465 replies to this topic

[Mindfield]

ijor, on Tue Jun 7, 2005 4:06 PM, said:

Btw, speaking about the "fabulous" port of AR to the ST. I loaded the ST version the other day and noted something quite unusual.

Most of the time, the most important place in the titles goes for the original programmer. The one who made the port usually comes in second place only (smaller leters, appear later, etc).

In this case, the ST programmer appears first, and PP is mentioned only later. Guess he was thinking his port was better work than original PP's one

The ST version is crap.  There are a few more features than the 8-bit version, but it's missing a lot of the atmosphere, the music sucks, the sound sucks... it's just so bland.

[ijor]

Mindfield, on Tue Jun 7, 2005 5:50 PM, said:

ijor, on Tue Jun 7, 2005 4:06 PM, said:

Btw, speaking about the "fabulous" port of AR to the ST.

The ST version is crap...

Just in case it was not obvious. The usage I made of term "fabulous" was ironic.

[Xebec's Demise]

ijor, on Tue Jun 7, 2005 2:06 PM, said:

Btw, speaking about the "fabulous" port of AR to the ST. I loaded the ST version the other day and noted something quite unusual.

Most of the time, the most important place in the titles goes for the original programmer. The one who made the port usually comes in second place only (smaller leters, appear later, etc).

In this case, the ST programmer appears first, and PP is mentioned only later. Guess he was thinking his port was better work than original PP's one

*laughs*  Actually, he gets what he deserves for doing that.  He will forever be known as the tacky programer that ported the ST version.  I'm sure many have noticed his audacity in doing so.  Even 20 years later, people are still seeing the guy's mistake, trying to take the most credit for a game he did not originally program or design.

Urhm, urhm *clears throat and walks away*

Edited by Xebec's Demise, Wed Jun 8, 2005 2:39 PM.

[The Eidolon]

I almost liked the ST version better just because of the faster load times
and the lack of need for so much disk swapping.  Playing with a single
810 disk drive was painful, especially when that drive would permanently
damage a disk from time to time if it lost power with a disk inside.  I think
I lost side 2 of my 8-bit City disk that way...   (sheds a tear)

--The Eidolon

[Heaven/TQA]

worth to read:

http://www.marktaw.c...yTheVideoG.html

[Gunstar]

The Eidolon, on Wed Jun 8, 2005 8:34 PM, said:

I almost liked the ST version better just because of the faster load times
and the lack of need for so much disk swapping.  Playing with a single
810 disk drive was painful, especially when that drive would permanently
damage a disk from time to time if it lost power with a disk inside.  I think
I lost side 2 of my 8-bit City disk that way...   (sheds a tear)

--The Eidolon

I would agree that a single drive is a pain for all the swapping, I only had one 1050 when I first got the city, but I liked the game SO much that I bought a second 1050 just for A.R.: The City alone! Once you get by the initial swapping and loading of character, all you need is disk sides 2.1 and 2.2 (Making a copy of both sides on seperate disks by using the copier on side 2.1)and never have to touch the drives again until you save the game. Of course I Now have 4 disk drives (actually 5, but one isn't hooked up to the same 8-bit) as The Dungeon has more disks/sides and needs 4 drives to avoid swapping. But I don't mind the load times (less the more memory you have as well, it's great on a 128k+ Xl or XE) when I don't have to swap any disks. But I was glad I bought the second, etc. disk drives becuase they also came in handy for disk-backups and other games that required more than one disk, like Ultima 3 and 4 and many others. These days, even though I could play the ST version or play it on an emulator on my PC or DC, or even plway with multiple virtual drives with my SIO2PC, I still prefer using real disks on my real drives for nostalgia, but I'm also a patient man when it comes to waiting on games to load, especially when the are well worth the wait. Teh 8-bit version blows away every other port in so many catagories it's sick, there is no substitute to AR on my Atari 8-bit!

[Xebec's Demise]

Have you seen this article?

http://www.explore-g...te_Reality.html

Technology
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Among other things, AR contained some revolutionary technology and ideas for its time. It worked from a 3D first-person perspective, with a small window taking up about 1/9th of the screen at the center. The player controlled one character who had an absolute minimum of visual representation—the closest to a character image to be found was when one encountered a "doppleganger" monster. The 3D used was not like other contemporary 3D graphics either. Most other 3D first-person games used static graphics to represent the walls, meaning the player could only move one tile at a time. However, in this game the rate of travel depended on the character's speed, and moved incrementally along the tile. Distant walls would slowly come in to focus rather than suddenly appear.

