Legend

Double checked. Sorry, You're right. They cannot attack as far as I can tell while the number was on screen. You still cannot shoot though. I guess I wasn't paying attention before and just assumed that if they were moving, they were attacking. And not being able to shoot during that period does make sense since they cannot attack either. I noticed that, as far as I can tell, attacking the castles doesn't seem to be the dragons first priority. THey often seem to just be moving along when they are on screen. Last time when I made it to wave 6 I think, the black dragon just kept moving to the right as I chased after him and passed by the castles.

My main reason behind suggesting two joysticks instead of the keypad is because most players are more likely to have two joysticks as opposed to a keypad. This would make the game more accessible to more players. Plus, in my opinion, many roguelikes like the original have unnecessary commands. It would be much simpler to just have one generic "use" command instead of several for things like reading scrolls, drinking potions, zapping wands, etc. Also things like armor and weapons could only use one command instead of two. I think it would be much simpler to just have a "use" command that can be issued in the inventory screen.

Playing with a joystick. Didn't realize it fired on release though. The momentum of the paladins speed when traveling also makes it challenging to shoot. So I think a possible straight shot variation wouldn't be too easy and still challenging. Haven't seen a Grendel hide yet. At the start of each wave, there is a short period of time where the player cannot shoot or draw his lance, but the enemies are still moving and attacking. Is this on purpose? Kind of frustrating in my opinion. Also, I can never really tell if a castle has been healed at all. It never seems noticeable.

That's part of the strategy, actually. It's a tad more realistic then shooting an arrow straight up, and encourages the player to stay in motion and anticipate the dragon's movements. I suppose I could put in a variant on the difficulty switches that changes the angle of the shot, but that would require some additional RAM and cycles, so I'll table that one for the final build, if I have any leftover resources. I agree that the arrows arching kinda like the stones in No Escape does add to the challenge and is welcome for the most part. The frustration comes mostly from when you are trying to hit the soldiers. Shooting them can be very frustrating since they are so much closer and the arrow arcs right away, I often find myself constantly going back and forth constantly just trying to hit one. After a few more plays, I don't really think the world needs to shrink. Finally encountered the Grendel. Cool. Seems like just a slight variation on the knight though.

A roguelike on 2600 would be awesome even though it would have to be dumbed down. Although using the keypad would make it less accessible. I would rather go for using two joysticks like raiders of the lost ark. The first joystick would be used for movement and firing ranged weapons/zapping wands. The second joystick would be used for inventory. Using the 4 directions to choose between whether you are using melee, ranged, wand, or magic. The fire button on the first joystick would activate/fire this. Pressing the fire button on the second joystick would bring up the inventory. All items would be used directly from the inventory by pressing the fire button again. Some items could even be straight instant use when you pick the up like health, magic, and possibly food. I think food would most likely have to be left out though. Of course some items would have to be dumbed down and or cut out. Scrolls could still be used. Potions may be able to be eliminated since scrolls can basically do the same things. Or maybe they can stay. Just less of each type. Not sure if they will be able to be randomized in effect though. Same with weapons and armors. Less monster types too. I would prefer to keep the traps kept in the game. They are a big part of it. Cut out some of the stats maybe though. Just health. Maybe magic/mana to fuel the wands instead of the wands having set charges. Maybe even have to cut out all of the leveling up. Cut out diagonal directions. One thing I would like to see would be to have a tombstone for the ending score screen and have the tombstone be fancier depending on how much gold you found/points earned. I kinda doubt this would be possible on 3600, but I think it would be really cool in any roguelike really. The only one I've ever seen do it was Fatal Labyrinth for the genesis. Anyways, I think that is the most likely way to see a feasible roguelike on 2600. Not a full on rogue port, but a roguelike similar to the original with no classes, races, or magic system. Definitely needs the random dungeons though. Only one way. Straight down. Probably much few levels too. Like 10.

I agree with this statement mostly. The game only occasionally seems like you are just traveling though empty space. I suppose it could be shortened a little, but not much. Would it have to be to 6 instead of 9? or could it be like 7 or 8 instead of 9? a little smaller might make it feel a bit more frantic and make the game play faster. I think it might be a good thing. It does seem to slow down and drag slightly towards the ends of the levels when there are only a couple enemies left. I wouldn't mind this too much personally. Still wouldn't want it too small though.

