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Spotting Repros


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#1 vortistokushima OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Feb 7, 2019 9:32 PM

Somewhat new Jaguar collector here. I've gotten my first few games cib, and like the idea of getting as many as possible this way.

 

I've seen some repro boxes floating around on various sites, and this is a bit worrisome when thinking about the higher end games. Is there any way that you can tell the difference and know you are getting an original box? Especially if buying online and not able to physically handle it? Just looking to do my due diligence.



#2 davidcalgary29 OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Feb 7, 2019 11:20 PM

Sure: avoid eBay and just buy all of your games directly from the AtariAge store, Songbird, Telegames UK, or in the marketplace forum. No one on this site would try to sell you crap like that.

#3 neo_rg OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 9:53 AM

You can always post links to the eBay auctions if you're not sure if they're the real deal. There are

enough people here who can spot a fake or repro game, uploading pictures of the item in question

is a good idea too.



#4 madman OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 10:20 AM

I don't know that there are many CIB repros aside from Battlesphere, most I've seen are loose carts and are fairly obvious. If the seller is only selling a bunch of loose carts that are higher $$$, they're probably bootlegs. And if the seller has 50 copies of Battlesphere, those are also bootlegs.


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#5 Greenious OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 10:44 AM

For the most part, the cost of making a bootleg jaguar game exceeds the cost of a real game, or the profit margin is so low with a fairly small market, that it's never really been a problem except for a few select titles.


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#6 travistouchdown OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 10:47 AM

Labels.  Take a good long look at the labels vs. original labels.

 

Manuals.  If it doesn't come with a manual, good indicator it might be a repro.

 

Some games are so expensive (over $120) that a repro is not a bad route to go.  But that's up to you.  I actually have repro's of 1-2 jag games I own to save the wear on the originals. 



#7 LinkoVitch OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 10:57 AM

If it's still sealed then it's worth looking at the back of the box.  Official sealed games had a fold down plastic loop on the back.  If someone has sealed a game themselves I doubt they would have the ability to affix a plastic fold out tab on the cellophane.



#8 Greenious OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 11:26 AM

Labels.  Take a good long look at the labels vs. original labels.

 

Manuals.  If it doesn't come with a manual, good indicator it might be a repro.

 

Some games are so expensive (over $120) that a repro is not a bad route to go.  But that's up to you.  I actually have repro's of 1-2 jag games I own to save the wear on the originals. 

 

For the original retail games a missing manual is not an indicator of anything.

 

For the latter releases by songbird and others, when only enthustiasts and collectors remained, you do have a point. I don't think I've ever seen a loose cart of any of those releases.



#9 madman OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 11:32 AM

I actually have repro's of 1-2 jag games I own to save the wear on the originals. 

How many carts have you worn out in your life?



#10 Hyper_Eye OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 1:28 PM

How many carts have you worn out in your life?

 

I have one or two Jaguar carts that are worn. My Ruiner Pinball cart has to be pushed to the right after it is inserted or all kinds of crazy crap happens. For example the score gets way too high way too fast. I think it also messes with the physics. I have owned the cart for over 20 years and it did not always have this problem so it must have happened over time. It was heavily used.



#11 vortistokushima OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 3:00 PM

Appreciate the responses and information so far, guys. Here are just some examples I've found on a common site. Are these blatantly obvious fakes? My worry is someone making a game "complete" by purchasing pieces that are repro and making a more money from the sale. But, I could always avoid auctions as already mentioned!

 

https://www.etsy.com...x?ref=related-1

 

https://www.etsy.com..._search_click=1

 

https://www.etsy.com...h_click=1&cas=1



#12 Gummy Bear OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 3:01 PM

I have one or two Jaguar carts that are worn. My Ruiner Pinball cart has to be pushed to the right after it is inserted or all kinds of crazy crap happens. For example the score gets way too high way too fast. I think it also messes with the physics. I have owned the cart for over 20 years and it did not always have this problem so it must have happened over time. It was heavily used.


