Opportunities Squandered

[Omega-TI]

Do you remember back in the day, how many opportunities or "good things" in the TI community were squandered and lost because of apathy?

 

I remember one BBS in particular, the sysop spent hundreds of dollars on a dedicated system, multiple phone lines and spend hours keeping the BBS up-to-date with fresh stuff... BECAUSE THE LOCALS REQUESTED IT. The BBS took off like a rocket, people scarfed the downloads, but never even bothered to write a single message on the BBS. After a couple of months, the Sysop gave up because all people wanted to do was leech all the new freebies, but not participate.

 

Human nature being what it is, people develop habits from positive re-enforcement, if they get a positive result, they come back, if they get a big nothing burger too often, they give up and move on. The problem is, many people never looked into a mirror back then and realized (or admitted) that they were part of the problem.

 

There is a saying, "Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it". Sadly another aspect of human nature is that some people can be painfully obtuse while in the middle of an active situation, but will be the first to lament the demise of something that they could have prevented. Whether some learn to connect the dots remains to be seen.

[sparkdrummer]

I believe this sentiment is matched by what happened in a lot of TI Users Groups. My club was taken care of by a small group of members and when help was asked for, people kept their hands down, including me. After awhile, I saw my club dwindling and decided I better get off my duff and do something, so my hand went up (shudder). I was instrumental in my club taking on the FEST WEST in Phoenix in 92, along with my co-chair - Hazel Knight. She was a feisty lady and ALWAYS was willing to help. After awhile I ran for Vice President and won (go figure) and then ran for President and won (go figure). At the end I was President, Newsletter Editor, Demo chairman, Assistant SysOp and general GOFER. I had a few people in my club complain about some things - you guessed it, they were ones that sat on their hands. I usually told them to run for an office or be on a special interest group and that always shut them the hell up.

[+arcadeshopper]

Do you remember back in the day, how many opportunities or "good things" in the TI community were squandered and lost because of apathy?

 

I remember one BBS in particular, the sysop spent hundreds of dollars on a dedicated system, multiple phone lines and spend hours keeping the BBS up-to-date with fresh stuff... BECAUSE THE LOCALS REQUESTED IT. The BBS took off like a rocket, people scarfed the downloads, but never even bothered to write a single message on the BBS. After a couple of months, the Sysop gave up because all people wanted to do was leech all the new freebies, but not participate.

 

Human nature being what it is, people develop habits from positive re-enforcement, if they get a positive result, they come back, if they get a big nothing burger too often, they give up and move on. The problem is, many people never looked into a mirror back then and realized (or admitted) that they were part of the problem.

 

There is a saying, "Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it". Sadly another aspect of human nature is that some people can be painfully obtuse while in the middle of an active situation, but will be the first to lament the demise of something that they could have prevented. Whether some learn to connect the dots remains to be seen.

 

Such is the BBS ways..took me many years to get a bunch of regulars to get on The KEEP regulary was just me and a few friends for many years.. then it was crazy busy all the time always full always active..then the internet came and fixed that.. still had some regulars but it was much slower..and now everyone's moved on.. the BBS is still there, same as before..but nobody cares to logon and participate except for a few diehard gamers

[FDOS]

I absolutely understand. Unfortunately, I'm in need of help for the two projects I have selected to continue, so I'm unable to help others, as I'm too busy.

[+Schmitzi]

Yes, sorry, I can understand this all, and you are fully right,

but at the moment I am too busy to contribute, because have to sort & test all my downloads :grin:

 

 

(for me this is just a matter of time, these days)

[broettger]

I have seen this happen many times over the years that I have been involved in various clubs. Just out of curiosity, is there a particular opportunity that you feel is currently being squandered?

[Omega-TI]

I have seen this happen many times over the years that I have been involved in various clubs. Just out of curiosity, is there a particular opportunity that you feel is currently being squandered?

 

 

Such is the BBS ways..took me many years to get a bunch of regulars to get on The KEEP regulary was just me and a few friends for many years.. then it was crazy busy all the time always full always active..then the internet came and fixed that.. still had some regulars but it was much slower..and now everyone's moved on.. the BBS is still there, same as before..but nobody cares to logon and participate except for a few diehard gamers

 

You're a die hard Greg! I'm impressed. You know, the same thing applies with new stuff. A guy has to be a true die-hard to improve existing software, let alone create new stuff... if hardly anyone is going to use it. How many times does someone log in, only to see ZERO ACTIVITY, without getting discouraged and eventually give up?

