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PLATOTerm 1.1 Lite for Atari 8-bit computers

IRATA.ONLINE ATARI PLATOTERM PLATO DISK CARTRIDGE

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#1 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Dec 18, 2018 1:47 PM

PLATOTerm 1.1 Lite for Atari 8-bit systems is released. Available in 16K cartridge and single-file bin versions. No preferences, 1200 baud only, but it is a complete terminal. Come get it! https://github.com/t...-ATARI-LITE-1.1#irataonline #plato #platoterm #atari

 

Have attached release notes here, as well:

 

PLATOTerm Lite Version 1.1

=====================
 
About The Atari Lite Release
==================
This is a special version of PLATOTerm, that has been re-organized to fit the code within approximately 16K of space, so that it can be fit onto a cartridge, or with other programs on a disk.
 
In order to do this, preferences was eliminated completely, and 1200 baud is the only data rate supported. But the upside is, you can flash this onto a cartridge.
 
Like the larger version, PLATOTerm requires a loaded R: handler. The cartridges are configured to load the DOS first, before jumping into the main program, so any handlers you wish to run, you should be sure they are loaded first (e.g with AUTORUN.SYS).
 
Since devices like the Atari 850 can autoboot their handler if no disk drive is present, they will also work with the cartridge version. Just be sure that the 850 interface is switched on, before poweron.
 
R-Verter users must ensure their handler is loaded, before starting PLATOTerm.
 
The only available hotkeys are:
 
* SELECT-T to switch to TTY mode.
* SELECT-P to switch to PLATO mode.
* SELECT-RETURN to send a carriage return and a line feed.
 
Versions available:
============
 
There are file and cartridge versions available for the following touch devices:
 
* Amiga mouse
* standard Joystick
* Koala/Atari Touch Tablet
* Atari Trak-Ball
* Atari ST mouse
 
------------------
What is PLATOTerm?
------------------
 
PLATOTerm is a terminal emulator to access CYBIS services now available
on the Internet utilizing a WIFI Modem, or (soon!) an Ethernet device
supported by a Crynwr Packet Driver.
 
For the purposes of this documentation. PLATO and CYBIS are interchangeable
names for the same platform.
 
--------------------------------------------------------------
What services are currently available to access via PLATOTerm?
--------------------------------------------------------------
As of writing this preliminary documentation (October 2018), there are
two major CYBIS systems running. CYBER1.ORG and IRATA.ONLINE.
 
---------------------------
WHAT IS PLATO? (aka CYBIS?)
---------------------------
(from the PLATO wikipedia page:)
 
PLATO (Programmed Logic for Automatic Teaching Operations), was the first
generalized computer-asisted instruction system. Starting in 1960, it ran
on the University of Illinois ILLIAC I computer. By the late 1970s, it
supported several thousand graphics terminals distributed worldwide, running
on nearly a dozen different networked mainframe computers. Many modern
concepts in multi-user computing were originally developed on PLATO, including
forums, message boards, online testing, e-mail, chat rooms, picture languages,
instant messaging, remote screen sharing, and multi-player games.
 
-------------------
What is CYBER1.ORG?
-------------------
 
CYBER1.ORG is a CYBIS system initially set up in 2004, as a haven for
ex-PLATO users to experience a classic PLATO author experience.
 
CYBER1.ORG is home to many thousands of classic PLATO lessons and
notesfiles which have been restored from various sources, and have
been made available in the interests of preserving PLATO.
 
---------------------
What is IRATA.ONLINE?
---------------------
 
IRATA.ONLINE is a CYBIS system that has been set up for the benefit of
the greater vintage computing community, in the interest to provide
a unique experience that can be accessed on a wide variety of
vintage computers with a bitmapped graphics display. To this end,
IRATA.ONLINE develops PLATOTerm for dozens of platforms, so that they
can access CYBIS systems, as well as provide a community and learning
infrastructure for vintage computing users of all types, in the hopes
that as a cohesive community, something unique can hopefully
emerge.
 
-----------------------------------------------------------
What is the connection between IRATA.ONLINE and CYBER1.ORG?
-----------------------------------------------------------
 
CYBER1.ORG and IRATA.ONLINE are independent of one another. With that said,
the reason IRATA.ONLINE and PLATOTerm exist, are because of the efforts of
CYBER1.ORG to not only preserve a running PLATO system, and provide the
necessary information for interested parties to write terminal software
to access CYBIS systems, but also in their effort to produce a publically
available distribution of CYBIS that others who are interested may also
run their own CYBIS installation. IRATA.ONLINE is a direct result of the
public release of this distribution.
 
