Help with paddles

[easmith]

I recently acquired a used VCS from amazon( mine was given away long ago by my parents) .It works pretty

well , although sometimes I have to seat the carts a few times for them to be read .

I ordered some paddles , but returned them as defective because the player one paddle was defective Aaa .

Then I ordered another set of paddles . Damn if these did not have the same problem : the player 2 paddle functions correctly , but the player 1 paddle does not : the button works but spinning the paddle does not register .

1. Did I get unlucky with 2 sets of paddles having the same defect ?

2. Could it be a problem with the console hardware ?,

3. If it is a paddle defect , is there a way to repair it?

 

Thanks !

[+SpiceWare]

Could be a cracked solder joint on the controller port. Same problem and as seen in this reply #4 about a faulty power socket.

[easmith]

Could be a cracked solder joint on the controller port. Same problem and as seen in this reply #4 about a faulty power socket.

Thanks . Where specifically would I look for this controller port joint ?

[+SpiceWare]

There's a picture in that Reply #4 link with an arrow pointing at a cracked solder joint. That picture's of the power socket, which has 6 pins, you'll be looking for the 9 pins adjacent to the controller port.

[Video]

If it's not working at all, it's likely a bad solder joint. Usually they jitter badly, but you can clean them and they'll work great.

 

Soldering a controller is a while different ball game from consoles, there's really nothing you have to worry about effin up, so their great if you're a total noob at soldering. I've been practicing, but still but confident around chips and resistors LOL.

[Bucket Brigadier]

I had the same problem with the P3 paddle in one of my consoles. Turned out one of the capacitors had jarred loose, and I had to re-solder it in place. See this topic:

 

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/259877-player-3-troubleshooting/

 

If it isn't at the controller port itself, check other areas of the motherboard for loose components.

[zylon]

I recently acquired a used VCS from amazon( mine was given away long ago by my parents) .It works pretty

well , although sometimes I have to seat the carts a few times for them to be read .

I ordered some paddles , but returned them as defective because the player one paddle was defective Aaa .

Then I ordered another set of paddles . Damn if these did not have the same problem : the player 2 paddle functions correctly , but the player 1 paddle does not : the button works but spinning the paddle does not register .

1. Did I get unlucky with 2 sets of paddles having the same defect ?

2. Could it be a problem with the console hardware ?,

3. If it is a paddle defect , is there a way to repair it?

 

Thanks !

 

Is this a 4-switch or Jr console by chance?

[easmith]

Is this a 4-switch or Jr console by chance?

4 switch

[zylon]

4 switch

 

 

Replace the TIA. The paddle lines run throught it, but do not have the hex buffer like a 6er does.

[easmith]

Replace the TIA. The paddle lines run throught it, but do not have the hex buffer like a 6er does.

Sorry for being so dumb , but how does one go about replacing /obtaining TIA?

 

Probably will start with easiest /cheapest fix then go from there . I suppose I can look at the motherboard/ controller pins first and look for loose or cracked components / joints , then replace TIA if these all check out?

Edited May 26, 2018 by easmith

[zylon]

Sorry for being so dumb , but how does one go about replacing /obtaining TIA?

 

Probably will start with easiest /cheapest fix then go from there . I suppose I can look at the motherboard/ controller pins first and look for loose or cracked components / joints , then replace TIA if these all check out?

 

The TIA is the farthest from the cart port of all 3 IC's inside. Best Electronics will have them and some here might as well. By all means, try the other things 1st.

 

I have one handy, so many might.

Edited May 27, 2018 by zylon

[easmith]

Ok, I am going to dive in to this. Wish me luck. I have a coworker who is good at this sort of thing.

 

Is there a labeled diagram anywhere of motherboard for 4- switch woody?

 

I also have an occasional issue where the cart is not read and it takes several attempts for it to register. While annoying this is not fatal (yet).

Could these issues be related or are they separate?

[Bucket Brigadier]

Personal opinion, so take it with an entire bucket of salt, but I'd think they are likely unrelated. A lot of games for the VCS are old and have seen a lot of use. Connectors get worn. I have several games which I have to shimmy about in the cart port to get them to read correctly. Could also be my port - some of my newer games run into the issue at times, too, but I tend to notice it with specific games in my inventory more than others which boot the first time almost every time.

[christo930]

I recently acquired a used VCS from amazon( mine was given away long ago by my parents) .It works pretty

well , although sometimes I have to seat the carts a few times for them to be read .

I ordered some paddles , but returned them as defective because the player one paddle was defective Aaa .

Then I ordered another set of paddles . Damn if these did not have the same problem : the player 2 paddle functions correctly , but the player 1 paddle does not : the button works but spinning the paddle does not register .

1. Did I get unlucky with 2 sets of paddles having the same defect ?

2. Could it be a problem with the console hardware ?,

3. If it is a paddle defect , is there a way to repair it?

 

Thanks !

 

Sorry if this is just too obvious, but have you cleaned the connector on the paddles themselves? I have had this problem before and it was the paddles and not the port.