I thought I heard different types of sounds. That is mostly what I was referring to when I said it may be difficult to explain what the different sounds mean. As in trying to say a "whoop-whoop" means this and a "whaaa-whee" means that. A visual clue would be nice. I liked the way the visual clues looked in the old version of the game too. They were obvious and helpful. Took me a little bit to figure out what the line (lance I guess) on the side of the screen meant in the new version. I didn't even really notice it at first and wrote it off as a graphics glitch. You weren't happy with the way it looked or weren't happy with it all together? I think it looked fine and was simple enough to serve it's purpose. I would definitely like to see it come back and don't mind the loss of the bats, but I do think the soldiers should try to be kept. Btw, I haven't really noticed, can they hurt you? I think you are doing a good job so far in trying to create that type of game that splits the players focus. The addition of the princess would probably add to it even more. I think both versions do a good job. I don't think the original flickered that bad. It didn't bother me anyways. Btw, on a related note, do you happen to have another build of the old version newer than rev1? I like bothe versions and will probably play both, but rev1 of the old version unfortunately has a bug that seems to make the game bug out sometimes when dying and just showing the dragon fire sprite scrolling up and down the screen. Maybe you could even make two versions of it? One to build on the old version and one that keeps going in the direction you are now? Kinda like a part one and part and part two. Either way, at the end of the day, it's your game and creation to make turn out how you would be satisfied with it.

Well, I guess the short answer is that "radar" has been replaced with "sonar." I thought it was a bit of overkill to have radar to track one aerial enemy in a world with only three castles that was only 9 screens wide. I also think it made the display a little busy and drew the eye away from the action too much. Instead of a flickery radar, the player can now listen to the sounds of Dragon fire and the ringing sound of the Soldier's sword to track their positions. The closer you are to the enemy, the louder its sound becomes. There are different sounds to indicate different attacks, and even a sound to indicate when dragonfire hits a castle. I haven't seen those sorts of audio clues in many Atari games, so I think it's sort of unique. The longer answer is that certain RAM and ROM tradeoffs I made to create the radar display in the old version aren't as viable in the DPC+ kernel. I would probably have to sacrifice a chunk of gameplay to do it, and with a smaller world and a lone enemy to track, it seems like overkill. I agree that they are a little undercooked right now. I added them in almost as an afterthought before posting the build, since the world sometimes felt a little empty. But they don't really change or increase the challenge over the course of the game in their current form. I'm using almost 2 bytes of RAM for them right now (a full byte to track their world location and four bits to track alive/dead, hit location, flight direction, and bats remaining), so I could always scrap them and beef up one of the other characters. Maybe I could alternate between bats and soldiers, with only one or the other appearing at a time, and just use one bit to determine which enemy type is spawned after death? If that was the case, I could potentially make bats more interesting, and more of a threat without spending more valuable RAM. I believe in the build I posted, you meet your first Grendel in wave 5, and your first Wizard in wave 10. The highest I've been able to make it in this version is wave 18. My idea was this: Castles start the game with 20 hit points. After each stage, they regain 8 hit points, to a maximum of 40. If you are able to protect a Castle well enough for it to reach it's max 40 HP, the little flag on top will be replaced by a Princess, who will function similar to the humans in "Defender." When on a screen with a Princess, instead of attacking with fire the Dragon will attempt to kidnap the Princess and take it to the top of the screen. If successful, the Castle loses 10 HP and reverts to its Flag state. If you shoot the Dragon before it reaches the top, the Princess falls. If you catch her you before she hits the road get a bonus, and if you return her to her Castle you get a second bonus, and the Castle is once again protected from dragonfire. To make this happen, I think I'll minimally need to find persistent RAM to track the following: Princess in Castle (1-3): 3 bits Active Princess (1-3): 3 bits Princess Falling on/off: 1 bit Princess Dies / Princess Caught by Knight: 1 bit Princess returned to Castle: l bit Princess world location: 1 byte I might be able to swap the Bat for this element. I think I might try this in my next build to see how well it works. Thanks again! J Although I think the audio clues are a cool idea, there are some definite drawbacks to using "sonar" as opposed to the radar. They are a little hard to figure out what sound means what. Can't easily be explained through text. Sometimes you have to play with the sound/ volume down or even off. Deaf players. Alternating the bat and soldiers sounds like a good idea if the bat gets beefed up somehow. Otherwise, I would leave it out all together personally. It doesn't really add much to the game as is. I only got to wave 4. Explains no Grendel/Wizard The princess mechanic sounds cool. I would definitely prefer it to the bats if I had to choose.

I finally had the chance to try this newer version of Charge you've been working on. One thing that I really miss from the older version is the little radar type thing at the bottom that let me know where I was. I feel it added a sense of direction and destination. Without it, I feel like I'm just wandering a little aimlessly from side to side and hard to keep track of which castles have been cleared. I also miss the galloping sound fx. Personally I don't think the bats are very interesting or needed. If something had to be taken out in order to make room for something else, I would pick the bats. I haven't run into the Grendel or wizard yet. You mentioned "falling princess". Does that mean you would have to occasionally catch a princess that is falling from a castle or tower or from the dragon's grip in the sky? If so, that sounds like a very fun and interesting addition to gameplay. Maybe the player would get a visual or audio warning that she is about to fall and and react quickly by positioning themselves under her and hitting the fire button at the right moment to catch her? I don't really think being able to fire two arrows on screen at once is needed. The graphics look awesome. But I kinda like how the old version looked better. I liked the hills in the back. The fire that the dragon shot looked cooler. The paladin was more simplistic but still looked good. Even the arrow that the player shot looked better. Talking about Charge! Rev1 in this thread: Charge! (A2600 WIP) Speaking of the arrow, it's kinda a pain to aim now since it curves. Especially when switching directions.