That's more likely to be worn, dirty slot in your Jag.
It's almost impossible to put appreciable wear on the actual cartridge pins.

#13 -^CrožBow^- ONLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 3:21 PM

Appreciate the responses and information so far, guys. Here are just some examples I've found on a common site. Are these blatantly obvious fakes? My worry is someone making a game "complete" by purchasing pieces that are repro and making a more money from the sale. But, I could always avoid auctions as already mentioned!

 

https://www.etsy.com...x?ref=related-1

 

https://www.etsy.com..._search_click=1

 

https://www.etsy.com...h_click=1&cas=1

 

Literally each of those states in the title that it is a reproduction or "replacement" (replacement is code for repro). And yeah pretty much anything on Etsy will be a repro...



#14 Hyper_Eye OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 3:25 PM

That's more likely to be worn, dirty slot in your Jag.
It's almost impossible to put appreciable wear on the actual cartridge pins.

No. It's definitely the cart. I don't have issues with other games and I have a lot of carts including the complete retail set. Typically it's inserted into my Jag CD. Does the same thing in the Jag's slot. Does the same thing in my multiple other Jags. The edge of the board is worn on that cart.



#15 Gummy Bear OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 3:30 PM

No. It's definitely the cart. I don't have issues with other games and I have a lot of carts including the complete retail set. Typically it's inserted into my Jag CD. Does the same thing in the Jag's slot. Does the same thing in my multiple other Jags. The edge of the board is worn on that cart.


Ah I see what you mean. So it doesn't center properly.

#16 Hyper_Eye OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 3:43 PM

Ah I see what you mean. So it doesn't center properly.

Right. Some times it locks up completely mid-game unless I push it to the right after inserting it.



#17 ls650 OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 4:12 PM

Could someone make a believable complete fake with a high quality box, manual, etc. and pawn it off as genuine?  

Sure, but I don't think it's worth the effort unless it's one of the more pricey games such as Wolf 3D, Missile Command, Defender 2000. 

Even then, I'm not sure the 'counterfeiter' would make a whole lot of profit unless the game were something like BattleSphere selling for $300+.

 

Simple rule of thumb; unless it's selling for at least $150+, it's likely genuine; it's just not worth the effort to fake.

 

If it's cart only, ask the seller if he can provide a decent high-res photo of the label. 

If it's a genuine cart selling for big buck$, the seller should have no problem with this request.

If the seller starts making excuses as to why that's not possible, it could be a fake.


Edited by ls650, Fri Feb 8, 2019 4:12 PM.


#18 davidcalgary29 OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Feb 8, 2019 4:33 PM

Appreciate the responses and information so far, guys. Here are just some examples I've found on a common site. Are these blatantly obvious fakes? My worry is someone making a game "complete" by purchasing pieces that are repro and making a more money from the sale. But, I could always avoid auctions as already mentioned!

 

https://www.etsy.com...x?ref=related-1

 

https://www.etsy.com..._search_click=1

 

https://www.etsy.com...h_click=1&cas=1

 

Sure, there are a number of easy "tells" here. The label on NBA Jam is muddy and poor, and doesn't look at all like the authentic release (no snapshot of the game; the basketball is on the other side). The quality of the print on Breakout 2000 looks okay, but the box looks like it's made with thin stock that will tear easily, and I don't recall that it had a gloss finish (mine doesn't). And my (authentic) copy of Wolfenstein 3D doesn't have a "M" on the front, but there could be box variations out there. Some titles, such as Flashback, also had a Jaguar holograph sticker, and it's more difficult to fake that.