You are nearly certainly going to have to clean the paddles anyway. Dip a toothpick in rubbing alcohol and shove it in and out a few times and maybe some compressed air.

[easmith]

Did some investigation ( actually a coworker who knows more about electronics did most of it) . Was able to determine that the "defective" paddle (P0) was not defective by running it through the "good" paddle's (P1) circuitry .

So it must be the TIA ( or perhaps the C218 capacitor which the P0 paddle potentiometer circuitry runs through ?) .

All solders look good on the board ( including the C218 capacitor, although we resoldered for good measure) .

 

So I ordered a new TIA and will see if this does it. Thanks so much for the advice.

[easmith]

Ordered a TIA from Best Electronics. Put it in. The P0 paddle movement still does not register . So there must be a problem somewhere else along the circuit . But I cannot figure it out by looking at the motherboard . Again, the solder joints look fine. I tested for conductivity along the circuit and it was fine . So I guess I have been defeated.

 

I have not replaced the C218 capacitor, but it seems unlikely that this would be the issue. The was a very low voltage that would register at the input TIA pin 40, but the voltage would not change when the P0 paddle is rotated.

 

Another bizarre result is that when I put the new TIA in , the colors are now significantly off. So maybe the replacement TIA is itself defective ?

Frustrating. I even ordered another set of paddles just in case and they have the same issue. Not meant to be I guess.

Edited June 18, 2018 by easmith

[Andromeda Stardust]

IF you replaced the TIA, I suspect you will need to recalibrate the color pot. My 4-switch was always fine but my 7800 needed some color correction on the 2600 side of things. Circuits tend to drift overtime and will likely need recalibration after sitting for 30 years in the dust bin, or especially after having replaced any critical component.

[easmith]

IF you replaced the TIA, I suspect you will need to recalibrate the color pot. My 4-switch was always fine but my 7800 needed some color correction on the 2600 side of things. Circuits tend to drift overtime and will likely need recalibration after sitting for 30 years in the dust bin, or especially after having replaced any critical component.

Thanks. I put the old chip back in since the new chip did not fix the paddle issue.

[easmith]

Best Electronics recommended I replace all three chips . I did , and P0 paddle POT still does not register. Again, I know the paddle works. All solder joints look ok so far as I can tell. Very frustrating. If anyone can solve this I would be much obliged.

[easmith]

I have been made aware of the Field Service Manual. Perhaps the answer lies in there.....

[easmith]

Personal opinion, so take it with an entire bucket of salt, but I'd think they are likely unrelated. A lot of games for the VCS are old and have seen a lot of use. Connectors get worn. I have several games which I have to shimmy about in the cart port to get them to read correctly. Could also be my port - some of my newer games run into the issue at times, too, but I tend to notice it with specific games in my inventory more than others which boot the first time almost every time.

I have a SpaceMaster X7 cart that I cannot get to work no matter how much I jiggle/re-insert . All other carts work . Is there a way to clean/fix the cart or is it just dead? I have tried cleaning the visible pins a bit to no avail.

[Video]

You could get a test cart from aa. It may show your pot working wrong (bad wiring or something)to

 

If it's working wrong, it could still be sending out a wrong signal a game may just ignore it, but a text cart could show it sending a different signal.

[easmith]

You could get a test cart from aa. It may show your pot working wrong (bad wiring or something)to

 

If it's working wrong, it could still be sending out a wrong signal a game may just ignore it, but a text cart could show it sending a different signal.

Thanks. I will look into the test cart. I know the paddles work properly. I have used three different sets of paddles and they all have resulted in the same issue. I think it must be a bad capacitor or a bad trace on the board somewhere. Both of these fixes are getting a bit beyond my level. I have a friend who is good at this stuff but we have already spent two days diagnosing various components and I am afraid I am wearing out my welcome.

[fluxit]

My only thoughts, are that I didn't see the physical joystick port mentioned(beyond bad solder joints.) Are all nine pins present and in good shape on the plug side? Also, have you tried 'reflowing' all joints on the port, using flux? It's rare, but bad joints can look good occasionally.

 

Your large ICs are socketed, correct? You may have a damaged socket, where one or more of the pins is not being adequately 'pinched' by the wiper or hole(depending on the type of socket) for that pin. You also may have a bad solder joint on a socket, which would be resolved by removing the socketed chip, and then reflowing the joints on the socket.

 

This isn't a particularly good part of the 2600's board for showing problems via pictures, but you never know. There might be something there, that's being missed by you and your friend, that would be obvious to someone else. You might want to provide pictures of the top and bottom of the board.

[Bucket Brigadier]

I have a SpaceMaster X7 cart that I cannot get to work no matter how much I jiggle/re-insert . All other carts work . Is there a way to clean/fix the cart or is it just dead? I have tried cleaning the visible pins a bit to no avail.

Normally I just clean the pins with rubbing alcohol. One of my games (Pressure Cooker), I just barely push into place, not until it is even fully seated and that seems to be the best way to get it to work. If the pins are clean, and the game will not boot regardless of cartridge positioning, I'd think the cart is dead. If you had another system to test it on that would probably confirm it.