Mindfield

For those interested, the new version of Atari800Win is out, though I suspect we'll see a newer one in the not-too-distant future that's based on a newer Atari800 kernel. Anyway, you can grab it at http://www.atari-area.net/PLus/index_us.htm (NOTE: Page doesn't work properly in Netscape or Mozilla, so for those of us who try and avoid anything Microsoft-related, you'll have to drag Internet Exploder out to view this one...)

Someguy: It's the principle of the thing. The fact that someone's getting royally waxed for something that isn't worth half what he's paying is just wrong. Look at all those damned O'Shea auctions; someone went and bought up those O'Shea's commons and turned around trying to sell them on E-Bay to the highest bidder. I mean, if I ended up paying $10 or $20 or something, only to find out later I could have gotten it for $1, I'd be quite peeved about it -- especially when I came to the realization that this is exactly where the actioner got them from in the first place. As for the topic at large, I'm in Canada as well, and just don't shop on E-Bay for that very reason. Between US conversion and any extraneous charges (paypal, for example) it drives the price of the thing you're bidding on up enough that it makes the 'bargain' you might have otherwise got nearly irrelevant.

Zekish: My mistake about BJL then; I'm not sure where I'd heard what I did. I didn't really play it all that much, so I didn't have any corroborating experience. As for the music in Ballblazer vs. Ballblaster, the only real difference is that the real Ballblazer got a little funky with randomly generated (but still muscally sound) notes played over the bassline in between 'choruses'. Ballblaster did not feature this. Regarding Montezuma's Revenge, I never got to the end on the 8-bit version, either. The VCS version had different, shorter levels, and so was much easier. The 8-bit version was much larger in scale; I remember getting to a point where I'd actually encountered the huge statue of Monterzuma, but never figured out what you had to do with him... Tempest: I don't know who put out the cartrige version. There is no copyright information, nor is there anything that indicates who did it. I never bothered trying to look at it with a file/sector editor though; perhaps the answer's buried in there somewhere...

AR has, and still remains my all-time favourite RPG for any system. Ever. It was way ahead of its time (texture mapping 3D 5 years before the first such game appeared on any other system. Granted, it was precalculated, but it was the first game ever to feature such), it was *incredibly* atmospheric -- all those little touches, the wind, night and day, rain and shine, random encounters, a full original score, secret areas, incidental sounds (the sound of the smithy's hammer, or the sound of battle as you passed the Arena) really enhanced the whole experience. I played the City to death, and then played it s'more. I ended up with a 14th level character who was immune to Deadly Poison, so as soon as I got a red & sweet potion, it got quaffed. If it was deadly poison -- oh well; I'd quaffed so many deadly poison potions and healed myself at the healer's that I built up an immunity to it. But if it was Treasure Finding, I went a-huntin' -- especially gremlins at night in the rain; they always had the best treasure on them when you were under the influence of treasure finding, and always appeared most frequently at night when it was raining. The Dungeon I also loved, although much of the atmosphere was lost. It was a logical move, of course; there are no atmospheric effects -- sun, rain, wind, etc. -- in a dungeon. Still, I missed that. They also changed the sound of the smithy's hammer, which bugged me 'cos it didn't sound as good as the original. There was however an actual plot in the Dungeon -- with numerous sub-plots and quests to engage in, which really kept you interested and playing hard. And yes, there's plenty that modern games could learn from the AR series. These days it's all about pomp and ceremony; flashy graphics, realistic sound -- all the sales pitch material. Unfortunately it's usually at the expense of good -- and bug-free -- gameplay. With software companies constantly tightening deadlines and trying to push more product out faster, it's all become one big grist mill -- the Hollywood of video games, endlessly churning out cookie-cutter games that look pretty and elicit plenty of oohs and aahs from spectators, but don't try very hard to foster any sort of affinity from the one who's actually playing. Personally, I feel a game's enjoyment is inversely proportional to the number of aftermarket patches that are (or will be) required to be able to play the game properly. Is it any wonder retrogaming is so in vogue these days? I mean, it highlights better than any example the fact that pomp is, in the larger sense, irrelevant next to how well the game plays -- and more importantly, replays. Sure, I love the immersiveness of first person perspective games, but by the same token, I'd rather play a game that immerses me in other, more important ways. I'd rather play a game that involves me and encourages me to play it further. Modern games are of a finite nature; there's a definite beginning, a middle, and an end, like a one-off book, and that's fine and well. The AR series however was very much open-ended; while there were definite tasks you needed to complete (in The Dungeon), even after completing the final task and revealing the Alien plot, you could still, even after the end sequence, wander about and kill creatures and such, ostensibly in preparation to import your character into the ill-fated third in the series. That kind of open-endedness offered unlimited gameplay, and the fantastic gameplay itself made you want to continue to play even after you've completed it. And you can't fake that kind of thing like modern companies try to do with all that window dressing.

