bars I wonder?

 

Secondly, both RetroMood and Retrofixes use differing resistances instead of the 22Ω resistor.  Joe does state in his design that some people may experience colour shift near the top of the image and that tweaking the 22Ω resistor higher has been found to alleviate the problem (via a potentiometer).  So, my guess is that in their testing the 47Ω and 27Ω worked best for them with their particular test setups.  BUT, based on Joe's statement, wouldn't it be best to replace the 22Ω resistor in these boards with a potentiometer so that images can be optimised after the install.

 

The variations around the 660Ω resistor are within tolerance and are likely to have negligible effect on the output image.

 

What I would love to see is a board design that includes a potentiometer instead of the 22Ω resistor AND a place to install an optional 2000µF capacitor between +5V and GND which has been reported as helping solve smearing of bright areas.  Anyone?  :) 


Edited by Ikrananka, Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:48 AM.


#34 iesposta OFFLINE  

iesposta

    River Patroller

  • 3,855 posts
  • Retro-gaming w/my VCS
  • Location:Pennsylvania

Posted Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:47 PM

 

As far as I can tell, the Retrofixes mod is not out of stock : https://store.retrof...kit-coming-soon

 

I wondered too about the tolerance of the resistors but doubt it has much impact. ...  :) 

 

Sorry, I meant RetroRGB. That site is out of the Intellivision RGB mod boards.

 

Thanks for the additional resistance information.

 

If I'm going to build one, I think I'll use 1% tolerance on the 75 ohm resistors, and 10% tolerance on the others.

It seems video to displays really like 75 ohms.

And you're also right to mention that there should be variable adjustable resistance where it affects the output picture, because personal preference and every display will display will differ.



#35 -^CrožBow^- ONLINE  

-^CrožBow^-

    Quadrunner

  • 6,592 posts
  • Collector of Fine Atari and Sega Antiquities!
  • Location:Ivory Tower, Fantasia (Oklahoma)

Posted Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:50 PM

Wanted to followup that I just installed one of the composite boards from the guy in Turkey. (Last one I had on hand..). and the brightness issues with it changing that I've observed in the past is NO longer happening since I changed out my AV setup and use an Extron AV selector for my analog stuff. So it appears that issue was due to either my JVC s700 selector I was using previously, or the s-vid/cvbs to HDMI upscaler I was using...or both. Either way that issue is a goner with my current setup now. I had previously thought it was my TV causing this and I'm glad to know that isn't the case either.

 

Also, I did order two of the boards from the ebay auction lined on the previous page. They seem well made and arrived in 3 days to my house. They are smaller than I've seen before so they fit in a lot of places easily. Also, they do NOT come with any wire which, isn't that big a deal since you can use whatever you want in that regard. But the via openings for the wiring to go into is smaller than standard vias. So it would be tricky to use 24ga and larger in the openings I think. My Tandyvision has really bad RF so it might be the first candidate to try one of these composite AV boards. But in looking it over it seems to use the same scheme as the one in the Wiki... so I expect similar results to the others I've tried.



#36 Ikrananka OFFLINE  

Ikrananka

    River Patroller

  • 2,796 posts
  • Location:Canada

Posted Fri Aug 31, 2018 4:55 PM

Also, I did order two of the boards from the ebay auction lined on the previous page. They seem well made and arrived in 3 days to my house. They are smaller than I've seen before so they fit in a lot of places easily. Also, they do NOT come with any wire which, isn't that big a deal since you can use whatever you want in that regard. But the via openings for the wiring to go into is smaller than standard vias. So it would be tricky to use 24ga and larger in the openings I think. My Tandyvision has really bad RF so it might be the first candidate to try one of these composite AV boards. But in looking it over it seems to use the same scheme as the one in the Wiki... so I expect similar results to the others I've tried.

 

Will be interesting to see what these are like once installed.  It does indeed use the same Wiki schematic and sticks to the Wiki recommended resistor values, whereas the others have increased the final 22ohm resistor to higher values to tweak the image quality.  Let us know how it goes and what you think.



#37 iesposta OFFLINE  

iesposta

    River Patroller

  • 3,855 posts
  • Retro-gaming w/my VCS
  • Location:Pennsylvania

Posted Mon Sep 3, 2018 9:53 AM

I’ve ordered an RGB board from the designer who makes them for RetroRGB. 

I have to install it myself.

He is very busy with other hardware that is in demand by lots of gamers, so I’ll get it when I get it. Not a problem. 