Alternate Reality had a raycasting engine equalling that of Wolfenstein 3D, which came seven years later, but was recognized for popularizing the system! However, the design implemented right-angle movement only, thus hiding the revolutionary technology.

Another upshot of the fact that the graphics were rendered rather than simple images is that while the sun was setting, the entire pallete of colors changed convincingly. Distant waterfalls moved, and the rain was realistically rendered.

Edited by Xebec's Demise, Thu Jun 9, 2005 9:55 PM.

[Heaven/TQA]

there seem to be alternative gfx?

look at the screens...

http://www.atarimaga...Adventures.html

[Wrathchild]

Hi all,

A question regrading Stats. The FAQ refers to display and internal values.
(Section 5.3.1 MANIPULATING THE CITY, Eobet's FAQ version 2.0 - beta)
I've examined how these are calculated and here's my synopsis:

Each stat (STR/CHR etc) has a base offset address -
as given in the FAQ as the 'displayed' value. e.g. WIS = $8940
(btw - STR needs correcting from $892E to $895E)

Starting with 'Displayed' as having an offset of zero (s0)
then the calculation for displayed happens as follows:

min(s2+s3, 255) -> s1
min(s4+s6+s7, 255) -> s0
max(s1-s0, 0) -> s1
min(s1+s5, 255) -> s0

Therefore I'm not sure whether the Natural & Effective
values refer to s1 and s2 respectively? Looking at the
Levelling Up code, s2 is the entry that can get incremented
so I'd more say this is the 'Actual' and s1 is a working value?
The only s1 value referenced elsewhere in the code is STAmina.
However, I'm yet to examing the encounter code where it may
be used more.

I'll probably work out the uses for s3->s8 later but wonder
if anyone else had any ideas? Probably mods for armour,
drunkeness/poisons etc. A case of wait for something to
happen to your character and then use the debugger to
check the difference, (e.g. press F8 and then type 'm 8900'
to show the page of memory containing the stats).

Regards,
Mark

[Heaven/TQA]

http://www.eobet.com...ernate-reality/

just maybe someone can't find it on the net...

[Heaven/TQA]

and the 128 colour painter Mr price used...

http://www.atarimaga...n5/painter.html

[Xebec's Demise]

Wrathchild, on Fri Jun 10, 2005 7:34 AM, said:

Hi all,

A question regrading Stats. The FAQ refers to display and internal values.
(Section 5.3.1 MANIPULATING THE CITY, Eobet's FAQ version 2.0 - beta)
I've examined how these are calculated and here's my synopsis:

Each stat (STR/CHR etc) has a base offset address -
as given in the FAQ as the 'displayed' value. e.g. WIS = $8940
(btw - STR needs correcting from $892E to $895E)

Starting with 'Displayed' as having an offset of zero (s0)
then the calculation for displayed happens as follows:

min(s2+s3, 255) -> s1
min(s4+s6+s7, 255) -> s0
max(s1-s0, 0) -> s1
min(s1+s5, 255) -> s0

Therefore I'm not sure whether the Natural & Effective
values refer to s1 and s2 respectively? Looking at the
Levelling Up code, s2 is the entry that can get incremented
so I'd more say this is the 'Actual' and s1 is a working value?
The only s1 value referenced elsewhere in the code is STAmina.
However, I'm yet to examing the encounter code where it may
be used more.

I'll probably work out the uses for s3->s8 later but wonder
if anyone else had any ideas? Probably mods for armour,
drunkeness/poisons etc. A case of wait for something to
happen to your character and then use the debugger to
check the difference, (e.g. press F8 and then type 'm 8900'
to show the page of memory containing the stats).

Regards,
Mark

There should actually be four, the displayed, the natural, the effective and then an additional counter that goes from 1-255.  This is like the decimal place of the stat.  Once you successful use a skill 255 times, it will go up one.

