Atari ST Monitor Questions

[atarian1]

Actually, the JVC monitors were the first version of the SC1224. I always pick those up if I find them because they certainly are the best.

[TheAtariKing]

Actually, the JVC monitors were the first version of the SC1224.  I always pick those up if I find them because they certainly are the best.

934867[/snapback]

 

You are wrong about that. The "ET Head" was the first version of the Atari SC1224 color monitor. Do your homework, buddy.

[+Mitch]

Actually, the JVC monitors were the first version of the SC1224.  I always pick those up if I find them because they certainly are the best.

934867[/snapback]

 

You are wrong about that. The "ET Head" was the first version of the Atari SC1224 color monitor. Do your homework, buddy.

934886[/snapback]

 

No, actually he's right. The JVCs were first, then the Goldstar and lastly the Samsung.

 

Mitch

[tjlazer]

Isn't the "ET Head" the one for the Mega ST series? If so it cannot be the first as the 520ST came out before the Mega ST

[TheAtariKing]

Isn't the "ET Head" the one for the Mega ST series?  If so it cannot be the first as the 520ST came out before the Mega ST

935573[/snapback]

 

No, the Samsung monitor is for the MegaST. It is the lowest quality, but best looking in appearance. The Goldstar monitors are nice and I personally think they look better on a MegaST. The JVC monitor is more for professional use. It has a longer picture tube and is the best quality of the three. The ET Head (Goldstar) monitor is the one that is usually seen in old Atari ST ads. When I got my first ST, back in 1985, it came with a Goldstar monitor and a single-sided disk drive. I think the JVC monitors were only available in Japan at the time. I could be wrong about this, but that is what I remember.

[tjlazer]

Isn't the "ET Head" the one for the Mega ST series?  If so it cannot be the first as the 520ST came out before the Mega ST

935573[/snapback]

 

No, the Samsung monitor is for the MegaST. It is the lowest quality, but best looking in appearance. The Goldstar monitors are nice and I personally think they look better on a MegaST. The JVC monitor is more for professional use. It has a longer picture tube and is the best quality of the three. The ET Head (Goldstar) monitor is the one that is usually seen in old Atari ST ads. When I got my first ST, back in 1985, it came with a Goldstar monitor and a single-sided disk drive. I think the JVC monitors were only available in Japan at the time. I could be wrong about this, but that is what I remember.

935614[/snapback]

 

Oh ok so the ET Head must be some kind of prototype monitor then? I wonder if someone can dig up a picture of it.

 

Kinda like the "boxy" Amiga 1080 and 1902 monitors, do you remember seeing them in old computer magazines?

[dbvandyke]

Hello all,

 

I have a Mega ST4 and a 1040ST. I would like to sell them on eBay, but I don't know if they work or not. Does someone have a wiring diagram for the video port and / or know of a way to connect it to a modern monitor? Even via a composite connection would be great. I have an "old school" Commodore 1702 monitor and somewhere I have an old Apple II color monitor that I could use also.

 

Thanks.

[dbvandyke]

One more thing... I opened up the Mega ST4 and see that there is, pluged into the processor socket, some kind of daughter card. It has "© Sack" printed on its circute board. Does anyone know what it is?

 

Thanks again.

 

Ok I looked at it again, and it is actually soldered (pin for pin) TO the existing processor.

 

Here... I'll try to attach a photo.

Edited October 8, 2005 by dbvandyke

[Paolo]

Sack made emulator boards for ataris. maybe it is an AT-speed board

[Gunstar]

Hello all,

 

I have a Mega ST4 and a 1040ST. I would like to sell them on eBay, but I don't know if they work or not. Does someone have a wiring diagram for the video port and / or know of a way to connect it to a modern monitor? Even via a composite connection would be great. I have an "old school" Commodore 1702 monitor and somewhere I have an old Apple II color monitor that I could use also.

 

Thanks.

944222[/snapback]

 

One of the 13 pins (don't know which one off hand) on the ST's monitor port puts out a monochrome-composite signal that you could attach an RCA style plug to and then attach it to a RCA composite video input jack on a TV (or that Apple&cCommodore monitors composite jack) for testing purposes. This IS NOT monochrome high-res mode, it will display the low&medium resolution in monochrome. You'd hook the postive wire of the RCA jack to the pin and the negative (ground) wire to any ground position (or shielding which is grounded) on the ST.