--------------------------
Connecting to IRATA.ONLINE
--------------------------
 
Once PLATOTerm is started, you can connect to CYBER1.ORG using your WIFI modem,
using a command such as:
 
```
ATDTIRATA.ONLINE:8005
```
 
------------------------
Connecting to CYBER1.ORG
------------------------
 
Once PLATOTerm is started, you can connect to CYBER1.ORG using your WIFI modem,
using a command such as:
 
```
ATDTCYBERSERV.ORG:8005
```
 
PLATO Keyboard
-------------------
The PLATO keyboard is mapped to the Atari keys, like so:
 
| PLATO KEY  | Atari Key  |
|--- |--- |
| ANS  | CTRL-A  |
| BACK  | CTRL-B  |
| SHIFT-BACK | CTRL- + (left arrow) |
| COPY | CTRL-C |
| SHIFT-COPY | CTRL- - (up arrow)  |
| DATA | CTRL-D ||
| SHIFT-DATA | SHIFT-CTRL-D |
| EDIT | CTRL-E |
| SHIFT-EDIT | SHIFT-CTRL-E |
| FONT | CTRL-F |
| ÷ | CTRL-G | 
| HELP | CTRL-I |
| SHIFT-HELP | SHIFT CTRL-H |
| LAB | CTRL-L |
| SHIFT-LAB | CTRL-= (down arrow) |
| SUPER | CTRL-P |
| SHIFT-SUPER | SHIFT CTRL-P |
| SQUARE | CTRL-Q | 
| ACCESS | SHIFT CTRL-Q |
| STOP | CTRL-S |
| SHIFT-STOP | SHIFT CTRL-S | 
| TERM | CTRL-T |
| × | CTRL-X |
| SUB | CTRL-Y |
| SHIFT-SUB | SHIFT CTRL-Y |
| CR and LF | Select RETURN |
 
Pressing the function keys will cycle through all possible color values.
 
Credits
=======
* '''Thomas Cherryhomes''' - Terminal coding, sleepless nights.
* '''Steve Peltz''' - original PAD protocol decoder from MacPAD.
* '''Christian Groessler''' - multiply funcs for Atari, lots of testing
* '''Jon Halliday''' - Fast text output routines for Atari
* '''Ron Klein''' - Testing, testing, and more testing
' '''Sijmen Schouten''' - Testing, testing, and more testing.
* '''Michael Sternberg''' - Apple2 testing, showing off at Kansasfest 2018
* '''The.Doctor''' - Help tuning XON/XOFF parameters.
* '''John Buell''' - Testing
* '''John Manterola''' - Testing
* '''Jasmaz''' - Commodore 64 testing
* '''Paul Rickards''' - Commodore 64 testing
* '''Glenn Wiorek''' - Commodore 64 testing.
* '''Rory McMahon''' - Testing
 

Attached Files



#2 MrFish OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Dec 18, 2018 2:10 PM

You posted the "stmouse" rom twice. I think you meant to post an XEX version.

 

[Edit] Actually, it is the XEX version, but you've got the wrong extension on the file (the second one).


Edited by MrFish, Tue Dec 18, 2018 2:13 PM.


#3 manterola OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Dec 18, 2018 2:12 PM

great I have a mouse I was waiting ofr a version with mouse support to try with my rverter sio2wifi thing

#4 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Dec 18, 2018 2:18 PM

Great, they all have had mouse support from the beginning. It was just in preferences.

 

This version has been trimmed so that it can be flashed onto a cartridge (or used as a single-file binary).. This took quite a bit of work, and preferences, as well as the splash screen, had to be sacrificed, to fit this into memory (6 bytes left!)

 

-Thom



#5 Gunstar OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Dec 18, 2018 2:28 PM

Cool, now I can use Platoterm Lite on cartridge for my 800, and standard Platoterm on my upgraded 1200XL. And thanks for all the choices. I have an ST mouse, Atari tablet and Atari trackball I can use instead of joystick. I'll have to see what I prefer, but the 800 and 1200 will use different controllers, probably mouse on my XL and either tablet or trackball on the 800.

 

I haven't set any of this up and tried it, or learned anything yet. Does the normal Platoterm have a choice of all these controllers built-in?