[Wrathchild]

Xebec's Demise, on Fri Jun 10, 2005 6:44 PM, said:

There should actually be four, the displayed, the natural, the effective and then an additional counter that goes from 1-255.  This is like the decimal place of the stat.  Once you successful use a skill 255 times, it will go up one.

That makes sense, 's8' is used for that

[Chunder]

Greetings all! Just found this great place in my search for more AR City info - what a fantastic resource

I'd fully agree with the sentiments that the 8-Bit Atari version was the best; I spent *way* too much time playing it when I was younger... and have recently rediscovered how cool it is via the Atari800MacX emulator!

I've been running a few characters through their paces in an attempt to get one who can compete in the challenge, but of the first half dozen none have made it past level three... the worst thing was that the sixth character was doing _really_ well, but it all fell apart when I was taking a screenshot... no image file was generated, and I observed that whenever I pressed the F13 key it appeared to advance the clock - the sky got darker, night fell, rain came... but then when I tried to do anything else the keys didn't respond!! Argh! Reboot and lose all progress... curses!

I have fond memories of placing a help-wanted ad in Page 6/NAU once asking for AR:City help - some guy from Scotland called to let me know the best weapons (Magical Flamesword and Magical Spiked shield, maybe Tower shield) and armour (Magical Crystal Plate)... the only time I've ever found anything remotely interesting was getting a Flamesword once - but I didn't check its status... not magical, but Cursed! Typical

Anyway, my 7th character was getting fed up of being kicked around, so I had a look around for some ways to hack the game (knowing that this will invalidate that characters competition status) - after finding the FAQ on eobet.com, I took the plunge and went into hack mode. My fiancee is probably really p'd off with me for playing around with this all day, but it's been fun... and I've found quite a lot more interesting and useful stuff...

Format is Memory location, followed by a description, and some of my notes... use these at your own risk (for example, increasing the hunger/thirst/fatigue counters too much kills the character! I found that out the hard way... oops!)

8924 X coordinate (current)
8925 Y coordinate (current)
8926 X coordinate (previous)
8927 Y coordinate (previous)

892e Strength
892f
8930

8937 Intelligence
8938
8939

8940 Wisdom
8941
8942

8949 Skill
894a
894b

8952 Stamina
8953
8954

895b Charisma
895c
895d

8964 Speed?
8965
8966

897d Potions *2^0
897e Poisoned (not sure if the value indicates the strength of poisoning?)

89d0 Noticeability? (appears to be a count down, or something?)

8aa6 Experience *2^24
8aa7 Experience *2^16
8aa8 Experience *2^8
8aa9 Experience *2^0

8aaa Level *2^24
8aab Level *2^16
8aac Level *2^8
8aad Level *2^0

8ab8 Hit points (current) *2^8
8ab9 Hit points (current) *2^0
8abc Hit points (maximum) *2^8
8abd Hit points (maximum) *2^0

8abe Gold *2^24
8abf Gold *2^16
8ac0 Gold *2^8
8ac1 Gold *2^0

8ac2 Silver *2^24
8ac3 Silver *2^16
8ac4 Silver *2^8
8ac5 Silver *2^0

8ac6 Copper *2^24
8ac7 Copper *2^16
8ac8 Copper *2^8
8ac9 Copper *2^0

8aca Gems *2^24
8acb Gems *2^16
8acc Gems *2^8
8acd Gems *2^0

8ace Jewels *2^24
8acf Jewels *2^16
8ad0 Jewels *2^8
8ad1 Jewels *2^0

8f9d ?
8f9e ?
8f9f ?

8fa0 ?
8fa1 ?
8fa2 Inebriation (0-FE=Tipsy, FF=Drunk)
8fa3 Blackout?
8fa4 Blindness?
8fa5 ?
8fa6 Treasure finding (each item found decreases counter?) (WOO!!)

8fab Food packets *2^0
8fac Water flasks *2^0

8fad Hunger level (00-06=Normal, 07-0C=Hungry, 0D+=Famished)
8fae Thirst level (00-06=Normal, 07-0B=Thirsty, 0C-0F=Very Thirsty, 10+=Parched)
8faf Fatigue (00-0f=Normal, 0f-?=Tired)

8fb1 ?
8fb2?


