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#26 BuddyBuddies OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Sep 16, 2008 12:30 PM

I don't care to look it up so I'll just ask, is there any software for the Panther? Controllers even?

to my knowledge ,there is a prototype system and a developement system..... :) 3-4 games exist that i heard of,all of which are Jaguar titles.


Yep, Cybermorph was a port to the Jaguar from the Panther... and it shows. :P

If Cybermorph is an example of what the Panther had to offer, I'm glad they chose to go with the Jaguar.

Hey it could have gone like this...

"And then in 1993 Atari was working on two game systems, the 32 bit Panther, and a 64 bit Jaguar. The Panther was slow in development, and the 64 bit Jaguar was actually ahead in progress, but Atari wanted to release a system more in step with the market with cheaper production costs.

The delayed Panther was released into the market with marginal success. It's graphics capibilities were impressive for the time, but not enough to compete with already existing and successful Sega Genesis, and Super Nintendo systems which won over by sheer number of games. Soon the 3D0 came out, leaving Atari's Panther in it's cat tracks.

Sadly, the Atari Jaguar was a promising system, with a unique graphic and sound chip and would have displayed millions of colors, but with the results of the Panther the Jaguar never saw the light of day, caged in an Atari office until Atari was sold to JTS. Only a few Jaguar prototypes have been found since. It's two games, a ported Cybermorph from the Panther system and Trevor McFur show only glimpses of what could have been in this last Atari system."


Yeh, if I was to have a last Atari system, I'll take the Jaguar any day!!! :D

LOL :ponder:

#27 Godzilla OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 17, 2008 5:38 PM

Id still like to see what the games for the system would have looked like and is that god-awful fax machine what the console proto actually looked like? yeesh.

#28 BuddyBuddies OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:28 PM

Id still like to see what the games for the system would have looked like and is that god-awful fax machine what the console proto actually looked like? yeesh.

the Panther did not look like that if memory serves... :)

#29 BuddyBuddies OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:31 PM

Id still like to see what the games for the system would have looked like and is that god-awful fax machine what the console proto actually looked like? yeesh.

the Panther did not look like that if memory serves... :)

here is a link showing what the Panther looked like...........


http://www.homecompu...es/panther.html

#30 moycon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Sep 21, 2008 11:29 PM

Very cool link. Thanks!

#31 BuddyBuddies OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:57 AM

Very cool link. Thanks!

no problem buddy! :)

#32 doctorclu OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 24, 2008 11:41 AM

Id still like to see what the games for the system would have looked like and is that god-awful fax machine what the console proto actually looked like? yeesh.

the Panther did not look like that if memory serves... :)

here is a link showing what the Panther looked like...........


http://www.homecompu...es/panther.html


You see, that was a Panther prototype.

Now the reason why the Panther concept looked like a printer was because it was supposed to be the 32-bit add on that plugged into the cartridge port of the Atari 5200. ;)

#33 Shawn OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 24, 2008 1:19 PM

From those pics it looks like it did use the Jaguar Controller style. Neat.

#34 carmel_andrews OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Dec 21, 2008 7:33 AM

If i remember rightly tempest 2000 was also ported over from the panther...I remember seeing screenshots in a review in a UK games mag (and it was from the panther, not jaguar)

#35 TXG/MNX OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 13, 2017 4:22 AM

I posted up all of the Panther dev disks and I think the manual about 2 years ago...

NOT an impressive system based on the spec's... sorry, one one lonely Panther sits in my office, the other kitty's are still out in the wild icon_winking.gif



Curt

Anyone has a copy of these dev disks cannot find them online anymore, did ask Curt but maybe anyone overhere has a copy...

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#36 Clint Thompson ONLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 14, 2017 7:49 AM

Holy revival of the Panther thread!

 

Just doing a quick roll count, it appears there are at very least 5 panthers floating right now (out of a possible minimum of 7):

 

1. Curt (assuming he still has his)

2. Stefan (verified this morning to still have his)

3. JerryG (if he still has it?)

4. TXG/MNX (now has one)

5. Lance

 

Doesn't seem like a bad number of development kits out there! Hopefully something can be compiled and shown working soon.



#37 TXG/MNX OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 14, 2017 7:54 AM

Holy revival of the Panther thread!

 

Just doing a quick roll count, it appears there are at very least 5 panthers floating right now (out of a possible minimum of 7):

 

1. Curt (assuming he still has his)

2. Stefan (verified this morning to still have his)

3. JerryG (if he still has it?)

4. TXG/MNX (now has one)

5. Lance

 

Doesn't seem like a bad number of development kits out there! Hopefully something can be compiled and shown working soon.

 

Can you all invited them to https://www.facebook...62444254055577/

 

The Panther Facebook page there is already some info and more to come....



