Porky's for Vic 20?

[imstarryeyed]

Just searching for random stuff on Ebay and I found this listing from some seller called "80sKid" who appears to be selling a few Vic 20 carts that look like they might be prototypes.

 

The interesting one here is the one called Porky's.. Has anyone heard of that game mentioned on ads or magazines? I knew about the 2600 version but did not know that there was possibly a Vic 20 version.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/COMMODORE-VIC-20-Porkys-Computer-War-Games-Tank-Commander-cartridges-THORN-EMI/222132417178?hash=item33b81fb29a:g:y7kAAOSwR5dXSWCT#viTabs_0

 

I did not see any pictures of it running just a screenshot of the chips and board which do looks like they are old and from that time.

 

I was wondering if anyone else had any information about this game?

 

 

[carlsson]

It appears these cartridges have been for sale for at least 1.5 years, and the seller already back then promised to test them but apparently nothing has happened.

http://sleepingelephant.com/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=8028

 

Regarding the other two cartridges, at least Computer War in cartridge form has been dumped though it is commonly available as a tape release.

[imstarryeyed]

Thank you for the insight... yeah it would seem a bit suspicious that after all of the time the seller has not yet tested... my best guess is that he/she has tested it and it does not work but does not want to say that as it may affect their selling price.

 

It would be great to see what this game would look like one day if possible.

[carlsson]

Porky's was made both for the Atari 2600 and the Atari 8-bit computers, though the latter seems only to have been released on erasable ECPC cartridges through Romox. Atarimania speculates that Romox picked up the 8-bit computer version when 20th Century Fox decided to not publish it. Romox for that matter also published proper VIC-20 cartridges like Princess and Frog, Typo and Anteater.

 

After a closer study, it looks like the cartridge shell for the Porky's game could be the same one used by Sega. At first I assumed it would be Thorn EMI just like the other three and had prepared a long text about how it would be atypical for them as a UK company to obtain licensing rights to an US movie but it seems to have been a false start from me.

Compare this picture stolen from a 10 year old sales thread, originally posted by user Atarivision:

with the image on eBay (that may or may not like hot linking, we'll see):

 

Of course a loose PCB might fit any shell, in particular if the holes in the back were drilled after production. I haven't been able to find an image of a Sega cartridge from the back side nor a loose PCB to compare. At least Sega and 20th Century Fox in modern times have some common references, though I don't know about back then. Also as I understand Sega published games for both Atari 2600 and Atari 8-bit, they may just as well have been related to Porky's on these systems too if these circumstantial evidences are anything to go by.

[Rareusgold]

Porky's was made both for the Atari 2600 and the Atari 8-bit computers, though the latter seems only to have been released on erasable ECPC cartridges through Romox. Atarimania speculates that Romox picked up the 8-bit computer version when 20th Century Fox decided to not publish it. Romox for that matter also published proper VIC-20 cartridges like Princess and Frog, Typo and Anteater.

 

After a closer study, it looks like the cartridge shell for the Porky's game could be the same one used by Sega. At first I assumed it would be Thorn EMI just like the other three and had prepared a long text about how it would be atypical for them as a UK company to obtain licensing rights to an US movie but it seems to have been a false start from me.

Compare this picture stolen from a 10 year old sales thread, originally posted by user Atarivision:

with the image on eBay (that may or may not like hot linking, we'll see):

 

Of course a loose PCB might fit any shell, in particular if the holes in the back were drilled after production. I haven't been able to find an image of a Sega cartridge from the back side nor a loose PCB to compare. At least Sega and 20th Century Fox in modern times have some common references, though I don't know about back then. Also as I understand Sega published games for both Atari 2600 and Atari 8-bit, they may just as well have been related to Porky's on these systems too if these circumstantial evidences are anything to go by.

 

These are in fact Protos. I have not tested yet. I opened two and it is an eprom cart. It did not have a sticker on the window. So I did not want to photograph. The second one had a sticker it did look like a regular chip. I will test them and let everyone know what is on them as soon as I figure out where the hell my Vic 20 is! I have one somewhere. I have no idea why the guy would not have opened or tried to test them as he could have increased the value 5 fold or more if he had spent the $30 to get a Vic 20. But, hey one mans loss is anothers gain!

[carlsson]

I understand your anxiiety regarding chips without protective stickers, though in my experience it takes a good deal of UV light to even partially erase or damage the content. Of course any piece of opaque tape would protect the window, if you don't have a suitable sticker at hand. Not that taking pictures of the PCB's say very much, except possible for comparison with known carts from various publishers.

[rpiguy9907]

SOLD!