Edited by Gunstar, Tue Dec 18, 2018 2:33 PM.


#6 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Dec 18, 2018 2:32 PM

it seems to work here. 

 

For anyone testing the XEX version, if it complains about MEMLO, let me know. I can raise it, due to the code being much smaller (it's currently at $2420)

 

-Thom



#7 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 19, 2018 8:56 AM

@Gunstar - yes, but it looks like the mouse and trakball drivers (which use common code) will need to be rewritten to handle the fact that I'm using the serial port at the same time that the mouse is being used.



#8 Stephen OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:02 AM

@Gunstar - yes, but it looks like the mouse and trakball drivers (which use common code) will need to be rewritten to handle the fact that I'm using the serial port at the same time that the mouse is being used.

The things we take for granted these days!  Stalling the computer just reading a mouse - crazy.



#9 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:33 AM

I do think that this 16K stripped system sans prefs may be the way I go forward. The addition of dos file I/O routines (and the bits to make them look like stdio C functions), and the bits to support the menu system used by the prefs was enough to add about 7K of code.

 

-Thom



#10 Gunstar OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 19, 2018 12:46 PM

@Gunstar - yes, but it looks like the mouse and trakball drivers (which use common code) will need to be rewritten to handle the fact that I'm using the serial port at the same time that the mouse is being used.

Well I hope you do fix it, as my ST mouse is painted to match my XL line and it just won't do to have to use it with Platoterm lite on the 800! That's suppose to be for the trackball or touchtablet! :-o  ;)



#11 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 19, 2018 12:59 PM

I will try at some point, am trying to get cc65 devs interested to help.

 

in the mean time, I am taking today to see if I can get the TGI drivers ported from the C64 to the PLUS/4, so I can do a bring-up of PLATOTerm on the PLUS/4 (in case anyone doubts I am trying to port this thing EVERYWHERE) :P :)

 

-Thom



#12 sanny OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 19, 2018 4:09 PM

This version has been trimmed so that it can be flashed onto a cartridge (or used as a single-file binary).. This took quite a bit of work, and preferences, as well as the splash screen, had to be sacrificed, to fit this into memory (6 bytes left!)

 

Trimmed in which way? Is there something left out, except for preferences and splash screen?

 

Nice job!

 

regards,
chris



#13 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 19, 2018 4:10 PM

no preferences, no splash screen, no config file loading saving of any kind, so you have to set settings if they are different from default when you start.

 

It clocks in at just under 16K in ROM space on the cart versions.

-Thom



#14 Gunstar OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Dec 19, 2018 4:24 PM

I will try at some point, am trying to get cc65 devs interested to help.

 

in the mean time, I am taking today to see if I can get the TGI drivers ported from the C64 to the PLUS/4, so I can do a bring-up of PLATOTerm on the PLUS/4 (in case anyone doubts I am trying to port this thing EVERYWHERE) :P :)

 

-Thom

I guess I'll use the Trackball on my 800 and touch tablet on the 1200 until you get it sorted for a mouse. Unless I find Platoterm Lite is enough for me no matter the computer.



#15 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 20, 2018 12:53 PM

I am crestfallen.

 

The "disk" version of Lite has problems loading in various memory configurations. I really need some help to try and situate this thing in the Atari memory map so that everybody can use it.

 

I'm becoming exceedingly frustrated with trying to fit Atari programs so that they'll load by all the various DOSes. It's the one aspect of program development that makes me want to scream at the top of my lungs and curse, because I don't have these issues on any of the other 6502 targets.

 

-Thom



#16 flashjazzcat ONLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 20, 2018 12:58 PM

What particular disparities between different DOSes are causing the problems? Unless you're specifically taking advantage of CLI stuff or running in the Shadow RAM, you can usually rely on basic functionality being pretty similar. Extended RAM usage can be problematic in the face of RAMdisks and SDX 'USE BANKED', etc, but they're not insurmountable problems.

 

I'm just curious as to what's the biggest pain here.



#17 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 20, 2018 1:06 PM

My program reserves an 8K block of RAM at the end of RAM for a mode F display. In addition, I am also allocating roughly 512 bytes of RAM for the C stack.

 

The problem is, depending on where I place the start address in memory (currrently at 0x2420 for the fat version), the program will crash when it tries to start serial I/O, or complain that the program is loading below memlo.

 

This is compounded because MEMLO changes subtly depending on the different serial interfaces.