Some other observations:
8b0a-d seems to contain the primary weapon, and 8b0e-8b11 the secondary. The first two addresses of each (e.g. 8b0a-b and 8b0e-f, respectively) contain the low and high byte memory address for the relevant weapon - for example, the 8b0a=94, 8b0b=8D. If I was to look in location 8D94, there's the details for my Magical Sword (the first 7 bytes are either all 00 for a normal weapon, or CDC1C7C9C3C1CC for a magic variant; not sure about cursed).
The second two addresses from the original location (e.g. 8b0c and 8b0d) are again a low-high memory address pair; e.g. 89 BD points to memory location BD89. This location seems to be a three byte number containing the strength of the weapon, but I'm not too sure what each of the bits mean... but shove them each up to FF, and whatever you're wielding becomes unstoppable

Hope that this is of interest to someone - if anyone else has done any digging, then I'd be interested to see what you've found...

(e.g. where is the alignment held? Temperature must be in there somewhere, too, as is the disease... Are the potions random, or are their details held somewhere? etc. etc.)

Regards!

[Mindfield]

Chunder, on Sun Jun 12, 2005 6:46 PM, said:

Greetings all! Just found this great place in my search for more AR City info - what a fantastic resource

Indeed it is and welcome aboard!

Quote

897e Poisoned (not sure if the value indicates the strength of poisoning?)

More than likely it does.  Based on current speculation there should also be somewhere that is a modifier to this that indicates your character's level of immunity to poison.

Quote

89d0 Noticeability? (appears to be a count down, or something?)

Probably; IIRC there is a potion you can drink that makes you very conspicuous, which increases the number of encounters you have.  This is awesome when used in conjunction with treasure finding!

Quote

8aaa Level *2^24
8aab Level *2^16
8aac Level *2^8
8aad Level *2^0

Why on Earth would you need 4 bytes to express your character's level?  I spent months just reaching level 14 -- not even half a byte yet!

Quote

8ab8 Hit points (current) *2^8
8ab9 Hit points (current) *2^0
8abc Hit points (maximum) *2^8
8abd Hit points (maximum) *2^0

There should also be "percieved" and "natural" bytes for this (used for when you're drunk or otherwise perceptually altered) -- the "natural" stat would be your base "real" HPs.

Quote

8fa3 Blackout?
8fa4 Blindness?

Probably -- from potions of blindness, inebriation (since you blackout periodically), etc.

Quote

8fa6 Treasure finding (each item found decreases counter?) (WOO!!)

I have also speculated that any given potion of treasure finding may have a random strength, which of course affects how long it lasts -- but I also believe that the stronger the potion (the higher this counter) the more valuable items you find, and as it counts down you find increasingly less valuable (and possibly fewer) such items.

Quote

Some other observations:
8b0a-d seems to contain the primary weapon, and 8b0e-8b11 the secondary. The first two addresses of each (e.g. 8b0a-b and 8b0e-f, respectively) contain the low and high byte memory address for the relevant weapon - for example, the 8b0a=94, 8b0b=8D. If I was to look in location 8D94, there's the details for my Magical Sword (the first 7 bytes are either all 00 for a normal weapon, or CDC1C7C9C3C1CC for a magic variant; not sure about cursed).
The second two addresses from the original location (e.g. 8b0c and 8b0d) are again a low-high memory address pair; e.g. 89 BD points to memory location BD89. This location seems to be a three byte number containing the strength of the weapon, but I'm not too sure what each of the bits mean... but shove them each up to FF, and whatever you're wielding becomes unstoppable

Each weapon likely contains various stats -- the minimum and maximum damage it is capable of inflicting, a to-hit value (essentially a skill modifier that increases or decreases your chances of hitting your opponent), whether or not it is magical and if so, what type of magic it poseses, a modifier that increases or decreases either its maximum damage, to-hit ratio, versus modifier (i.e. a flamesword may damage creatures who are vulnerable to flame more than another creature), or conversely its cursed status, which would also modify your to-hit and damage levels most likely, and so on.

Quote

(e.g. where is the alignment held? Temperature must be in there somewhere, too, as is the disease... Are the potions random, or are their details held somewhere? etc. etc.)

I'm pretty sure potions are determined at random -- the game probably determines what it is when you examin/sip/quaff it.

Edited by Mindfield, Mon Jun 13, 2005 4:24 AM.

