Thoughts on A8 upgrades

[Bryan]

I've been looking at all the stuff being done for the A8, and it's all very cool (and I'm not trying to discourage any of it), but I started thinking some things:

 

What upgrades should be performed and what upgrades take away from the 8-bit experience? Obviously, in this day and age anything is possible. An Atari could be fitted with high-resolution graphics, digital sound, a blazing processor, tons of RAM, etc... but where would you draw the line?

 

What things would you like to see, and not like to see? What would make the ultimate A8 without going too far?

 

-Bry

[Schmutzpuppe]

Really good question, hard to say where to draw the line...

For me an update should keep up the spirit of atari.

I know this is not very accurate let me give you an example, a vga adapter for the PBI wouldn't be such a device.

A definitely great update would be the dual GTIA/ANTIC solution I really looking forward to it.

One more update I'd really like to see is a dual (stereo) pokey in a FPGA enhanced with some different waveforms and a lowpass filter

[Goochman]

Without the software support Im not sure how far we really need to go. For me the best A8 enhancements are those that reduce the # of cables and increase ease of use -

 

Internal MyIDE - no more disk drives

USB Cart - Replacement joysticks and keyboards

Flashcarts - ease of loading carts

Desktop GUI - ease of managing files and such

Network interface - to exchange files easy

 

Just my $0.02

[Bryan]

I've thought about this, and personally I think an upgrade should be:

 

1. Atari related hardware. More POKEYs, ANTICs and whatnot fit this description.

 

2. Non-Atari hardware that was applicable to the A8 during its production life. Improved CPU's, more RAM, etc... fit this description.

 

3. Connectivity hardware. Things that make the A8 able to use modern devices, but don't actually change the nature of the machine itself. Adapters for Ethernet, USB, IDE, etc... fit this description.

 

In other words, enhancements to the hardware spec should reflect '80's technology. Connectivity upgrades allow us to apply the A8 today, and can be more modern in nature.

 

-Bry

[andy_bernstein]

Brian,

 

I've been thinking for a long time of how to update my beloved Atari 8-bit units to higher standards while still maintaining the Atari spirit.

 

My answer is simple: try to integrate as many Atari technologies possible (pre-Tramiel obviously as there was barely any 8bit development under his reign - save for the XEP80).

 

Obviously, the Double ANTIC / GTIA upgrade is kosher. Same goes with the Stereo POKEY upgrade, the 65c16 also works with me as it is the successor to the 6502 and even Apple managed to keep the spirit of the Apple II line with the IIGS.

 

What I would have loved to see was obviously an integration of the Maria graphics chip (see my post from last week) but, following your comments, it doesn't seem to be possible.

 

Some people talk about integrating the SID chip but, frankly, I'd rather see the AMY chip reverse engineered by a capable engineer so that we could figure out how to integrate it and maybe manufacture it within an expansion card (as a composer / orchestrator, the AMY would be the next generation of Atari 8-bit music for me).

 

SID emulation is very promising and, for me, would be the way to go (especially with two Pokey's inside a machine) rather than the integration of a native SID chip or two.

 

Also, I'd love to see possible integration of AMIGA elements within the 8-bit line as we know the Amiga should have been an Atari computer (not Commodore) but this is more down the road.

 

Finally, what I don't want to see are 5-6 upgrades that have to cohabit together. This, I really can't take. I'd rather try to find a way to make as many upgrades possible cohabiting on one board (even as an external unit) that would connect either through the parallel port (600/800XL) or the cartridge port for all other systems.

 

To make expansion boards easy to manufacture, affordable to all (to guarantee market penetration even if it's only 50-70 users), we need an overall simplification: the KERI chip - ANTIC / GTIA combination - would be a way to drive the price down for Mux's Double GTIA upgrade but it hasn't been made available until now.

 

1. Atari related hardware. More POKEYs, ANTICs and whatnot fit this description.

 

2. Non-Atari hardware that was applicable to the A8 during its production life. Improved CPU's, more RAM, etc... fit this description.

 

3. Connectivity hardware. Things that make the A8 able to use modern devices, but don't actually change the nature of the machine itself. Adapters for Ethernet, USB, IDE, etc... fit this description.

 

In other words, enhancements to the hardware spec should reflect '80's technology. Connectivity upgrades allow us to apply the A8 today, and can be more modern in nature.

 

1/2/3: I agree 100% with you.

 

Regarding the Double ANTIC / GTIA upgrade, once the prototype board is financed, manufactured and (especially) tested, I'll start another poll to get an idea of how many people want it. I expect my conversion of a well known video game to be using this board - what this board needs (and any other expansion board frankly) is a "killer app" that shows the improvements brought by it.

 

Also, I do have tons of PCB layout for extensions (even a 65c816 PCB layout that would fit nicely within an Atari) but it's really about time and money (I'm lacking both right now) so one thing at a time.

 

AB.

[frogstar_robot]

How about a 1090 like expansion cage that could take all sorts of boards and enhancements without having take apart our vintage hardware?

[Goochman]

I would also add that additional speed is a good thing also for things like ATOS and such

[andy_bernstein]

Frogstar,

 

Most upgrades will require internal soldering so you'll still have to open the case.

 

AB.

[BoatofCar]

I'm open to all upgrades which don't change the physical structure of the machine. I want my 1200XL to look like my 1200XL, kind of like when you see classic cars with all original interior, but a button folds down the original radio to reveal a pioneer stereo system