Edited October 8, 2005 by Gunstar

[atarian1]

Hello all,

 

I have a Mega ST4 and a 1040ST. I would like to sell them on eBay, but I don't know if they work or not. Does someone have a wiring diagram for the video port and / or know of a way to connect it to a modern monitor? Even via a composite connection would be great. I have an "old school" Commodore 1702 monitor and somewhere I have an old Apple II color monitor that I could use also.

 

Thanks.

944222[/snapback]

 

One of the 13 pins (don't know which one off hand) on the ST's monitor port puts out a monochrome-composite signal that you could attach an RCA style plug to and then attach it to a RCA composite video input jack on a TV (or that Apple&cCommodore monitors composite jack) for testing purposes. This IS NOT monochrome high-res mode, it will display the low&medium resolution in monochrome. You'd hook the postive wire of the RCA jack to the pin and the negative (ground) wire to any ground position (or shielding which is grounded) on the ST.

944543[/snapback]

 

Note that this method only works on machines that have an RF modulator in it. You can't use this method on the MegaST and you can only do this on your 1040ST if you have a 1040STFM version of the machine.

 

You could wire up a VGA adapter if you know how to make cables. Diagrams to make this are available here:

ST to VGA adapter.

[dbvandyke]

Wow. Thanks Atarian1. That is exactly what I need. Too bad Atari made their video output so propriatary so one had to use an Atari monitor.

 

Thanks, and also thanks to Paolo for his comments.

[Gunstar]

Hello all,

 

I have a Mega ST4 and a 1040ST. I would like to sell them on eBay, but I don't know if they work or not. Does someone have a wiring diagram for the video port and / or know of a way to connect it to a modern monitor? Even via a composite connection would be great. I have an "old school" Commodore 1702 monitor and somewhere I have an old Apple II color monitor that I could use also.

Thanks.

944222[/snapback]

 

One of the 13 pins (don't know which one off hand) on the ST's monitor port puts out a monochrome-composite signal that you could attach an RCA style plug to and then attach it to a RCA composite video input jack on a TV (or that Apple&cCommodore monitors composite jack) for testing purposes. This IS NOT monochrome high-res mode, it will display the low&medium resolution in monochrome. You'd hook the postive wire of the RCA jack to the pin and the negative (ground) wire to any ground position (or shielding which is grounded) on the ST.

944543[/snapback]

 

Note that this method only works on machines that have an RF modulator in it. You can't use this method on the MegaST and you can only do this on your 1040ST if you have a 1040STFM version of the machine.

 

You could wire up a VGA adapter if you know how to make cables. Diagrams to make this are available here:

ST to VGA adapter.

944907[/snapback]

 

That is not completely correct, I did this with my 1040STf (with out the RF modulator) and it works perfectly, that is how I know about it; from experience. Myabe you are right about the Mega's, I haven't tried with them, but if it works with my 1040stf, it probably works with all basic ST models.The monochrome composite video output pin on the ST's monitor jack has nothing to do with the RF modulator at all.

 

I also have a custom adapter I made for high-res monochrome on a VGA monitor like you are talking about.

Edited October 9, 2005 by Gunstar

[dbvandyke]

Hi, wired it all up according to the instructions... BINGO DINGO, it works! Would be nice if there were some way to get color on my 21" monitor. I guess I would have to buy some adapter or somethings... but then there I go again. I just need to clean 'em up for an eBay appearance.

 

I have a 40MB hard drive that I hooked up to it and right away it booted off of it and there is some software and files on it, but don't really know how to use it.

 

Any way to get color out of this thing with bailing wire and chewing gum?

 

Question: Where would the RF modulator connect in? Does it plug into the monitor output port, inside the machine, or maybe through the expansion port?

 

Thanks to all! You have been a great help.

 

[Paolo]

I can't understand why you get the composite signal, but not the colour... it looks like you caught the luminance signal off who knows what pin...

 

What I remember is that you can't get the composite out of the MEGASTE since they dropped it in favour of a genlockable signal (i know, since I miss so much that lovely composite who let me tape some little things I made on my ST)

 

About the RF: the modulator was placed in another area of the motherboard, and IIRC they used the composite and audio and modulated them in the RFmod

[ijor]

I never heard about a "mono" composite signal, and I think this doesn't make much sense. May be your ST is PAL and your TV is NTSC (or viceversa)? This would explain why you don't get colors.

