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Scramble (5200 Conversion)


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#26 Goochman OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 9:05 AM

Excellent well done conversion - fun to play and just as hard as I remember the arcade version!



#27 Britishcar OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 9:30 AM

FANtastic! Thank you so much!



#28 Cafeman OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 9:34 AM

Misread it as Scrabble. Oh well ... ;) :D

#29 Swami OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 9:46 AM

Misread it as Scrabble. Oh well ... ;) :D

My mom would love that.



#30 Swami OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 9:56 AM

Blowing the base at the end is easy.
You have to shoot it not bomb it. Manouver your ship to let it be just in front of the....base.....what is it anyway LOL....and fire.

Kiwilove: I prefer joysticks over pads. However, how does the support of the second button of the Sega pad work ? By connecting it to the second joystick port ?

In that case it’s easy enough to build a proper arcade like control panel with arcade joystick and arcade buttons :)

Sega makes joysticks for the Genesis, as well, if you don't mind the stick on the left. I saw a few new genesis quickshot arcade or tron-style joysticks on ebay for under $30.  2-button Amiga stick will also work, although you need to weed out all the ones where both buttons are are actually fire1. I am about 95% sure Sega SMS sticks will work, as well. If you don't like the club one (Sega Master Control Stick), it is stupid easy to replace it with something else, like a CX22 stick, 7800 stick top or a ball top, although you need the right kind of ball (small hole to thread the screw into). It may be just me, but it seems like the SMS Control Stick is more of a 4-way than 8-way stick; it does have the stick on the right, though.



#31 MrFish ONLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 10:15 AM

Misread it as Scrabble. Oh well ... ;) :D

 

My mom would love that.

 

That's something I'd like to work on in the future; the Atari's could use a good version, with an official dictionary.

 

I came up with a good scheme for doing the graphics, using P/M's for underlays and widescreen mode.

 

scrabble.png

 



#32 Mclaneinc OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 10:35 AM

How many "HO's" do you know MrFish?

 

Worse still, tell me HO isn't now party of the dictionary...Please say its not so!!!!!

 

Oh my word, it is...Google was NOT my friend.....

 

Seriously, we use "street speak" in the Oxford Dictionary........What next....The spoken word in whatever language is our way along with mathematics to communicate, the fist time an alien pops down and asks "where da Ho's at" or asks for HO's in binary and then I know it will have gone very wrongly...


Edited by Mclaneinc, Tue Aug 7, 2018 10:40 AM.


#33 pseudografx OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 11:04 AM

The major issue with this kind of games is that they are hard to implement on a single computer unless there is only player vs AI mode. If it aims for PvP, the only option is to play over network so that other players can't see each other's cards/tokens.



#34 slx OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 11:20 AM

Very nice port, thank you very much!



#35 MrFish ONLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 11:46 AM

The major issue with this kind of games is that they are hard to implement on a single computer unless there is only player vs AI mode. If it aims for PvP, the only option is to play over network so that other players can't see each other's cards/tokens.

 

That's exactly what I had in mind, single player against computer and networked mode for multiplayer.

 

Anyway, back to the subject; I don't mean to disrupt here.

 

--------------------------------------------

 

Nice job and thanks Playsoft and Harvey. All the options help keep it interesting

 

It kind of ties in with the hack of Super Cobra I was doing, where I was improving the gameplay by

making the chopper a little smaller.



#36 a8isa1 OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 11:56 AM

Reading the history of the Scramble coin-op - it says it does use (or should I say reuse?) Galaxian hardware - which would explain why it uses a vertical monitor.  You would guess extra chips would be in use - to say enable scrolling? and to add the needed landscape. (This was not the first game to have a proper scrolling landscape?)

Atari 8-bit computer users should not download the hacked 5200 version - at the top of the page - but download instead the official version - which is 1/2 way down the page - and get hold of a Genesis/MegaDrive gamepad - so that you can use two fire buttons - as per the coin-op.  Or put such a gamepad on their shopping list.  Hopefully more and more programmers would start using this nice gamepad - and hackers could hack older games which would benefit from using it.

 

I don't know you'd prefer using Z and X keys - whereas the Genesis gamepad seems to be the far better option?

 

Harvey

 

If I wanted to modify an Atari joystick with a second button I'm assuming it would be connected to Paddle 0 pin.  

 

What value pullup should be used?
 



#37 kiwilove OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 3:19 PM

Blowing the base at the end is easy.
You have to shoot it not bomb it. Manouver your ship to let it be just in front of the....base.....what is it anyway LOL....and fire.

Kiwilove: I prefer joysticks over pads. However, how does the support of the second button of the Sega pad work ? By connecting it to the second joystick port ?