[Rareusgold]

I understand your anxiiety regarding chips without protective stickers, though in my experience it takes a good deal of UV light to even partially erase or damage the content. Of course any piece of opaque tape would protect the window, if you don't have a suitable sticker at hand. Not that taking pictures of the PCB's say very much, except possible for comparison with known carts from various publishers.

I am not a technical computer person. So I wasnt sure as to how much UV light takes to erase the EPROMs. But I see that one of the games was released. Maybe its Computer War. Those might be regular chips and just a prototype that was used for testing where as Porkies and Tank Command might be EPROMs. I bought stickers I just have not had the time to do anything more.

[carlsson]

Yes, both Computer War and Tank Commander are known Thorn EMI games. Those shells also are slightly different than the fourth one with the hand written label.

[Rareusgold]

I saw Tank Wars but not Commander in the released list. And it didnt look like Thorn was the company that released it?

 

Yes, both Computer War and Tank Commander are known Thorn EMI games. Those shells also are slightly different than the fourth one with the hand written label.

[carlsson]

Hm, you're right. Tank Commander seems only to have been released on cassette for 8K expanded computer through Creative Sparks, which was the subsequent label to Thorn EMI somehow, lots of games share credits between those two labels.

 

Here is a tape copy for sale: https://www.sellmyretro.com/offer/details/tank-commander-16706

 

So in the sense finding a version of the game running from cartridge, it might be special.

[+Psionic]

On 4/3/2018 at 7:29 PM, carlsson said:

Porky's was made both for the Atari 2600 and the Atari 8-bit computers, though the latter seems only to have been released on erasable ECPC cartridges through Romox. Atarimania speculates that Romox picked up the 8-bit computer version when 20th Century Fox decided to not publish it.

The same thing happened with M*A*S*H, although the irony with that one is the 8-bit version was never published by Fox even thought it was the original version of the game that the other ports (2600, TI-99, etc) were based on.  The author of the original 8-bit version actually wasn't even aware Fox had commissioned other versions of the game until relatively recently.
 

Quote

After a closer study, it looks like the cartridge shell for the Porky's game could be the same one used by Sega...

Of course a loose PCB might fit any shell, in particular if the holes in the back were drilled after production. I haven't been able to find an image of a Sega cartridge from the back side nor a loose PCB to compare. At least Sega and 20th Century Fox in modern times have some common references, though I don't know about back then. Also as I understand Sega published games for both Atari 2600 and Atari 8-bit, they may just as well have been related to Porky's on these systems too if these circumstantial evidences are anything to go by.

Sega and Sirius did appear to use the same supplier for their PCBs and cartridge shells (Boone Software used them as well) so they're all quite similar, but there's really no connection beyond that.  Fox and Sirius had a working relationship as you may know, but Sega had nothing to do with Porky's or any of the other Fox titles.  I'm not sure who would've developed a VIC-20 conversion.  Fox had in-house development but also used several subcontractors.  I actually tracked down the guys who did Fox's ColecoVision titles just recently, so I'll see if they know anything. 

I didn't see this auction so I don't know what the prototype looked like.  There are actually two variations of Sega cartridges for the VIC.  One variation has screws on the back of the cartridge and the other has them under the label.  The Boone games basically used a generic version of the first variation (minus the Sega logo on the back).  The Sirius cartridges were probably a retooled version of the second variation.

Did anything else come of this?  Does the game work?
 

 

[carlsson]

Unless I'm mistaken, the eBay listing was won by Rareusgold as above. The listing thus has expired but the hot linked image remains as you can see in my post #4 above. I don't know if the cartridge itself has moved or even been tested.

Edited August 7, 2019 by carlsson

[+Psionic]

3 minutes ago, carlsson said:

Unless I'm mistaken, the eBay listing belonged to Rareusgold as above. The listing has expired but the hot linked image remains as you can see in my post #4 above. I don't know if the cartridge itself has moved or even been tested.

Per his post above, Rareusgold appears to have been the buyer not the seller.  The listing has been removed from eBay (in the U.S. anyway) and your hotlinked image isn't appearing, at least not on my computer.

[Rareusgold]

10 minutes ago, carlsson said:

Unless I'm mistaken, the eBay listing was won by Rareusgold as above. The listing thus has expired but the hot linked image remains as you can see in my post #4 above. I don't know if the cartridge itself has moved or even been tested.

I have never had a chance to test. Life got in the way and pulling out a VIC 20 was lost in life. I still have them and will let everyone know when I get a chance to get around to testing. NES Black Box and Wata has gotten in the way. But, I think those things are all good for us collectors out here. 

[carlsson]

4 minutes ago, Psionic said:

your hotlinked image isn't appearing

Hm, odd because it shows up on my computer. Let's try to hot link it again, look for the cartridge to the top left.