Tempest: Yep. I remember playing both, though I prefered the real 48k version. For your convenience, here are links to the 16k Cartrige Version and the 48k disk version [ 07-04-2001: Message edited by: Mindfield ]

Nukey Shay: Yep. That was the high point of the game for everyone I knew that played it. Waiting patiently to see if it was a genuine crewmember was pretty tense... wait for the knock ... wait ... wait ... whew, there's the second knock. Or get startled out of your socks when the alien leaped on to your windscreen. :-) Few games were ever able to do that as effectively as RoF. Gunstar: There are a few solutions. The SIO2PC will certainly work. 800XLDJ is also a piece of software you can use with an XFormer cable or SIO2PC (I think) to allow you to load ATRs off your PC right from your 8-bit as if they were real disks. Albert: There was an ending of sorts to The Eidolon. I remember sitting down one night determined to finish it. The final level features a nasty little 8-headed (or was it 6-headed? Well, one for each level anyway) dragon where you had to defeat each of the heads with a particular colour of crystal; I think the order went in the same order of the crystals you used to defeat the dragon in each of the prior levels. It's quite a tense battle, but worth the effort to defeat it. :-) I've never finished Koronis Rift, though; in fact, to this day I'm still not entirely sure how to properly play. :-)

Just to add my 2c regarding differences in 400/800 games: - Behind Jaggi Lines was "leaked" before Lucasfilm released it under its more common moniker, Rescue on Fractalus. As I recall, BJL was entirely combative -- in other words, you didn't have to rescue marooned crew members. At least, I believe that was the main difference. In this sense BJL didn't have the same sense of tense drama as RoF. In RoF, you landed at the site of a downed crewmember and waited for him to knock ... and wait ... if a second knock came, it was a crew member and you could safely let him enter. Otherwise, a nasty ol' alien would leap on to your windscreen -- or if you opened the door without waiting for the second knock and it wasn't a crew member, you'd get mauled by the alien. - The Last Starfighter is another one those "leaked" betas that floated around before Atari had secured the rights to use that name. In the end they never did, and ended up renaming it Star Raiders II. I'm not sure if there are any differences beyond its name. - Lucasfilm's famous Ballblazer also had a pre-release beta leaked, and was known prior to release as Ballblaster. It was file-based, rather than a full boot disk, had no loading animation/sound, and the music was a little different, as was some of the attract mode text. All the main elements of the game were present, however. - Montezuma's Revenge originally came in two flavours: 16k (cartrige?) and 48k. The 16k was bare-bones essentials; no title screen, no intro music, no background "bleeps" during gameplay. The 48k had a fancy title screen with music and background "bleeps" (two notes played over, and over, and over, and ... fortunately its volume was tollerable enough to mentally tune out). Both games played pretty well the same, though.

There is an ATR version of Rescue on Fractalus with the intro intact. It's available in the Atari 8-bit section of my site. (click here for a quick browse) [ 07-03-2001: Message edited by: Mindfield ]

I'm fairly certain a prototype exists. AHS has a picture of it on their site -- whether or not it's a functional prototype I don't recall. I also have a promo video clip for it from Atari (circa 1983) briefly describing what the Mindlink was about and how it worked -- I'm fairly sure I got this from AHS as well. Either way it was certainly conceptualized and had progressed to the point where Atari was promoting it on dealer tapes with upcoming hardware/software, so a working prototype almost has to exist. I think the main reason it never saw the light of day was because either Atari internally, or focus groups/play testers felt it was difficult to control accurately, and therefore was largely useless as any kind of reliable controller.