[Gunstar]

Mindfield, on Mon Jun 13, 2005 10:23 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure potions are determined at random -- the game probably determines what it is when you examin/sip/quaff it.

One of the guides states that the type of potion is decided the moment it is used(opened/unseal) and something about saving a character with 3 or more potions allowing the potions to be different with each load, but if it's decided upon using th potion, then I would think this would be true no matter how many potions you save a character with...my point is that any potion in your posession is potentially anything right up until you unseal it.

[Chunder]

Mindfield, on Mon Jun 13, 2005 10:23 AM, said:

Quote

89d0 Noticeability? (appears to be a count down, or something?)

Probably; IIRC there is a potion you can drink that makes you very conspicuous, which increases the number of encounters you have.  This is awesome when used in conjunction with treasure finding!

Yeah, this is what I was thinking, although my experimentation at tweaking the values didn't amount to much! There's potions of invisibility and noticeability, and the Assassins guild teaches you to be more stealthy - which presumably reduces your noticeability...

Quote

Quote

8aaa Level *2^24
8aab Level *2^16
8aac Level *2^8
8aad Level *2^0

Why on Earth would you need 4 bytes to express your character's level?  I spent months just reaching level 14 -- not even half a byte yet!

Yeah, weird, huh? Perhaps he was hedging on the situation where a person keeps a character right through the whole series? The only things against this are that (a) the stats max out at 255 and (b) experience, by the very virtue of its relationship with level, needs must be a much larger number. How are you ever suppose to earn the high levels if the experience level doesn't go high enough??!

Quote

Quote

8ab8 Hit points (current) *2^8
8ab9 Hit points (current) *2^0
8abc Hit points (maximum) *2^8
8abd Hit points (maximum) *2^0

There should also be "percieved" and "natural" bytes for this (used for when you're drunk or otherwise perceptually altered) -- the "natural" stat would be your base "real" HPs.

Oh yeah, I forgot about that. I can't remember what 8ab6/7 had in them - it seems likely that they'll be the right address, though...

Quote

Quote

8fa3 Blackout?
8fa4 Blindness?

Probably -- from potions of blindness, inebriation (since you blackout periodically), etc.

This is a strange one - if you set the blackout value to non-zero, your character blacks out once, and the value is reset to zero... perhaps it is programmatically reset whilst your character is on the drunken bender?

(on a side note, the inebriation seems to be controlled by a selection of addresses - which strikes me as rather odd; it isn't as straightforward as the single-byte counter of hunger, thirst, etc...)

Quote

Quote

8fa6 Treasure finding (each item found decreases counter?) (WOO!!)

I have also speculated that any given potion of treasure finding may have a random strength, which of course affects how long it lasts -- but I also believe that the stronger the potion (the higher this counter) the more valuable items you find, and as it counts down you find increasingly less valuable (and possibly fewer) such items.

Yep - I think that you're right; this is probably the way in which the poison potions work, too.
One thing I noticed was when I artificially maxed the TF value, and then quaffed another TF potion, the stat went right down. It seems like the program just accumulated the two values, and only stored the LSB...

Quote

Quote

Some other observations:
8b0a-d seems to contain the primary weapon, and 8b0e-8b11 the secondary. The first two addresses of each (e.g. 8b0a-b and 8b0e-f, respectively) contain the low and high byte memory address for the relevant weapon - for example, the 8b0a=94, 8b0b=8D. If I was to look in location 8D94, there's the details for my Magical Sword (the first 7 bytes are either all 00 for a normal weapon, or CDC1C7C9C3C1CC for a magic variant; not sure about cursed).
The second two addresses from the original location (e.g. 8b0c and 8b0d) are again a low-high memory address pair; e.g. 89 BD points to memory location BD89. This location seems to be a three byte number containing the strength of the weapon, but I'm not too sure what each of the bits mean... but shove them each up to FF, and whatever you're wielding becomes unstoppable

Each weapon likely contains various stats -- the minimum and maximum damage it is capable of inflicting, a to-hit value (essentially a skill modifier that increases or decreases your chances of hitting your opponent), whether or not it is magical and if so, what type of magic it poseses, a modifier that increases or decreases either its maximum damage, to-hit ratio, versus modifier (i.e. a flamesword may damage creatures who are vulnerable to flame more than another creature), or conversely its cursed status, which would also modify your to-hit and damage levels most likely, and so on.