In that case it’s easy enough to build a proper arcade like control panel with arcade joystick and arcade buttons :)

 

The official 8-bit computer version is programmed to work with Sega Genesis/MegaDrive controllers - there'll probably be some arcade quality joysticks around - but the stick may be in the wrong place? Paul should answer the question regarding how the second button is programmed to work (paddle option) - like in the thread about using that particular controller for our Ataris.

Any other key (except P and R) can be used for bombing - but I think the Genesis gamepad is the better option than regular joystick/keyboard.  More comfortable/more responsive?

 

So you do use the Genesis gamepad in the regular joystick port.

 

My concern with the game - was with it's mix of graphics - that I did not want to change or detract from the original graphics too much.  That it does work out well overall? The major work was already done for me - and I'm very grateful for that.  I'm hoping that the Youtube video "Let's Compare Scramble" will be updated to include this and other later conversions (C-64, NES and TI).

 

Harvey



#38 MrFish ONLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 4:01 PM

Kiwilove: I prefer joysticks over pads. However, how does the support of the second button of the Sega pad work ? By connecting it to the second joystick port ?

 

The official 8-bit computer version is programmed to work with Sega Genesis/MegaDrive controllers - there'll probably be some arcade quality joysticks around - but the stick may be in the wrong place? Paul should answer the question regarding how the second button is programmed to work (paddle option) - like in the thread about using that particular controller for our Ataris.

 

So you do use the Genesis gamepad in the regular joystick port.

 

Trigger-B on the Sega controller is the standard Atari trigger (Strig0), and Trigger-C on the Sega controller uses the the paddle register (Paddl0).

 

Paddl0 reads "228" for button pressed and "1" for button not pressed.



#39 917k OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 8:54 PM

Really great conversion! Thank you.



#40 Heaven/TQA OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Aug 7, 2018 11:18 PM

Regarding genesis pad... can it blow up chips?

What about 7800 2 button pad?

#41 kiwilove OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 8, 2018 4:17 AM

My 800XL remains fully functional with using a MegaDrive gamepad - so it doesn't adversely affect your computer. Someone did mention using the Sega gamepad as their preferred controller - and did not report any problems with using it.

I would guess that with the 7800 controller - the second button would not work?

 

Harvey



#42 Heaven/TQA OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 8, 2018 4:46 AM

thanks... I just think of having all those buttons triggering some nasty pins which they should not do... that was my fear that I blow some PIAs or POKEY.



#43 Mclaneinc OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 8, 2018 5:14 AM

Loving both versions, official and not so official and thank playsoft first and foremost for the lovely game, and I know its not really the donething without a request but the Homesoft version was done in good faith and with an apology built in..

 

As for blowing up the base Level42, I suppose the bit getting to the base is simple too :)

 

Well just shoot the items, simples :)

 

Lol...I wish I had the speed of movement back to the tiger honed speed I had as a young man, sadly I have the speed of a tiger that's been stuffed (no cruelty to REAL animals please!!)



#44 Level42 ONLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 8, 2018 8:02 AM

I tried to explain that you can’t bomb it...at least that’s what I tried the first 5 times, from different heights and angles but to no avail....yes it s a bit tricky but you need to be completely to the right most part....then move left and go down at the right spots....I guess it needs a video...

#45 _The Doctor__ ONLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 8, 2018 8:22 AM

I forget which sega stick it was but there is a mod to stop the stick from getting over heated and sucking some power from the Atari... one of the many discussion on AA ....



#46 MrFish ONLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 8, 2018 8:45 AM

I'm pretty sure it was the Sega 6-button version that had problems; the Sega 3-button version is fine.



#47 gorgh OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 8, 2018 8:50 AM

I gave it a try couple minutes ago, very addictive game, although a bit too hard, but that's not coders' fault :)



#48 Lord Thag OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 8, 2018 8:57 AM

Regarding genesis pad... can it blow up chips?

What about 7800 2 button pad?

No. I've been using Genesis three button arcade sticks on the 8-bit line since the 90s. Never had an issue. I don't like the six button arcade stick options so I've never used them. 

I highly recommend the Asciiware sticks. 



#49 Mclaneinc OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 8, 2018 8:59 AM

@Level42 -  I was pulling your leg...I know what you mean... :)

 

Re the sega stick, I'm sure I heard of possible damage issues from using a certain sega pad, the only thing is I can't remember if it was Atari or C64 related..

 

It was wiring related and a genuine problem, wish I could (from mem) think what machine it referred to..

 

I'll google it...



#50 Mclaneinc OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Aug 8, 2018 9:01 AM

No. I've been using Genesis three button arcade sticks on the 8-bit line since the 90s. Never had an issue. I don't like the six button arcade stick options so I've never used them. 

I highly recommend the Asciiware sticks. 

 

Didn't they do a really colourful pad for the Snes, if it was that company then it was really good and highly recommended.....Lovely pad it was, nice little individual autofire switch iirc...






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