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Gyruss for Intellivision?


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#201 artrag OFFLINE  

artrag

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Posted Sun Jun 17, 2018 2:36 AM

1980gamer, I think that it is because of you and people thinking like you that operations like Dino's one happen and will continue to happen...

 

Be aware that stealing code and graphic of an ongoing project (to be released as cartridge!) to make and sell your own cartridge having changed the game titles pretending it is your own work is the worst aberration  that software piracy has ever conceived. It is the safest way to make the real developers quit from the scene slamming the door.

 

Pretending mercy and acceptance by 

 

1) not telling the real story, but spreading lies and half truths: we are newbies, in good faith, we produce at cost (150€!!), we didn't know your game was under development (it is also in Intybasic competition!!), come to Milan to see the game - but he is in Pavia (!!) , we have rewritten the whole code (sure, look at the video and the picture), the list is very long and even growing...

2) refusing to return the stolen goods by showing the game and publishing the code under the same conditions of the one he has stolen

 

is not acceptable by any means in general, but even less acceptable in this case, where these apologies are solely aimed to gain reputation and new public for his fore coming  productions.

 

If he want to publish the code of "his"  game, he can use github or whatever public repository, so he is still on time to accept my request.

This is my condition to close the affair.

Not accepting this condition could only mean he is still thinking to sell the 200 (!!) cartridges sooner or later and some people (you ?) could be interested in buying them.


Edited by artrag, Sun Jun 17, 2018 2:37 AM.


#202 mr_me OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Jun 17, 2018 3:11 AM

No, just a phone call.  I was just looking to take some server load away and speed up the process for our accounting department.
Which I did. 
 
Maybe I was foolish?  Water under the bridge.

If its a recent event, they have no legal right to your program.

If they are using his method and not his code (ie. rewritten) than there is no copyright infringement. You can't copyright an idea or method; maybe it can be patented. If it's within 12 months he might still be able to patent his method. If they are using his code then permission to use was given but not to make and distribute copies.

Edited by mr_me, Sun Jun 17, 2018 3:14 AM.


#203 artrag OFFLINE  

artrag

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Posted Sun Jun 17, 2018 3:16 AM

If they are using his method and not his code (ie. rewritten) than there is no copyright infringement. You can't copyright an idea or method; maybe it can be patented. If it's within 12 months he might still be able to patent his method. If they are using his code then permission to use was given but not to make and distribute copies.

 

Rewritten what ? They are using my code, my math tables, my sprites, it is my program under any relevant aspect.

The video and the picture show exactly this.

The fact he does not want to publish a new video nor the code is even more explicative for clever people, but maybe you are not getting there... 

 

[edit] You was telling about the other case, sorry for the misunderstanding.


Edited by artrag, Sun Jun 17, 2018 3:55 AM.


#204 Rev OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Jun 17, 2018 7:05 AM

 
Rewritten what ? They are using my code, my math tables, my sprites, it is my program under any relevant aspect.
The video and the picture show exactly this.
The fact he does not want to publish a new video nor the code is even more explicative for clever people, but maybe you are not getting there... 
 
[edit] You was telling about the other case, sorry for the misunderstanding.


Yes. Sorry for confusing the topic!

I need to be severely punished. 😎

#205 1980gamer OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Jun 17, 2018 11:33 AM

1980gamer, I think that it is because of you and people thinking like you that operations like Dino's one happen and will continue to happen...

 

Artrag,  I am Sorry you feel this way about me.  How you feel about Dino is understandable.  Again,  I don't know this guy.  I assume you have spoken to him directly?

Only you and Dino have real information. 

 

I want him to release the game code as well.  Banning him, to me prevents ever letting this happen.

 

Be aware that stealing code and graphic of an ongoing project (to be released as cartridge!) to make and sell your own cartridge having changed the game titles pretending it is your own work is the worst aberration  that software piracy has ever conceived. It is the safest way to make the real developers quit from the scene slamming the door.

 

No doubt.  I understand where you are coming from.  Without seeing his code being significantly different from your original code.  He is 100% a thief.

Of course refactoring variables etc. is NOT new or original code by Dino.  Anyone can do that, or tweak graphics etc. 

 

If he rewrote movement algorithms and collision detection significantly.  That would help him.  But even if he completely rewrote you game, I still feel that is not correct either.

For learning purposes, fine.  To release as a NEW game.... when you have the same game in progress for 2 or more years is ridiculous!

 

 

Pretending mercy and acceptance by 

 

1) not telling the real story, but spreading lies and half truths: we are newbies, in good faith, we produce at cost (150€!!), we didn't know your game was under development (it is also in Intybasic competition!!), come to Milan to see the game - but he is in Pavia (!!) , we have rewritten the whole code (sure, look at the video and the picture), the list is very long and even growing...