 

This is part of why I have tried to push for a "lite" cartridge version. It side-steps these problems quite nicely.

 

I tried to do a disk version of the 16K build, because I thought it would fit more comfortably...and it works great under SDX, but trying to boot it under ANYTHING else basically causes the serial I/O to fail initializing.

 

Argh. I know this sounds silly to some of you, but I've been spending close to 6 months trying to make a build of PLATOTerm that will work as close to everywhere as possible, and I want to cry.

 

-Thom



#18 flashjazzcat ONLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 20, 2018 1:25 PM

OK - so primarily memory considerations.

 

To an extent, trying to shrink code down in inventive ways in order to beat the 'out of memory' problem is one of the more enjoyable challenges on an 8-bit platform, but given the fact PLATOTerm is cross-platform and you're fighting on several fronts at the same time, I do not envy you the task. And eventually the fun drains out of the code shrinkage challenge too.



#19 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 20, 2018 1:28 PM

The 1.0 version of PLATOTerm works great booted from its disk, so that version is okay. 

 

but I think I'm going to delete the disk versions of the 1.1 lite.

 

sigh.

 

-Thom



#20 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 20, 2018 1:31 PM

@flashjazzcat - The various atari serial drivers do really stupid things in their supposed "relocatable" loaders, including putting buffers at fixed memory locations...

 

I _WANT_ to make a version that works in the ultimate 1mb as a cart slot, but have no fucking idea how to pull that off with cc65. :(

 

-Thom



#21 Gunstar OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 20, 2018 1:48 PM

I say ignore everything but SpartaDOS versions. The more SpartaDOS specific things get, the more people will migrate to SpartaDOS and maybe start to make it the Atari standard deveolpers use, and therefore, everyone uses. It's got a menu tree for those that don't like command-line Atari DOS. I'm sick and tired of half the stuff coming out being for Sparta and half for DOS 2.5 compatibles which are so much inferior anyway. I left them behind as much as I could back in '86 when I first got the SpataDOS construction set with my 1050 US doubler.

 

Now I have to duck down to avoid the fodder surely headed my way by MyDOS and other users... :-o


Edited by Gunstar, Thu Dec 20, 2018 1:49 PM.


#22 Stephen OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Dec 20, 2018 2:06 PM

I say ignore everything but SpartaDOS versions. The more SpartaDOS specific things get, the more people will migrate to SpartaDOS and maybe start to make it the Atari standard deveolpers use, and therefore, everyone uses. It's got a menu tree for those that don't like command-line Atari DOS. I'm sick and tired of half the stuff coming out being for Sparta and half for DOS 2.5 compatibles which are so much inferior anyway. I left them behind as much as I could back in '86 when I first got the SpataDOS construction set with my 1050 US doubler.

 

Now I have to duck down to avoid the fodder surely headed my way by MyDOS and other users... :-o

I'm there with you on this one.



#23 manterola OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Dec 29, 2018 3:25 PM

Yesterday I was able to try the xex versions of Plato term lite. I tried the tablet one and the st mouse. I prepared a disk with DOS 2.5, the Rverter driver renamed autorun.sys and the different xex's.
The tablet version showed the pointer and I could move it, but nothing else happened. I turned off and on the sio2wifi thing and nothing showed in the screen. I type atdt to dial to irata online and nothing happened, I was able to hear the keyclick sound thru the speakers though.
I tried select p and select t and messages showed up, but nothinga else.
What I am doing wrong?.
I can use Plato 1.0 without problems, with Rverter interface, but I wanted to try a version with pointer.
The st mouse version showed the pointer but it lookrd.like crashed, because no keyclick sound and no pointer movement.

#24 tschak909 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Dec 29, 2018 4:49 PM

The ST, Amiga, and Trakball versions all need driver fixes, as the CC65 drivers for those do not work with serial I/O also enabled... I am working on trying to fix those. I will remove those from the release section for now.

 

Tablet works just fine for me, with Koala and Atari CX77 touch tablet devices.

 

-Thom



#25 Alfred OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Dec 29, 2018 5:08 PM

The 1.0 version of PLATOTerm works great booted from its disk, so that version is okay. 

 

but I think I'm going to delete the disk versions of the 1.1 lite.

 

sigh.

 

-Thom

 

What's the origin for that version ? If it's also $2400, then it doesn't seem like it's MEMLO that's causing the serial i/o issues.







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