I don't necessarily think it would take away from the dungeon feel of it. I kinda like the idea. A variety of types of puzzles would be the coolest thing I think. I like the mastermind puzzle to unlock doors idea. Maybe the player ggets damaged if they can't figure it out in so many guesses. Kinda like trying to pick a lock that's booby-trapped. maybe a mini minesweeper type puzzle? Maybe even some small chess-like puzzles. I think that would kinda fit a dungeon theme. I'm sure if you google "simple" or "small" "puzzles" you could get some more ideas.

The only thing I can really think of is a simple scoring system and to make the puzzle rooms more "puzzly". Like maybe make them simple sokoban variations or sliding block puzzle variations. That would probably get it more attention and intrigue people. Don't know if that falls under "complicated crap" though. Sorry if it does.

a half-pinball half-arcade game would be awesome. I'd like ti see a breakout-pinball hybrid. Using paddles to controll flippers.

Fortress of Narzod dangit! p.s. Is it even possible on 2600?

Looks very cool. Wish it was for pc too. I have a fairly large collection of the original gamebooks and a handful of the re-prints that came out by wizard books over the past few years.

Still working on this one? It looks really cool.

That box art does look awesome. There is a typo on the back that says " for 1 or 2 players" though.

No for the "only" bit and here's my reason: Look at "Pit" from brawl. was he on the wii? until that game, he hasn't been in a game since the gameboy era. look at rob. he had no appearance on the wii i knew of, until brawl. it's a clash of different video-game characters, but it's never exclusive to characters from one certain platform. as for the "or primarily" bit. once again, sorry, but it's not gonna happen. i've already pretty much run out of room for characters. out of all of them, i have 2 atari characters. the hero from berserk, and pacman. anyways, i can't continue until i can get someone to do some music for me. i'm not good with music. so until then, i'm sorry, but i will make no more progress. Respectfully, The characters in Brawl are not about being on the Wii. The smash bros series didn't even start on wii. It started on n64. The characters are about being Nintendo franchises that were on Nintendo consoles in general. Even Sonic ended up on gamecube and wii before making his way into brawl despite originally being a Sega console exclusive. Personally, this project would interest me and probably most of the community much more if it was primarily characters that were on the 2600 like mentioned before. Which would include some nintendo characters like Mario, DK, and even possibly mega man since there was a demo of mega man made for 2600. Even Master Chief for the same reason. As it is with the current character selection, it holds little interest for me personally. Characters like the knight from joust, bently bear, a yar, the adventure hero, adventure dragon, and definitely pitfall harry would interest people far more and even possibly make it's way to cart form because enough people would be interested. Even if E.T. was in there to give him a little redemption. Just my opinion and I think a lot of others feel the same. Characters like Captain Falcon, Samus, Kain, Marth, Kirby, and Tails hold no interest for me personally on a 2600 game. Link maybe, but that's it really. Now if it was a nes homebrew, that would be a very different story. People would be and have been clamoring for an 8-bit version of smash bros and I think it would be very successful with those classic nes characters. Same case if it was being done for the Genesis, people would want and expect characters from Sega franchises. In the end though, it's your game and creation, so it's entirely up to you and I respect that. Btw, do you need someone to program the music or just write it?

I would go with "Grail", rather than "Chalice" if you are going to go that route of using the cup in the title.

what about adding some simple obstacles like walls in some of the game variations? Nothing too "Mazey" but just a small handful of walls to get in your way. Maybe have going outside the border make you lose points so you have to be careful to stay within the square. If you get down to zero points, then you also lose a life?

Fortress of Narzod ...Star Castle... the D&D games.

Dang, I was going to suggest "Quest for the Golden Chalice". Lol. I meant to work "Magician" into the title instead of "wizard" btw. Although "Wizard" would be cool too.

Would be nice if the Fuel Canisters and gauge had their own more unique feel instead of river raid. I like the car sprite you did on page 3 the best.

Maybe put an emphasis on the Dragon in the title or the other monsters? Since it seems to be a sequel to Evil Magician returns, why not work "Wizard" into the title? "Dragons, and Wizards, and Trolls! Oh my!" Maybe even use "Castle" in the title since the chalice appears in any one of the castles that you have to search through. Personally, I would stay away from using "Chalice" or maybe even "Quest" in the title. They just seem a little overused and just a teeny bit too cheesy.

Awesome! Hope I can make some time next week to try it out. Although the new player graphic looks really cool and impressive, I kinda liked the original one like in your avatar. I think it has a little more character and kinda amusing when the horse runs. The damsel idea sounds really cool. You can never have enough games with dragons and Wizards! Very glad this is still going.

Personally, I don't think that title really strikes a chord with the game. To me, the word "lords" in the title makes me think of a warfare game. It also implies multiple lords and there only seems to be a lone hero.