#38 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:31 AM

Holy revival of the Panther thread!
 
Just doing a quick roll count, it appears there are at very least 5 panthers floating right now (out of a possible minimum of 7):
 
1. Curt (assuming he still has his)
2. Stefan (verified this morning to still have his)
3. JerryG (if he still has it?)
4. TXG/MNX (now has one)
5. Lance
 
Doesn't seem like a bad number of development kits out there! Hopefully something can be compiled and shown working soon.


Guildo H.thinks he might still have his in the attic somewhere..but no documents or source code to go with it.

Jim Gregory still has his in his garage, offered it for sale, but never got back to a buyer i put in touch with him.

Anyone pick up an Ex-Domark machine?.

#39 Clint Thompson ONLINE  

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Posted Fri Sep 15, 2017 2:21 PM

Leonard was kind enough to scan this in and share it via TXG/MNX - figure I would add it here as well since a lot of people aren't in the FB groups. GPU specs and Leonard makes it very clear that the Blossom video chip from the ATW800 has absolutely nothing to do with the Panther.

 

Attached File  Panther - Display Sub-Sytem Specification - march 5, 1991.pdf   4.03MB   50 downloads



#40 TXG/MNX OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:44 PM



I am looking for a program rdbpar it was a program for Programming the Panther devkit.
It was available for st (maybe pc aswell)

Development was done on a ST using MadMac

If someone can find this program please let know.

#41 StopDrop&Retro OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:02 AM

I hope I'm not going too far off topic, but can anyone tell me why this is the best image we have of the Panther production sketch??

 

Atari-panther.gif

 

 

Is that real?? How are we sure? Where did it come from?

 

It's laughably amateur, I hope there's a story behind it. It looks like kids concept art that was submitted for a video game magazine competition back in the day. It's just so strange to know that this piece of hardware got far enough to have prototype hardware but the only sketch exists on a napkin. Anyone know what's going on here?

 

If it actually came out, I could see the Panther claiming top prize in 'Ugliest Consoles of all Time' lists.. ugh...



#42 Clint Thompson ONLINE  

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Posted Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:19 AM

I hope I'm not going too far off topic, but can anyone tell me why this is the best image we have of the Panther production sketch??

 

Atari-panther.gif

 

 

Is that real?? How are we sure? Where did it come from?

 

It's laughably amateur, I hope there's a story behind it. It looks like kids concept art that was submitted for a video game magazine competition back in the day. It's just so strange to know that this piece of hardware got far enough to have prototype hardware but the only sketch exists on a napkin. Anyone know what's going on here?

 

If it actually came out, I could see the Panther claiming top prize in 'Ugliest Consoles of all Time' lists.. ugh...

 

There's always this, even if incorrectly referenced as a 64-bit system:

 

panther.png


Edited by Clint Thompson, Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:20 AM.


#43 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 21, 2017 5:49 AM

Leonard was kind enough to scan this in and share it via TXG/MNX - figure I would add it here as well since a lot of people aren't in the FB groups. GPU specs and Leonard makes it very clear that the Blossom video chip from the ATW800 has absolutely nothing to do with the Panther.
 
attachicon.gifPanther - Display Sub-Sytem Specification - march 5, 1991.pdf


So, did Curt have incorrect specifications all these years then?

from Curt Vendel (Cvendel@aol.com)
(Atari Historical Society's virtual Atari museum):
The Atari Panther was going to be Atari's original video game console system before the Jaguar, it was a kludged combination of the Atari ST and the Transputer Blossom video card. I have the spec's for the Panther and it was a horrible piece of junk

#44 Clint Thompson ONLINE  

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Posted Fri Sep 22, 2017 7:22 AM

So, did Curt have incorrect specifications all these years then?

from Curt Vendel (Cvendel@aol.com)
(Atari Historical Society's virtual Atari museum):
The Atari Panther was going to be Atari's original video game console system before the Jaguar, it was a kludged combination of the Atari ST and the Transputer Blossom video card. I have the spec's for the Panther and it was a horrible piece of junk

 

There seems to be multiple different stories, some probably created by media outlets at the time. 16-bit system, 32-bit system, 16-bit chip with 32-bit internals. It's a mess.

 

Leonard mentioned it had nothing to do with the ST (unless you count the 680000 but that doesn't really count) and didn't use the Blossom video chipset. He also mentioned that there were no working Panther chips yet we have at least 7 development kits floating around. Turns out it was a misunderstanding and he said while the development kits work, they don't work as intended with unstable video and a huge hardware bug, something Minter mentioned as well and having to force reset the hardware. They had hoped one of the developers would find a way around the bug but that never happened.