Quite honestly I never used to play the VCS with music. I s'pose at the time I was far more interested in getting into the game rather than be distracted by external noise. Mind you there are a few songs in the 80s that bring back distinct moments on my 8-bit Atari. I remember, for example, several songs that were hits at the time (though I didn't actually _like_ them) that bring to mind specific points during which I was playing Alternate Reality: The Dungeon. One song in particular reminds me, for some reason, that I was at the time it was playing going down a long passage way on my quest for the Staff of Acrynimiril, having found one of its three parts. I can't remember the song, though; it was one of those 80s pop tunes like "Come Go With Me" or somesuch. Funny how insiginificant things like that can be burned in your memory by some external influence.

My favourite non-Atari console would have to be Colecovision. I owned one of those alongside my VCS, and had lots of fun with it. My favourite computer would, of course, have to be the Atari 8-bits. I owned a variety of them throughout in the 80s, eventually learning to program on 'em and do all sorts of wonderful things. The Atari ST also has a warm place in my heart, as I owned them after the 8-bits, and did quite a bit more programming on 'em.

Well, though not VCS-related, I absolutely loved to play "Destructor" on Colecovision. Unfortunately, I had utterly no clue how to play it; it was borrowed off of a friend so I could give a game other than Turbo a go that used the driving controller. Still, that didn't stop me from playing it. Mostly I spent my time building forts out of the crystals to slow that crystal-eating creature's progress towards me. Or I'd shoot them at the creature, 'til they were all gone. It was only when I got into emulation that I realized you were supposed to take the crystals to the 'home base' and drop 'em in...

Yes, I think Alda was a much better choice for a spokesman than Plimpton. Alan always had that sense of joi de vivre, where as Plimpton was always so stiff and stodgy. AHS does have two of the commercials, but none of the rest, except as storyboards.

Although the nostalgia factor where Atari is concerned is high, it's not necessarily relevant when it comes to anything new from Atari. Certainly most of us would look at anything new from them with an eyeful of suspicion, since most of us would look at any new Atari products through that filter of nostalgia, and we'd be subconsciously comparing new stuff to Atari proper's original stuff and silently measuring them up. But I think any real chance at success Atari may have for the future lies in Atari of the new looking to the innovation of Atari of the old. Look at Warner's Atari. Everyone waited with baited breath to see what they'd come out with next, because usually what they came out with was new and exciting and innovative. Granted, these days it's much harder to be innovative because, frankly, what hasn't been done already? That's one of the reasons I've lauded Atari for their jumping on the Cell-gaming bandwagon, because it is innovative and new -- or rather, it's old in a new way. For Atari to be a part of that lends them an air of Warner's Atari and the innovation they were heralded for. Even under the Tramiels, Atari's innovation never ceased -- if anything, and despite the Tramiels' tragic lack of good business sense, they became even more innovative and forward thinking. Sure, Atari had a bad rep by then, and was only made worse by the Tramiels constantly announcing vapourware and letting the home computer market share slip through their fingers, but you have to admit that Atari's computers for their time had some pretty great ideas. On the other hand, Hasbro's ownership of Atari amounted to little more than the pimping of the Atari name to sell cheap games. Nothing new or innovative there; just a company hoping to cash in on a well known brand name, but in the process damaging Atari's name even further. That's why I'm hoping Infogrames can bring a little of the shine back to the Fuji. Pick the right projects, market them properly, and use the Atari name to do some good, and they might have a chance of bring Atari back to right.

In the first stage you have to chase the ghost around to gain crosses by running through him. Careful though, 'cos if you do this too much you'll die. You can get around 24 crosses before this happens, if you're careful. The second stage has you in front of the castle, where you'll have to pick off the various creatures roaming round the castle walls. The bats are hardest to see, since they're virtually the same colour as the inky night sky they fly in at the top. Don't bother trying to kill the axe-weilding mummies; you can't. Just duck under them as required. The third stage will have you roaming round inside the castle. Here you have to search the coffins for things. You do this by getting to one side of them and placing your hand on its edge. This can be a bit tricky, but if you find anything you'll be rewarded with an object and a sound. Watch out for the 'wall' that sweeps back and forth; it'll kill you if it touches you. There are 2 floors in this stage. The last stage is where you have to kill Dracula himself. It's been a long time so I can't quite remember how this is done...