[+adamantyr]

The AMS system was definitely a squandered opportunity. I remember when it was released in 1993, and the excitement was... minimal. I recall some grognard types saying "Oh, you'd never need more than 32k for anything."

 

Of course Asgard's sudden closure later didn't help things, but the general apathy towards "module coding" and the mistaken belief that the TI already had enough memory to do what it needed to was a huge letdown to me. It wasn't long after that when I moved to a PC and boxed up the TI for several years.

[+arcadeshopper]

 

 

You're a die hard Greg! I'm impressed. You know, the same thing applies with new stuff. A guy has to be a true die-hard to improve existing software, let alone create new stuff... if hardly anyone is going to use it. How many times does someone log in, only to see ZERO ACTIVITY, without getting discouraged and eventually give up?

 

I spent many hours going 'hey if you stay on like 30min someone else will logon..' in fact i have a system message that said that periodically at menus to try and get their subconscious since nobody reads the menu

[+arcadeshopper]

The AMS system was definitely a squandered opportunity. I remember when it was released in 1993, and the excitement was... minimal. I recall some grognard types saying "Oh, you'd never need more than 32k for anything."

 

Of course Asgard's sudden closure later didn't help things, but the general apathy towards "module coding" and the mistaken belief that the TI already had enough memory to do what it needed to was a huge letdown to me. It wasn't long after that when I moved to a PC and boxed up the TI for several years.

 

It was too expensive and didn't have any software for it persay. these problems weren't really addressed until the last few years and now at 80 bucks it's pretty easy for most of us to get one and put it in our system. Though I've considered building a 2nd 4/a set up so i could keep my foundation/myarc ram in one and the ams in the other..shrug..with tipi that starts being more feasable

[Omega-TI]

 

..with tipi that starts being more feasable

 

Speaking of TIPI... I'm starting to worry about the really cool specialized stuff we have available for it. For instance, Chatti gives us TI'er's real-time chatting, but if no one is ever online when we log in, it just becomes another seldom used messaging system. Chess is another one... if people go a week - OR MORE - without making a move, people will eventually stop checking in to play the game... it becomes a cycle that feeds on itself. Unless a programmer is a die-hard, I question if they would bother updating software that is ignored. Would they even consider writing new stuff?

 

Supporting the community is not always about making stuff, it can be simply using what we have been given, which in itself can give some encouragement to the people/programmers who bend over backwards devoting their valuable time to make this cool stuff in the first place.

 

I once thought using the PiOLED as a status indicator for both of those applications *MIGHT* get peoples attention and prod them to log in, but not everyone is excited about that piece of hardware.

[Opry99er]

The vast vast majority of our group hasn't purchased one yet, as it's only been out a matter of weeks. When the card is officially released for the PBox, I think you'll see a nice bump in usage.

[+arcadeshopper]

Yeah there's a total of 34 people in the Tipi owners club plus beta testers.. no way most of them have time to sit in chatTI all day

 

Sent from my LG-H872 using Tapatalk

[Omega-TI]

Yeah there's a total of 34 people in the Tipi owners club plus beta testers.. no way most of them have time to sit in chatTI all day

 

 

Totally agree, no one with a life could, but it would be nice to see at least one or two people online once in a while, even now, while I type this message, it's only me.

[Omega-TI]

The vast vast majority of our group hasn't purchased one yet, as it's only been out a matter of weeks. When the card is officially released for the PBox, I think you'll see a nice bump in usage.

 

I sure hope so! With any luck the spike might ignite lasting activity.

[+InsaneMultitasker]

 

Totally agree, no one with a life could, but it would be nice to see at least one or two people online once in a while, even now, while I type this message, it's only me.

 

Maybe they were waiting for you to log out!

 

For me, it seems the nature of the TI would diminish the need or "desire" to use programs like a messenger app on a constant basis. In a multitasking OS, such a program can sit in the background whereas with the TI you are limited to using it exclusively while you converse (or wait to converse). Even an interrupt-driven chat would post challenges to most existing programs.

[Omega-TI]

 

Maybe they were waiting for you to log out!