 

Anyone interested in Intellivision RGB, he mentioned he may make a few and that they will be on eBay before December 25, 2018. 

 

Now I have an original ’79 - ’80 USA Intellivision with perfect RF for CRT gaming, and will have an Intellivision II with RGB for modern and future displays. 



#38 Ikrananka OFFLINE  

Ikrananka

    River Patroller

  • 2,796 posts
  • Location:Canada

Posted Mon Sep 3, 2018 11:20 AM

I’ve ordered an RGB board from the designer who makes them for RetroRGB. 

I have to install it myself.

He is very busy with other hardware that is in demand by lots of gamers, so I’ll get it when I get it. Not a problem. 

 

Anyone interested in Intellivision RGB, he mentioned he may make a few and that they will be on eBay before December 25, 2018. 

 

Just be aware that this RGB mod will not work with an OSSC.  Discussion on this is here.



#39 -^CrožBow^- ONLINE  

-^CrožBow^-

    Quadrunner

  • 6,592 posts
  • Collector of Fine Atari and Sega Antiquities!
  • Location:Ivory Tower, Fantasia (Oklahoma)

Posted Tue Sep 4, 2018 9:59 AM

 

Just be aware that this RGB mod will not work with an OSSC.  Discussion on this is here.

 

I haven't look at how the RGB is broken out on the connection side for this? It just using a mini din to scart or something along long lines? I'm asking because with my Extron in the mix, it is possible that I could get the Intelly RGB to work provided I have break out cables for the RGB and Sync. That way the Extron is handling the video signal and outputs everything to VGA analog that the OSSC seems to like just fine.



#40 JohnPCAE OFFLINE  

JohnPCAE

    Moonsweeper

  • 477 posts

Posted Wed Oct 3, 2018 6:30 PM

I finally installed my composite mod in my Inty II, and it works ;-)  The circuit is identical to the Turkish mod, with the exception that mine is designed for unpolarized Tantalum capacitors instead of electrolytic ones. I found that while the prototype will fit, it really needed the mounting screws shifted a bit for better fitment and more clearance from circuit pads. For what it's worth, here is a link to the final version:

 

https://oshpark.com/...ojects/T4uK2inN

 

For mounting, I used 3/8" nylon standoffs, with mounting screws going in from the bottom of the case and from above at the circuit board (total of 8 screws required).

Attached Thumbnails

  • Inty II Composite Mod.jpg

Edited by JohnPCAE, Wed Oct 3, 2018 6:31 PM.


#41 JohnPCAE OFFLINE  

JohnPCAE

    Moonsweeper

  • 477 posts

Posted Fri Oct 19, 2018 3:22 PM

Edit to the above post: it requires unpolarized MLCC 100µF capactors, NOT Tantalum ones.


Edited by JohnPCAE, Fri Oct 19, 2018 3:23 PM.


#42 -^CrožBow^- ONLINE  

-^CrožBow^-

    Quadrunner

  • 6,592 posts
  • Collector of Fine Atari and Sega Antiquities!
  • Location:Ivory Tower, Fantasia (Oklahoma)

Posted Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:58 AM

Okay...so previously I had mentioned that I had purchased two of the composite mod boards from the v3 modders seller on ebay. I installed them last night into an Intelly 2. Not I said I installed them? That is because the first one produces a black n white picture like the colorburst is missing. But it isn't consistent because you can reset the intelly 2 and sometimes there will be color. But always when first powered on, you get black n white. So wondering if it was the board or my wire wore, I installed the second one I ordered. That one gives color each and every time. So it would appear that one of the mod boards I ordered from v3 isn't working properly. Or at least not on this Intelly 2 I'm trying to get modded.

 

Now..how do they look? Well...not that great to be honest. There is lots of ghosting in the overall images across all colors not just white. I didn't notice any color shifting on the top edge of the image but the overall noise and ghosting in the image just...yeah... I'm not happy with it.

 

I wish retrofixes would get them back in stock again unless they have decided to stop offering them? Because at this point the guy in Turkey is the only other verified decent board left to order. But he takes 2 months from ordering to in your mailbox delivery time and he recently increased the cost of his boards a considerable amount compared to the other solutions.

 

so disappointed.. 



#43 mthompson ONLINE  

mthompson

    Dragonstomper

  • 854 posts
  • Location:Northern Illinois, USA

Posted Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:31 AM

I ordered a few from the seller in Turkey not long ago, and they arrived in about 2 weeks. So maybe at least that has improved.