Yeah, I've been to a few of those. For all I know they don't even sell the NES stuff anymore. Mostly it's modern stuff, with possibly a smattering of old Genesis/SNES and, on rare occasion, TG-16. I suppose if you want the real vintage stuff you have to go to the big, well-established flea markets. I think there's a huge one in Pickering, but I can't for the life of me remember what it's called -- or if Pickering is even it's location. I think that's Mr. Flea's or something...

You're probably thinking of Alan Alda. He did quite a few Atari commercials back in the early-mid 80s. Actually, I liked him as an actor and in those commercials. I have a couple of them, but I know there are quite a number that for all I know no one ever recorded and/or ripped.

To be honest it's been ages since I've even been to a flea market. I don't acutally know where any good ones are. I've been to a few pseudo-flea markets -- y'know, the ones that make weekend appearances at needier malls. I've been promising myself to go to the 410 flea market though -- I live just down steeles from it, but I've never had the opportunity to visit it. I think I'll make a trip out there in the next few weeks. I'll let you know if I see anything decent. Or anything at all, really...

Actually, my first "Atari" system was a Coleco Gemini, which came with Donkey Kong. I'd later gotten Mousetrap, plus a few other games that obviously weren't that memorable 'cos I don't remember them. Then I was on an Atari hiatus while I had a Colecovision with driving controller and a few games. Then when my father and I moved, we'd put the Colecovision, Gemini, and related hard/software, in a green garbage bag that unfortunately got mistaken for actual garbage and was thrown out. But my birthday was right around the corner, and when it came, our new neighbours, whom we'd known through the friends-of-the-family we lived with at the time gave me their old Atari 2600 complete with over 30 carts. Obviously I was in heaven, and began a ritual shortly afterwards of buying a new game every week. (At the time, most games fit well within my weekly allowance of $10. :-) Perhaps this should go in the "Games you were embarassed to like" topic, 'cos I actually bought *all three* Mythicon games. :-)

The thing is though that from the Tramiels onward, the Powers that Be who owned Atari at the time went about everything the wrong way. The Tramiels only realized the importance of advertizing when it was too late and they didn't have enough money to launch anything very effective, and eventually broke Atari. JTS didn't do a damn thing, and Hasbro pissed away the Atari name by releasing inferior revamps of done-to-death classics. Infogrames may be beating a similar dead horse, but they're doing it in a way that at the very least makes some sense: it's relatively cheap, both to develop and to maintain, and it acts as inexpensive, mass advertising. Sure, it may be through more done-to-death classics, but it's in a new way that isn't wasteful of resources and can still serve to represent the Atari name in a favourable light. I mean, you can't expect Atari to go and release some huge game on such a simple device as a cell phone in such a relatively simple language as J2ME, so classics make the most sense. Besides, such games won't be any kind of cash cow; they'll pay for themselves and perhaps offer some small profit besides, but they're just a small means to a larger end anyway. Really, though, it's not to the cell phone market that we'll be looking to see what they come up with next. That's just a way for Infogrames to shop the Atari name around again, rather like them showing up at E3 just to sell bottled "Atari Water." It's when they start getting serious about releasing new titles under the sign of the Fuji that we'll have to start paying closer attention.