#19 JaggingUK OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Feb 9, 2019 11:13 AM

The Jaguar is not the N64 with regards the amount of bootleg copies out there. Loads of rarer N64 titles have popped up on your AliBaba type stores, and then you can buy a reproduction box too and manual and try selling the game on, but that has been happening for ages now. It's really been the N64 and Megadrive that have seen all their valuable collectable games copied to death, on the Jaguar it's not worth the hassle as (has already been stated on here) Battlesphere is the one copy that will turn up but people selling it will always be listing as reproduction. No one seems to be selling copies of Another World which would seem to be the only other one worth bothering with on cartridge (don't know if that's on a bigger memory size cartrdige than the norm).

 

On Jaguar there's not enough profit to be made from someone selling copied/bootleg games as the user base is so low compared to Nintendo and Sega machines. The N64 really does appear to be getting clobbered with copies and bootlegs, and I can see why - vintage games are big business, and some titles are worth a fortune so people will always flood the market with them for as long as they can - that's the joy of the Jaguar in a way, if you collect for that then the games are going to legit - sealed games (as stated) have the tag inside them, and nearly all of them sealed games range from $20 (Checkered Flag, Dragon etc) to $100 (Raiden, Defender 2000) and then a bit higher for Alien vs Predator, then higher for Another World, then much much higher for Battlesphere,  but one thing you will be getting if you collect for the Jaguar is the original game.

 

The real pirates out there are making their money on the more popular consoles, and the rarer games on those - collecting for the jaguar is a solid bet that what you are buying is legit. Just steer clear of Battlesphere's in the $100 - $200 price range.

 

It really is a great machine to collect for and a machine that a full collection of used or sealed games is achievable to collect without breaking the bank unlike collecting for some other machines where you will need to remortgage the house and then keep your fingers crossed that the games are legit. I just wonder who out there is trying to replicate the Nintendo plastic seals and then they can seal any old rubbish into a reproduction box and sell it for a fortune knowing that the seal will never be taken off the box, so the contents of the box will never be fully checked.

 

In my opinion, the Jaguar is a very very safe bet that what you are buying (sealed or not) will always be legit - there's just not enough money to be made by pirating Jaguar games. 



#20 travistouchdown OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Feb 9, 2019 2:48 PM

Agreed.

I have not once seen a reproduction battlesphere that wasn't labeled as such, and they NEVER come with a manual.

You are generally pretty safe with the Hand most repro folks are focusing on Nintendo and Sega offerings.

#21 -^CrožBow^- ONLINE  

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Posted Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:14 PM

Agreed.

I have not once seen a reproduction battlesphere that wasn't labeled as such, and they NEVER come with a manual.

You are generally pretty safe with the Hand most repro folks are focusing on Nintendo and Sega offerings.

 

I have... but it was still easy to tell apart because the label still didn't look quite right if you knew what to look for. But no where on the label did it state it was a reproduction. Then again it was priced like a reproduction so that too gave it away easy enough.



#22 madman OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Feb 11, 2019 3:41 PM

Yeah, didn't someone here recently buy a bootleg (I refuse to call them reproductions) Battlesphere on EBay where the seller had dozens of copies? IIRC it wasn't marked as such. 



#23 Stephen ONLINE  

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Posted Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:30 PM

Why is it ever acceptable or allowed to sell these bootlegs?  Even if offered as such?  I certainly can't sell a bootleg copy of Windows 10, even if I say "Hey, it's not legit, but that's OK, just hand me your cash"?  It's stealing plain and simple.

 


#24 alucardX OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:58 PM

 

Why is it ever acceptable or allowed to sell these bootlegs?  Even if offered as such?  I certainly can't sell a bootleg copy of Windows 10, even if I say "Hey, it's not legit, but that's OK, just hand me your cash"?  It's stealing plain and simple.

 

 

 

It's not okay, but Microsoft will swoop in to protect their copyright and no one is doing so with these Jag reproductions. The copyright holder actually has to initiate that process in some way.


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#25 travistouchdown OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:24 PM

Yeah and Microsoft is still selling Windows. The people who own Battlesphere won't do another run despite great demand so thats on them.

Now people bootlegging stuff Carl has the rights to at Songbird and is actually producing and selling still, that I think is very bad.




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