#44 DZ-Jay OFFLINE  

DZ-Jay

    Quadrunner

  • 11,644 posts
  • The P-Machinery AGE is almost here!
  • Location:NC, USA

Posted Sat Oct 27, 2018 6:54 AM

I just saw this thread in the forum and read it as "Witch Videomod at 2609," which sounds like some quirky Halloween-themed game.  Man, now I wish someone made that game. :(

 

    -dZ.



#45 -^CrožBow^- ONLINE  

-^CrožBow^-

    Quadrunner

  • 6,592 posts
  • Collector of Fine Atari and Sega Antiquities!
  • Location:Ivory Tower, Fantasia (Oklahoma)

Posted Sat Oct 27, 2018 11:57 AM

I ordered a few from the seller in Turkey not long ago, and they arrived in about 2 weeks. So maybe at least that has improved.

 

From his website of through ebay?

 

When I try to purchase from his website PayPal denies the transaction yet I have plenty in my PP account to cover...so...that's odd?

 

**Update** so I was able to purchase and pay via PayPal through ebay with no issues. However they cost more that way because from his website he offers free shipping whereas the shipping is $20 through Ebay!!! Still I gotta see if the v3 boards are issue or if Intelly model 2s just don't AV mod as well as model 1 units do.


Edited by -^CrožBow^-, Sat Oct 27, 2018 12:01 PM.


#46 mthompson ONLINE  

mthompson

    Dragonstomper

  • 854 posts
  • Location:Northern Illinois, USA

Posted Sat Oct 27, 2018 12:11 PM

I ordered through his website because it was a little cheaper that way.

 

I'll be curious to hear how the mod works for you on your Intellivision II. I intend to install an AV mod on mine, but I haven't gotten around to it.



#47 -^CrožBow^- ONLINE  

-^CrožBow^-

    Quadrunner

  • 6,592 posts
  • Collector of Fine Atari and Sega Antiquities!
  • Location:Ivory Tower, Fantasia (Oklahoma)

Posted Sat Oct 27, 2018 2:05 PM

I ordered through his website because it was a little cheaper that way.

 

 

Interesting..again that was the way I originally tried to order them but PayPal kept telling me they wouldn't authorize the transaction from my account. But again, through his ebay auction listing...no problem at all and it went right through. wonder if there is something PayPal doesn't like with me trying to order it from his website. I'd never gotten the message like that before and I know that in the past I did order direct from his website. Oh well, hopefully it doesn't 2 months like last time.



#48 -^CrožBow^- ONLINE  

-^CrožBow^-

    Quadrunner

  • 6,592 posts
  • Collector of Fine Atari and Sega Antiquities!
  • Location:Ivory Tower, Fantasia (Oklahoma)

Posted Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:57 PM

Guess I'm not going to be able to afford to order any more mods from the guy in Turkey. I place an order just the other day for 2 boards from his ebay store and received shipping notification today on them. Someone commented on my YT channel about not ordering from this guy because they had not received their AV boards yet and he apparently wasn't communicating anymore. And then...I go to check his ebay store and look at this?!

 

https://www.ebay.com...872.m2749.l2649

 

Get a load of the price hike?! What in the actual....?!



#49 JohnPCAE OFFLINE  

JohnPCAE

    Moonsweeper

  • 477 posts

Posted Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:22 PM

That's crazy. The cost for the bare PCB should be around $3 to $4 given the size, and it's not as if the components are at all expensive. I guess you could build my version if you wanted to. The circuit is identical. For what it's worth, these are the RCA connectors it would take:

 

yellow: https://www.mouser.c...ItvDW4M8xvx2XY=

black: https://www.mouser.c...vBsNHR2KsS%2bQ=

 

capacitors: https://www.mouser.c...2bHGz2Y2ZUoOA==

 

Resistors are just the run-of-the-mill 1/4W type and the transistors are a dime a dozen.


Edited by JohnPCAE, Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:27 PM.


#50 Ikrananka OFFLINE  

Ikrananka

    River Patroller

  • 2,796 posts
  • Location:Canada

Posted Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:23 AM

Wow - I guess the guy in Turkey doesn't want to sell any more.

 

I've just finished putting together some composite video PCB designs for my personal use on an Odyssey 2.  I'll put one together for the Inty and will share it on OshPark so that anyone can make their own.  Also happy to put some together with components and sell them at cost (plus a few dollars for my time) here on AA if there's any demand.

 

Here's an example of one of those I've completed for the Odyssey 2.

 

O2T2small.png






0 user(s) are browsing this forum

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users