Agreed that this is how it should work (i.e. how you'd design it to work) but I can't seem to find any of the relevant info within the memory - this one will probably need quite a lot more investigation...

All interesting stuff, anyway!

(on preview - hmm, my quotes don't seem to be quoting! Weird... no tags are open... perhaps the posted message will be OK?)

[Mindfield]

Chunder, on Mon Jun 13, 2005 8:18 AM, said:

Yeah, this is what I was thinking, although my experimentation at tweaking the values didn't amount to much! There's potions of invisibility and noticeability, and the Assassins guild teaches you to be more stealthy - which presumably reduces your noticeability...

The Assassin's Guild's stealth training increases your chances of surprising (sneaking up on) an opponent.

Quote

Yeah, weird, huh? Perhaps he was hedging on the situation where a person keeps a character right through the whole series? The only things against this are that (a) the stats max out at 255 and (b) experience, by the very virtue of its relationship with level, needs must be a much larger number. How are you ever suppose to earn the high levels if the experience level doesn't go high enough??!

Well that's the thing; each successive level gained requires double the amount of experience needed to reach the previous level, thus a level 10 character that requires 128,000XP would need 256,000XP to reach level 11.  Four bytes of experience would be enough to accommodate 255 experience levels -- and since I doubt anyone, ever, has reached that level I can't see any point.  My only guess is that these may not be MSB/LSB but another set of current/max/percieved/actual bytes -- even though nothing in the city that I'm aware of effects experience levels in an impermanent capacity.

Quote

This is a strange one - if you set the blackout value to non-zero, your character blacks out once, and the value is reset to zero... perhaps it is programmatically reset whilst your character is on the drunken bender?

(on a side note, the inebriation seems to be controlled by a selection of addresses - which strikes me as rather odd; it isn't as straightforward as the single-byte counter of hunger, thirst, etc...)

In all probability drunkenness (and for that matter confusion) temporarily alters an assortment of stats -- intermittent blindness, loss of one's sense of direction,  speed (slower), stealth (less stealthy), noticeability (more noticeable), skill (less skillful), etc.

Quote

Agreed that this is how it should work (i.e. how you'd design it to work) but I can't seem to find any of the relevant info within the memory - this one will probably need quite a lot more investigation...

I imagine a great lot of these hidden, inner workings are going to be difficult to flush out.  You have to hedge your own observations against changing stats and figure out whether or not the stat you're watching is having the in-game effect you think it is.  Definitely not an easy thing to work out.

An interesting thing; I was thinking about the game again on my way to work this morning and I realized something.  AR probably has one of the most significant cult followings of any RPG -- pretty well anyone who's ever played it has loved it and still loves it and regards it as one of the best RPGs ever.  We all know this.  The really bizarre thing is, it managed to achieve such a status in spite of breaking one of the most significant cardinal rules of any RPG: It has no plot!  There is a general overall theme, but there's just no plot -- no goal to work towards, no quests, absolutely nothing.  The game isn't even finished for cryin' out loud!  You can't join the guilds like you should have been able to, nor any of the other planned excersizes within the game.  That's a pretty heavy testament to the strong gameplay this game has.

And in a related observation, I was considering what purpose the curious peripheral establishments would have played in the game:

Jack's Fitness Academy: I can imagine that this would have been a gym.  You probably could have gone there to work out, thus over time increasing strength, stamina, speed, constitution, and other stats.  Would have been interesting if this had been implemented.

House of Ill Repute: You probably could have gone there for some "healing" -- though likely with the risk of contracting a disease.  I doubt that even if Philip had implemented this Datasoft would have ever let that one pass -- a whorehouse in a video game?  The uproar would have been deafening.

[Chunder]

@Mindfield

The suspected level fields definitely seem to bump up the level - the displayed value changes to a string of exclamation points

Drunkeness doesn't seem to alter the stats; I had an expensive bender last night, but it didn't seem to change anything.
Delusion, however, changes the s5 value (as defined in Wrathchild's post about the stats calculations), and extreme fatigue changes s7.
Poisoning doesn't seem to have an effect on the stats - I drank every poison potion that I could get my hands on; there's a strange series of address which get updated each time you get poisoned (or so it seemed) up to a certain point... can't remember the exact locations but it's written down at home.