I have never talked to Dino, I hope you have.  But I can only base my knowledge of Dino by his comments here.

 

2) refusing to return the stolen goods by showing the game and publishing the code under the same conditions of the one he has stolen

is not acceptable by any means in general, but even less acceptable in this case, where these apologies are solely aimed to gain reputation and new public for his fore coming  productions.

 

Yes, your demand is perfectly inline with what should have happened.  But banning him gives him an out now. 

 

If he want to publish the code of "his"  game, he can use github or whatever public repository, so he is still on time to accept my request.

This is my condition to close the affair.

Not accepting this condition could only mean he is still thinking to sell the 200 (!!) cartridges sooner or later and some people (you ?) could be interested in buying them.

 

I hope he does release the code to YOU at the very least.  I would hope no one on AA would buy this game without your blessing.  But in the wild, he maybe able to sell them.

 

At the rediculous price he was asking, I can't believe he would sell very many.  But in this case, 1 is to many.

 

I still feel banning was to much at this time, without all the facts.  yes, I believe he stole your game.  Even if he changed the code.  But at least if he rewrote it completely, I wouldn't ban him.



#206 1980gamer OFFLINE  

1980gamer

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Posted Sun Jun 17, 2018 11:52 AM

If they are using his method and not his code (ie. rewritten) than there is no copyright infringement. You can't copyright an idea or method; maybe it can be patented. If it's within 12 months he might still be able to patent his method. If they are using his code then permission to use was given but not to make and distribute copies.

The conversion was along the lines,  Do you mind is we use this in our next version.  I said, No.  Not thinking a Forced new purchase was coming.

Also, I will not really know if they rewrote my procedures?  I did it quick and dirty as a test.  No error handling etc.  So I would HOPE they modified the code.  :?

 

It would have been nice if they said, you get yours free....  The software is cloud based.  But the data extraction is local ( the adapter piece ).  So even though I could just use my code,

We have to pay for all the pieces anyway, and the support for it too. 

 

We have recently installed another 3rd party product that ALMOST works properly.  But I feel like we are doing all the Beta,no, Alpha testing for them.... I want to send them a bill!

I don't know how other users don't see these problems.  Does anyone else reconcile their books?

 

Anyway...Way off topic. 



#207 mr_me OFFLINE  

mr_me

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Posted Today, 5:43 AM

... Disassembling someone's code for analysis is perfectly legal.

Shouldn't have said it like that. A disassembly is still an unauthorised copy, however courts have allowed it when the reason for the disassembly was acceptable.

 

 

...Taking someone's work for your own must not be welcomed.

 

    -dZ.

 


There's plenty of other examples here where the original credit has been removed and replaced or programming work has not been credited.

Edited by mr_me, Today, 5:54 AM.


#208 Gernot OFFLINE  

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Posted Today, 5:45 AM

may i interfere?

 

all creative work is derivative. to "lean out" is more as just common without that any art wouldn't have been developed ever.

 

plagiatism is something quite different, i claim it's mine and that's the problem.

 

it's a well known old problem and unfortubately money drives it.

dino is just a small fish, intellivision is not of interest for the real sharks in the business.

 

however i do understand artrag and his frustration well, in fact it is a good reason to turn your back on it (and slam the door).

money, ts - sometimes it's all about fame, money i would understand.

 

some are trustworthy others are sleek bastards.

unfortunately the sleek ones have usually the better hand (cards).

 

i guess we noticed such a bad behave for pretty the first time here and that is disappointing.

but it's common, we just grew and such is a side effect of this growth.

 

in the end our developers have to decide if they will further publish their work before it's engraved in a rom.

that would be sad, but what option do you have?

either or not, 0 or 1 - decide ;)

 

how would gernot handle this on the street?

i would have the greatness not to take it serious - with nothing you can change someones mind as with his own feel of debt, show greatness and they feel guilty.

my best buddy the hool, never understands this he's more the type of let's cut off his balls, this can also work out well.



#209 Gernot OFFLINE  

Gernot

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Posted Today, 5:57 AM

mr. me

no reason to excuse this, it's 100% legal, if a third one takes this table and makes something new out of it for the same purpose it's no theft.

that is good and shouldn't be changed resp. has been softened for the good of industry already to much.

in a further sense pioneer is nothing else as this.

of course the least you can do is to state that you did it and that it is based on someone elses idea.

i'm not talking about legality, to me it's a matter of pride.

copyrights are the matter of sleek lawyers (*and similar) who i only would touch in a protective suit and a long claw.

 

*and similar

we had this guy in our team, i never liked him, already his shitty avatar told me what sort of human he is.

he accused me of plagiatism, while he blatantly copied code, his quite small contribution to the project stayed while i was pushed out.

see that's the sort of ppl, that's their character, false hearted through and through.

he will become certainly a brillant lawyer.






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