 

You're right though, specs are pretty bad for its time as well. You would've been better off with a re-packaged STe as a console in my opinion but knowing Atari, it would have shipped with no RAM.



#45 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:46 AM

From the UK Press i collected, it was always known as a 16 bit machine, just one that on paper was a SNES Killer..

Then Atari's angle was that they wanted to leapfrog the 32 bit generation completely and here was the Jaguar, which would do just that.

Curt sadly doesn't name a source for his specs, so it's hard to say what information and from where, he referee to in that quote.

The hardware bug sounds like the one Jim Gregory of HMS referenced...

The divide-by-zero issue, that he and another developer reported and he recreated in code, but Leonard apparently refused to believe..

HMS having 1 of the earliest development kits..be interesting to see if the Psygnosis kit suffers the same overheating issues..

The lack of Ram issue on Panther is often mentioned, but Atari ignored warnings from the Bitmap Bro that the Falcon lacked enough RAM and Peter Moyne ux etc warned them the Jaguar needed more as well..

So yes, i could easily see Atari releasing the Panther with the same issue and blaming developers not the hardware.

#46 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Sep 22, 2017 10:20 AM

Regarding Leonard Tramiel and his original comments..

Didn't he claim the prototype chips were plugged in, but didn't work and they were never fixed..and because of that, any images of chips being housed in development kits were false...

And there was no software development outside of Atari Corp..

Something we knew was incorrect as you had Hand Made Software telling Lynx User Magazine at the time they had been developing for the Panther..Jim Gregory has since confirmed this.

The One magazine detailed Pysgnosis doing Shadow Of The Beast and it was Atari UK who had invited them to see the cancelled hardware and devolopment kit..

And we also had Guildo talk about moving The Crypt from the Konix Multi-system to the Panther. .

All European development.

Seems Leonard was mistaken on a few points regarding Panther..understandable given how long ago it was, but it does highlight why you need multiple sources to get the true picture.

A lot of information has come to light since the initial follow up press on the Panther.

I hope we see a lot more..
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#47 Inky ONLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 27, 2017 3:19 PM

Wasn't the Jag/ Panther controller also supposed to work with the Atari STE computers?



#48 Inky ONLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 27, 2017 3:21 PM

 

You're right though, specs are pretty bad for its time as well. You would've been better off with a re-packaged STe as a console in my opinion but knowing Atari, it would have shipped with no RAM.

Was Atari even considering an ST based game system?



#49 Lost Dragon OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Sep 27, 2017 4:15 PM

Project Robin was Rob Zydbel trying to convince Atari to put the ST hardware into an XE Case..release it as a console with old coin op conversions like Battlezone, Moon Patrol etc.

It was mentioned in UK magazines like The Games Machine.. Atari promises ST console by mid '89..

Computer And Video Games refered to it as The ST+

This was before press like Zero magazine started mentioning the Panther and making clear this wasn't based on ST hardware.

I created a thread on Assembler to showcase UK press coverage of the ST console to the Panther and what had been confirmed and dismissed as new information came to light:

https://assemblergam...rage-etc.66307/

But it was sadly hijacked along the way..but you can find the coverage there if anyone is interested.

Edited by Lost Dragon, Wed Sep 27, 2017 4:21 PM.


#50 Curt Vendel OFFLINE  

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Posted Tue Oct 3, 2017 9:44 PM

So, did Curt have incorrect specifications all these years then?

from Curt Vendel (Cvendel@aol.com)
(Atari Historical Society's virtual Atari museum):
The Atari Panther was going to be Atari's original video game console system before the Jaguar, it was a kludged combination of the Atari ST and the Transputer Blossom video card. I have the spec's for the Panther and it was a horrible piece of junk

 

Yeah, Leonard approached me perhaps 2 months ago asking.   I had posted that info up, man like 97-98'  - Info was highly erroneous from a former Atari employee and this was well before I had begun to ship out the palettes of documents I had saved from 1196 from CA out here in NY to begin to research.

 

Blossom is 1,000% incorrect.  I had deleted the data from Atari Museum well over 10 years back, but unfortunately the misinformation had propagated out to other sites :-(

 

Someone just recently approached my on FB Messanger, not sure who is was, kind got a little uppity with me and in a semi-insulting way was practically demanding I give him the Panther dev disk images.   Well despite the encounter I've been updating the Panther page (not yet public yet) on Atari Museum.  I'll put up the Dev disks, the game code and other materials I've scanned and read in and put them up for everything.

 

Clint:   Who's 3D model is that you posted?   I would like to use it on Atari Museum, but I'd like to get permission and if given, who to credit, please let me know...  thank you.


Edited by Curt Vendel, Tue Oct 3, 2017 9:48 PM.





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