 

The composite signal has to be related to the RF modulator. You can't have composite without encoder. And AFAIK there were no ST produced with encoder but without RF modulator (once you have the composite encoder circuit, it doesn't take too much to add the RF). You got either both composite and RF, or none. But may be you do have a computer with encoder but not modulator (that would be strange)?

 

Can you check on what pin of the monitor connector you got this signal?

[tjlazah]

Wow. Thanks Atarian1. That is exactly what I need. Too bad Atari made their video output so propriatary so one had to use an Atari monitor.

 

Thanks, and also thanks to Paolo for his comments.

944919[/snapback]

 

Actually Atari did not make video output propriatary, you could use a non Atari monitor if you wanted to, just had to use the correct plug. It was plain RGB. Commodore did the same thing but they did use a somewhat easier to find connector. (DB23 type)

[Gunstar]

I never heard about a "mono" composite signal, and I think this doesn't make much sense. May be your ST is PAL and your TV is NTSC (or viceversa)? This would explain why you don't get colors.

 

The composite signal has to be related to the RF modulator. You can't have composite without encoder. And AFAIK there were no ST produced with encoder but without RF modulator (once you have the composite encoder circuit, it doesn't take too much to add the RF). You got either both composite and RF, or none. But may be you do have a computer with encoder but not modulator (that would be strange)?

 

Can you check on what pin of the monitor connector you got this signal?

945605[/snapback]

 

Well, I don't know what to tell you except that I have a 1040STf without any RF modulator and it works. It's pin 11 on the monitor connector. Here is a link to the ST monitor pinout: http://pinouts.ru/data/AtariStMonitor_pinout.shtml

 

It says monochrome signal, I connected a standard RCA jack to it and ground, and you can run it to any composite RCA plug on a TV or monitor and get B&W output in low&mendium resolution. So if it requires a composite encoder circuit, then obviously my 1040STf has a composite encoder circuit on it. It is a standard NTSC 1040STf. I also know that another friend of mine needed something to use with his ST until he got a monitor, and IIRC, it was a Mega ST or Mega STE, I have know idea if he had RF or not, but it also worked for him. It has been a few years since I did this, but I also noticed on the pinout that there is a composite video out too, so maybe I used it instead, it's been a while, maybe the monochrome video is for the ST monochrome High res and I use the composite out, in any case, I connected it to my Commodore 1080S at the time and I got a B&W picture, this monitor works in color with my 8-bit and other composite video sources I connected to it, so if it was the composite output I used, I have no idea why it was in B&W, but I do recall connecting it to the pin that I though was monochrome video out. In any case, according to what you have said, the composite out pin should not have worked either if I have no RF modulator, but it does work (which ever pin I used).

Edited October 12, 2005 by Gunstar

[ijor]

Well, I don't know what to tell you except that I have a 1040STf without any RF modulator and it works. It's pin 11 on the monitor connector.

 

I really have no idea what you were getting.

 

I suppose that indeed it wasn't pin 11. Pin 11 is mono output for high resolution. And not only that there is no singal at this pin on low/med rez; that pin alone by itself is useless because it has no sync information.

 

So I guess you used pin 2, which is composite output. It is well known that the signal on this pin is only working on ST models with RF modulator. In the original (non F models) official schematics, this pin is NC (not connected).

 

But what can I say. If it worked for you, it worked, again, no idea what was going on.

 

Btw, I don't know if this was your case; but you sometimes get B&W on the composite ST output because of a sync mismatch. The refresh rate is software programmable in the ST. And many euro games force a 50Hz refresh rate disregading what kind of ST model you have. Then, many TV's get confused if they receive an NTSC signal at 50Hz.

[+remowilliams]

The b&w composite signal doesn't seem to make much sense. Unless as was already mentioned that it is a 50/60hz issue.

 

My 1040ST has a modulator and I built a cable to get composite video (and the other vid signals) from it using Pin 2. This cable has also worked on two other STs. Can't say for sure if all of them had modulators or not though.

 

Pin 11 definitely is the monochrome high res vid signal as I've used that one as well.

[Rybags]

All DB15 (3 rows of pins) monitor cables are analog.

EGA monitors (DB9) are digital, and as such only capable of 8 colours.

 

Digital has only recently made a return to the mainstream with LCD monitors using DVI cables. And, AFAIK they use a bitstream to describe the pixels.

 

In any case, the number of colours displayable is a limitation of the display hardware of the computer, even 24 bit RGB colour provides a fraction of the range that a monitor can display.

 

Re: border colour. The ST's don't have a border colour register like the C-64. The border assumes the background colour (0). Standard desktop display is green, and border white as the OS uses a foreground colour for the destop.

