TigerSuperman Posted September 26, 2018 Share Posted September 26, 2018 Hello Atari Age, I am currently building a homebrew Mega Man clone for the Atari 7800! Been working on it for about a year now. It's actually going well, however I've been using a basic stick man as Mega Man while building the levels and the backgrounds. I made this thread so I can ask if anyone who has experience coding for the 7800, could help me in creating a Mega Man sprite. Backgrounds are one thing, but when it comes to sprites I kind of goof up. If anyone can help out I'd really appreciate it. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlidellMan Posted September 26, 2018 Share Posted September 26, 2018 I can create level tiles, but you may want to contact Fragmare for your character sprite needs. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trebor Posted September 26, 2018 Share Posted September 26, 2018 Hello Atari Age, I am currently building a homebrew Mega Man clone for the Atari 7800! Been working on it for about a year now. It's actually going well, however I've been using a basic stick man as Mega Man while building the levels and the backgrounds. I made this thread so I can ask if anyone who has experience coding for the 7800, could help me in creating a Mega Man sprite. Backgrounds are one thing, but when it comes to sprites I kind of goof up. If anyone can help out I'd really appreciate it. Dracula & Belmont Man look a lot like a Mega Man 'type' to me. Fragmare also covered MM III's title tune via POKEY chip recently. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerSuperman Posted September 26, 2018 Author Share Posted September 26, 2018 (edited) Dracula & Belmont Man look a lot like a Mega Man 'type' to me. Fragmare also covered MM III's title tune via POKEY chip recently. I've been debating whether I should use Pokey or not. I feel like not using it would be more authentic and closer to the common 7800 programming experience since only two games used it among official releases. Edited September 26, 2018 by TigerSuperman 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trebor Posted September 26, 2018 Share Posted September 26, 2018 I've been debating whether I should use Pokey or not. I feel like not using it would be more authentic and closer to the common 7800 programming experience since only two games used it among official releases. Indeed, the "common 7800 programming experience" is one of the reasons why there are only two games that use POKEY. Other items that can be categorized that way include only two games 144K in size. The majority of titles (30 games) were 64K or less. The most common size among the original retail library is 32K (13 games). The common 7800 programming experience is what developers of the original library lamented about. It included rushed deadlines, very limited resources, and sloppy/shoddy work at times as a result. No need for any of that nowadays, nor limiting the original intention of the system design (I.E. sound chips in carts). Completely understand the gist of your statement though. As a developer, stick with what makes you comfortable and happy with your title. Additionally, adding POKEY would place more complexity with development and managing resources. Besides, TIA can really shine, when handled properly. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bz1IvvzABP0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQPdbdQO7RY Regardless, good luck with whatever path(s) you choose! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Defender_2600 Posted September 27, 2018 Share Posted September 27, 2018 I made this thread so I can ask if anyone who has experience coding for the 7800, could help me in creating a Mega Man sprite. Backgrounds are one thing, but when it comes to sprites I kind of goof up. If anyone can help out I'd really appreciate it. Damn, I do not have free time to help you. Anyway, here is an example ... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Defender_2600 Posted September 27, 2018 Share Posted September 27, 2018 * EDIT: 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerSuperman Posted September 27, 2018 Author Share Posted September 27, 2018 Interesting. I had in a chat asked people what sort of name to call my homebrew Mega Man clone since obviously I can't call it Mega Man, and a guy said call the game Jeff. But that 7800 sprite does look like a Jeff. Maybe Jeff The Super Fighting Robot... Nahh name is too long. Indeed, the "common 7800 programming experience" is one of the reasons why there are only two games that use POKEY. Other items that can be categorized that way include only two games 144K in size. The majority of titles (30 games) were 64K or less. The most common size among the original retail library is 32K (13 games). The common 7800 programming experience is what developers of the original library lamented about. It included rushed deadlines, very limited resources, and sloppy/shoddy work at times as a result. No need for any of that nowadays, nor limiting the original intention of the system design (I.E. sound chips in carts). Completely understand the gist of your statement though. As a developer, stick with what makes you comfortable and happy with your title. Additionally, adding POKEY would place more complexity with development and managing resources. Besides, TIA can really shine, when handled properly. [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bz1IvvzABP0[/media] [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQPdbdQO7RY[/media] Regardless, good