@Thread

Can anyone tell me what went wrong with the quoting in my previous post? As far as I can tell, it should be fine - everything is closed off, and there's no random nonsensical tags in there... very odd

[analmux]

Well....to quote your quotes:

Quote

[quote][quote]8aaa Level *2^24
8aab Level *2^16
8aac Level *2^8
8aad Level *2^0[/quote] f.e.

you only have to "quote" once, while you typed two open-quote tags, and one close-quote tag.

[analmux]

oh, I didn't mention that you guys are probably pissing off Xebec now, you bunch of cheaters........examining character data is prohibited by law, and should be punished by death.  

Edited by analmux, Tue Jun 14, 2005 7:34 AM.

[Chunder]

analmux, on Tue Jun 14, 2005 1:32 PM, said:

oh, I didn't mention that you guys are probably pissing off Xebec now, you bunch of cheaters........examining character data is prohibited by law, and should be punished by death. 

Lol - yeah, I did think that after having read through a few of his (?) posts regarding allowing character backups in the flash-cart version...
Punishable by *perma*death - you don't want anyone to come back to life from using a backup, do you?


Re. the quoting - there's actually two levels of quoting there; i.e. me quoting someone else, and that quote in itself is quoting a previous response.
It appears to work everywhere else... I'll have a look in more detail; perhaps it just needs some extra spaces, or something....

[analmux]

Chunder, on Tue Jun 14, 2005 4:54 PM, said:

analmux, on Tue Jun 14, 2005 1:32 PM, said:

oh, I didn't mention that you guys are probably pissing off Xebec now, you bunch of cheaters........examining character data is prohibited by law, and should be punished by death. 

Lol - yeah, I did think that after having read through a few of his (?) posts regarding allowing character backups in the flash-cart version...
Punishable by *perma*death - you don't want anyone to come back to life from using a backup, do you?


Re. the quoting - there's actually two levels of quoting there; i.e. me quoting someone else, and that quote in itself is quoting a previous response.
It appears to work everywhere else... I'll have a look in more detail; perhaps it just needs some extra spaces, or something....

weird........just a quote test:

Quote

Quote

quotation

quoted quotation

[deathtrappomegranate]

Chunder, on Tue Jun 14, 2005 10:54 PM, said:

Re. the quoting - there's actually two levels of quoting there; i.e. me quoting someone else, and that quote in itself is quoting a previous response.
It appears to work everywhere else... I'll have a look in more detail; perhaps it just needs some extra spaces, or something....

I've had a look at your post with the quotes. It looks OK.

The part up to and including "LSB..." works fine on its own. The rest of the post works OK on its own. This is weird.

[Mindfield]

Chunder, on Tue Jun 14, 2005 7:09 AM, said:

@Mindfield

The suspected level fields definitely seem to bump up the level - the displayed value changes to a string of exclamation points

I think the "!!!!" is just the game's way of displaying a number that's either too long to fit, or negative.

Quote

Drunkeness doesn't seem to alter the stats; I had an expensive bender last night, but it didn't seem to change anything.
Delusion, however, changes the s5 value (as defined in Wrathchild's post about the stats calculations), and extreme fatigue changes s7.
Poisoning doesn't seem to have an effect on the stats - I drank every poison potion that I could get my hands on; there's a strange series of address which get updated each time you get poisoned (or so it seemed) up to a certain point... can't remember the exact locations but it's written down at home.

Well, that was all pure speculation on my part -- I didn't know for sure whether or not any hidden stats were altered, but it would have made sense in context.  I do know that extreme inebriation causes those temporary blackouts and causes you to change your direction at random -- I just figured there may be other less obvious side effects.

Poisoning probably doesn't affect any of the obvious stats, but I'm certain there is at least one or more locations that contain information on either the amount and/or type of poisons you have consumed during the life of your character and/or your character's susceptability to them such that over a (long) period of time you can build up an immunity to one or more of them.  It took my character 'til at least 11th or 12th level before he was immune to deadly poison -- and that was with me quaffing every single red/sweet potion I could without hesitation as soon as my character was high level enough to withstand the ravages of deadly poison until I could get to a healer.