Using raster interrupts or hardware tricks like overscan hacks could allow a different border colour, but it would be more trouble than it's worth (for the side borders, anyway).

[Greenious]

Well, I don't know what to tell you except that I have a 1040STf without any RF modulator and it works. It's pin 11 on the monitor connector.

 

I really have no idea what you were getting.

 

I suppose that indeed it wasn't pin 11. Pin 11 is mono output for high resolution. And not only that there is no singal at this pin on low/med rez; that pin alone by itself is useless because it has no sync information.

 

So I guess you used pin 2, which is composite output. It is well known that the signal on this pin is only working on ST models with RF modulator. In the original (non F models) official schematics, this pin is NC (not connected).

 

But what can I say. If it worked for you, it worked, again, no idea what was going on.

 

Btw, I don't know if this was your case; but you sometimes get B&W on the composite ST output because of a sync mismatch. The refresh rate is software programmable in the ST. And many euro games force a 50Hz refresh rate disregading what kind of ST model you have. Then, many TV's get confused if they receive an NTSC signal at 50Hz.

947054[/snapback]

 

 

About the mono signal working in low & med res... Never heard of it, and never tried it. But it is not completely unplausible. I can very well imagine that Atari didn't put any safeguards against that kind of output, since it normally shouldn't be anything connected to mono-out when a colour monitor is connected & vice versa.

 

Also, about composite... According to my schematics, non-rf modulator equipped ataris send hsync+vsync to pin 2, although no colour/pic data. And on my schematics, it's refered to as Composite Sync on non rfmod equipped models, and composite video on rfmod equipped models.

[Gunstar]

Well, I don't know what to tell you except that I have a 1040STf without any RF modulator and it works. It's pin 11 on the monitor connector.

 

I really have no idea what you were getting.

 

I suppose that indeed it wasn't pin 11. Pin 11 is mono output for high resolution. And not only that there is no singal at this pin on low/med rez; that pin alone by itself is useless because it has no sync information.

 

So I guess you used pin 2, which is composite output. It is well known that the signal on this pin is only working on ST models with RF modulator. In the original (non F models) official schematics, this pin is NC (not connected).

 

But what can I say. If it worked for you, it worked, again, no idea what was going on.

 

Btw, I don't know if this was your case; but you sometimes get B&W on the composite ST output because of a sync mismatch. The refresh rate is software programmable in the ST. And many euro games force a 50Hz refresh rate disregading what kind of ST model you have. Then, many TV's get confused if they receive an NTSC signal at 50Hz.

947054[/snapback]

 

 

About the mono signal working in low & med res... Never heard of it, and never tried it. But it is not completely unplausible. I can very well imagine that Atari didn't put any safeguards against that kind of output, since it normally shouldn't be anything connected to mono-out when a colour monitor is connected & vice versa.

 

Also, about composite... According to my schematics, non-rf modulator equipped ataris send hsync+vsync to pin 2, although no colour/pic data. And on my schematics, it's refered to as Composite Sync on non rfmod equipped models, and composite video on rfmod equipped models.

949031[/snapback]

Hmm...interesting. Well, as I stated before, it's been several years since I did this "mod" and it has been long since removed since I have had an SC1224 for years now, but whether it was pin 2 or pin 11, I did infact get a B&W composite picture in low&medium res. Not that any of it really matters now. The origianl poster just asked if there was a way to get a video signal without the monitor and I suggested what I had done, and he has apparently figured out something now anyway.

[dbvandyke]

Once again, thanks everyone for your help.

 

I wired up a cable based on the information found at this link:

 

http://www.notator.org/html/contributions.html#st_vga

 

I think this wiring scheme is specifically for getting a hi-rez, B&W picture on a VGA monitor.

 

Does anyone have a step-by-step, as in the above linked information, on how I could do this to get color?

 

Thank you again. You Atari fans are fervent... and it's NICE!

 

Edited October 19, 2005 by dbvandyke

[krupkaj]

It is easy to make cable for color, just connect R, G, B, VSYNC, HSYNC and GND to appropriate pins in VGA connector. But there is a problem: your VGA monitor must be able to handle 15kHz horizontal frequency. It must be true multisync, for example NEC 3D.

 

In case you have such monitor you can add switch on high detect pin and then you can use the monitor for all color or mono resolution.

 

I think the scheme of the cable is in doit archive at http://www.doitarchive.de