luck with whatever path(s) you choose! The reason why I don't think Pokey is authentic is because it wasn't part of the system. It was something you had to opt-in to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+SmittyB Posted September 27, 2018 Share Posted September 27, 2018 My opinions on the matter are these (ignore them as you wish). Firstly, the POKEY is as authentic as the mapping chips that the MegaMan games used to even be possible on the NES. More so if you consider that the POKEY is just used for sound but the MMC enhances nearly every aspect of the NES. Don't limit yourself if you don't want to, be free with your ideas. Secondly, I'd like to encourage you to be original. What I mean by that is I'm sure you're going to make a hell of a good MegaMan-like game, but using the names, graphics, music, or level design is likely going to land you a cease and desist letter when it becomes popular. I also mean that you're a unique individual with a lot of good ideas and I'm sure we'd all like to see some of them. Even the smallest amount of your own creative twist goes a long way. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DracIsBack Posted September 27, 2018 Share Posted September 27, 2018 Excited to see your ideas. Some many cool things happening in homebrew land on the 7800 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerSuperman Posted September 27, 2018 Author Share Posted September 27, 2018 My opinions on the matter are these (ignore them as you wish). Firstly, the POKEY is as authentic as the mapping chips that the MegaMan games used to even be possible on the NES. More so if you consider that the POKEY is just used for sound but the MMC enhances nearly every aspect of the NES. Don't limit yourself if you don't want to, be free with your ideas. Secondly, I'd like to encourage you to be original. What I mean by that is I'm sure you're going to make a hell of a good MegaMan-like game, but using the names, graphics, music, or level design is likely going to land you a cease and desist letter when it becomes popular. I also mean that you're a unique individual with a lot of good ideas and I'm sure we'd all like to see some of them. Even the smallest amount of your own creative twist goes a long way. I think you misunderstand my intentions, if you read my previous post I am making an original game but I wanted something to base a new sprite off of. The game for the most part is nearing completion, however I'm not good with sprite design. It's why my previous projects were 2600 and Intellivison games because I could make goofy stick characters! Once the sprite issue is resolved, I'll post a demo or two here. Excited to see your ideas. Some many cool things happening in homebrew land on the 7800 7800 is familiar so it's easy to put together a homebrew if you got programming experience for older machines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinks Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 Wow! Excited to see what you have done! Once your ready... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RevEng Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 Amazing! What are your 2600 and Intellivision games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerSuperman Posted September 28, 2018 Author Share Posted September 28, 2018 Amazing! What are your 2600 and Intellivision games? They weren't full games just some demos. Those were made some time ago, I decided to try and make an actual game on the 7800 since it gives me the graphical power I need to really create a world. Not that the 2600 can't do that, but I think it's too limited for the vision I have in mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg2600 Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 Just my 2 cents, but if you're capable of programming a version with Pokey audio, I would encourage you to do so! As others have said, the only thing that enabled/disabled programmers from doing certain things, or using certain extra hardware was money. That's no longer a concern. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RevEng Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 They weren't full games just some demos. Those were made some time ago, I decided to try and make an actual game on the 7800 since it gives me the graphical power I need to really create a world. Not that the 2600 can't do that, but I think it's too limited for the vision I have in mind. Ah, too bad. Each dev has a unique style that you can sometimes pick out, even with different platforms. I was hoping for a preview of yours. Any chance for show+tell with your 7800 WIP? I think the crowd would be thrilled to see any of your screens, even without the sprites. I think TIA audio is a good place to start. You could later add "pokey enhanced" features, if you change your mind. That way you're still covered, if the current pokey famine continues. I'd hate for your game to be only available for those who can supply a pokey. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerSuperman Posted September 28, 2018 Author Share Posted September 28, 2018 Just my 2 cents, but if you're capable of programming a version with Pokey audio, I would encourage you to do so! As others have said, the only thing that enabled/disabled programmers from doing certain things, or using certain extra hardware was money. That's no longer a concern. I haven't written it off or anything, I'm still debating about it in my head. I originally wanted to use Pokey from the start listening to what was done with Ballblazer. But I am curious about what kind of sound I could get out of the TIA with a bit of fiddling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragmare Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 (edited) Hello Atari Age, I am currently building a homebrew Mega Man clone for the Atari 7800! Been working on it for about a year now. It's actually going well, however I've been using a basic stick man as Mega Man while building the levels and the backgrounds. I made this thread so I can ask if anyone who has experience coding for the 7800, could help me in creating a Mega Man sprite. Backgrounds are one thing, but when it comes to sprites I kind of goof up. If anyone can help out I'd really appreciate it. What a great idea! Mega Man... but not Mega Man! I had a similar idea of making a Mega Man game on the 7800, but not a port of any of the existing games. An original Mega Man game on the 7800. In fact, I already started drawing a few of the Robot Masters. All of them named after something Atari related. Missile (Command) Man, Yar Man (The Fly?), Centi(pede) Man, Tempest Man, etc. etc., you get the idea... Here is Missile Man in 7800 160a mode Some other 7800 crap I've done... I do lots of 7800/PC-Engine sprite/bg work, as well as a lot of POKEY/TIA chiptune/sound fx work as well. I'm sure you've already got about 65536 PM's already offering sprite work, but I could help out. P.S., You sound like you're on the fence about POKEY music, but if you decide to do it, I can help you out there, as well... just know that the standard 4-channel mono POKEY *CAN* sound wonderful and even usurp the 2A03 in some respects. Here is a playlist of all my Atari chiptune music, if you'd like an idea of how my POKEY music generally sounds. http://https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXS-1k_cLBlzd9q7MTUFXY_osY56vKRne Edited September 29, 2018 by Fragmare 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DracIsBack Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 One of the challenges with POKEY (as much as I love the sound) is the availability. Look at all the Atariage store games that all say "you supply your own" now because they are in such short supply. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DracIsBack Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 Those designs are so cool, Fragmare. Thanks for sharing them with us! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragmare Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 One of the challenges with POKEY (as much as I love the sound) is the availability. Look at all the Atariage store games that all say "you supply your own" now because they are in such short supply. I sometimes wonder what the cost would be for a batch run of FPGA repro POKEYs. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RevEng Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 Curt Vendel advised that after XM is done, he has plans to do an ASIC run of pokeys. This should be much more affordable than FPGA. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBeefy Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 Not that my opinion matters but I would say no Pokey. In a lot of instances I don't think it adds enough to make the hunt/price hike worth it. If there is a cheap replacement ever then sure. Right now BBCQ is the only Pokey I have heard that is actually worth the extra price/hunt. Circus AA was okay but not worth it (talking about Pokey, game is heck a lot of fun to play). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RevEng Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 Any chance for show+tell with your 7800 WIP? I think the crowd would be thrilled to see any of your screens, even without the sprites. Just leaving the above here, in case you missed it the first time around. Throw the crowd a bone. I know you mentioned you only had unfinished game demos for the 2600 and inty (still would love to see them!) but what about your Colecovision Outrun WIP? Would be great to see it in action, even with the speed problem. Pretty sure we'll be amazed! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxdrive Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 What a great idea! Mega Man... but not Mega Man! I had a similar idea of making a Mega Man game on the 7800, but not a port of any of the existing games. An original Mega Man game on the 7800. In fact, I already started drawing a few of the Robot Masters. All of them named after something Atari related. Missile (Command) Man, Yar Man (The Fly?), Centi(pede) Man, Tempest Man, etc. etc., you get the idea... Here is Missile Man in 7800 160a mode Some other 7800 crap I've done... I do lots of 7800/PC-Engine sprite/bg work, as well as a lot of POKEY/TIA chiptune/sound fx work as well. I'm sure you've already got about 65536 PM's already offering sprite work, but I could help out. P.S., You sound like you're on the fence about POKEY music, but if you decide to do it, I can help you out there, as well... just know that the standard 4-channel mono POKEY *CAN* sound wonderful and even usurp the 2A03 in some respects. Here is a playlist of all my Atari chiptune music, if you'd like an idea of how my POKEY music generally sounds. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXS-1k_cLBlzd9q7MTUFXY_osY56vKRne I saw your Belmont man in the other post he also looked similar to the guy from river city ransom that be a awesome game idea too 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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