 

For me, it seems the nature of the TI would diminish the need or "desire" to use programs like a messenger app on a constant basis. In a multitasking OS, such a program can sit in the background whereas with the TI you are limited to using it exclusively while you converse (or wait to converse). Even an interrupt-driven chat would post challenges to most existing programs.

 

That could be a possibility! They log in, see I'm there... and then make a hasty retreat!

 

When I'm in the den, and on AtariAge I'm often running the the APP. on the TI.

There is a way, in the background, but it's not palatable to some people.

[+InsaneMultitasker]

Does the program display the last date (or time) the person was active and does it let you choose who can see your status/availability?

 

Seems to me you can't really use your TI for other purposes while "awaiting" a message from someone who might be using their TI for another app at that time. Simple cached messages, like a mailbox slot or ICQ (RIP) offline messages could be a nice way to make it engaging without turning it into a PC app. I suppose that's a consideration for another thread.

[Omega-TI]

Does the program display the last date (or time) the person was active and does it let you choose who can see your status/availability?

 

Seems to me you can't really use your TI for other purposes while "awaiting" a message from someone who might be using their TI for another app at that time. Simple cached messages, like a mailbox slot or ICQ (RIP) offline messages could be a nice way to make it engaging without turning it into a PC app. I suppose that's a consideration for another thread.

 

Currently if you want to, you can type in the date & time of a message to someone offline. I do that already. If you can toggle the status availability, I don't know how to do it. AFAIK, when you log in, everyone knows.

 

No, this would not be a TI program, it would be on the RPI that most users leave on 24/7. From my thinking it would be two great reasons to have a PiOLED. When you get a Chatti message, a "M" could appear on the screen. If it was your move in Chess, a "C" could appear in the display. I see this as a way of encouraging people to turn on their TI's. Another reason is the new TIPI/RPi case has a window just made for the PiOLED!

[+Vorticon]

Omega, did you bring this topic up because of a perceived lack of interest in TIPI or was it something else?

 

I have said this many times before but it's worth repeating: In this day and age, one should NEVER embark on any project for the TI (or any other retro platform for that matter) with the expectation of receiving accolades, praise, or even significant usage of the end result by the community because everyone has different views and priorities and this is a hobby for the vast majority of us consuming valuable time from real life. It should be solely driven by the need for personal enrichment and learning.

Your brought up the issue with BBS use: The way I see it, there is zero practical need to connect to any BBS these days given the vast resources available on the internet and particularly in this forum. Those who connect do it for the nostalgia of it and nothing more, and BBS sysadmins set up and continue to maintain these dinosaurs for exactly the same reason...

 

I for one am not a fan of these kind of guilt trip posts...

[RickyDean]

Beside that, some of us do not have internet at the house. Satellite is too expensive for the amount of usage you get, so all my net habits are laid to rest at 5pm each day, for the most part.

[Omega-TI]

Omega, did you bring this topic up because of a perceived lack of interest in TIPI or was it something else?

 

I have said this many times before but it's worth repeating: In this day and age, one should NEVER embark on any project for the TI (or any other retro platform for that matter) with the expectation of receiving accolades, praise, or even significant usage of the end result by the community because everyone has different views and priorities and this is a hobby for the vast majority of us consuming valuable time from real life. It should be solely driven by the need for personal enrichment and learning.

Your brought up the issue with BBS use: The way I see it, there is zero practical need to connect to any BBS these days given the vast resources available on the internet and particularly in this forum. Those who connect do it for the nostalgia of it and nothing more, and BBS sysadmins set up and continue to maintain these dinosaurs for exactly the same reason...

 

I for one am not a fan of these kind of guilt trip posts...

 

Something else. There is NO lack of interest in the TIPI, it's design insures continued use, I have absolutely no worries on the TIPI hardware front.

 

I guess I'm not a practical guy. I like happy endings, I hate to see good opportunities and capabilities slip away. I also like to see peoples hard work rewarded by use in the means it was intended.

 

I lament what society is becoming with 'microaggressions', 'political correctness', and where every post or word has to be analyzed because it could be taken the wrong way, and where even pointing the similarity of something... becomes a 'guilt trip'. This thread will only degrade if I continue, so I'm done. I'm sorry to have offended anyone.

[+Vorticon]

You did not offend anyone. You stated your view and I stated mine, and that is how these forums work

Just because we don't see eye to eye on this should not be construed as "micro-aggression" and you should never let anyone, myself included, deter you from expressing your views.