Well, I'm not so enamored of the fact that it's on cell phones in and of itself, but rather it's the potential for inexpensive, mass advertizing that will reach literally millions of people globally for a fraction of the cost of a mass television or even radio campaigns. If nothing else it will in some capacity push the Atari name once again to the fore of technology, even if it's not with machines of their own. Brand recognition is an important factor in the success of a company, and while Atari has been a household name for close to three decades, its name has been tarnished as it changed hands, each exchange making our beloved Fuji look just a little more dull. The fact that Infogrames wants to take Atari into new areas while at the same time revisiting old ones simply bodes well for its future. It may not seem like much on the surface, these cell phone games, but put in the perspective of the larger picture it helps to rebuild an underlying reputation that they can further build upon. And that's why I think it's such a good idea. Whether you like the concept or not -- and for the record, I think it's kinda cool, if a little pointless if you can't offload the cames to a memory stick, smart card or PC via USB -- is entirely up to you. The concept in itself is not nearly as important as what it represents, which is the beginnings of a good foundation upon which to rebuild Atari. It may surprise a few people, and may even harken back to the Warner days and the ads that said, "What will they come up with next?" Maybe I'm being a little overly optimistic, but you have to admit the idea of the Fuji, arising phoenix-like from the ashes, is appealing, especially if Infogrames can somehow recapture some of the glory of Atari's salad days when innovation was hallmark, and everyone kept looking to see what they had just over the horizon. Yeah, it's optimistic and maybe even highly unlikely, but baby steps though they are, I can't help but think they're in the right direction so far...

Last place I saw VCS carts was in the Cash Busters on Queen St. west of the 410 in Brampton (in the same small plaza as East Side Mario's.) They were all commons, and there weren't that many, either, but it was cool to see them there, and they were selling for around $5 a piece. That's probably one of the better places to look for stuff like that -- Cash Busters or Cash Converters. (There's both on Queen and the 410; the other one is in the mall that's adjacent to the bridge over the 410, in the larger plaza where the chinese buffet and Kelsey's is)

Okay, maybe it's just me, but I think this is a brilliant marketing strategy. The buzzword these days is "convergence" -- the merging of multiple, disparate technologies into one device. The PS/2 was one of the first to latch on to the idea, merging a PSOne, PS2 and DVD player into one "family entertainment unit," though I think this has been as much of a disincentive for people who already have DVD players and/or PSOnes as an incentive for those who don't. Now it's cell phones, which are also turning into PDAs, game machines and MP3 players. But Atari jumping right into the fray to license games is probably one of the most brilliant ways to get the Atari name circulated amongst the masses again. Anyone, anywhere with an iPhone will be able to download a classic Atari game and play it any time they want. No need to buy cartriges or CDs, and no need for a separate handheld system -- it's all there on the phone. The US $0.35c per download charge may be a bit annoying after a while, though -- I think perhaps incorporating SmartCards or memory sticks into cell phones will inevitably be the way to go. Still, it's an interesting start, and a great way to freshen up the old Fuji in new ways and get people looking at our favourite logo -- on the go. Now all we need is a VCS emulator written in J2ME... :-)

Well, for a start the screenshot's graphics are rather beyond the 2600's abilities. Something like it could be done, but you'd probably need some serious bank switching to display detail even close to that -- a 32k cart would probably be required, and very few of those were made.

I've been into Abandonware for some time, and yes, it does sort of irritate me when some company enforces their rights and force websites to remove old programs. It seems to me that, even if they were to revamp their old titles into new ones, there'd be utterly no loss of revenue from people going and getting the old version of the game, particularily considering the new game would likely be far more graphically and aurally capable. I suppose companies seem to feel that people would have bought this ancient game if it wasn't available on the net -- but they seem to fail to realize that its availbility on the net was the only reason they got it in the first place. No one would bother to pay for it -- unless it was a buck or something, and even if that was the case, the software company has already made its money from the sale of the title to the store in the first place. ROMs and disk images of old systems are the same way. Sure, there are avid collectors who will buy them still, but that's all private sale stuff and is nothing to do with the companies. For the most part though the reason many of us are into emulation is because it's there, and allows us to relive our youth without costing us anything or taking up extra space. 'sides, the whole point is that whether or not software companies/copyright holders decided to press the issue of removing their material from websites, the fact is they'd never see a dime of revenue from it again anyway -- and that the distribution of these old games has utterly no effect on future sales of updated versions. Sure, it _might_ impact the sales of old emulated classic packages -- but those packages usually come with extra information, such as historical bits, video interviews, etc. which are a good reason to buy 'em even if you already have the ROMs.