 

[+Psionic]

14 minutes ago, Rareusgold said:

I have never had a chance to test. Life got in the way and pulling out a VIC 20 was lost in life. I still have them and will let everyone know when I get a chance to get around to testing. NES Black Box and Wata has gotten in the way. But, I think those things are all good for us collectors out here. 

I can understand that but you should at least test and dump the cartridge ASAP.  Assuming it does work in the first place it's not going to suddenly fail altogether, but the chances of a few bytes here and there going bad are somewhat high.  NES black boxes are cool but not all that important compared to a one-of-one prototype.  Just sayin'...
 

11 minutes ago, carlsson said:

Hm, odd because it shows up on my computer. Let's try to hot link it again, look for the cartridge to the top left.

Doesn't work, there's nothing there.  Just save the image and repost it.  I really have no idea why anyone would hotlink an image in 2019.

[carlsson]

Ok, I don't know what could be different but here the image goes for a third time:

 

[+Psionic]

Yes, that's probably a generic version of the first Sega shell I mentioned above.  It's a tight squeeze, but a socketed EPROM board will fit inside that shell.  Sega actually used (soldered) EPROMs in early copies of their games (Star Trek, Congo Bongo & Buck Rogers).

[Tempest]

Wow missed this post the first time around.  

 

It's amazing how such an average to crappy game based on an adult movie of mild popularity got ported to so many systems.  Did TCF really think Porky's was that big a hit?

[+Psionic]

On 8/7/2019 at 11:46 AM, Tempest said:

It's amazing how such an average to crappy game based on an adult movie of mild popularity got ported to so many systems.  Did TCF really think Porky's was that big a hit?

It is crazy how much time and money they spent porting some of these games to every platform imaginable.  Of course, I'd imagine they spent quite a bit on some of these licenses and wanted to take full advantage of it.  Still, it would've been nice had they devoted some of that energy towards something original instead of just cranking out all these ports. 

[carlsson]

After reading DoctorSpuds' blog on the 2600 games released by 20th Century Fox, I got a good feeling that they were desperate to get some IP to base their games upon, let it be already 20+ year old long forgotten movies that they happened to already have the intellectual rights to, or something new and obscure. They didn't seem very convinced that a game could sell on its own merits, or perhaps that money and time should be invested in coming up with playable and ideally original games.

[+Psionic]

16 hours ago, carlsson said:

They didn't seem very convinced that a game could sell on its own merits, or perhaps that money and time should be invested in coming up with playable and ideally original games.

Not that much different from the movie industry I suppose, especially these days.  These studios keep cranking out remakes and sequels but amazingly enough a lot of people keep paying money to watch them.

Fox Video Games started a satellite office in Chicago at one point and hired a couple of ex-Bally programmers to work on ColecoVision games.  After speaking with one of these guys, my impression of the people running the show back in California is that they were artsy-fartsy, pie-in-the-sky types (probably from the film industry) with little business acumen and no clue about video games in general.

I also spoke with the programmer of the original Porky's VCS game (which was developed outside Fox) several years ago, and he told me the Fox people were impressed that his company was able to come up with a decent game with any kind of actual storyline.  And they did put a decent effort into the game, actually hiring a Disney animator to do the game graphics.  They also developed a custom chip that accelerated sprite computations but Fox would not spend the additional money on this chip, so that bit the dust.

 

[carlsson]

Btw, the 2600 games I was referring to would be Alligator People (never released but named after a movie from 1959), Crash Dive (1983, named after a movie from 1943 ??), Earth Dies Screaming (1983, named after a movie from 1964), Fantastic Voyage (1982, named after a movie from 1966) and Space Master X-7 (1983, named after a movie from 1958). Possibly Flash Gordon (1983) doesn't belong on the list since its IP was used in a movie as recently before as 1980 so it still could be "current" in the eyes of the consumers.

 

Of course 20th Century Fox made games based on more recent IP like M*A*S*H and the unreleased Planet of the Apes, not to mention Porky's as discussed in this thread but to have 1/5 of their 2600 output being based on or named after 15-40 year old movies which probably most people already had forgotten about, not to mention the 10-15 year olds actually playing video games never heard of, is quite a lot. Today I can't think of any major video game publisher deciding to put out new games based on movies from the late 1990's no matter how popular those movies were in the first place.

[+Psionic]

19 minutes ago, carlsson said:

Crash Dive (1983, named after a movie from 1943 ??)

That one was originally supposed to be based on Irwin Allen's Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea but apparently there was a problem with the license and the title was changed.

But I agree, they definitely were scraping the bottom of the barrel looking for movie titles to badge the games with.